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Mickey and Minnie's Runaway Railway confirmed

MansionButler84

Well-Known Member
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I don't want to burst anyone's bubble, but it's hard to imagine a more useless discussion than debating how a ticket system that's been extinct for nearly 40 years would apply to current theme park rides. There's no way to prove your argument.
Yes but while the original use of the System is gone, its nomenclature is, if anything, used more widely than ever in the industry-at-large. The fact that it is subjective makes it all the better for a discussion forum. At least it’s not a discussion of monorail expansion, strollers for 12-year-olds, or people smoking on rides before experiencing dracarys on gondolas.
 

Brer Oswald

Well-Known Member
Wow it just occurred to me that y'all haven't had one of those massive yet fruitless E-ticket debates for a long while.



Let's not even pretend that looks anything like the new animation. Just look at the two pictures... one goofy looks like he just came out of a sewer high and doesn't really give a **** about life, the other is far closer in appearance and attitude to the goofy we see in the parks today. Which you like better is up to you, but the new goofy is distinctly different than just about anything produced in the past.
The comment against the design was a lack of pants, to which I provided proof that it was a callback to when he didn’t wear pants. I wasn’t comparing overall designs.
 
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kap91

Well-Known Member
I have not seen any proof that FoP is 8k. And it doesn't really matter. 4k is MORE than enough for the imperfect human eyeballs that are viewing the video. IMAX film is arguably 8k or more, but again, your eyes simply can't see it. FoP is definitely crisper than Soarin' 1.0, ot 2.0, was.

There is most definitely warping on the edges of FoP. The strobe start is cool, but hardly new.

The motion is more than Soarin', but the video is purposely low on action to keep motion sickness down to please the masses it is targeted to.
Flight of Passage's ride film is 10k at 60FPS. It also uses the latest generation laser projectors which allow for perfect black levels and much brighter highlights than traditional projectors, increasing the overall contrast, which increases color depth, which increases perceived resolution. In short it's a hell of lot better quality than IMAX 70mm.

It's also not entirely accurate to say that human eyes can't perceive the difference between 2k and 4k. On a traditional movie screen (and certainly on a home TV) that's absolutely true, but at the scale of the projections in FOP or any large format theatre. You'd definitely notice. Same for 8k. Above that it's hard to say - but I imagine the non-standard 10k resolution was chosen based on specific reasons and tests.

 

kap91

Well-Known Member
Nah, just always find it amusing when Disney announces an all screen ride and it's praised, and Universal is panned.

If this is Pooh's Hunny Hunt with screens, and some Ratatouille added (actually much below PHH), then it will be a great ride. If it has a lot of Mystic Manor type stuff added, it would be fantastic, but since the whole world will likely be projected, that wouldn't add much.
Because when Universal build's a screen based ride - it's literally just a bunch of rooms with one large screen and you watch a movie. In some cases, the screens barely even have sets connecting them.

Disney, on the other hand has been steadily moving towards using screens and projections in novel ways - with multiple layers and integrating them well into a built environment or on animatronics. This ride in particular is using groundbreaking amounts of projecting onto moving shapeshifting objects, something that has never really been seen before, especially on this scale along with a clever use of an existing ride system and an interesting premise. So yeah, I'm excited.
 

Marc Davis Fan

Well-Known Member
I simply don't get the TRON praise. I was so hoping they would fix the theming in the US, but all signs point to another TRON ride devoid of TRON set dressings.
Answer this: have you been to Shanghai Disneyland? Simple answer. Yes or no. Don’t talk around it.
Also you can not rate a rollercoaster without having been on it, the experience is completly different.
I've had the good fortune to visit Shanghai Disneyland, and unfortunately, I found TRON to be... just ok. It will certainly be a solid addition to MK's lineup - it's wonderful to have a new e-ticket in the park, and I think everyone here will enjoy the ride - but I also don't think it will blow most of you away. It reminded me of a motorbike version of RnRC - launch, dark room with minimal lit-up sets, soundtrack. Exactly what it looks like in the videos. It's also quite mild from a thrill standpoint (which obviously you can't really tell from the videos). That said, most of the guests I watched exiting the attraction seemed VERY happy and impressed. Overall, I'm looking forward to having another fun roller coaster to ride at MK, while also realizing that it's nothing more than just another fun roller coaster to ride at MK.

