Low crowd trends? Is this true?

[maryszhi]

it is possible bc of potter, people are waiting all day and not even getting in. i leave thursday and the lady on the phone when i made dinner reservations said we have openings in all in disney studios. when i asked about crowds, she said they were down. she said no to worry bc tech. disney owns a huge part of unviersal stuidos by owning marvel. also the vanity will eventually wear off and it will become normal crowding. anyways i am interested to see this for my self. btw i have an inking ioa will be #1 most visited for this year..

 

[angelsteve]

Crowds and discounts

I am new to the boards, but do go about every other year to Disney, sometimes yearly. One of the reasons we are getting to go so frequently is because of the great discounts that have been offered by Disney. Please say it is not true that the are going to be cutting back on these. We sure will not get to visit so often. We are trying early February for the first time this year. Went October last year, it was terribly hot and crowded.

 

[stuart]

Just back from two weeks at the world, 28th june to 10th july and the crowds were certainly down on what they have been the last few years. MK on the 3rd from 6pm till after the fireworks was reallly quiet, not even the constant light rain could account for that. EPCOT on the 4th was also quieter than normal, and from talking to a CM we know rather well, attendance was much lower than predicted.

We were speaking to a few people at times and both said they were never normally there in July, and reading up, expected there to be larger crowds but were a lot lower than what they expected.

 

[tirian]

Well I was at MK saturday night 10th I was really surprised crowds were light walked on POTC and that was after the first parade peter pan was the only one the had a real wait 50 mins haunted mansion walked on went to EPCOT Sunday and crowds were really light I told my wife it felt like a ghost town even Captain EO was walk on no wait for nemo or SE It was nice and scary at the same time . Also Seaworld has taken a pretty good hit also from some people that I talked to .

By summer standards, the MK was practically dead Saturday. I was shocked.

(Space Mt. and PPF maintained long waits.)

 

[cslafferty]

I posted earlier in this thread, but I'll say it again - I'm sure it's due more to the economy than to HP. And, because of that, I'll bet the crowds are going to pick up during the "off season" when the free dining kicks in . . . right when I get there on Aug 16th!

 

[tirian]

I posted earlier in this thread, but I'll say it again - I'm sure it's due more to the economy than to HP. And, because of that, I'll bet the crowds are going to pick up during the "off season" when the free dining kicks in . . . right when I get there on Aug 16th!

Yeah, now that we're heading for a double-dip recession (and supposedly, it'll be worse this time), people are holding onto their money tighter than ever.

HP is a great land, but it isn't going to empty WDW.

 

[maryszhi]

i also think disney needs to cut back ticket prices and other costs. most places are charging less, instead disney is charging more

 

[stlbobby]

Yes, MK hit capacity on the 4th.

I don't think the Harry Potter thing will be big for long, it's a trend that's huge now yes, but so was Pokemon and many other fads, it'll die eventually, and Disney did plan for this, look at all the expanding they are doing, Fantasyland in WDW, Disney Cruise Line, Disneyland, Disneyland Hong Kong, etc. I was there for the weekend (July 1-5) and it was good crowds, busy on the 4th of course, and MK seemed to have a good crowd on the 3rd, especially when everyone left after the fireworks!

Just back from two weeks at the world, 28th june to 10th july and the crowds were certainly down on what they have been the last few years. MK on the 3rd from 6pm till after the fireworks was reallly quiet, not even the constant light rain could account for that. EPCOT on the 4th was also quieter than normal, and from talking to a CM we know rather well, attendance was much lower than predicted.

We were speaking to a few people at times and both said they were never normally there in July, and reading up, expected there to be larger crowds but were a lot lower than what they expected.

I wish they would just release the actual numbers so we could have real evidence since there are completely conflicting reports.

According two these two posts MK hit capacity, yet the crowd was less than expected. I'm not saying anyone is wrong or lying, I just think perception is a big part of things even for CM's.

I haven't been down this summer, but I do know that the resort rooms at WDW are filling pretty well to the point when I was considering an impromptu trip over the 4th there was a very small selection of rooms, especially at the value level.

