My Magic + details ...

[dnylla]

The rooms will require RFID-enabled media. They have stated that resort guests will get the bands but can opt out and get the RFID cards, if they choose.

That is good to hear about the cards. I really don't like the idea of wearing some plastic band on my wrist, especially with the heat and humidity in Orlando. It really feels too much like "Big Brother" to me, although I know the cards will have RFID too.

Of course, like many others here I'm not impressed with how this change to FP+ forces you to pre-plan so much more of your trip than before (and I say this as someone who is a planner) so I may not be going back to WDW anytime soon...

 

[No Time To Say Hello Goodbye]

To clarify on my FastPass+ comment,
Things I like:
-cut down on paper waste
-fastpass for parades, shows, and fireworks
-limit of 3 "reservations" at a time
-some control over what time your fastpasses are for

Things I don't like:
-Including rides and attractions in the 60 day out planning.
-unable to return fastpasses should you deign not to use them
-limit of 3 ALL DAY PER PARK

Personally, I think this would work a lot better if they left the parades and such for 60 days out but you could ONLY get fast passes for rides IN the park. With the way smart phones and such work today, they can tell when and where you are in the park. And for people who don't have smart phones, there could be kiosks available through out the parks (at guest services, town hall in MK, etc). Not having them at the actual attraction would be beneficial because you won't have to split up your party and have a "runner" go get passes before they "sell out."

I both like and hate the limit of 3. 3 at one time, awesome. All day for only one park? Not so much. After you use, say 2, you can reserve more OR you can sign up for an additional three at another park that day.

This method kind of seems like a "best of both worlds" scenario, IMHO.

Thoughts? What would you add or change?

Agree. I like the idea you can only pre-book 3 so everyone gets a chance for a few. But I really wish there was a way that once you had used them in the park you could then book more from whatever was still available (even if it was similar to now where you could only get new ones every 2 hrs).

 

[dadddio]

The bonus fastpass only applies to the test in August. It may or may not make it into the final product. Right now, if you are booking FP+ for Sept 1st or later, there is not a bonus FP+.

Still there is no reason to believe that additional same day FPs won't be available since they have been available during every test and the T&CS suggest that they will. If they are, it will be OK that the additional one can't be prereserved.

 

[jessfriends]

Sorry you had a problem with that. I had no problem adding our RFID PAPs to our MDE accounts. I was even able to add our MNSSHP tickets to it!

That's good to know that they are accepting some PAPs. I didn't believe her when she said some were working. It's also good to know they are accepting the MNSSHP.

 

[ginnymack]

Well, not quite in theory, and not quite without "check-in". But, close to that.

You do not need to stop by the front desk, as they have CMs with iPads to process you outside. So, think of it more like a "mobile" front desk. But the bands to not alleviate the need to "check-in"...

And no, you won't ever get your room number by text anytime soon, and that is not how the system works now...

It's a bad idea, which locks Disney into some sort of commitment. That would be a very bad idea on Disney's part, however, having someone meet you with an ambiguous iPad and "check you in" works fine.

You can, however, ease your ME check in experience, hotel check in experience, and overall experience with them now.

How do I know? I just did it Friday.

This is what we are being told is in the very near future.
I, too was recently greeted at the door with an iPad. It was quite effiecent. My room was ready, but I have had my room number texted to me in the past.
With an enhanced online check in process and guests already in possession of tix and room key. We are being told that the traditional check in may be totally optional.

Saving the front desk clerk 5 minutes will certainly pay for the whole investment, dontcha know?

 

[englanddg]

This is what we are being told is in the very near future.
I, too was recently greeted at the door with an iPad. It was quite effiecent. My room was ready, but I have had my room number texted to me in the past.
With an enhanced online check in process and guests already in possession of tix and room key. We are being told that the traditional check in may be totally optional.

Saving the front desk clerk 5 minutes will certainly pay for the whole investment, dontcha know?

