New MARVEL attractions to Disney Parks

AEfx

Well-Known Member
Spider-Man and Transformers don't even have a similar layout, so no, he doesn't get it. He's making unfounded assumptions, not unlike yourself.

And you apparently have not ridden it, or not read any of the reviews that mention it. I personally have already explained it in this thread, but here, I'll give it one last try:

It's not a similar TRACK LAYOUT...it's the progression and content of show scenes.

The track layout is irrelevant. It's the progression of show scenes and the contained effects.

So when they plunk it down in Spidey, the transitions between scenes may be programmed differently, but the scenes are beat for beat.

But since you know everything, apparently, and ignore all the evidence - I'm probably wasting my breath. It's one of those things that is so blatantly obvious that dismissing it so easily tells me that Walt himself could come back to life and tell you and you just won't believe it until the day it happens.
 

TalkingHead

Well-Known Member
Can anyone explain why Universal would sell the rights back to Disney?

If they sold the rights back, then WDW could use the well-known Marvel characters, which would theoretically drive up attendance for Uni's competition...

So why again would Uni want to gut and retheme an entire land at IOA to help out the Mouse?

(Did I hear someone say, "They wouldn't"?)
 

GLaDOS

Well-Known Member
but the scenes are beat for beat.

As someone who's ridden Spider-man hundreds of times and from watching the TF video, they aren't beat for beat. There are a few similarities here and there, but overall, not close to being beat for beat.

EDIT: Just went and watched the video again. There are 4 scenes that are similar to Spidey's 17 scenes. Ravage jumping on the car is similar to Scream, Megatron grabbing the front is similar to Doc Ock, Megatron firing the missile is similar to Hobgoblin's pumpkin bomb, and then the fall. But the rest of the scenes are literally nothing like those in Spider-man. There is much more screen use and much less traveling through set environs for much of the ride. Also, the "traveling up scene" happens quite a bit prior to the fall in Transformers. One you go up the building, you stay there battling Starscream and Megatron, traveling scene from scene before falling. That's not the case in Spider-man.

Now, this isn't to say a change could never happen. But it's far from the "Cut and Paste" simplicity many here seem to believe it is.
 

JT3000

Well-Known Member
And you apparently have not ridden it, or not read any of the reviews that mention it. I personally have already explained it in this thread, but here, I'll give it one last try:

It's not a similar TRACK LAYOUT...it's the progression and content of show scenes.

The track layout is irrelevant. It's the progression of show scenes and the contained effects.

So when they plunk it down in Spidey, the transitions between scenes may be programmed differently, but the scenes are beat for beat.

But since you know everything, apparently, and ignore all the evidence - I'm probably wasting my breath. It's one of those things that is so blatantly obvious that dismissing it so easily tells me that Walt himself could come back to life and tell you and you just won't believe it until the day it happens.

A ride's track layout is irrelevant? Since when? How in the world are you going to "easily" replace one dark ride with a clone of another when their infrastructures are completely different!? Your idea of "scene progression" is what's irrelevant. Guess what -- to replace Spider-Man with Transformers, they would have to START FROM SCRATCH regardless of whatever arbitrary similarities you find in the ride films. Either that or film an ENTIRELY NEW FILM to make up for the differences in direction and pace, with a need to STILL replace all of the theming. You act like this is a stationary simulator and these things don't matter. You've either never ridden either of these attractions or you're just utterly delusional.
 

GrumpyFan

Well-Known Member
Can anyone explain why Universal would sell the rights back to Disney?

If they sold the rights back, then WDW could use the well-known Marvel characters, which would theoretically drive up attendance for Uni's competition...

(Did I hear someone say, "They wouldn't"?)

True, at the moment, there's no good reason for them to sell the rights back to Disney when these properties are hotter than firecrackers on the fourth of July. However, I can think of a few reasons why they might consider selling them, eventually.

  • Limited use of specific characters they have right now
  • Unable to add or change characters/attractions without Disney/Marvel permission
  • License fee increases annually per Consumer Price Index
  • Paying direct competitor to use their products

It's kind of a good/bad situation for both Disney and Universal in the current arrangement. Universal has a few properties they can advertise and use in the parks to draw some crowds, but they have to pay Disney for these. Disney, meanwhile, benefits from Uni's use of these monetarily thru license fees and some attendance draw by guests who visit both resorts.
 

GLaDOS

Well-Known Member
True, at the moment, there's no good reason for them to sell the rights back to Disney when these properties are hotter than firecrackers on the fourth of July. However, I can think of a few reasons why they might consider selling them, eventually.

  • Limited use of specific characters they have right now
  • Unable to add or change characters/attractions without Disney/Marvel permission
  • License fee increases annually per Consumer Price Index
  • Paying direct competitor to use their products

It's kind of a good/bad situation for both Disney and Universal in the current arrangement. Universal has a few properties they can advertise and use in the parks to draw some crowds, but they have to pay Disney for these. Disney, meanwhile, benefits from Uni's use of these monetarily thru license fees and some attendance draw by guests who visit both resorts.

