Jim Hill on XPass coming in 2012

[scottnj1966]

Jim Hill has many articles, many rumors, and many ideas. Most of what he says never happens. Remember that.

And the people that ask cast members about rumors, those cast members get their info from where we do, online. Senior personnal do not usually go around letting every cast member know new plans unless they will be in the testing phase, and those people would not be talking about it to us. They would get fired.

I do not think Disney would do this. They have always made it a point that fastpass was free, not like some other parks where you can pay for it. It would make them look like fools. Then again I have been watching Disney the last few years and they are making many sad moves. If you have the wrong people running the parks, you will have many wrong decisions made.

 

[DisneyJoe]

Currently Disney allows FP's for all every park guest which is alot more than 30,000.

Allows being the key word. They are still dispensed based on availability.

Universal INCLUDES their Express pass with each and every hotel room - and it grants room guests 1 entry for each and every participating attraction. In other words, at the start of each day, Universal needs to allocate 2400 rooms x number of guests per room x number of participating attractions ride entries.

Disney could not do that with 30,000 rooms.

 

[bgraham34]

isn't it all guest stratification? aren't people who are more inclined to stay at the grand floridian in a different segmentation than those who stay at pop century? or those who choose to dine at california grill a different segment than those who choose to eat at earl of sandwich? if you want to do it, you can. if not, you don't have to. and operating under the assumption that reserved booking times will cut into the amount of fast passes issued, it won't affect the stand by line. assuming that's true, it's limiting the impact on those who choose to not opt into the program. so i guess i just don't see the problem.

The problem is that you don't see a problem with this and thus becomes mainstream. All the people who have no problem spending more and more money on things like this drive up the cost of everything else. Look at dining, because DDP is so successful it has considerable raised up the prices on dining. I remember just a few years ago Dinner at Ohanas was 10 bucks cheaper but because dining plan has come in they are trying to force you into the dining plan and in the long run it actually costs more.

 

[wvdisneyfamily]

I'm reserving judgement on this idea for several reasons.

A) Why get worked up about something that may or may not come to fruition?
B) I've not seen the plan in action.
C) I don't know how directly I will be impacted.

The only thing I will say is I don't like how much you are willing to pay directly impacting your experience on the attraction. There's not anything like this currently in play (or nothing of which I'm aware).

I personally think that the park experience, especially the attractions and character interactions, are sacred ground. Don't make money the deciding factor of exactly how great the experience and memories are. Some families scrimp and scrape and stay offsite to afford that once in a lifetime trip. Their park experience should be just as great as people who have money to go multiple times per year and on-site.

I understand business, profit, capitalism, supply and demand, blah, blah, blah... Making money is good. I don't expect Disney to not try to turn a profit. However, sometimes, profit can't be the bottom line. Aside from my ethical objections to what has been described by Jim Hill, I can't see how this will be good for Disney. Imagine the media spin on this concept. It'll be ugly. Theme parks have had some negative press over ticket prices anyway. What will this do?

 

[DisneyLeo18]

I'm reserving judgement on this idea for several reasons.

A) Why get worked up about something that may or may not come to fruition?
B) I've not seen the plan in action.
C) I don't know how directly I will be impacted.

The only thing I will say is I don't like how much you are willing to pay directly impacting your experience on the attraction. There's not anything like this currently in play (or nothing of which I'm aware).

I personally think that the park experience, especially the attractions and character interactions, are sacred ground. Don't make money the deciding factor of exactly how great the experience and memories are. Some families scrimp and scrape and stay offsite to afford that once in a lifetime trip. Their park experience should be just as great as people who have money to go multiple times per year and on-site.

I understand business, profit, capitalism, supply and demand, blah, blah, blah... Making money is good. I don't expect Disney to not try to turn a profit. However, sometimes, profit can't be the bottom line. Aside from my ethical objections to what has been described by Jim Hill, I can't see how this will be good for Disney. Imagine the media spin on this concept. It'll be ugly. Theme parks have had some negative press over ticket prices anyway. What will this do?

I don't think Disney would do this, as much as they like to turn a profit. Even today, when you pay more its almost transparent to the other guests. You don't get fancy buses pulling up to take you back to the Grand Floridian or anything like that.

I think this will work out the same way, if it ever happens.

 

[MickeyPeace]

Ask Jim Hill.

He tried it, and got his behind kicked right outta Disneyland. Of course, he tried to wear it as a badge of honor, but we all know it must have stung.

Oh, that's right - right after he took preorders for his "park tour" CD's you could listen to around the park. He was gonna get them! Awhile later he said it was coming along nicely. Even a bit later, hitting snags but still coming.

Gee, I wonder at what point those preorders got cancelled, when it never actually came to be, like any other project he has started.

Lou Mongello makes park tour CDs and charges to give personal tours in Orlando.

