News Monster Inc Land Coming to Disney's Hollywood Studios

[GoofGoof]

Your pure logic has resulted in good analysis.

I will use my human emotion to expect the worst and hope for the best.

Lets regroup in 3 years to see where we are at.

Sure thing. By the end of 2027 I would expect to see Tropical Americas open and Monsters near completion or maybe even open itself. Back corner of MK will still be a large construction site but if they want to open Cars by 2029 we should have some vertical construction (mountains) above the construction walls by end of 2027.

I am curious to see when the construction walls go up around the river. I assume they will put up walls from HM all the way around to BTMRR before draining the river but then there’s a lot of groundwork and leveling to be done before starting on the actual land. Lots of construction photo updates for the next few years.

 

[MisterPenguin]

Why do they need to respond, though? They don't have to constantly be matching each other pound for pound. It's not really in either of them's best interest to stay in a constant cycle of "they did this, so we're going to do that". It's good sometimes, but other times each resort needs to just do things for internal reasons, not external reasons. We've seen how bad it can be when one of them rushes to respond to the other.

Not everything is a competition, and I doubt seriously that either Disney or Universal wants everything to be a competition. There are times for them to lock horns, and then there are times where they should focus on themselves.

Oh, it definitely is a competition.

Disney wants to be King of Orlando for the prestige branding, but also it allows for premium prices.

So, IOW... $$$

The problem here is that some make EU to be sorta like a WDW-killer/swatter. Yes, it definitely is a step up for Uni. And I hope it's successful. Disney could stand a little pressure from competition. But it won't be a WDW-killer/swatter.

Disney has been adding as much capex that their free cash flow would allow for the past 7 years. And now, they'll have a lot more free cash in the coming decade.

But keep in mind: Disney has other children... Anaheim, Paris, Hong Kong, and Shanghai. All those parks need some love, too. So, yeah, Disney is putting up 11-ish new rides... but spread throughout the world -- not just in Orlando.

 

[celluloid]

Who cares when Disney announces things. Either pay attention or not.

Who cares if some projects get cancelled, stuff happens.

Move on, hug a loved one or whatever.

Wdw discussion board and people who are stakeholders as various levels and degrees here.

 

[GoofGoof]

There was absolutely no lack of discussion about EU before the official announcement.

Universal much, much less often announces things they don’t build. Sure, a lot (too much) was cut from EU, but Uni never cynically benefitted from announcing those attractions and then not building them. Disney announcements are PR largely divorced from the final project - it’s something to get the suckers at D23 excited or to cover the removal of a beloved ride and if it never gets built, so what? Disney won’t suffer.

I don’t disagree with any of this, but I still prefer the more open release of info even if that means sometimes being disappointed if it doesn’t happen.

 

[JD80]

The decade in question (more than a decade, actually) is the one ending in 2017. Which is why you’re listing things like Launch Bay, Meet and Greets, and Magic Bands to obscure it.

Poor Iger, powerless in the face of the mighty Chapek.

Are we talking about 2006 through 2016?

Did this really quick, ignored all the DVC and restaurant stuff.

2006 - Finding Nemo, Mission Space Alt, Expedition Everest
2007 - The Seas with Nemo and Friends, Laugh Floor, Grand Fiesta Tour
2008 - Toy Story Mania
2009 - American Idol
2010 - Main Street Electrical Parade
2011 - Disney Jr Live on Stage (also Free Wireless Internet 30 day Pilot), Star Tours Refurb
2012 - New Fantasyland, AoA
2013 - Magic Bands/Anna Elsa M&G/FP+/Galactic Spectacular
2014 - 7DMT, Path of the Jedi, Frozen Sing a Long
2015 - SW Launch Pay, Disney Springs (kinda)
2016 - Frozen Ever After

2010/2011 was pretty empty but it was full of New Fantasyland ramp up and Pandora announcement.

 

[JD80]

Wdw discussion board and people who are stakeholders as various levels and degrees here.

I just don't understand people strong opinion on announcement timing. It's interesting to discuss the whys and hows but I don't think it's worth having a strong reaction to.

 

[Blobbles]

My assumption is that the post show for SSE (Global Neighborhood area) will close first and open a lot earlier than the actual ride, there's an elevator near the entrance to that area that'll provide access to the presumed area it's going (the former sponsor lounge).

I wouldn't be shocked if the lounge opens while both are down and they provide a temporary pathway in and out to the lounge's elevator.

The lounge is opening in 2025, so I wouldn't be shocked if it's opening around the time the ride itself/post show closes. But I also don't expect it to close 2025...

