NEW! Epcot News and Rumors... GIGANTAMUNDO updates, finally!

[speck76]

It's somewhat off topic, but I wanted to make everyone jealous....

Bloomberg reports today that over the next three years, Oriental Land Co. is going to spend 1.3 BILLION on improvements to their Tokyo parks. Yep, Billion...with a "B".

If we could get budgets like that over here......wouldn't be no stinkin' pavillions closed or outdated...for long.

If WDC had the low overhead and cash flow the OLC had, it would be a different story all together. OLC is a real estate developer that made its fortunes reclaiming land from the sea and developing condos, hotels, shopping, and theme parks. TDL is basically a "locals" park, the metro Tokyo area has a population of 33million....it is the largest metropolitan area in the world. TDL needs to invest just to find places to put all of the visitors.

 

[Lee]

Absolutely true...
But, to paraphrase Wierd Science: "We know about reality. Don't %&*$ with the fantasy"!

I just get woozy at the thought of a budget that size. :dazzle:

 

[Just A Big Kid]

Thanks for the update Grizz

 

[wannab@dis]

Unless we have more examples of how a NEW ride changed the theme of a significant area of real estate in a BAD way, I don't see any cause for concern in regards to The Land. (in fact I'm happy about the change, give me something MORE & NEW to do in Epcot).

WoL is the same thing. I think it is waaaaaay too early to cry wolf about the status of the pavillon.

And there we are in agreement.

I'm not going to pass judgement until we know the plans and see the results. But, I still have to say that I don't agree with the usage of seasonal operations, especially with a pavilion. Sure, if Making of Me is seeing 5 or 10 guests per show, then they could the show seasonal, but the ENTIRE pavilion. Makes no sense to me.

 

[speck76]

How do you feel about seasonal operation of restaurants. Should the park maintain the same capacity for dining during Easter week as they do during the dead part of September?

Why are attractions any different?

 

[wannab@dis]

How do you feel about seasonal operation of restaurants. Should the park maintain the same capacity for dining during Easter week as they do during the dead part of September?

Why are attractions any different?

I would consider WoL or CoP to be much different than a restaurant. First, I paid to enter the park and enjoy the attractions. If they are closed, then the money I paid didn't get me as much. For a restaurant, if it's closed, I'm not eating there, and therefore I didn't spend any money. I don't think any sit down or popular counter establishments should close, but I can understand if some of the outdoor vendors were not available or if a couple of counters were not open.

I understand the need to be conscious of expenses, but most attractions would not entail a large amount of capital to run. If nothing else, let's use shortened hours SPARINGLY and POST those hours so people know in advance. The hours should be seasonal and not daily / weekly. It stinks to find out the day that you arrive that some attraction is closed.

 

[KevinPage]

Absolutely true...
But, to paraphrase Wierd Science: "We know about reality. Don't %&*$ with the fantasy"!I just get woozy at the thought of a budget that size. :dazzle:

One of the greatest movies of all time. As a teenager I ached for Kelly LeBrock to be "nekid" in it beyond belief.

Some of my favorite lines:

"don't threaten my Al, I'll kiss you "

"What do you do for a living Al?, Al, Dad is a plumber, so, um, I guess you plumb"

"Crazy insane? Insane, crazy?"

"Every damn night, on the telephone?"

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[General Grizz]

Soarin'. Grizz's main beef is that 3 balloons, a water fountain and a food court are being removed.

WRONG!







...



There are FIVE ballooons, not three!! :lol:

No, seriously, this is NOT why I would protest the change. It's not the balloons and fountain leaving -- it's the SPIRIT of the attraction that has the potential to be lost. If you read my protest thread, there is NO article under "Balloons, Fountain." There IS a subject about the pavilion's serenity, but the concern is the change that would replace the setting.

Does it fit? Does Soaring over CALIFORNIA REALLY have to do with the Land and symbiosis? Will handgliders themes enhance the understanding of our intricate relationships with the environment?

This is the concern with the Land. You are CORRECT, Kevin, in saying that there is no sign they will screw up. But Disney is KNOWN in the recent past for not putting as much care in for rehabs.

If I was standing in the Land ten years ago, I would have said, "Change this puppy." I would have had pure confidence that Disney could have made the Land better. Ten years later, I do not hold that confidence. Why? Because Disney has stripped Epcot of its animatronics, its peaceful openness, its song, and high-quality queues. (i.e. vents and speakers in full sight).

And what's all this nonsense that a new ride should not impact the theme of the area surrounding it? :brick: Why not? If a NEW ride is worth retheming a pavillon or area of the park to, go right ahead. It's not like the current theme of The Land is the pinnacle of Imagineerig.

Which is more relevant to Epcot's message: flying over California or understanding man's relationship with nature? This is debatable, but the more determining level comes when we factor in how an UNORIGINAL attraction that is 100% in existence in another Disney park is taking over a RELEVANT, original peace of art? Why can't Disney make a NEW experience to guests, capturing (and perhaps even ENHANCING?) the essence of Soarin', but theming it to suit The Land's theme? Otherwise, Soarin just looks like a "dropping" from Disneyland despite the "Oh, flying over the Golden Gate Bridge and orange groves fits in perfectly."