Too bad it's not called "TRON Mountain," though.

Edit: After reading all these TRON-related posts, I forgot this was the Runaway Railway thread rather than the TRON thread. If we want to talk about TRON, we should probably move it to the TRON thread. If people have "TRON ride experiences" questions that you want me or others who've been on it to answer, feel free to tag me/them in the TRON thread.
 
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glendroid

Active Member
Nope. I've yet to visit HK Or Shanghai. But that sure doesn't mean I can't judge the TRON coaster from the layout, videos, and knowledge of Vekoma motorbike coasters. I have seen both TRON movies, I really doubt the Imagineers did. I think they bought the Soundtrack, saw the Light Cycle at the Comicon Flynn's Arcade, and thought they could make a TRON RIDE.

Is RnRC an E ticket? It's literally a clone of a VERY poorly rated coaster that is uncovered. So, is putting a poorly rated coaster inside, adding unsynchronized music to it, some flashing lights, and plywood cutouts the secret recipe to an E ticket? if Kings Dominion and Island were to fill their Flight of Fear buildings with alien cutouts, and add the Mars Attacks soundtrack, I'm pretty sure absolutely NO ONE would say they've built Disney E ticket quality coasters.

What parks have you been to, since we're comparing notes?
I've been to all multiple times except for Paris. Tron like most rides is more than a sum of it's parts. It's impossible to ride Tron and not come off that ride without a smile on your face. It's a great experience... Not distinctly Tron as you've mentioned, but it's Tron enough and it's truly great in person.
 

Hawg G

Active Member
Flight of Passage's ride film is 10k at 60FPS. It also uses the latest generation laser projectors which allow for perfect black levels and much brighter highlights than traditional projectors, increasing the overall contrast, which increases color depth, which increases perceived resolution. In short it's a hell of lot better quality than IMAX 70mm.

It's also not entirely accurate to say that human eyes can't perceive the difference between 2k and 4k. On a traditional movie screen (and certainly on a home TV) that's absolutely true, but at the scale of the projections in FOP or any large format theatre. You'd definitely notice. Same for 8k. Above that it's hard to say - but I imagine the non-standard 10k resolution was chosen based on specific reasons and tests.

The ride is apparently projected at 10k, but could be upscaled to that (most likely). They dance around actual render resolution in that article, and I really doubt it's a coincidence. The angle of view in FoP isn't all that much larger than a modern theater's main auditorium. Definitely not double, width wise, if you sit in the sweet spot for movies. Add in that you are moving, which is going to severely hinder your ability to discern pixels, and I still highly doubt 95% of viewers would notice if it was 4k. And the other 5% probably sit 15 feet from their awesome 4k TV at home.

I'm just a loon right? Well, let's dig into details.

Using this distance graph, for 4k, the slope is about 8 feet per 120 inches.

https://www.thx.com/assets/uploads/2017/01/1-ghF7Unj-vk60wyKUiVy4EQ.jpeg

FoP's screen is said to be 70' x 100' so the diagonal is about 1500", assuming no curve. So for 4k to be fully seen at 1500", you'd need to be at least within 96 feet of the screen. For a 1080p image (half resolution of 4k), it looks about half the slope. I don't know for sure, but we'll assume 8k is half the slope of 4k. If we extrapolated that, then for an 8k resolution, at 100", you would need to be about 4 feet, or 60 feet for FoP. And I'll be darn, the center of the screen is about 30 feet from the center seats, of that. But, the farther you get out, you quickly start getting 60 feet away for parts of the screen. So, it does seem most seats are close enough to see 8k, with some assumptions.

However, I felt the edges, that some people are VERY close to, are blurry, and anyone not in the center seats is more than 60 feet from the other side of the screen.

Add in the screen is curved, and actually MUCH wider, by linear inches, than 100 feet, so it's sorta unclear what the horizontal resolution is. 10k should be the vertical resolution, but that would assume 100 linear feet of screen width, when it is probably closer to 150

So, taking in to account the motion, the fact most folks are likely more than the maximum distance away to truly even see 8k in half of the screen (especially taking into account 2/3 of the people are above or below the sweet spot by a good distance), and I have a real hard time believing they rendered at 8k. It would have been quite a waste.