Why is Disney ok with that if they weren't when JH did it?

 

[Master Yoda]

Lou Mongello makes park tour CDs and charges to give personal tours in Orlando.

Why is Disney ok with that if they weren't when JH did it?

If I remember the story correctly a problem arose when a couple of guests who had paid for an official Disney tour mistook Jim's tour for the official one and complained. He was then asked to leave and discontinue his private tours.

One would assume that Disney has a policy against this but they look the other way as long as you do not cause problems for other guests.

 

[DisneyJoe]

Lou Mongello makes park tour CDs and charges to give personal tours in Orlando.

Why is Disney ok with that if they weren't when JH did it?

Possibly group size. Lou limits his groups to no more than 6 people.

 

[njDizFan]

There is no hoping. The future is not catering to the select few. If you have been to the theme parks recently, you'll notice that the demographics are shifting. The days of the theme parks being full of middle upper class Americans are over. This was even addressed on the last quarter's conference call, where Jay addressed booming international business from South America and specifically stated that the increase more than made up for a decrease in European visitation. International visitors and domestic Hispanic visitors drive attendance. I would assume the general demographic here is 25 - 45 year old white males. Disney isn't even interested in us anymore, but that is another discussion.

The point is that it's ludicrous to think that the foundation of "NextGen" is going to be swanky bleachers in front of Cinderella Castle for the 3pm Parade and a select few people being able to schedule Big Thunder Mountain Railroad at 3:51pm on Tuesday November 24, 2012. The idea that the future of Walt Disney World is catering to 1,000 of 100,000+ people a day is insanity.

For that matter, premium experiences will certainly continue to be on the rise. But like that $189 Animal Kingdom thing, I would be surprised if many of them infringe on the enjoyment of others.

some good points but, Disney like all companies are now catering to a "higher end" client base. As a person in a financial position with a large bank, we have internally been told to push for people with "means" and private client revenue. If you are the avergage client you will be charged fees and will see diminishing returns on your small savings balances. It is currently the largest growing sector of my business, since the people who have money are growing steadily while the middle class is diminishing.


On the other points I will put on my tin foil hat and re-read my copy of "The singularity is Near". (yes, the human brain has reached its capacity and with computers getting smarter expodentially, we will all be cyborgs in under 40 years):lookaroun.

This is the age of information. Who could have imaginged just 20 years ago, the rise of cell phone and computers to the point of absolute neccesity even in third world countires. This NEXGen stuff is coming and coming everywhere. Data mining is going to be a prequisite for any company looking to expand and reach out for advertisement. It may show many different forms but it all a way to reach out to the client faster and more direct. Pushing harder for that finite dollar.

 

[captainkidd]

Allows being the key word. They are still dispensed based on availability.

Universal INCLUDES their Express pass with each and every hotel room - and it grants room guests 1 entry for each and every participating attraction. In other words, at the start of each day, Universal needs to allocate 2400 rooms x number of guests per room x number of participating attractions ride entries.

Disney could not do that with 30,000 rooms.

Exactly.

 

[GrumpyFan]

I'm reserving judgement on this idea for several reasons.

A) Why get worked up about something that may or may not come to fruition?
B) I've not seen the plan in action.
C) I don't know how directly I will be impacted.

I understand business, profit, capitalism, supply and demand, blah, blah, blah... Making money is good. I don't expect Disney to not try to turn a profit. However, sometimes, profit can't be the bottom line. Aside from my ethical objections to what has been described by Jim Hill, I can't see how this will be good for Disney. Imagine the media spin on this concept. It'll be ugly. Theme parks have had some negative press over ticket prices anyway. What will this do?

Nicely said. The important thing to remember here is this is still in the rumor stage, which means anything can happen.

I think Disney has reached a point in crowd levels, where something like this is almost a necessity in order to keep from losing visitors and money. Consider the amount of money someone pays staying at a Deluxe resort. In order to attract and keep these guests at Disney, there may be a need for this at least at this level.

 

[musketeer]

All the people who say, "If they do this, I'm not going anymore..." Yeah right. That's like people who say, "if so and so gets elected, I'm moving to Canada..."

I doubt that a system that will not be very visible will cause you to stop going.

 

[G00fyDad]

All the people who say, "If they do this, I'm not going anymore..." Yeah right. That's like people who say, "if so and so gets elected, I'm moving to Canada..."

I doubt that a system that will not be very visible will cause you to stop going.

Hey hey hey.... hold it right there.... let's not be hasty now. If they say they're not going anymore don't try to talk them out of that. It leaves more room for us.

 

[PhilharMagician]

Allows being the key word. They are still dispensed based on availability.

Universal INCLUDES their Express pass with each and every hotel room - and it grants room guests 1 entry for each and every participating attraction. In other words, at the start of each day, Universal needs to allocate 2400 rooms x number of guests per room x number of participating attractions ride entries.

