News New Gondola Transportation - Disney Skyliner -

flynnibus

flynnibus

Premium Member
ugh... why do people have to argue stuff that doesn't matter.

The Rack Rates can be changed anytime - The only legality around it is some locales require hotels to post their rates (what you see on the doors) as a form of consumer protection to ensure hotels/clerks don't frudulently charge guests. There is no constraint on what those rates are - the laws are about ensuring customers aren't shown one price, and charged a higher price. As long as the guest knows the price at check-in... they are fine.

It's about truth in advertising, not limits on what you can charge. Sheeez. What a waste of time.
FL Consumer Protection re: lodging
61C-3.002 Consumer Protection Requirements.

The division shall consider it an unethical business practice for any establishment to engage in, or knowingly permit anyone on the licensed premises to engage in, any illegal, unfair or deceptive act. Such acts include imposition of a charge separate and apart from, or in addition to, the room rate, that is not disclosed in writing to the guest at the time of check-in; failing to disclose that additional telephone surcharges are being applied which exceed the user-line charges of the local telephone company; or depriving an individual or party of accommodations at a public lodging establishment after having prepaid reservations for said accommodations. To avoid depriving a guest of a prepaid reservation for accommodations at a public lodging establishment the establishment shall make every effort to find other comparable accommodations; and refund all monies deposited for such reservation whether deposited with the public lodging establishment, or a travel or booking agent."

FL Statues
509.101(2)
(2) It is the duty of each operator of a transient establishment to maintain at all times a register, signed by or for guests who occupy rental units within the establishment, showing the dates upon which the rental units were occupied by such guests and the rates charged for their occupancy. This register shall be maintained in chronological order and available for inspection by the division at any time. Operators need not make available registers which are more than 2 years old.
 
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GoofGoof

GoofGoof

Premium Member
cosmicgirl said:
Up to now I've read more posts from people trying to avoid SWL by planning their trip before the opening than posts from people who are trying to catch SWL. Whether there will be a pre-opening dip in attendance is left to be seen. Don't forget that the Mickey ride should be there to draw some crowds in September.

You are correct about the 499-day rule, however, you can in fact already see prices for the whole year by looking at the rate calendars for individual room types. Those rate calendars for all of 2019 are what I based my original post on. Even December, the safest bet for the average Joe who only knows about Disney's "late Fall" announcement, is not showing any out of the ordinary increases at the resorts I checked. I do agree that cutting discounts is a simple measure to keep up with increased demand, but the existing gondola resorts never get more than 10-20% anyway, especially not after September. I don't think it would have a huge impact on those resorts for that reason.



CBR is the cheapest of the moderates, so even if they had brought it in line with the others it wouldn't stand out to the average potential guest. You're right that only a very small percentage of guests are following the Skyliner progress close enough to know it'll likely open in about a year. However, the overall Disney fan base is expecting the gondolas to be operational when SWL opens, which brings us back to late Fall 2019. It would've been a safe bet to increase rack rates for that time of year, because that whole market is confident that the Skyliner will be open then. Therefore, at least some of them would be willing to pay more. I'm not saying that they should have increased the rates, I'm just saying that I'm surprised that they didn't.
Click to expand...

I don’t expect to see a sudden rate increase in the fall or Nov/Dec at these resorts. I do think that if bookings ramp up the basics of supply and demand will kick in and they will charge more or more likely just discount less. If there is a more permanent increase I think it happens during the regular release of 2020 prices. All rooms will increase, but there’s a good chance that these resorts will see a higher than most percent increase. When Pandora opened Disney didn’t have a special ticket price increase on opening date, they just built some extra in the regular yearly increase knowing demand for the new land would more than offset people not willing to pay the steep increase.
 
larryz

larryz

I'm Just A Tourist!
Premium Member
Lift Blog said:
Cabin dimensions are 113" x 87" x 78" so good luck running.
Click to expand...
Running would be unnecessary. Just getting everyone to rock from side to side in unison would be sufficient to get the cabin swinging.

How much lateral movement is tolerated before the cabin has an issue at a set of tower rollers?

Oh, and if people took a good, hard look at how the gondola cabins attach to the cable...
csm_klemme440x350_11f6e5a470.jpg

they'd think long and hard about rocking it at all.
 
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Lift Blog

Lift Blog

Well-Known Member
larryz said:
How much lateral movement is tolerated before the cabin has an issue at a set of tower rollers?

Oh, and if people took a good, hard look at how the gondola cabins attach to the cable...
csm_klemme440x350_11f6e5a470.jpg

they'd think long and hard about rocking it at all.[/spoiler]
Click to expand...

I think it is 15 degrees by code but Doppelmayr goes beyond that to ~20 degrees. May not sound like a lot but that is a huge amount of swing.

It may not look like much but the grip force acting on the haul rope in that photo is insanely high. Doppelmayr built a gondola for Volkswagen that carries completed SUVs with just four of those grips.
 