This in itself (California, not a new film) shows dishonesty. It is no longer pure. And this leads to my distrust in the reTHEMING of the pavilion. Will there be HONESTY in this theming? Will there be PURENESS?

If there is, I support that retheming. But as I have expressed already, you really can't be too sure with today's WDC.

 

[KevinPage]

I understand the need to be conscious of expenses, but most attractions would not entail a large amount of capital to run. If nothing else, let's use shortened hours SPARINGLY and POST those hours so people know in advance. The hours should be seasonal and not daily / weekly. It stinks to find out the day that you arrive that some attraction is closed.

I think we don't realize how much in electricity and maitenance costs attractions, let alone whole pavillons cost to run. They don't make these decisions willy nilly, I'm sure. If they were cheap to operate everything would be open all the time.

I wish everything could be open all the time as well. But I'm not that upset over something like WoL when it's essentially a ghost town most of the time.

 

[speck76]

I would consider WoL or CoP to be much different than a restaurant. First, I paid to enter the park and enjoy the attractions. If they are closed, then the money I paid didn't get me as much. For a restaurant, if it's closed, I'm not eating there, and therefore I didn't spend any money. I don't think any sit down or popular counter establishments should close, but I can understand if some of the outdoor vendors were not available or if a couple of counters were not open.

I understand the need to be conscious of expenses, but most attractions would not entail a large amount of capital to run. If nothing else, let's use shortened hours SPARINGLY and POST those hours so people know in advance. The hours should be seasonal and not daily / weekly. It stinks to find out the day that you arrive that some attraction is closed.

That being said, should the park maintain maximum hours 365 days each year? The park is open from 9am-1am'ish on July 4th, so if you visit that day, you are getting 16 hours of enjoyment for your ticket cost. On the other hand, the Magic Kingdom last week was open from 9am-6pm, so you would only be getting 9 hours for that same price. Also, should the park stop closing rides for refurbishment, as a ride out for refurbishment means a ride that you paid to go on, but can't.

 

[General Grizz]

That being said, should the park maintain maximum hours 365 days each year? The park is open from 9am-1am'ish on July 4th, so if you visit that day, you are getting 16 hours of enjoyment for your ticket cost. On the other hand, the Magic Kingdom last week was open from 9am-6pm, so you would only be getting 9 hours for that same price. Also, should the park stop closing rides for refurbishment, as a ride out for refurbishment means a ride that you paid to go on, but can't.

There is a difference. Refurbishment is necessary. Seasonal operation is not.

 

[Stitchfan712]

WONDERS OF LIFE___________________

Oh boy. Where can I start?

As we all know, Wonders of Life was last open to the public in May (during Epcot’s test of opening attractions after dark for resort guests). Since then, the pavilion has remained CLOSED to the public, HOWEVER. . .

THE PAVILION IS STILL RUNNING – at least most of it. That’s right. AREA MUSIC, LIGHTS, SIGHTS, and SOUNDS are running inside the Wonders of Life (although major attractions are not) – and there is photographical evidence in my first August Epcot update (see: Resources). But why??

Let’s break it down for the record:

• THE PLANTS in Wonders of Life need sunlight.
• CAST MEMBERS have conventions in the pavilion, including meeting areas, skits, and social activities. (Couldn’t this be done in the Odyssey, World Showplace, or Upstairs Image Works, all originally opened to the public anyway?!)
• CONVENTIONS

OBVIOUSLY Disney has the guests in mind. But what’s this you asked? Wonders of Life never was a guest hit? I beg to differ. Cranium Command is an all-time favorite of most Epcot fans, and take a look at numerous online boards to see the outrage of the Wonders of Life’s closure. (To think, it’s open to everyone BUT the guests!) In fact, Cranium Command had roughly 20% of Epcot’s visitors (according to statistics I recently found), and the Wonders of Life itself had on average 11,000 visitors per day. (Compare this to the average 8,000 over at Imagination and 15,000 at Test Track and Mission Space). A lot, isn’t it?

Yet, Disney is keeping Wonders of Life closed to guests in order to keep it on “Seasonal Status,” which in turn pays a few million dollars to Disney.

What does this mean?

THERE IS A CHANCE Wonders of Life may open in THANKSGIVING and CHRISTMAS BREAK to fill its seasonal quota, then close for good – with no sign for refurbishment. This is absolutely horrible and a slap in the face to fans and Epcot guests.

Also, expect The Making of Me to (PERHAPS) run on only select days (if at all) during these potential openings. There is also a chance Wonders of Life may be open while the Land is closed for rehab.

There are NUMEROUS resources for Wonders of Life, including a CALL TO ARMS and a great TRIBUTE VIDEO. . . these are linked in the RESOURCES page.​

I am VERY sad to hear this. Last time I was in WDW I didn't have time to visit the Wonders of Life pavilion, but I guess it would have been closed anyway.

There is a chance that I may go back to WDW on Thanksgiving break, but not unless I can find work and very soon. Now I hope to go even more with the possibility of this pavilion closing forever.