Frankly, I wouldn't mind it. I could live without a front desk and their useless service. Read my trip report, I wasn't even impressed with the "atrium club level front desk"...

I'm fine with people meeting me at my Magical Express bus with iPads confirming and directing me on my way.

 

[englanddg]

Man, it feels odd to debate Disney while at Disney..., as a side note...

 

[WDW1974]

I have something based on INTERNAL WDW Co docs that I wanted to get out and move the discussion back onto what Disney is doing in O-Town versus what UNI is doing. Naturally, it all relates to NGE (which has had Tom Staggs in town ... apparently, he had a heated discussion at the Grand Flo with another 'suit' who may well have been George, but that hasn't been confirmed yet and this stuff really isn.t quite as important to me right now as it normally would be).

Anyway, like many of us in the fan community (and those well outside of it but with a known interest), I've been on a Spirited search for any information on the massive commitment TWDC has made to the nebulous program we have come to know as "Disney's Next Generation Experience." And information I have found as Yoda (soon to be in a 3D spectacular!!!) would say.

It might conflict with what we've been led to believe, it might conflict with some insider information previously posted to this site (including my own) and it may well be that the 'final product' will be a patchwork of all of this combined with work no one is yet aware of.

I do want to reinforce that no one has been able to confirm the current expenditure for NGE. No one knows or will say. It might as well be a government program because you aren't going to find anyone, likely other than 3-4 people at the VERY top of Disney, who know the answer.

We Do know, from reliable sources and company releases, it exceeds $1.1 billion. Looking at the reconfiguring of certain budgets, the movement of monies, many folks believe the $2 billion mark was passed long ago now and the steady march toward $3 billion is inevitable. That's all probably accurate.

Now, we want Disney to invest in the parks, in tangible ways for the casual guest as well as us crazy fans. We want existing offerings maintained and new ones brought on line. Not just E-tickets, but the 'Disney' of Walt Disney World that was not so dated, not so stale, not so out of touch.

We are getting NGE. So, that's what I'm focusing my MAGICal time on right now.

Having said that,keep in mind, some of that NGE budget is going toward required improvements in both IT infrastructure and actual brick and mortar within the parks. No, not new attractions. The redos/renovations of queues, gift shops and window displays, food locations, doorways and door locks...and, yes, even MAGICal toilets (paging @TalkingHead) appear to have made their way into the NGE spend. Much has been speculated about this project, almost nothing has been confirmed beyond certain aspects of MM+ by Disney (mostly relating to FP+). and Disney, no doubt, prefers it that way.

Here's the problem: Disney is declaring publicly the opposite of what the aim/goal/mandate for NGE was and is.

Everything I've read, again from internal docs, about Disney's work on NGE is layered with terminology including data mining, machine learning, and advanced applications for all sorts of embedded systems. Those aren't my words. Those words come directly from NGE's master plan.Those are Disney's words.

Again, reread that.

In everything I have now reviewed, there's not merely an oppressive reliance on data but something more. There is, within the project, specific reference of the need to "overcome" line of sight deficiencies and the challenges of geolocation capture within large structures (i.e., anything from the Main Street's Emporium to EPCOT's Living with the Land biodomes).

ZigBee, in addition to everything else packed into those no-so-MAGICal-bands, is mentioned liberally. The absolute necessity for engineers to employ "mesh networks" and find "reliable methods to locate" parkgoers is emphasized. Whether this was accomplished isn't known, but - given the language - NGE relies heavily on this aspect.

A healthy portion of NGE references, unambiguously, the need to not just capture but exploit and warehouse data. (Both of those words are emphasized. To the point of making one's head nearly explode...and, let's face it, those are not friendly words. HINT: If you do not like the NSA spying, why would you think that it is OK for a for profit corp?)