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larryz

larryz

I'm Just A Tourist!
Premium Member
Lift Blog said:
I think it is 15 degrees by code but Doppelmayr goes beyond that to ~20 degrees. May not sound like a lot but that is a huge amount of swing.

It may not look like much but the grip force acting on the haul rope in that photo is insanely high. Doppelmayr built a gondola for Volkswagen that carries completed SUVs with just four grips per carrier.
Click to expand...
Oh, I understand there's a lot of gripping power. It just doesn't look very substantial for a device that, if it failed, could send 8 or so people plummeting to their grisly demise at the bottom of a rocky canyon.
 
George

George

Liker of Things
Premium Member
larryz said:
Oh, I understand there's a lot of gripping power. It just doesn't look very substantial for a device that, if it failed, could send 8 or so people plummeting to their grisly demise at the bottom of a rocky canyon.
Click to expand...

Or to the asphalt of the Pop Century parking area. Of course, it would be fantastic to see the Disney corpse removal crew in action as they move each body to the designated area 6" off property before declaring them belly up.
 
cosmicgirl

cosmicgirl

Well-Known Member
GoofGoof said:
I don’t expect to see a sudden rate increase in the fall or Nov/Dec at these resorts. I do think that if bookings ramp up the basics of supply and demand will kick in and they will charge more or more likely just discount less. If there is a more permanent increase I think it happens during the regular release of 2020 prices. All rooms will increase, but there’s a good chance that these resorts will see a higher than most percent increase. When Pandora opened Disney didn’t have a special ticket price increase on opening date, they just built some extra in the regular yearly increase knowing demand for the new land would more than offset people not willing to pay the steep increase.
Click to expand...
Not to drag this out any longer, but Pandora is not a fair comparison because that's not specific to certain resorts. The monorail would be a fair comparison. Why is WL so much cheaper than CR, GF and the Poly? They all have boat access to the MK, so it must be the monorail.
 
MisterPenguin

MisterPenguin

President of Animal Kingdom
Premium Member
Lift Blog said:
I think it is 15 degrees by code but Doppelmayr goes beyond that to ~20 degrees. May not sound like a lot but that is a huge amount of swing.

It may not look like much but the grip force acting on the haul rope in that photo is insanely high. Doppelmayr built a gondola for Volkswagen that carries completed SUVs with just four of those grips.
Click to expand...

Is it as strong as G.I. Joe's kung-fu grip?
 
Horizons78

Horizons78

Grade "A" Funny...
Lift Blog said:
I think it is 15 degrees by code but Doppelmayr goes beyond that to ~20 degrees. May not sound like a lot but that is a huge amount of swing.

It may not look like much but the grip force acting on the haul rope in that photo is insanely high. Doppelmayr built a gondola for Volkswagen that carries completed SUVs with just four of those grips.
Click to expand...
MisterPenguin said:
Is it as strong as G.I. Joe's kung-fu grip?
Click to expand...

The Doppelmeyer cable latching system has actually been demonstrated to exceed the grip of monorail passengers attempting to keep the doors shut.
 
danlb_2000

danlb_2000

Premium Member
Original Poster
larryz said:
Oh, I understand there's a lot of gripping power. It just doesn't look very substantial for a device that, if it failed, could send 8 or so people plummeting to their grisly demise at the bottom of a rocky canyon.
Click to expand...

It might not look substantial, but the safety record of the Gondola prove that it is.

From @Lift Blog:

"Reality check: North America's 116 gondola systems have operated without a rider fatality for 41 straight years (not counting this suicide.)"
 
seabreezept813

seabreezept813

Well-Known Member
cosmicgirl said:
Up to now I've read more posts from people trying to avoid SWL by planning their trip before the opening than posts from people who are trying to catch SWL. Whether there will be a pre-opening dip in attendance is left to be seen. Don't forget that the Mickey ride should be there to draw some crowds in September.

You are correct about the 499-day rule, however, you can in fact already see prices for the whole year by looking at the rate calendars for individual room types. Those rate calendars for all of 2019 are what I based my original post on. Even December, the safest bet for the average Joe who only knows about Disney's "late Fall" announcement, is not showing any out of the ordinary increases at the resorts I checked. I do agree that cutting discounts is a simple measure to keep up with increased demand, but the existing gondola resorts never get more than 10-20% anyway, especially not after September. I don't think it would have a huge impact on those resorts for that reason.



CBR is the cheapest of the moderates, so even if they had brought it in line with the others it wouldn't stand out to the average potential guest. You're right that only a very small percentage of guests are following the Skyliner progress close enough to know it'll likely open in about a year. However, the overall Disney fan base is expecting the gondolas to be operational when SWL opens, which brings us back to late Fall 2019. It would've been a safe bet to increase rack rates for that time of year, because that whole market is confident that the Skyliner will be open then. Therefore, at least some of them would be willing to pay more. I'm not saying that they should have increased the rates, I'm just saying that I'm surprised that they didn't.
Click to expand...

Count me in as trying to avoid Star Wars.. but friends/family I know who are not as big of Disney enthusiasts are putting trips off until Star Wars
 

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