Is attendance really down at WDW this or…

[Trauma]

Buddy is right.

I have been going for a long time and it’s always been expensive.

Pay no attention to the fact that the cost has vastly outpaced inflation.

Doesn’t matter how much has been removed or lost over time that made the experience exceptional. I pretend not to understand what value is.

My favorite of all favoritist things is now paying for all the rides that I want to get on faster!!

I look forward to future upgrades to the Disney experience. Paying for timed access to the parks sounds great!! I sure hope they start charging by the hour.

I also hope they completely get rid of free room service and make me pay a fee every time I want my room cleaned. BETTER YET!! Maybe I’m forced to clean the room myself and if I don’t I pay a fine!!

This is all so glorious just think of the possibilities!!

Remember it’s all ok -

Disney has always been expensive!

 

[HauntedPirate]

It has always been expensive. This is not a new phenomenon.

The closest thing I posted to "how Disney has outpaced the standard rate of inflation" was WDW ticket price increases vs. household income, but I haven't updated this in a while:

View attachment 749524

It’s never been “expensive” when you look at income levels and ticket prices until Iger. $12k got my family and my extended family (11 people total, 6 adults, one teen, 3 kids and one under 3) airfare, three rooms and 7 nights at POFQ, 8 day park hoppers, a Christmas party for everyone, and the regular dining plan in December 2007. The dining plan was a whopping $39/adult/night. Today, 7 day park hoppers and a Christmas party ticket each would be $9k (it’s $7600 just for the regular park hoppers starting December 2). THAT is expensive.

But I fully agree with your statement about people wanting it to be more expensive. Truly a mind-boggling line of “thinking”.

 

[Tiggerish]

It has always been expensive. This is not a new phenomenon.

It has, absolutely. But never quite to the current degree, at least in my experience.

I joined this board more than 10 years ago. In that time, I was dumbfounded multiple times when members on here advocated for the parks to get more expensive so they would be less crowded. It appears that they finally got their wish. I hope they are happy now.

You’re 100% right about that, but IIRC, there were maybe six of them. One of them was really vocal about it, so it may have seemed like more.

It‘s the old “be careful what you wish for”, but in this case the few wished it on the many.

 

[fgmnt]

The lack of extended downtime on headliners for maintenance is really beginning to show. But we just need to let Bob's plan play out, remember. Everything is good, just trust in Bob's plans.

The company has painted itself into a corner with paid ILL. They pretty much can't do scheduled downtime without transparently leaving a lot of profit on the table. They will have to build a new attraction at that caliber in that park before they can offline it, and then the cycle of suck begins anew.

And realistically, can we expect another Rise level attraction at DHS before 2030? I would lean heavy no.

They might get bold enough to rotate out a Genie+ ride to ILL or maybe there's a compelling mid-level attraction (3rd Galaxy Edge ride?) that could get the ILL from debut until Rise comes back online.

 

[thomas998]

Thing is, they make much more off of the multi-day folks on everything else (food/merchandise) which is why they "discount" the multi-day tickets - it's the entire reason for their being.

A one-day person is likely coming from off-property, which means they have transportation - and is more likely to eat before they come, and/or after. A multi-day visitor is more likely eating 3 meals a day on property (even if they aren't all in the theme parks). A one-day visitor is also less likely to spend time wandering around shopping as they only have that one-day.

Even if you take out the hotel part of the equation, a multi-day guest spends a lot more than a day tripper on the things they really profit from (food and merch).

You might get more out of a multi-day guest on food... but not merchandise. Only so many mouse ears on any trip, the multi-day guest isn't going to be as likely to buy the overpriced crap every day while the day-tripper is more likely to buy some over priced crap because it is their only chance.... I know lots of multi-day folks that tell their kids to look for something and then the last day they go back for whatever it was.

I'm not really even sure the day-tripper is that likely to eat outside the park. They have a limited amount of time and are probably the ones most likely to buy the 15 dollar turkey leg so they don't have to waste time trying to eat somewhere else.

