Monorail Expansion?

[MKCustodial]

Re: are you kidding??

Originally posted by freediverdude
Turkey Leg Boy, you have GOT to be kidding me. I personally have waited over 45 minutes to get buses to Caribbean Beach before, as have many other people I know. Especially the value and moderates, their bus stops are always mobbed and can't even pick up everyone there when they stop! Why do you think they have that "back and forth" cattle line going in front of the bus stops in some places? The buses are noisy, jarring, smoke spewing cattle cars that can't handle the type of crowds at park exits and openings.

Well, just as you know a lot of people who had problems with the buses, I for one didn't have a single headache during my time at All-Stars Music. The buses were great, and quick.

 

[Dizneydude87]

Geesh! Is this post page thing gonna make a record, it's already 5 pages! Lol. this is kinda neet.
D
R
O
P... IMHO (which won't amount to much, and prolly' will never happen) I think disney should build a central area for ALL the parking. And have monorails going out from there. I know it wouldnt happen, just something to ponder about when I am bored.:hammer:

 

[no2apprentice]

Plpeters70, are these automated monorails part of a civic mass transit, or at the Disney resort?

I ask because I can see automated doors not being a problem on a mass transit system, especially in Japan. But I can see a big problem with automated doors on the WDW monorail. There's that "lowest common denominator" that has to be considered. People aren't in a hurry to get to work, they're on vacation: they want to be convenienced, not inconvenienced, especially at WDW.

I can picture some toddler that the parent isn't watching closely, step into the path of the automatic closing door. I know that pressure sensors are in the end of those doors, but a crying child will anger a parent, and we all know where it goes from there.

 

[TURKEY]

Re: are you kidding??

Originally posted by freediverdude
Turkey Leg Boy, you have GOT to be kidding me. I personally have waited over 45 minutes to get buses to Caribbean Beach before, as have many other people I know. Especially the value and moderates, their bus stops are always mobbed and can't even pick up everyone there when they stop! Why do you think they have that "back and forth" cattle line going in front of the bus stops in some places? The buses are noisy, jarring, smoke spewing cattle cars that can't handle the type of crowds at park exits and openings.

What's the difference in missing a bus and missing a monorail?

I've had to wait over 20 minutes before BOARDING a bus. They way I understood your first post was waiting 20 minutes before a bus ARRIVED.

 

[jmarc63]

Originally posted by Fantasia Boi
Okay... I have time for a quick reply before I head off for work...

Longer stops would occur because you have larger trains. During peak times, you have more people getting in and out... During slow times, you have those folks who will walk alllllllllllll the way down to the end of the train looking for the best seat. My estimation for the average dwell time for an expanded Disney train would be 2 minutes for peak time, and 5 minutes for non-peak time.


Also, longer trains mean larger beams and larger stations. A full size monorail capable of holding 1000 people... that's a *LARGE* train. At thatsize, you get to the point where it's so huge, it looses the magic and becomes impersonal. (In addition to not being able to fit in a lot of places)

As stated before, the Contemporary cannot handle larger trains, as such the guests would have to transfer at the TTC and board the already maxed out current system, creating huge lines, and angry guests.

As for staggering the park closing times... that's not something Transportation has any power over. There will be times when Epcot, MK, and Studios will all close at 9pm.

And in regards to transfers... 0 transfers is the goal. It's EASY, and it's quick. Total travel time, you want no more than 20 minutes on average. (Most of our routes are 13-15)


If someone can design a transportation system that takes the following rules into account... then we might have a winner.


1.) It must be able to be flexible. Traffic flows often change. It must be able to shrink and grow with demand.
2.) It must be able to handle the mass crowds of a park exit with speed and efficiency.
3.) It must be Direct. All transfers must be kept to a bare minimum. All resorts must have direct access to the 4 main theme parks.
4.) It must not interfere with the theming of the resort. Any transportation system must blend in, and not distract from the theming.
5.) A transportation station must be a maximum of a 5 minute walk from all guest rooms.
6.) It must meet all federal ADA laws (Americans with Disabilites Act). However, not only must it be accessible, it must be EASILY accessible.
7.) It must be quick and efficient. Guests must be able to travel between resort and theme park in less than 20 minutes.
8.) It must come frequently. Guests should not have to wait more than 15 minutes for transportation.
9.) It must be Cost Feasible. By this, I mean, not outlandishly expensive, and within reason. It also must be paid by the resorts that it will service.
10.) The priority areas are All Stars and Pop Century... the Value resorts, and the ones that have the lesser room rates. Secondary concern areas would be Port Orleans, and Caribbean Beach.

