21stamps
Well-Known Member
Ok if she's now from Morocco then wrong country for that attire.lol
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Jasmine's new look
- Thread starter candy_pencils
- Start date
Incomudro
Well-Known Member
That's it really.
The movie makes the rules, and the parks have to play by them.
Revising things - characters, movies etc. that have already been done to fit into our pc oppression is something that irritates me.
Replacing the guns in ET with walkie talkies, Han Solo not shooting first...
If new characters are introduced that reflect current thinking, that's all fine and to be expected.
But please don't change what already exists.
21stamps
Well-Known Member
In a country where a successful iconic company felt the need to do this- Then the Jasmine thing shouldn't surprise me. But it does, because it's so incredibly ridiculous.
James Norrie
Well-Known Member
I looked for the city of Agrabah on a map of Morrocco, couldn't find it anywhere. Is TDO revising their own stories now to fit characters into parks?
21stamps
Well-Known Member
Apparently they're revising their stories to ya know, not offend that 1 in 1,000,000 person who gets offended by anything and everything.
I'm offended that we are appeasing the offended.
Bottom line, if someone needs a doll or a fictional character to make them or their children feel better about themselves. Then their issues are much greater than any Fictional Cartoon Character or Plastic Doll in existence.
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Andrew C
You know what's funny?
This really doesn't have anything to do with the main topic, but if that was the only Barbie available...Barbie would not even exist today. They were getting destroyed by Bratz...until they sued them and modified their line.
21stamps
Well-Known Member
It's the same thing. IF Disney did this to be PC.. It is EXACTLY the same.
Barbie has been under attack for year for "not being realistic" or "causing girls to have unrealistic expectations".
Where is the difference? Now Disney joined Mattel in the nonsense.
Andrew C
You know what's funny?
Not sure I understand the relevance of Barbie here....Mattel changed up Barbie to compete, not necessarily to be PC.
21stamps
Well-Known Member
I don't want to overshadow this thread with a Barbie debate. But like I said above, Barbie has been under attack for years. I don't think that was a hidden secret. It was adults basically boycotting them, because of such nonsense of being unrealistic etc.... because we have evolved into a strange society. One who needs to feel "included" in everything.
Some things can just be taken at face value.
Barbie, and Jasmine. Both fake. If they are fake, and one come from a fictional place, then how is it possible to offend anyone?
It's again, complete nonsense.
SorcererMC
Well-Known Member
Haven't you guys seen this? Jeesh
.
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21stamps
Well-Known Member
Ok, then if the entire movie is offensive, just shelf it. Remove the characters from the parks.
While they're at it, remove every female "princess" from the 90s and before. All of them are basically a negative representation of women. We can choose to be offended, or we can take them as what they are. The new movies are making the women strong..finally. I'm thrilled about that. It also doesn't mean that I don't enjoy the classics or am offended watching them.
I have a huge problem when people try to rewrite history. What's done is done. This is a slippery slope. Soon we won't be able to recognize anything.
Incomudro
Well-Known Member
Exactly.
Apply this line of reasoning to everything, and we will have nothing.
Nothing that hasn't been re-modeled, re-shaped, re-imagined in some form so as not to offend someone, somewhere.
21stamps
Well-Known Member
That's where we're headed.
@SorcererMC Another parallel, besides Barbie, would be Miss Saigon. One of my favorite musicals of all time. The difference is, Miss Saigon still goes on. Despite the protests, despite the "offended", and despite the criticism from the minority of the world.
Why? Because it's a beautiful work of ART. It's fictional. The world shouldn't be punished for the over sensitivity of a few.
But that's what's happening now isn't it? A few complain about something, and the majority get punished. Lines blur of what should be considered right, wrong, or just Art, or even just something from the past- because back then was a different time. Do we start censoring books, movies, dolls, plays, operas, etc, so we don't offend anyone?
That's the only way to solve it.
SorcererMC
Well-Known Member
Jasmine is already part of the Princess franchise, so I don't think that was an option...not to mention the Flying Carpets ride. Disney hasn't removed all 'offensive' images from their parks - they still have the indian tribe in the Peter Pan ride (which is a book report of the film). But it's not like they have a 'Red-Man' character walking around. They don't depict certain images from 'Song of the South' in Splash Mountain.
My point in posting that is that kids these days do not have the same kind of nostalgia for the film, that I suspect most of us posting here do. I probably watch it several times a year.
ETA: It may have been criticism from a minority of people in 1992 (eg when the lyrics were changed), but I think that most of the general public would recognize it as culturally offensive now (comments in this thread notwithstanding).
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21stamps
Well-Known Member
Exactly why it is ridiculous.
"We're sorry you're offended, so to appease you we will change Jasmine's attire. But everything else that you're offended by will remain." I still don't know who "you" is. If it's Arabic people, then which country should she portray? All of them have different cultures and dress. There is no blanket "Arabic attire".
What?!?!? It doesn't make sense. Not anymore than making an overweight doll with perfect facial features that still doesn't look like "your kid" makes sense. The doll was never supposed to look like us.
I highly, highly doubt that the "majority of the general public" found Jasmine's costume offensive. Also because Jasmine was never supposed to represent a specific people.
Again, she is a fictional character in a fictional movie from a fictional place. It has nothing to do with nostalgia. It has to do with facts. The fact is, she has her belly showing in the movie. Simple as that. Either censor what we see and read now..or stop changing only portions of something to become PC.
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lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
You're spinning around so much it's a surprise you are still standing. If this was about being more respectful of the culture than Jasmine and Aladdin would be Chinese. Saying that the characters are now Moroccan is nothing but shallow patronizing as though the Moroccan people are too stupid to know that One Thousand and One Nights is Persian in origin and that Aladdin is a later inclusion made popular by a Frenchman.
SorcererMC
Well-Known Member
I never said it wasn't patronizing. Disney is saying they are Moroccan by putting them there, not me. I have pointed out on a couple of occasions the problems with the source material, I'm pretty sure I was the first one to bring it up! Thanks.
[http://forums.wdwmagic.com/threads/jasmines-new-look.918160/page-16#post-7395772]
Edit: And I fully admit that my thinking on this issue has evolved from reading the initial post - why? B/c I spent 30 min. learning about why portraying Arab stereotypes might be a problem. I'm not an expert on 'Middle East' cultural affairs, but I have enough of a foundation in it eg modern Southwest Asia/MENA history and how narratives are shaped to know why a change like this is necessary. I recognize that my attempts at explaining it are lost on people reading it, and I probably won't continue doing so.
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21stamps
Well-Known Member
Wait what? I thought Morocco was next to Saudi Arabia? It can't be in Africa?!?!
Sadly, I don't even think a lot of people realize that different heavily Muslim countries speak different languages, and have different traditions, and dress differently. If they did then the past 15 posts wouldn't be happening.
This is the problem. Morocco is not in Southwest Asia. Nor is it in the Middle East.
If you google "Americans" you won't be able to understand us. Not really, and we're all in the same country.
Muslim is a religion, not a culture, and not a country.
Southwest Asia wouldn't include any of the things you are talking about. Turkey is arguably the most "modern" Muslim country, especially when it comes to clothing, so Jasmine definitely isn't representative of their current times.
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