I suspect SSE5 will be apart of Destination D23 like TT3 was, and close around early 2026. If we use Disney's old timeframe of a two year downtime like the last redo was planned to be it'll open back up around 2028. Maybe Global Neighborhood closes in late 2025 with a passage to the elevator for those wanting the lounge.

And if it opens during 2028, before August, which will be the 2nd to last before EPCOT50... That leaves a very obvious contender as the next in line for a make over. You feel me?

Of course a new CEO can see all these plans, laugh at them, chew them up, spit it out and all we have for EPCOT50 is EXPERIMENTAL PARTY CENTER OF TOMORROW.

I hate the wait for figment. We better get dreamfinder too for waiting this long. Figment 4.0 and villains opening in the same year would be crazy though. The year of wish fufillment anyone?

 

[Disstevefan1]

The decade in question (more than a decade, actually) is the one ending in 2017. Which is why you’re listing things like Launch Bay, Meet and Greets, and Magic Bands to obscure it.

Poor Iger, powerless in the face of the mighty Chapek.

I wonder if Iger appointed Chapek to have someone to blame?

 

[lazyboy97o]

That is my point. Not announcing EU didn’t mean nobody knew it was coming. Most of the major details were leaked out anyway. I am also sure stuff originally planned for EU was cut just like any Disney project. They have budgets and cost overruns too and Wall Street to impress. I guess my point is I actually prefer to have some concept art and details to discuss or debate. You just have to know going in that things will likely change. What’s the harm.

You also claimed there could be regulatory issues with holding off on announcements. Universal

There was absolutely no lack of discussion about EU before the official announcement.

Universal much, much less often announces things they don’t build. Sure, a lot (too much) was cut from EU, but Uni never cynically benefitted from announcing those attractions and then not building them. Disney announcements are PR largely divorced from the final project - it’s something to get the suckers at D23 excited or to cover the removal of a beloved ride and if it never gets built, so what? Disney won’t suffer.

Universal benefits from even fans who know things before they are announced pretending there are never any cuts.

I think you’re also way overstating how often Disney doesn’t follow through. Once you exclude COVID killing a lot of rather bad projects, there isn’t much recently that hasn’t happened. Main Street Theater is the biggest example and while a generally good idea was also going to be sub-par execution.

 

[Disstevefan1]

I think you’re also way overstating how often Disney doesn’t follow through.

This is my biggest gripe!

Disney announces stuff WAY TOO EARLY and so much is changed/cut from the early concept drawings.

 

[GoofGoof]

You also claimed there could be regulatory issues with holding off on announcements. Universal

Yep, Universal officially announced Epic Universe in a press release in August 2019 and discussion of the new park was in their SEC filings starting with the next filing. It was a material enough project to require disclosure.

 

[Blobbles]

I hate the wait for figment. We better get dreamfinder too for waiting this long. Figment 4.0 and villains opening in the same year would be crazy though. The year of wish fufillment anyone?

Furthermore, I worry inside out in Magic Eye could have a “Honey, I Shrunk The Audience” type effect where inside out characters overshadow Figment, and upper management decides inside out should be in the ride too, and we get “imaginary friend” figment with the emotions.

 

[GoofGoof]

This is my biggest gripe!

Disney announces stuff WAY TOO EARLY and so much is changed/cut from the early concept drawings.

Maybe I just look at it differently but if you know that going in then just take the concept art with a grain of salt Instead of expecting it to be representative of the exact finished product and then feeling disappointed. Concept art is more designed to elicit an emotional response to a new project than to lay out the schematics of the exact design. It’s supposed to give the vibe or “feeling” of the new attraction or land. I don’t disagree that a lot of details end up changing.

 

[Disstevefan1]

Maybe I just look at it differently but if you know that going in then just take the concept art with a grain of salt Instead of expecting it to be representative of the exact finished product and then feeling disappointed. Concept art is more designed to elicit an emotional response to a new project than to lay out the schematics of the exact design. It’s supposed to give the vibe or “feeling” of the new attraction or land. I don’t disagree that a lot of details end up changing.

I remember being surprised the concept rendering for Mission Space actually matched. I didn't think they were going to implement the curly bit on the pavilion.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Yep, Universal officially announced Epic Universe in a press release in August 2019 and discussion of the new park was in their SEC filings starting with the next filing. It was a material enough project to require disclosure.

And the thread here on the park started in 2018. Universal had been working on the park for years already. This is also earlier in the process than they usually acknowledge projects and they provided no details beyond it being a new park. If they had announced when Disney typically announces they would have announced in 2017.