The "venue" we regard as Walt Disney World is cited as allowing investigation into consumer behavior with "real-life guests and customers" (us) and, in particular, is touted as being 'the only place on the planet' that affords "unique investigations" of a scale and density to best exploit the convergence of technology with consumer behavior.

Now, limited as I may be in the technical aspects of some of this, and wanting as I might be to believe Disney has no interest in our specific behavior(s), some folks appear to be giving Disney a bit too much of that long ago squandered 'trust' as the project screams Big Data. And more.

There are entire coding 'departments' that appear to be focused on pulling stunningly specific data points from A BAND. No, not populations/patterns. From individuals. ID-based folios where minute-by-minute geolocation is coupled with all sorts of stuff. For example, from when you enter an attraction/building to when you exit...that's a given. But, that 'mesh' system designed for WDW seems intent on knowing exactly how your time was spent in that building.

And, of course, when you aren't actually 'hiding' in an attraction, shop or toilet stall. This stuff is referenced, folks. I guess, it appears, Disney wants to be on the forefront of this world without privacy thing. Understand, there is no knowing exactly what TWDC will be able to deliver. This is, however, what NGE was (is?) all about. Well, all of that and exploiting it for maximum profit - as the projects declares in the opening graf/outline of every piece of it I've been made privy to.

Looking at it, and some of the terminology (a fair amount, I admit, I do not have the required background to understand on a first or second read) that appears out of place in a for-profit company's planning and projects, I'm at a loss as to how this was ever designed to be a legit profit engine without the selling that data. From the start, I said that's what this was all about. I'm more convinced of that today than at any time since NGE began at Disney.

They want to know you, and your kids and -- really -- anyone and everyone, on an intimate level. They then want to turn that information into something else. At last check, I think it remains profit.

 

[KingStefan]

Still there is no reason to believe that additional same day FPs won't be available since they have been available during every test and the T&CS suggest that they will. If they are, it will be OK that the additional one can't be prereserved.

Agreed. But note that intention to make additional same day FP+ available (that is, the system will be capable of doing that), and the fact that they have been available during very limited testing (meaning the system has not been tested in practice anywhere close to the anticipated volume), does not mean that the FP+ limit (due to capacity) on many attractions, especially the most popular ones, won't be reached very quickly each day once MM is fully implemented. Just as it is now with the existing system. Only being able to reserve them ahead of time will exacerbate this effect.

 

[dadddio]

Agreed. But note that intention to make additional same day FP+ available (that is, the system will be capable of doing that), and the fact that they have been available during very limited testing (meaning the system has not been tested in practice anywhere close to the anticipated volume), does not mean that the FP+ limit (due to capacity) on many attractions, especially the most popular ones, won't be reached very quickly each day once MM is fully implemented. Just as it is now with the existing system. Only being able to reserve them ahead of time will exacerbate this effect.

That is certainly true. However, the one FP per ride per day rule will spread that limited number of FPs among a greater number of guests than the current system does.

 

[dadddio]

...
In everything I have now reviewed, there's not merely an oppressive reliance on data but something more. There is, within the project, specific reference of the need to "overcome" line of sight deficiencies and the challenges of geolocation capture within large structures (i.e., anything from the Main Street's Emporium to EPCOT's Living with the Land biodomes).

ZigBee, in addition to everything else packed into those no-so-MAGICal-bands, is mentioned liberally. The absolute necessity for engineers to employ "mesh networks" and find "reliable methods to locate" parkgoers is emphasized. Whether this was accomplished isn't known, but - given the language - NGE relies heavily on this aspect.

Shouldn't we expect the company to be able to locate any guest on it's property? From a safety and security standpoint, this would be absolutely necessary as it not only allows stray kids to be found quickly and easily, but it would allow the park to be 'cleared' easier in case of emergency (or at closing time). I'm at a loss as to why people would expect a company not to take steps to be able to locate all personnel on it's property.