Disney could not do that with 30,000 rooms.

I am refering to WDW resort guests and non-resort guests "paying for access" to be the only guests having access to the current FP system. I am not talkng about giving each guest a FP for every FP accessable attraction. I understand that you cannot give out 30,000 FP for an atttraction that can maybe only handle 20,000 guests per day.

 

[DVCOwner]

This is nothing new. Walt Disney World has always been about the money. They are just trying to get better at it. Three years ago I rented a boat and watch Wishes from the lake in front of the Magic Kingdom, way cannot all guest do that for free. Two years ago I rented a private viewing area for Illuminations and had a Brownie and drink bar only for my group. Last year we had a private meal in a reserved area and got to watch Fantasmic! We had a private guide bring us into and out of the area. My grandson was in a stroller and we were allowed to bring it in when other guest could not. This year we went on the Disney Cruise and rented a private Cabana on the Disney Island. Everyone I my group chips in some money so that we can do one special event every Disney trip. If you can write a big enough check, I think Disney would even close the park just for you and your friends late one night.

 

[Monty]

All the people who say, "If they do this, I'm not going anymore..." Yeah right. That's like people who say, "if so and so gets elected, I'm moving to Canada..."

I doubt that a system that will not be very visible will cause you to stop going.

:lookaroun


Canada's nice.... :shrug:


And you can still go to WDW from here! :sohappy:

 

[WDWcouple]

Generally as South Florida residents my wife and I will head up for a long weekend a few times a year and this would obviously not benefit us at all. However, once every 3 -5 years we go all out and will have an experience like we did on on our honeymoon which at the time was called the “Dream Maker Gold Package” for 8 days at a deluxe resort. I am planning such a vacation for early January 2013 on the “Magic Your Way Premium Package” In this case the XPass would be something I would dole out the extra cash for just for the experience. Then again we don’t have children and tend to go nuts on the golf, dining, recreation, and tours included in the package. So on that basis I do hope that it is more than a rumor. With that said I doubt there is an expanded market that will make the XPass a long term program .

 

[Brian Noble]

All they are doing is cutting out the labor portion with the guide and streamlining the program.

But, I'm not sure how well that works. The folks plunking down for VIP tours (especially the one that includes essentially unlimited FP access) are doing so in part because it is a high-touch experience. They want someone else to deal with it, and are willing to pay them to do so. They don't want to plan it themselves.

If something like this comes about (and I think it will in some form or another) I think it will be positioned down-market from the current VIP offerings. That's not hard to do. The VIP tours look like they start at $175 with a minimum of six hours---and that's the one that doesn't include FP queue access.

 

[WDW Vacationer]

The whole NextGen/XPass/Sorcerers of the Magic Kingdom/RFID nonsense frustrates me.

That entry system test at Epcot was a nice thing at least. The rest of the NextGen package is junk.

But lets focus on XPass. I have quite a few issues.

The first is that it costs extra. WDW vacations are already becoming more and more in-affordable for families. While FASTPass is a benefit that can be fairly taken advantage of by everyone, this isn't. So only those who can pay X amount of dollars get those exclusive viewing areas, secured attraction times and special screens reap anything. The rest suffer a decline in quality. It will create a caste system in WDW. So little Billy whose parents saved for years to take him to WDW sees interactive screens in IASW. He thinks its cool. He doesn't get that benefit because his parents could barely afford the basics. He asks why and the parents feel like Billy is disappointed and they feel bad. Billy and his parents will have to fight a lot harder for parade slots and wait longer for rides too.

Next, the whole idea of booking attraction times is nuts. I know I don't know what I want to ride an when as I enter the park, never mind in advance. A VACATION shouldn't be a fully structured experience. Its enough I have to know what I want to eat 180 days out.

The screens in attractions will do nothing but clutter up and kill the atmosphere of attractions in the name of 15 seconds of pleasure.

Finally, how much will this cost? Surely this money could have been used on other things. The whole NextGen program is fluff, and a VERY bad idea.

 

[AEfx]

Lou Mongello makes park tour CDs and charges to give personal tours in Orlando.

Why is Disney ok with that if they weren't when JH did it?

Well you'd have to ask Disney that.

Disney doesn't have a problem with the CDs because unless you say they are a Disney product or feature Disney copyrighted material, they really can't say anything.

As MasterYoda pointed out, the problem at Disneyland is that Hill made a spectacle of himself, some guests complained, and they threw him out of the park (I also think he got a 1-year ban? I can't remember).

Perhaps Lou doesn't make a big spectacle of himself. But like I said, you'd have to ask Disney.

The point about the CD's is that it reenforces the fact that Jim Hill has never finished anything in his professional life - a series of articles, CD's he took pre-orders for, or had a successful track record of anything. He's all in it for what he can get, from all appearances.