But really, Universal is always paying competitors for their properties. They pay Seuss's estate, JK Rowling and WB, Sony (MIB), Fox (Simpsons), Marvel (Disney), etc

I really don't think it bothers them all that much.
 

GrumpyFan

Well-Known Member
But really, Universal is always paying competitors for their properties. They pay Seuss's estate, JK Rowling and WB, Sony (MIB), Fox (Simpsons), Marvel (Disney), etc

I really don't think it bothers them all that much.

Perhaps, but none of those listed operate a larger theme park/resort right down the road...
It would bother me if I had to pay my biggest competitor to use their products.
 

GLaDOS

Well-Known Member
Perhaps, but none of those listed operate a larger theme park/resort right down the road...
It would bother me if I had to pay my biggest competitor to use their products.

But is Disney Comcast's biggest competitor? I wouldn't say so.

Remember, the theme park divisions are only parts of these two companies, and this licensing deal is a drop in the bucket compared to the money these companies are making.
 

NemoRocks78

Seized
As someone who's ridden Spider-man hundreds of times and from watching the TF video, they aren't beat for beat. There are a few similarities here and there, but overall, not close to being beat for beat.

EDIT: Just went and watched the video again. There are 4 scenes that are similar to Spidey's 17 scenes. Ravage jumping on the car is similar to Scream, Megatron grabbing the front is similar to Doc Ock, Megatron firing the missile is similar to Hobgoblin's pumpkin bomb, and then the fall. But the rest of the scenes are literally nothing like those in Spider-man. There is much more screen use and much less traveling through set environs for much of the ride. Also, the "traveling up scene" happens quite a bit prior to the fall in Transformers. One you go up the building, you stay there battling Starscream and Megatron, traveling scene from scene before falling. That's not the case in Spider-man.

Now, this isn't to say a change could never happen. But it's far from the "Cut and Paste" simplicity many here seem to believe it is.
:sohappy: Thank you. I've also been on Spidey hundreds of times, and Transformers twice so far. There is absolutely no way they could just plop Transformers in over a couple of weeks. It'd require a damn near complete gutting. I don't see the HD upgrade as "preparing for the future" in that case.
 

AEfx

Well-Known Member
A ride's track layout is irrelevant? Since when? How in the world are you going to "easily" replace one dark ride with a clone of another when their infrastructures are completely different!? Your idea of "scene progression" is what's irrelevant. Guess what -- to replace Spider-Man with Transformers, they would have to START FROM SCRATCH regardless of whatever arbitrary similarities you find in the ride films. Either that or film an ENTIRELY NEW FILM to make up for the differences in direction and pace, with a need to STILL replace all of the theming. You act like this is a stationary simulator and these things don't matter. You've either never ridden either of these attractions or you're just utterly delusional.

You'd be wrong on both counts.

But it's tiring explaining the same thing over and over to someone who just cannot get it.

A dark ride is a series of scenes. You can alter the layout of the transitions between scenes while still using the same scenes in the same order. That's why the track is irrelevant, because it only affects what direction you face when leaving/entering a scene, which can be easily manipulated via programming of the ride vehicle.

Regardless, again, it's tiring explaining this - and since you've gone to the level of personal insults (calling me a liar, as I have already stated I have ridden both attractions) and just seem very emotional about this topic, it's time to just leave it at - you'll see, someday. I'd prefer Spiderman stay, myself, but I simply do not believe that logically five years from now it will exist at IOA.
 

jt04

Well-Known Member
Pretty much. I come trying to find news, and have to wade through a bog of nonsense each and every thread to find any.

Steve posts breaking news on the home page.

I like this section of the forum because it is a great place to discuss rumors once you wade through a bog on nonsense about what is real.

See what I did there? :lookaroun
 

JT3000

Well-Known Member
You'd be wrong on both counts.

But it's tiring explaining the same thing over and over to someone who just cannot get it.

If I don't "get it," why is most everyone agreeing with me? Stop acting like you know something the rest of us don't. When you're losing this badly, perhaps it's time to look at your own argument and see how flawed it is, rather than continuing to push it stubbornly.

You'll see, someday.

Nice prediction. Can you give me the winning lottery numbers while you're at it?

I'd prefer Spiderman stay, myself, but I simply do not believe that logically five years from now it will exist at IOA.

You're welcome to your beliefs and theories. Unfortunately, you've yet to prove how they're at all logical.
 

celluloid

Well-Known Member
You'd be wrong on both counts.

But it's tiring explaining the same thing over and over to someone who just cannot get it.

A dark ride is a series of scenes. You can alter the layout of the transitions between scenes while still using the same scenes in the same order. That's why the track is irrelevant, because it only affects what direction you face when leaving/entering a scene, which can be easily manipulated via programming of the ride vehicle.