A healthy portion of NGE references, unambiguously, the need to not just capture but exploit and warehouse data. (Both of those words are emphasized. To the point of making one's head nearly explode...and, let's face it, those are not friendly words. HINT: If you do not like the NSA spying, why would you think that it is OK for a for profit corp?)

The difference between those two scenarios is pretty obvious. The program such as what people fear that the NSA's has become 'spies' on people who are in their private homes while Disney is going to track people within their theme parks. The NSA looks at you while you are in a location that carries an expectation of privacy, while Disney is going to know your location while you are on their property where you do not have an expectation of privacy, if you are to be believed.

The "venue" we regard as Walt Disney World is cited as allowing investigation into consumer behavior with "real-life guests and customers" (us) and, in particular, is touted as being 'the only place on the planet' that affords "unique investigations" of a scale and density to best exploit the convergence of technology with consumer behavior.

Now, limited as I may be in the technical aspects of some of this, and wanting as I might be to believe Disney has no interest in our specific behavior(s), some folks appear to be giving Disney a bit too much of that long ago squandered 'trust' as the project screams Big Data. And more.

There are entire coding 'departments' that appear to be focused on pulling stunningly specific data points from A BAND. No, not populations/patterns. From individuals. ID-based folios where minute-by-minute geolocation is coupled with all sorts of stuff. For example, from when you enter an attraction/building to when you exit...that's a given. But, that 'mesh' system designed for WDW seems intent on knowing exactly how your time was spent in that building.

To what end? They will perhaps have the ability to glean from the data that people with families of X size who spend Y dollars on vacation tend to buy Z swag. Beyond their ability to target me and offer me things that I want to spend money on while not offering me things that I don't care for, what do you think is the end game? Perhaps they will only send PIN codes to high spenders, I guess.

This is, however, what NGE was (is?) all about. Well, all of that and exploiting it for maximum profit - as the projects declares in the opening graf/outline of every piece of it I've been made privy to.

It is not a shocker that Disney's end game is to maximize profits. That is every business' goal. Luckily, the primary way for an entertainment company to increase profits is to increase customer happiness.

Looking at it, and some of the terminology (a fair amount, I admit, I do not have the required background to understand on a first or second read) that appears out of place in a for-profit company's planning and projects, I'm at a loss as to how this was ever designed to be a legit profit engine without the selling that data. From the start, I said that's what this was all about. I'm more convinced of that today than at any time since NGE began at Disney.

I'm dubious as to whether Disney would want to sell this data. I believe this because the data would fall into two categories. It is either not translatable to other types of company/customer interactions or it is too valuable to allow it to be obtained by the competition. It is far more likely that the data will be heavily used in house, but not allowed out in the world. Further, it is VERY unlikely that if any data was sold that it would be individual data. It would almost certainly be used to build data sets that can be used to develop predictive models regarding the behavior of guests of a certain type, but would not include individually identifiable information. As such, who cares if the used the information in-house or sold it?

 

[KingStefan]

I have something based on INTERNAL WDW Co docs that I wanted to get out ...

They want to know you, and your kids and -- really -- anyone and everyone, on an intimate level. They then want to turn that information into something else. At last check, I think it remains profit.

Thanks. That's really good stuff. Your information is always quite interesting.

I'm concerned about privacy issues like everyone else. And I'm undecided about whether a for-profit collecting this type of info is an issue.

Disney already knows (or can know) what resort you stay at and when you open your door with a key; and if you buy tickets from them or register your ticket with your account, when you enter a park, fastpasses you get; and if you use dining plans or charge to your room, where you eat and possibly what. And possibly what airline you use and when you come and go. All this without MM or bands.

Google already does this sort of thing. Probably so do many other companies you interact with perhaps without you even knowing - google is just up front about it. I get on-screen adds targeted to me based on my email content all the time.

And it is a companies right (obligation for public companies) to maximize the future worth of the present value of the owner's share of the company. Basically that translates into balance of long-term and short-term profit.