I once found this INCREDIBLE video about what you eye can really see. By the cinematographer of The Last Jedi, among other films. It's very long, but is about as visual fact based as I've seen. Ultimately, it proves that even in a local theater 4k is unnecessary. And those screens can get to be equal to 1/2 the dimensions of the FoP screen. A GREAT watch, if you're a big time theater nerd.

http://yedlin.net/ResDemo/ResDemoPt2.html

What does all this mean? They may be projecting in 10k (not sure how, since I can't see it being more than 2 4k projectors on top of each other. Hell, it may have even been rendered in 10k (but I just don't believe that, maybe 5k per eye, which is sorta what "4k" home projectors do with pixel shift). But, ultimately, even 4k would have been enough for the vast majority of people, especially at 60 fps, and taking in to account your eyes are moving MUCH more than they do in a regular theater. Plus, they are looking through old 3D glasses with scratches, and multiple layers of distorting plastic in them.
 
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TJJohn12

Well-Known Member
The ride is apparently projected at 10k, but could be upscaled to that (most likely). They dance around actual render resolution in that article, and I really doubt it's a coincidence. The angle of view in FoP isn't all that much larger than a modern theater's main auditorium. Definitely not double, width wise, if you sit in the sweet spot for movies. Add in that you are moving, which is going to severely hinder your ability to discern pixels, and I still highly doubt 95% of viewers would notice if it was 4k. And the other 5% probably sit 15 feet from their awesome 4k TV at home.

I'm just a loon right? Well, let's dig into details.

Using this distance graph, for 4k, the slope is about 8 feet per 120 inches.

https://www.thx.com/assets/uploads/2017/01/1-ghF7Unj-vk60wyKUiVy4EQ.jpeg

FoP's screen is said to be 70' x 100' so the diagonal is about 1500", assuming no curve. So for 4k to be fully seen at 1500", you'd need to be at least within 96 feet of the screen. For a 1080p image (half resolution of 4k), it looks about half the slope. I don't know for sure, but we'll assume 8k is half the slope of 4k. If we extrapolated that, then for an 8k resolution, at 100", you would need to be about 4 feet, or 60 feet for FoP. And I'll be darn, the center of the screen is about 30 feet from the center seats, of that. But, the farther you get out, you quickly start getting 60 feet away for parts of the screen. So, it does seem most seats are close enough to see 8k, with some assumptions.

However, I felt the edges, that some people are VERY close to, are blurry, and anyone not in the center seats is more than 60 feet from the other side of the screen.

Add in the screen is curved, and actually MUCH wider, by linear inches, than 100 feet, so it's sorta unclear what the horizontal resolution is. 10k should be the horizontal resolution, but that would assume 100 linear feet of screen width, when it is probably closer to 150

So, taking in to account the motion, the fact most folks are likely more than the maximum distance away to truly even see 8k in half of the screen (especially taking into account 2/3 of the people are above or below the sweet spot by a good distance), and I have a real hard time believing they rendered at 8k. It would have been quite a waste.

I once found this INCREDIBLE video about what you eye can really see. By the cinematographer of The Last Jedi, among other films. It's very long, but is about as visual fact based as I've seen. Ultimately, it proves that even in a local theater 4k is unnecessary. And those screens can get to be equal to 1/2 the dimensions of the FoP screen. A GREAT watch, if you're a big time theater nerd.

http://yedlin.net/ResDemo/ResDemoPt2.html

What does all this mean? They may be projecting in 10k (not sure how, since I can't see it being more than 2 4k projectors on top of each other. Hell, it may have even been rendered in 10k (but I just don't believe that, maybe 5k per eye). But, ultimately, even 4k would have been enough for the vast majority of people, especially at 60 fps, and taking in to account your eyes are moving MUCH more than they do in a regular theater. Plus, they are looking through old 3D glasses with scratches, and multiple layers of distorting plastic in them.
Cool story, bro. You do know that this thread is about MMRR, right? There’s plenty of other threads in this forum besides this one - which is again about MMRR - and the couple Star Wars threads your activity log shows that you randomly pop into. There are literally active threads on *every* ride you’ve griped about in this one that’s supposed to be about MMRR.

