New Hilton Hotel construction seen in Epcot

[Brian Noble]

I'd be interested in hearing what they had to say

The short version is that neither is all too fond of the other, and each tweaks the other's nose whenever possible. Not the sort of relationship where one asks permission or, if one did, one would not expect the answer to be "yes".

That said, I wouldn't be surprised if the Orange County board didn't have "close associations" with the Mouse House and its minions, so the political levers are probably in place should Mickey want to play hardball. And, Mickey likes hardball, but so does Wyndham.

 

[WDW1974]

The short version is that neither is all too fond of the other, and each tweaks the other's nose whenever possible. Not the sort of relationship where one asks permission or, if one did, one would not expect the answer to be "yes".

That said, I wouldn't be surprised if the Orange County board didn't have "close associations" with the Mouse House and its minions, so the political levers are probably in place should Mickey want to play hardball. And, Mickey likes hardball, but so does Wyndham.

Yeah, that makes sense. But Mickey wields a whole lot more power than Wyndham does, so I believe the Mouse can purchase whatever outcome he seeks!

I personally think if Mickey had been smarter and played nicer they likely would have been able to purchase that significant sliver of land.

And then when it didn't, I think Mickey could have been smarter with how it developed in the area around it.

Oh, well .... it's just dead trees under the bridge now!

 

[jt04]

Didn't Walt Disney's blessing of size quote kinda foretell that this WOULDN'T happen?

Only for the Magic Kingdom E.E., only for the Magic Kingdom

 

[Brian Noble]

It's also worth remembering how Wyndham makes its money in the "vacation ownership" segment: by lying, cheating, and stealing. They're not above much.

-brian, who likes his Wyndham points, but only because he bought them for a dime on the dollar resale.

 

[EPCOT Explorer]

That's the saddest thing (as I just wrote about).

WDW, for all its size, feels awful crowded and congested a lot of the time ... and that's without all the current resorts (Bonnet Creek, Four Seasons, BLT) even done yet.

I wouldn't say congested, but it does have SOME spacing issues.

 

[EPCOT Explorer]

Only for the Magic Kingdom E.E., only for the Magic Kingdom

:lol: How do you figure that? WDW is HUGE...They have more than enough room to give everything it's space.

 

[jt04]

:lol: How do you figure that? WDW is HUGE...They have more than enough room to give everything it's space.

I am of the opinion that Mr Disney was most concerned about outside visual intrusions for the Magic Kingdom. Not so much for whatever else might develop on the WDW property. If you look at his early drawings he planned to develop most of it. I am certain he did not think that his EPCOT would not lead to further development "off property" of which he would have no control and would be visible.

Now I agree that unwanted visual intrusions on world showcase are problematic but it is not quite the same as with the Magic Kingdom which was the primary concern Walt had. It has just become the standard for all Disney theme parks but it is not always possible. Disneyland would be the best example of that. Just my simple opinion.

 

[EPCOT Explorer]

I am of the opinion that Mr Disney was most concerned about outside visual intrusions for the Magic Kingdom. Not so much for whatever else might develop on the WDW property. If you look at his early drawings he planned to develop most of it. I am certain he did not think that his EPCOT would not lead to further development "off property" of which he would have no control and would be visible.

Now I agree that unwanted visual intrusions on world showcase are problematic but it is not quite the same as with the Magic Kingdom which was the primary concern Walt had. It has just become the standard for all Disney theme parks but it is not always possible. Disneyland would be the best example of that. Just my simple opinion.

Ahhh....I see what you are saying now. Agreed!

 

[hokielutz]

You wouldn`t have thought so, the land is outside of RCID - but all access is via property, and RCID controlled highway so far as permits and transportation goes. I`d imagine RCID could make it very hard to get materials to site if they wanted to. As soon as you pass the traffic signal at Buena Vista and BC you`re on property.

I'm sure that court battles would have been the ultimate deccider if RCID refused permits etc.... I don't think that battle would be won by RCID if it ever came to pass, because permitting there is just regulatory red tape that courts could and would overrule because a judge would not view a distant sightline annoyance as something that would overly affect Disney's business in themeparks and resorts.

And as mentioned before, BC could go back and point to the Swan & Dolphin projects as precidents that did nothing to hurt EPCOT's business.

 

[jt04]

I'm sure that court battles would have been the ultimate deccider if RCID refused permits etc.... I don't think that battle would be won by RCID if it ever came to pass, because permitting there is just regulatory red tape that courts could and would overrule because a judge would not view a distant sightline annoyance as something that would overly affect Disney's business in themeparks and resorts.