Toward that end, they strive to delight the customer within cost constraints, and encourage the customer to want more, thereby spending more (and being delighted with the value received). The type of information collection you describe above is exactly what is needed to accomplish that most effectively. This also benefits the consumer, creating a win-win situation. You are delivered exactly the product/content you want and are happy to pay for that added value.

The question becomes, do you trust Disney (and perhaps their partners) with protecting that information. And what is the likelihood that it will be stolen by or leaked to some government organization or someone else.

If you trust Disney and their partners and do not have the later concern, I personally see nothing wrong with Disney knowing this information. It's analogous to having an all-knowing assistant (think Radar O'Reilley) who always knows what you want or need next without you asking, and having it there on a silver tray before even you realized you wanted it. I kinda like that idea.

Suppose someone in your family buys tigger merch on Main Street. Then you get an email that says, "hey, did you know tigger is going to be in the MK parade every day this week? He's also appearing for autographs and pictures at (such and such a place) would you like to add a FP+ for that? I see you're available at (insert time of day)". This is the kind of thing they are trying to accomplish. I think.

Also, probably, "hey, look at this great tigger (insert name of other merch here) that I found over at Mousegears", or "You know, not many people realize tigger can ice-skate. He can, and he's appearing next month near your home town of (your home town - because "they know") in DIsney on Ice. You can buy tickets at (insert venue ticket link)."

I think this would be really cool. But it involves a leap of faith.

 

[KingStefan]

That is certainly true. However, the one FP per ride per day rule will spread that limited number of FPs among a greater number of guests than the current system does.

Yes, I have to admit that I like that aspect. Although if the ridership is light on that attraction, I'd like to see them offer more than one. Of course, then you don't really need a FP.

 

[dadddio]

The other thing about FP quantity is the ability to swap FPs. Under the current system, I might pull a FP and then not use it for various reasons. Perhaps I jumped into the line during a parade and don't 'need' to ride it again or I'm on the far side of the park with my recalcitrant family. Either way, that FP isn't used.

With the new system, I will be able to swap out the FP for a different attraction that better suits me. This will allow some lucky guest to snap up my old FP slot.

I think that this ability to swap FPs will result in more people trading in FPs that will not be used, thereby again increasing the number of guests who benefit. It's likely not a huge number of affected guests, but it is still a net gain.

 

[Minthorne]

The last two days with MyMagic+ have been really perfect. Swapping parks and fast passes has been a breeze with the app. All addmission and room charges worked seamlessly. I've been very impressed; once the media and records issues were resolved everything has worked as advertised and correctly.

I stopped at the front last night and told the CM that had assisted us how well it was working and he really sounded happy to hear it.

I plan to let Disney know that it was because of the professionalism of the CM with this rollout that we stuck with it. I'm sure gald we did.

 

[wogwog]

I debated with myself if I should post the following here or a new thread so forgive me if this is the wrong place in your opinion. Myself said put it here. I hate when the voices tell me what to do. Multiple cast members have told me the following. I think Disney may be feeding data on cast members to the same system that captures guest information in Next Gen or what ever you want to call it. Disney recently changed the way cast report to work. Previously cast would simply show a picture company ID card to a security guard and be admitted. Recently at the Magic Kingdom and perhaps at other parks cast members now take the same ID card and tap a device similar to but not the same as the guest entry points and with a green light and a sound signal pass the security. Strangely no picture is checked and no finger ID. This is not to clock in to go to work but only to enter. Clocking in for work is done later in the work area of the cast member. Perhaps this is simply to verify the cast member is scheduled to work and is OK to enter. But begs the question are they being tracked like GPS around property? I am absolutely not IT smart like some of you or even very tech savy period. So I am just making a point of this change during the rollout of the other tracking systems on guests seems convenient. Another interesting point to me is the cast were not issued new ID cards for this but use the same card they may have had for many years. Indicating Disney has been making the ID RFID ready for years. Just thought it was interesting.