Fantasia Boi

I was wondering if you had access to the any of the master plans boards. there three pictures that are posted under the masterplans link on the home page here. The photos dont show much of what they were proposing for the future Monorail expansion. I would like to see what they thought of doing before the broke our hearts and killed the Monorail expansion.

If you do if you could post some beter pics of these we all here could get a sense of what some of you here on the boards are saying about the loading senarios and the reason why disney doesn't want to do it saying that it isnt feasable to use the monorail as the future transportation for WDW.

Also mentioned on steves whats new posting from 2000 the officials said that a new transportation system was comming in 18 months, what happened with that , it should have been up and running already and didn't someone post some time back aswell that they were clearing land somewhere to start, Where is that area and Have they done that yet? or is nothing being done at all at this time?

 

[TURKEY]

Originally posted by jmarc63

Also mentioned on steves whats new posting from 2000 the officials said that a new transportation system was comming in 18 months, what happened with that , it should have been up and running already and didn't someone post some time back aswell that they were clearing land somewhere to start, Where is that area and Have they done that yet? or is nothing being done at all at this time?

They've started getting new buses. I can't remember the name of them right now, but I think they are larger and cleaner burning than the older models.

I don't know if that's part of what you're talking about or not.

 

[jmarc63]

Originally posted by turkey leg boy


They've started getting new buses. I can't remember the name of them right now, but I think they are larger and cleaner burning than the older models.

I don't know if that's part of what you're talking about or not.

Actually I was led to beleive from Al wieses coments it was the Light Rail/People mover system that they have at west virgina university??

 

[jmarc63]

Posted by John over at Intercot :
Quote:
We have obtained information from a very reliable source that Disney Executives have recently given approval for this expansion. The Monorail system is also set for a huge expansion with construction beginning as early as 2007 on a dual beam system to all four parks, which will eliminate the need to transfer at the Ticket and Transportation Center.


I just found this Quote on another rumor site. Who's right who's wrong??? Given past history with disney rumors with attractions my feeling is that they dont want to say what there going to do untill they do it. Like opening new parks they dont tell the exact date a new park is opening untill right before it does or a new hotel, even when you call them to ask.

 

[TURKEY]

I don't think Intercot is very reliable and I don't pay very close attention to what they say.

 

[Invero]

Originally posted by plpeters70
I want to ask this once again, what if these monorails were AUTOMATED like the new monorails in Tokyo -- meaning they have a set time limit in the station and have automatic doors that open and close at specific times?? Wouldn't this cut down on the time it takes to load?

Well... I'm not quite sure how those trains operate... they could operate under two different ways. The first being similar to other transit systems. The train automatically drives itself... and the doors are opened/closed by a "Conductor" that rides on board. Or, they could be 100% automatic.

If they do use a human to open/close the doors, you will run into the same scenario... 2-5min station times. If they are completely automated, you *MIGHT* have lesser dwell times, however, you will have VERY MANY upset guests when they get seperated from thier parties as the train doors close while Daddy is folding the stroller outside the train.

 

[Invero]

Re: transport plan

Originally posted by freediverdude
although I don't see why they couldn't keep the original monorail loops for just the parking lot and CR and PR and GF, and have these other monorails be separate.

Because there is no room. Not to mention, the MK entrance would look VERY cluttered with 4 or 5 monorail beams all over the place.

Originally posted by freediverdude
Do the buses have this kind of capacity at 60 people per bus? I doubt it. 10 buses could only remove about 600 people, and then they have to wait another 20 minutes for the next $&%& one.

Okay... first... the busses hold a real-time actual count of 72 people. Second, during park exits, we arrive into the MK at one bus per 30 seconds, on average. Also during park exits, we will often times Double Load a bus for busy areas such as PO, CBR, and ASR. It takes about 3-4 minutes to board those 144 people onto the two busses. Times that by Sports, Music, Movies, Riverside, Caribbean. That's 720. Plus the single loaded zones... S/D, YBB, FQ, AKL, OKW, and CSR... that's another 432.