If there is a lull, there are way too many factors to blame than just Harry. The economy, weather, and oil spill are all affecting travel especially to Florida. I am sure Harry has had an affect, but I'm not sure what it is. Does Harry take days away from WDW? Probably? But does he bring more people to Central Florida? Probably. Do some of those people end up at WDW for a few days? Probably.

Is Harry the big thing right now? Absolutely. Will that fade? Absolutely. Will it continue to be a draw years from now? Absolutely. Is it going to close down WDW? Absolutely not. Will it prompt Disney to make huge changes? Maybe, maybe not, I'm sure many new attractions will be opening in the next 5 years but are these directly because of Harry, or just part of the natural progression of things?

Finally, if the huge crowds at Harry do prompt Disney to make something huge happen, we won't see it for some time. If they started planning something really big today I think an optimistic opening is 2 to 3 years away. If they just push something they already have in the pipeline forward that might be sped up, but if they broke ground today on a huge new E-ticket the Harry-mania would already be waning by the soft opening.

It's better that they take their time, use their initiative, and creativity, to build something great rather than just react.

 

[prberk]

Epcot seemed to be pretty dead around 7 pm ish today. I was kinda shocked.

Hasn't anyone ever noticed that the reservation prices ALWAYS drop on July 5 or soon thereafter? I think late Summer has always been perceived as steady but not particularly busy for Disney. I think most people just think of it as too hot a time to go. That's what I always hear from my friends when I say anything about going in late summer.

They don't seem to realize that it is just as hot and muggy here, but without the nice breezes and predictable afternon thunderstorm for cooling off...

Paul

 

[AndyMagic]

disney owns a huge part of unviersal stuidos by owning marvel.

This is false. Disney owns Marvel but doesn't own any part of Universal. Universal pays a small licensing fee to Marvel so they can use the characters in the parks. If attendance increases at the Universal parks it doesn't increase the fee they owe to Marvel so an increase of people at Universal doesn't help Disney in the slightest.

 

[marypoppins68]

I was at Epcot today and it seemed pretty busy. Lots of Tour Groups. 90 minutes for Test Track. 60 minutes for Soarin'. It was also hot and humid. It rained for a short time around noon. Seemed like a regular July day.

 

[Biff215]

btw i have an inking ioa will be #1 most visited for this year..

Most visited Universal park? Maybe. Most visited anywhere? Not even close. They will no doubt get a bump from this, but as the lines show, IoA and specifically WWoHP do not have the kind of capacity to ever challenge MK or DL.

 

[stlbobby]

This is false. Disney owns Marvel but doesn't own any part of Universal. Universal pays a small licensing fee to Marvel so they can use the characters in the parks. If attendance increases at the Universal parks it doesn't increase the fee they owe to Marvel so an increase of people at Universal doesn't help Disney in the slightest.

Do you know this for sure, because I have seen posters state that Disney does get a percentage based on attendance and ride usage. Others have said it is a strict licensing fee.

 

[wm49rs]

Do you know this for sure, because I have seen posters state that Disney does get a percentage based on attendance and ride usage. Others have said it is a strict licensing fee.

They collect a licensing fee on the Marvel rides at Universal. But it's not based on percentages or attendance. It is a simple fee.

 

[slappy magoo]

If there is a decline in attendance, I wonder how much (if any) could be attributed to the possibility that WDW is becoming overpriced? Not just in the current climate of the economy, but in general?

I know, there are always promotions and specials to be found for people looking to go to WDW, and perhaps the diehards on a forum like this might not be the best place to ask. But there is always a perception that Disney is much more expensive than other vacations (in fact, it's comparable to vacations to metro areas that are also popular vacation destinations). Nonetheless, prices of tickets and resort rooms (minus promos) tend to increase higher than the rate of inflation...and WDW tends to attract a lot of repeat guests. Maybe the repeat guest aren't repeating as often as they usually do. Instead of every year, or multiple times a year, they're taking a year off (gotta compensate for that decimated 401K somehow, right?).

I've said this in other threads, but I think WDW is reaching a tipping point where the impression of it being a tremendous expense (and the reality that it IS a tremendous expense for many people) is coming back to bite them on the butt. They've employed a pricing structure similar to department stores who have ridiculous prices on their clothes to begin with, so a half-off sale makes their merchandise affordable while still maintaining a certain aura of prestige. WDW prices their services ridiculously high, so the discounts, where they still take in an impressive profit, comes off as a bargain in comparision. But you can only stretch that concept so far, and perhaps it's at a snapping point.