 

[dadddio]

I debated with myself if I should post the following here or a new thread so forgive me if this is the wrong place in your opinion. Myself said put it here. I hate when the voices tell me what to do. Multiple cast members have told me the following. I think Disney may be feeding data on cast members to the same system that captures guest information in Next Gen or what ever you want to call it. Disney recently changed the way cast report to work. Previously cast would simply show a picture company ID card to a security guard and be admitted. Recently at the Magic Kingdom and perhaps at other parks cast members now take the same ID card and tap a device similar to but not the same as the guest entry points and with a green light and a sound signal pass the security. Strangely no picture is checked and no finger ID. This is not to clock in to go to work but only to enter. Clocking in for work is done later in the work area of the cast member. Perhaps this is simply to verify the cast member is scheduled to work and is OK to enter. But begs the question are they being tracked like GPS around property? I am absolutely not IT smart like some of you or even very tech savy period. So I am just making a point of this change during the rollout of the other tracking systems on guests seems convenient. Another interesting point to me is the cast were not issued new ID cards for this but use the same card they may have had for many years. Indicating Disney has been making the ID RFID ready for years. Just thought it was interesting.

I think that the ability of the company to track anyone via an unpowered RFID card would be very, very limited. Basically, they would know if the employee tapped a sensor to enter an RFID-controlled door. They wouldn't know where the employee was standing on property at any particular point in time.

 

[pjammer]

I debated with myself if I should post the following here or a new thread so forgive me if this is the wrong place in your opinion. Myself said put it here. I hate when the voices tell me what to do. Multiple cast members have told me the following. I think Disney may be feeding data on cast members to the same system that captures guest information in Next Gen or what ever you want to call it. Disney recently changed the way cast report to work. Previously cast would simply show a picture company ID card to a security guard and be admitted. Recently at the Magic Kingdom and perhaps at other parks cast members now take the same ID card and tap a device similar to but not the same as the guest entry points and with a green light and a sound signal pass the security. Strangely no picture is checked and no finger ID. This is not to clock in to go to work but only to enter. Clocking in for work is done later in the work area of the cast member. Perhaps this is simply to verify the cast member is scheduled to work and is OK to enter. But begs the question are they being tracked like GPS around property? I am absolutely not IT smart like some of you or even very tech savy period. So I am just making a point of this change during the rollout of the other tracking systems on guests seems convenient. Another interesting point to me is the cast were not issued new ID cards for this but use the same card they may have had for many years. Indicating Disney has been making the ID RFID ready for years. Just thought it was interesting.

It was basically a cost saving measure. They used to have to staff cast entrance with security CMs that kinda checked the photo on your ID. But if you were a long time CM that the security guard knew but got fired and flashed any ID they would let you in. The new system double checks if you are a valid CM or not and if you are refused entry then there is a little camera with a speaker that you have to use to call a security CM so they can double check you are in the system show your drivers license then allowed in. They also eliminated recieving new stickers every year as a cost saving. 65000 CM having to get a sticker mailed and printed saved a lot of money. This conicided with the addition of the new security system at CM entrances.

IDs have had RFID chips in the for over seven years now. The new RFID entry has only been for the past two. It's also worthy to note that the IDs are not compatable with the park RFID entry and CMs have to still use the old turnstiles to come in.

One more thing I forgot to add. The chip is a short range chip and can only be read if it tapped to an RFID scanner so their is no GPS tracking going on.

 

[-em]

Not to mention that all cast costumes are now RFID chipped- so go figure...

-em

 

[RSoxNo1]

I know it's not the inside dirt that @WDW1974 posted, but I did speak at length with a Cast Member in they My Magic + booth yesterday. They were not allowed to appear in on camera interviews.
http://www.wdwthemeparks.com/news/2013/08/10/d23-expo-august-9-2013-my-magic-and-fastpass