And as mentioned before, BC could go back and point to the Swan & Dolphin projects as precidents that did nothing to hurt EPCOT's business.

Not to mention the Soarin' building :hurl:

Speaking of which, wouldn't some murals of distant Canadian Rockies-esque mountains work on the top of the Soarin' building that faces WS?

 

[hokielutz]

Not to mention the Soarin' building :hurl:

Speaking of which, wouldn't some murals of distant Canadian Rockies-esque mountains work on the top of the Soarin' building that faces WS?

Nah,

You would also have to build some peaks on top of the hangar, as well as giving it some 3-D dimension to it for a really good show. Paint on a box, only makes it look like a painted box.

 

[EPCOT Explorer]

Nah,

You would also have to build some peaks on top of the hangar, as well as giving it some 3-D dimension to it for a really good show. Paint on a box, only makes it look like a painted box.

It would be kinda odd though, to see Mountains popping out of the side of The Land Pav.:lol: Even I think that's *too* much of a "magic overlap".:lol:

 

[jt04]

Nah,

You would also have to build some peaks on top of the hangar, as well as giving it some 3-D dimension to it for a really good show. Paint on a box, only makes it look like a painted box.

I don't know, I've seen some flat paintings that look very 3-d but I agree some "glued on" peaks at the top edge would look great.

 

[sanctumsolitude]

I am in "wait-and-see" mode for this. On one hand, having the Hilton visible is definitely a problem, but if its only visible from one spot and at a certain angle... maybe it won't be so bad. I will have to see for myself before I start complaining about it. With that being said, even Tokyo Disneysea has an exterior hotel visible inside the park (the Sheraton). Of course, at least there they tried to block the view. At Epcot, they didn't even try to block Soarin'. Maybe someday we will get someone in charge who will work on the Epcot sightlines.

 

[jt04]

It would be kinda odd though, to see Mountains popping out of the side of The Land Pav.:lol: Even I think that's *too* much of a "magic overlap".:lol:

I would agree but the ironic part is you don't see Soarin' from The Land. Or did I just miss it because the Soarin building looks just like the Florida blue sky?:lookaroun

 

[EPCOT Explorer]

I would agree but the ironic part is you don't see Soarin' from The Land. Or did I just miss it because the Soarin building looks just like the Florida blue sky?:lookaroun

I dunno....QUICK! LET'S GO TO EPCOT JUST TO CHECK!:lookaroun:lol:

 

[MKCP 1985]

All the showcases only work visually from afar with a clean sky behind them.

Yes, the TOT is plainly visible from Showcase (c'mon, it is) yet as mentioned elsewhere IMHO it fits very well as a backdrop to Morocco. The Swan and Dolphin.... well, that depends on your personal point of view of them. And like Bonnet Creek they arn`t Disney (but unlike Bonnet Creek they are on property) and so the new Hilton issue is really 18 years old.

If I wanted to moan it would be about Soarin's show building and how it spoils the carefully planned design of the Canadian pavilion. But I won`t.

I have to say that I've read other postings about the Tower of Terror being so plainly visible as a backdrop to Morocco and on my last two trips to Epcot made a mental note to look for this. The first time, I forgot all about it while exploring the park and never noticed it. The second time, I remembered it while in Morocco and looked all over that pavilion for some "window" through which to spot the Tower of Terror. Needless to say, there isn't one.

The only way a person sees Tower of Terror as a backdrop to Morocco is from afar, as Martin noted in the first sentence. I dare say the casual Epcot tourist will never notice it, as I have failed to notice it or have anyone in my party notice it, despite two trips where I was of a mind ahead of time to actually search it out.

Swan and Dolphin have been there so long that I don't notice them much anymore either. They certainly don't detract from the immersive experience of being in Epcot.

Soarin's show bilding infringes on the photo ops for Canada, but again, it is not a major deal. The soft blue softens the blow. Canada should build a Rocky Mountain rafting adventure to block out Soarin.' That would be a nice fix!

 

[deWild]

Is it possible to see the Waldorf Astoria as well? It's going up right next to the Hilton. I say one hotel is enough as it is, but two is pushing Disney's imagination to the limits.

 

[jt04]

Is it possible to see the Waldorf Astoria as well? It's going up right next to the Hilton. I say one hotel is enough as it is, but two is pushing Disney's imagination to the limits.

Actually they are both topped out and you can't see them. So....:shrug:

 

[IfWeCanDreamIt]

So, any shareholders here? Maybe if we get enough together, we can vote against Rasulo. Proxy Vote here we come! LOL!

:ROFLOL::ROFLOL::ROFLOL:

As I laugh, i start to wish such a thing were possible!