Try working on becoming an actual member of the community and interacting with a tiny bit of humility. You are not the sole arbiter of the concept of quality.
 

Hawg G

Active Member
Cool story, bro. You do know that this thread is about MMRR, right? There’s plenty of other threads in this forum besides this one - which is again about MMRR - and the couple Star Wars threads your activity log shows that you randomly pop into. There are literally active threads on *every* ride you’ve griped about in this one that’s supposed to be about MMRR.

Try working on becoming an actual member of the community and interacting with a tiny bit of humility. You are not the sole arbiter of the concept of quality.
Thanks for responding.
 

BlakeW39

Well-Known Member
You know, I am not super excited for some of the E-tickets coming to the parks. I am excited, but not that excited. I was thinkinh abiut making a thread which can draw some people in to give some info about all of them. That said Tron I am only so excited for. It's not hype for me. Guardians I would be... if it were going to a more thematically relevant spot. I was for Star Wars but then heard it's not so great. But MMRR I am genuinely very excited for. It looks to be actually top notch. Honestly it would be great to have it in our castle park but DHS needs it more. Any idea how long it will be?
 

embracejg

Well-Known Member
Because when Universal build's a screen based ride - it's literally just a bunch of rooms with one large screen and you watch a movie. In some cases, the screens barely even have sets connecting them.

Disney, on the other hand has been steadily moving towards using screens and projections in novel ways - with multiple layers and integrating them well into a built environment or on animatronics.
Literally just described Harry Potter and the Forbidden Journey in that last sentence.

Please don't mistake this for defending Kong or Fast & Furious.
 

BlakeW39

Well-Known Member
Literally just described Harry Potter and the Forbidden Journey in that last sentence.

Please don't mistake this for defending Kong or Fast & Furious.
HP:FJ is worldclass and is on par with the best from Disney. It and Spider-Man are the exception, not the rule. Look at the mess that is Universal Studios. And why does Universal have 3 parks. They're just the samw thing. Sadly Disney is moving towards this but seriously it's on a template of IoA with differwnt IPs swapped.
 

Hawg G

Active Member
HP:FJ is worldclass and is on par with the best from Disney. It and Spider-Man are the exception, not the rule. Look at the mess that is Universal Studios. And why does Universal have 3 parks. They're just the samw thing. Sadly Disney is moving towards this but seriously it's on a template of IoA with differwnt IPs swapped.
What has Disney done, truly world class, lately? Especially state side? Disney rides are combinations, and progressions. Universal does the mind blowing E tickets now. They also do C and D tickets, and don't tout them all as the best thing ever.

MMRR and RotR MAY be world class. But we really don't know yet. And it wasn't too long ago that those "in the know" folks said Smuggler's Run was so much more advanced than Star Tours, and was going to blow our minds.

Ummm, yeah, I guess the CMs are keeping all that secret.
 

BlakeW39

Well-Known Member
What has Disney done, truly world class, lately? Especially state side? Disney rides are combinations, and progressions. Universal does the mind blowing E tickets now. They also do C and D tickets, and don't tout them all as the best thing ever.

MMRR and RotR MAY be world class. But we really don't know yet. And it wasn't too long ago that those "in the know" folks said Smuggler's Run was so much more advanced than Star Tours, and was going to blow our minds.

Ummm, yeah, I guess the CMs are keeping all that secret.
All rides are progressions, what you think FJ popped out of nowhere? No, there were precursors which paved the way for it in the same way that there were those for new Disney rides. And those precursors were for FJ were Disnet attractions, classic Disney ride elements used together to make something unique; yet not with without predecessors.

Whatever you are trying to take away from FoP is pointless, it is a ride unique in itself as is FJ and is every bit as revolutionary as Harry, if not moreso. For all the faults Disney has, they have been crafting great themed entertainment for decades. Unpopular opinion, Universal Studios is a STAIN on Orlando theme parks in comparison to even DHS. It has no theme, just a cluster of mess, it has awful D ticket and C ticket attractions (yes they are admitted to be D and C, but they are still bad ones), and not one great E. Not one.

IoA is a very good park.
 
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