 

[Gusey]

Maybe I just look at it differently but if you know that going in then just take the concept art with a grain of salt Instead of expecting it to be representative of the exact finished product and then feeling disappointed. Concept art is more designed to elicit an emotional response to a new project than to lay out the schematics of the exact design. It’s supposed to give the vibe or “feeling” of the new attraction or land. I don’t disagree that a lot of details end up changing.

Plus you can tell from some of the concept art how close a project is. Villains Land's is clearly just a bunch of ideas thrown together and not what the finished land will look like. Cars concept shows the footprint of the attraction but it's too blurry to see the exact details. The concept art for Tropical Americas and Monsters Inc Land is a lot more clearer than Cars and Villains, you can exactly where everything is going and small details like the Roz figure on one of the buildings

 

[AidenRodriguez731]

So why did they do the exact same thing by rushing to open Animal Kingdom less then a year before IoA?

Both Disney and Universal are deviating completely from past patterns when a new park opens. Historically, whether the new park is yours or the competition’s, you want to have new headliners opening at older parks to pull crowds. When IoA opened, for instance, the Studios had MiB ready to debut to lure crowds next door - and I’ve already listed the attractions Disney had ready. What we’re seeing with the opening of EU is a profound change in philosophy that is tremendously disadvantageous to consumers - and possibly to the older parks themselves.

"Why are 2 major companies changing their strategy that did not work before?"

I wonder...

 

[Disstevefan1]

And the thread here on the park started in 2018. Universal had been working on the park for years already. This is also earlier in the process than they usually acknowledge projects and they provided no details beyond it being a new park. If they had announced when Disney typically announces they would have announced in 2017.

I think providing no details was a good thing. For me, this went under the radar for a long time.

I need to ignore Disney announcements and just wait and see what gets built.

 

[MrPromey]

What decade is this?

2012 - New Fantasyland, AoA
2013 - Magic Bands/Anna Elsa M&G/FP+/Galactic Spectacular
2014 - 7DMT, Path of the Jedi, Frozen Sing a Long
2015 - SW Launch Pay, Disney Springs (kinda)
2016 - Frozen Ever After
2017 - Pandora, Rivers of Light, HEA
2018 - Toy Story Land
2019 - SWGE, Skyliner, Grand Destino Tower
2020 - MMRR
2021 - Remy, Enchantment, Harmonious (lol)
2022 - Guardians of the Galaxy
2023 - Tron, Journey of Water, HEA2, Epcot Re-do
2024 - TBA, Epcot Re-do

Because of Chapek, the two lightest years in the last 12 will be the next two.

WDW peaked in 2019 because it had a run up of three brand new lands in 2017, 2018 and 2019 which all were announced earlier in that decade.

We should see a similar attendance buildup as Villains is we did at SWGE.

We're clearly on two different wavelengths and for a lot of this. I think we'll have to agree to disagree.

My thoughts are involving things that increase attraction capacity and yours are on things like low-budget overlays*, resort/hotel room capacity increases and projects specifically designed to allow them to avoid increasing attraction capacity - the whole magicband FP+ project which is really a big part of what got us to where we are today in the parks.

You're right - they technically did do something when they opened Rivers of Light for a few months and when operations put in a few Christmas trees to offer a Frozen Sing Along as a stand-in for a real attraction to capitalize on the IP popularity that shockingly remains in this space to this day.

I was speaking to the period that ended with the opening of Pandora which you and Casper have since discussed.

Anyway, I'm willing to admit I forgot that NFL was a net gain of capacity although much of it was really shuffling around, relocating and/or closing of what had already been, if you're willing to admit MSEP coming back was a budget choice specifically done so as not to have to develop anything new when replacing the more modern parade it took the place of.

Also, listing NFL and SDMT as separate things feels more than a little disingenuous considering SDMT was the biggest part of NFL attraction-wise and just wasn't complete in time for the reopening of the rest of this redeveloped area.


*I'll concede that while being a square peg for a round hole in just about every conceivable way, FEA was not a cheaply done overlay.

 

[GoofGoof]

And the thread here on the park started in 2018. Universal had been working on the park for years already. This is also earlier in the process than they usually acknowledge projects and they provided no details beyond it being a new park. If they had announced when Disney typically announces they would have announced in 2017.

They bought the land back even before 2018 and most people assumed that was for another park. The public announcement was once the project officially kicked off. They didn’t give details at first which is pretty much on par for the way Universal operates.

For this round of projects at Disney the majority are supposedly going to break ground within a year or so of the D23 announcements so not as far in advance as 2017 for a project starting in the second half of 2019. Avatar was the one exception, but that required the acquisition of the theme park rights which had its own announcement well before construction was expected. But that was a deal between 2 publicly traded companies so Disney didn’t fully control the timing.