Regardless, again, it's tiring explaining this - and since you've gone to the level of personal insults (calling me a liar, as I have already stated I have ridden both attractions) and just seem very emotional about this topic, it's time to just leave it at - you'll see, someday. I'd prefer Spiderman stay, myself, but I simply do not believe that logically five years from now it will exist at IOA.

Well you are entitled to your belief of the subject but that it your faith on it. Not what is ultimately sure fire going to happen.

Universal did not just spend millions of dollars to update Spiderman so they could get rid of it in the near future to get rid of it in order to spend multi millions of more dollars so they can make it into a less popular property.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
You'd be wrong on both counts.

But it's tiring explaining the same thing over and over to someone who just cannot get it.
And a few people have now told you that the timing is not as exact as you say. You also ignore that the Transformers project began and was announced YEARS before Disney purchased Marvel. You haven't answered why Universal was once willing to just drop Marvel but is no longer willing. Your theory only makes sense if there was in issue regarding the contract and if Transformers was created after Disney bought Marvel.
 

AEfx

Well-Known Member
If I don't "get it," why is most everyone agreeing with me? Stop acting like you know something the rest of us don't. When you're losing this badly, perhaps it's time to look at your own argument and see how flawed it is, rather than continuing to push it stubbornly.

Sorry, I don't play games - "winning" or "losing". I'm just replying to what is being said to me, I wouldn't be "pushing it stubbornly" if people weren't making snarky replies questioning what I've written by people who refuse to see the writing on the wall.

Just because a couple of you are heck-bent that Spiderman is there to stay doesn't make it correct or logical.

/shrug

Well you are entitled to your belief of the subject but that it your faith on it. Not what is ultimately sure fire going to happen.

Universal did not just spend millions of dollars to update Spiderman so they could get rid of it in the near future to get rid of it in order to spend multi millions of more dollars so they can make it into a less popular property.

No, they spent millions of dollars upgrading the infrastructure to make it easier to do a swap-out later.

The ride film was easily the most negligible part. People have tried to argue that, but they don't understand the concept. Merging CGI with live action is very expensive because of the time, effort, and manual detail needed. The five minutes or so of ride film is completely CG, and all the elements still existed. At that point, it's a matter of moving a few objects around, messing with textures, and then reoutputting at a higher resolution. Five minutes of CG animation redone using existing elements didn't cost them millions of dollars - given the raw material, it could practically be done on a MacBookPro.

Everything else was upgrading infrastructure, to the same specifications used in...Transformers. :)


And a few people have now told you that the timing is not as exact as you say. You also ignore that the Transformers project began and was announced YEARS before Disney purchased Marvel. You haven't answered why Universal was once willing to just drop Marvel but is no longer willing. Your theory only makes sense if there was in issue regarding the contract and if Transformers was created after Disney bought Marvel.

The timing is right on the money, I've been on them. Reviewers at other sites have pointed it out as well. It's close enough to be obvious that fire is within the range of the fire machine already in Spidey, same with the wet features.

As to the timing, I didn't ignore it, it's irrelevant.

The sale of Marvel was not unexpected. If Disney hadn't bought it, it would have been someone else. Universal has been prepared for it for quite some time, it seems. If you notice, Superhero Island is built rather generically compared to the rest of the park. It fits in thematically because comic books are a flat medium, so the sparse, flat signage works - but there is little permanence there. The theming on the two other attractions is in signage only (although it would fit better at USH, even Hulk's color could be reused for a "Nick Slime" coaster, for but one example). They have a ride that could replace Spiderman (Transformers). And that's Marvel Island.

My guess is they have always known that it wasn't a permanent fixture, and have always had an "escape plan", which we are now seeing.

If I'm wrong, so be it. Not sure why some of you find it so threatening, aside from not wanting to lose Spiderman - which I, too, would rather not happen. But it's kind of illogical to think that Universal and Disney, either side, wants to be in bed together like this - people can make assumptions about merchandise, etc., but to be honest - I'm betting part of it will have to do with how well the Spiderman film this summer does how quickly or not the parties depart.

I don't know how anyone logically thinks this status quo will be maintained, but hey, I wouldn't mind - I prefer Spiderman to Transformers, so I'd love to be wrong; but I just don't believe that to be the case, in spite of the fact a few of you seem to agree that I am wrong.
 

Bob Saget

Well-Known Member
Earlier yesterday Bob Iger announced in a conference...that, yes, an Avengers attraction will come to Disney theme parks!
Nice. :cool:
I'm hoping the Avengers attraction comes to DHS, as that is the park which needs the most beef added as of right now. Backlot Tour is pretty much obsolete and past it's prime. Why not use that space for an Avengers or Spidey coaster of some sort?
 

Lee

Adventurer
Nice. :cool:
I'm hoping the Avengers attraction comes to DHS, as that is the park which needs the most beef added as of right now. Backlot Tour is pretty much obsolete and past it's prime. Why not use that space for an Avengers or Spidey coaster of some sort?

Well, it appears the thread has come full circle and wound up back where it started. :lol:
 

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