OOOOOOH Boy. First let’s get to the basics: The Land is closing on JANUARY 2, 2005 (a day before the first full year of Food Rocks’s closure – and a day before the 11th year that Kitchen Kabaret closed).

During the rehab, which will extend through Spring Break,

• POTENTIAL RAMPS, A NEW ELEVATOR, STAIRCASES, and ESCALATORS will be installed to ease guest flow to the bottom level
• THE SUNSHINE SEASON FOOD FAIR will be demolished and replaced by a brand new, smaller restaurant, which will more than likely have seating in the center of the pavilion.
• LIVING WITH THE LAND will have its queue changed with potential ride changes. (No, the greenhouses aren’t going anywhere)
• THE BALLONS AND FOUNTAIN are going away.
• CALIFORNIA TIME. . . gift shops, fastpass, you know it. The Costume is pretty much similar to that of DCA’s Soarin, by the way.
• ENTIRE RETHEMING of the pavilion. I have no clue what this will entail just let. Holler if you know anything.

That’s basically the jest, just, joist, and jist of the Land. Any D-Army action will rely on what the new theming will be.

But, if the new theming seems to be BAD. . . well, it looks like people have already started expressing themselves!

PROJECT WATCH: Special attention needs to be taken care on the right side of the Land Pavilion. Now that THE CANADA RAFT RIDE HAS BEEN RED-FlAGGED, there is now the potential for a roller coaster to spring up again. This idea was cancelled way back when the “funds” went to Canada, and I have NO indication that a coaster is being planned again, but this area is a prime chunk of Land that Disney is eyeing. We’ll keep you posted.

There’s not much else I can tell you about The Living Seas (I’ve posted that information way to many times here, use SEARCH “Living Seas”) and World Showcase, Mission Space, and Test Track are. . . World Showcase, Mission Space, and Test Track.

I hope you enjoyed the updates. Feel free to discuss.

I really didn't get to see much of The Land either, but I did go in for a meal at the Garden Grill. I liked the balloons! Why get rid of the balloons?

Is Garden Grill going to remain as-is?​

 

[General Grizz]

Stitchfan - - I know of no changes to Garden Grille. I think if anything happens to it, it will be cosmetic.

 

[AndyP]

Thanks for taking the time to make such a great update, I really enjoyed reading that!

 

[wannab@dis]

That being said, should the park maintain maximum hours 365 days each year? The park is open from 9am-1am'ish on July 4th, so if you visit that day, you are getting 16 hours of enjoyment for your ticket cost. On the other hand, the Magic Kingdom last week was open from 9am-6pm, so you would only be getting 9 hours for that same price. Also, should the park stop closing rides for refurbishment, as a ride out for refurbishment means a ride that you paid to go on, but can't.

But you're not talking about my ability to enjoy the attractions. Sure, when the parks are completely full, it will take 12 - 14 hours to visit the attractions. When the park has light attendance, then I can do the same thing in 4 - 6 hours. I don't mind the shortened hours, with the exception of MK closing before dark. I really enjoy the park in the evening hours! If it gets dark at 6 or 7 pm, then close at 7 or 8pm. I was there in Dec of 2001 and the park was closing while it was daylight. If I remember correctly, I believe the only time the fireworks were being shown was during the MVMCP.

So, in other words, I don't see the park hours based on attendance as a problem. But during those shortened hours, they should allow me to visit the attractions as I see fit or set up a schedule so that I know if I visit CoP from 10am to 2pm then I can enjoy the show.

 

[speck76]

There is a difference. Refurbishment is necessary. Seasonal operation is not.

Closed is closed. The general public does not care why....if they can't ride it, it is simply "closed".

 

[darthdarrel]

Disney hasn't made a family oriented ride in 10 years? Well, let's see:
Magic Kingdom:
Buzz Lightyear, Winnie the Pooh
MGM:
Well, you got me there
Epcot:
I got nothing... but they did inexplicably manage to the get the wait of the land over 60 minutes with fast pass machines. That's gotta count for something
Animal Kingdom: Well this was opened within the last 10 years, so I suppose that shouldn't count.

Out of curiosity When was Buzz lightyear and Winnie the pooh actually made?

 

[General Grizz]

Out of curiosity When was Buzz lightyear and Winnie the pooh actually made?

1998: Buzz Lightyear's Space Ranger Spin

1998: The Many Adventures of Winnie the Pooh

The Magic Kingdom is a family park. But my main concerns about family pavilions are especially centered at EPCOT. . .

 

[darthdarrel]

1998: Buzz Lightyear's Space Ranger Spin

1998: The Many Adventures of Winnie the Pooh

The Magic Kingdom is a family park. But my main concerns about family pavilions are especially centered at EPCOT. . .

WOW! I thought they were built earlier! Ok redsoxfan I stand corrected, I will admit when I am wrong and I am wrong, but I really did not think of them as I have never ridden on either of them. Is Winnie the pooh still operating?

 

[General Grizz]

WOW! I thought they were built earlier! Ok redsoxfan I stand corrected, I will admit when I am wrong and I am wrong, but I really did not think of them as I have never ridden on either of them. Is Winnie the pooh still operating?

Pooh is still operating, as is Buzz.