Another (lesser) factor that may come into play: Diehard Disneyphiles might be waiting for there to be more. The FL expansion, more at DTD, enough new to make the trip much more interesting.

 

[Ignohippo]

It is obvious that the economy certainly has had an impact but Universal is up by 300% so it's not affecting them nearly as badly (perhaps they would have a 500% increase if the economy were not so bad).It's just much more obvious at WDW because they don't have a new attraction to draw people.

Besides, is it Harry Potter that's affecting attendance or the possibility that people are waiting for Fantasyland to be finished before spending all of that money on a Disney vacation?

Disney's biggest mistake was not getting a big addition ready to go online while Fantasyland was being constructed and Potter was opened. That way, people wouldn't care so much about waiting for Fantasyland because there's another new hot A-ticket to go and check out.

Disney absolutely does get a percentage of the gates from Universal due to the Marvel acquisition. I've heard it's somewhere in the 5% range. They also get a hefty percentage of the merchandise sold. This was one of the biggest benefits of Iger buying Marvel – Disney would get a percentage from any success Universal has at their parks. It's a complete win-win for Disney.

 

[T-1MILLION]

It is obvious that the economy certainly has had an impact but Universal is up by 300% so it's not affecting them.

Disney absolutely does get a percentage of the gates from Universal due to the Marvel acquisition. I've heard it's somewhere in the 5% range. They also get a hefty percentage of the merchandise sold.

I don't know where you heard they get a percentage of the gate sales but I would not believe whoever told you that.

 

[Mammymouse]

Regarding the crowds around the 4th - traditionally the Northeast has vacation time around the 4th. It goes back to there was some prosperity and jobs in the northeast (beginning with the Industrial Revolution that started in RI with the knitting and cloth mills)and there were many factories and industry. The mills, factories, etc. would shut down totally those 2 weeks and that's when people had their vacation times. Many people from the northeast still follow the tradition. I find July, as well as August both pretty hot at Disney but if you aren't from the South you probably assume August is hotter.

 

[ptaylor]

I'm a local and have been in the parks a lot recently. I would say that on the whole attendance is marginally down, but certainly cannot be described as dead or empty. MK hit capacity on July 4, and the water parks have hit capacity on several days since.

I suspect that a few factors are contributing (in no particular order)

1. Economy - even during the hope of recovery in Jan 2010, people were remaining cautious and not booking their trips for Summer 2010. The fear of slipping back into recession again now prevents spur of the moment trips now we are actually in the summer.

2. Tour groups - the south american tours groups have been coming in bigger numbers in recent years, and this year is an all-time high in recent years from what I have seen. I know many people who actively avoid WDW during this time purely because of it.

3. "Holiday pricing" - on both resort rooms and dining. Why pay so much more for rooms and dining during the most uncomfortable time of year? Example - so called "holiday pricing" ramps up Boma from $33 to $37 for exactly the same food and service during July and August. The summer simply represents bad value at WDW.

4. Weather - high temperatures and lots of rain this summer have made park conditions not so great. This was particularly evident on July 4 weekend (almost constant rain) - lots of Floridians stayed away.

5. Visitor patterns have distributed out more evenly. The traditional dead times of Jan and Sep have picked up, moving some visitors from the summer to those times.

6. Universal. Nah. Potter may be busy due to it being new, but it's capacity is small and it's cannibalizing visitors from their other attractions. They aren't eating into WDW visitors enough to make an impact.

 

[Buried20KLeague]

It is obvious that the economy certainly has had an impact but Universal is up by 300% so it's not affecting them.

Disney absolutely does get a percentage of the gates from Universal due to the Marvel acquisition. I've heard it's somewhere in the 5% range. They also get a hefty percentage of the merchandise sold.

Source please.

Others have posted direct information from the purchase that seems to refute this.

Also... I'm pretty certain we've had more than one report of virtually all Marvel merch pulled from Uni's shelves (because that WOULD increase Disney's take).