That's 1152 per 3-4 minutes, which would bring an estimated 17,000 people moved in one hour. All done with flexibility, and direct travel. No transfers.

 

[Invero]

Re: are you kidding??

Originally posted by freediverdude
I personally have waited over 45 minutes to get buses to Caribbean Beach before, as have many other people I know. [...] The buses are noisy, jarring, smoke spewing cattle cars that can't handle the type of crowds at park exits and openings.

I'm sorry... but I'm trying to figure out how you waited for 45 minutes for a bus to CBR. Even during the super busy Fourth of July, when the parks reached capacity... we never had anyone wait that long.

Now let's take a look at the other phrase... Noisy... well, yeah, but the screaming kids aren't part of the bus. They will follow you on any form of transit.

Jarring... I can't really comment on that... that's all based on the driver, I guess.

"Smoke Spewing Cattle Cars"... LOL... obviously you've never been "herded" onto a Monorail at night. (The smoke is located at the power plant)

And finally, "Cant handle the type of Crowds at Park Exit and Openings"... Well... I dunno, we seem to handle it pretty well. 99% of the guests that get off my bus are always smiling, and thank me for the enjoyable ride.

 

[Tot Fan]

Question and thought!

Don't you think instead of buying new buses and spending more money on gas to run the air polluters, why doesn't Disney think out of the box and put that money towards a monorail that would connect everything? Just a quick thought I'd throw in. BYE!

 

[The_CEO]

Re: Question and thought!

Originally posted by Tot Fan
Don't you think instead of buying new buses and spending more money on gas to run the air polluters, why doesn't Disney think out of the box and put that money towards a monorail that would connect everything? Just a quick thought I'd throw in. BYE!

Dont Monorails run on gas ? lol <---- dumby!

 

[Monorail Lime]

Originally posted by Fantasia Boi
you will have VERY MANY upset guests when they get seperated from thier parties as the train doors close while Daddy is folding the stroller outside the train.

I love the automated monorails at Tokyo Disneyland. It's ashame that they'd never work here because Americans don't understand how to ride on trains.

As far as I can tell they are totally automated. Like the regular Japanese trains, there are musical tones that let you know the doors are about to close. If something is obstructing the door it opens a little but quickly tries to slam again... no holding it for your party!

If you stopped in the doorway of a train in a busy Japanese station to unfold a stroller you would get TRAMPLED.

 

[jmarc63]

Re: Re: Question and thought!

Originally posted by the_ceo_at_wdw


Dont Monorails run on gas ? lol <---- dumby!

Justin, you really burn me up asking such a reveling question as that , you dont know much about WDW.

The monorail run on electricity there is a metal rail that runs along the beam on both sides. It is located a few inches from the bottom of the beam. On the under carrage of each train there are at least two shoes on each side that make contact with this electrified rail to send power to each motor on the train.

The design is very simular to rapid transit systems that use the "Third rail" concept to power their trains.
Maybe Fantasia Boi can comfirm this to you.

MONORAILS RULE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Monorail Lime]

Re: Re: Re: Question and thought!

Originally posted by jmarc63
The monorail run on electricity there is a metal rail that runs along the beam on both sides. It is located a few inches from the bottom of the beam. On the under carrage of each train there are at least two shoes on each side that make contact with this electrified rail to send power to each moter on each train.

It's called a Buss Bar and it carries 600 volts DC. The "shoes" glide along the beam with little friction thanks to carbon.

 

[jmarc63]

Thanks Lime for filling in the blanks been a long day and my mind is on school and work.


MONORAILS RULE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[TURKEY]

Electricity has to be generated somewhere by using the same fossil fuels that buses do.

 

[garyhoov]

Electricity has to be generated somewhere by using the same fossil fuels that buses do.

Valid point (though nuclear, hydroelectric, solar, wind etc. can't be forgotten) and important to remeber when we are concerned with saving the planet. However, when it comes to a cleaner Disney experience, I would selfishly prefer to have my pollution elsewhere.