 

[ParentsOf4]

It has always been expensive. This is not a new phenomenon.

Disney World never was cheap but for its first 30 years, it was affordable.

For example, the first ticket I ever bought with my own money was a 3-day hopper in May 1983. I paid $35 (tax included) for that 3-day ticket, today’s equivalent of $109. $109 is not cheap but it is affordable for 3 days of entertainment. I was a student and part-time lifeguard making $3.75 per hour. (Minimum wage was $3.35.). Even I could afford a 3-day ticket which, at minimum wage, represented 10.4 hours of work.

Of course people complained about paying today’s equivalent of $109 for a ticket. That’s $436 for a family of four. No matter how you slice it, $436 is a lot of money for many families.

But let’s look at a 3-day ticket today. An equivalent 3-day hopper with tax is $534 or more in July, the month a typical family might go. For Spring break, another popular time for families, it's as high as $609 with tax! At today’s minimum wage, that represents an incredible 84.0 hours of work!

10.4 hours of work versus 84.0 hours of work is a tremendous change in affordability.

WDW never was cheap but it once was much more affordable.

 

[Nubs70]

In fairness tho. Im pretty sure if they did shut one down. They would replace it. Granted it may not generate as much but will still generate so altho Len’s numbers are staggering imo it would not be nearly that much…

The irony of ILL and G+ is WDW increases revenue the more inefficiently the rides operate.

WDW is rewarded for poor performance.

 

[celluloid]

In 1998 my entire family got the Play 4 pass. 4 days of park hopping theme parks for like 104 bucks.
Under 200 dollars today for a four-day park hopping ticket with inflation.
The Disney rate of inflation is far past premium.
Some parks have still barely netted any attractions since.

 

[Splash4eva]

The irony of ILL and G+ is WDW increases revenue the more inefficiently the rides operate.

WDW is rewarded for poor performance.

Altho i do see the point you & others are trying to make. Im not 100% convinced. Wait times no matter how efficient things are will always be there and above a solid 30 minute mark so with that being said. People will still buy Genie & people will still buy ILL to ride asap basically or do something again. Just the nature of the beast

 

[GhostHost1000]

I joined this board more than 10 years ago. In that time, I was dumbfounded multiple times when members on here advocated for the parks to get more expensive so they would be less crowded. It appears that they finally got their wish. I hope they are happy now.

Expense and crowds aren’t all that’s keeping people from going to WDW like they used tho

So many changes, complexity, and loss of things they once had contribute now more than ever as well

 

[Splash4eva]

Expense and crowds aren’t all that’s keeping people from going to WDW like they used tho

So many changes, complexity, and loss of things they once had contribute now more than ever as well

Using myself as an example and obviously not moving any needles but being at a couple Halloween parties this past weekend and everyone knowing im pretty much the Disney guy. Had people ask me about going for either their 1st time or 1st time pre covid and i kinda was telling them about changes etc and what is now gone and so on and so forth and literally everyone had the same response. Ill pass thanks for making my decision easier. Some of these people are one who have the means to pay for 1-2 day tickers at high prices and also pay to stay at any deluxe resort without worrying but when word of mouth starts to detour these people you have a problem.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

It really does feel like they are trying to squeeze every last penny out of those who go to the parks before too many stop going.

That’s what’s going on with Bob Iger…who is in bigtime, no BS, Wall Street trouble…

…but nobody will believe the storm clouds until it starts raining

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

It has always been expensive. This is not a new phenomenon.

…that was not…is not…and never will be the argument

 

[Tha Realest]

Using myself as an example and obviously not moving any needles but being at a couple Halloween parties this past weekend and everyone knowing im pretty much the Disney guy. Had people ask me about going for either their 1st time or 1st time pre covid and i kinda was telling them about changes etc and what is now gone and so on and so forth and literally everyone had the same response. I’ll pass thanks for making my decision easier. Some of these people are one who have the means to pay for 1-2 day tickers at high prices and also pay to stay at any deluxe resort without worrying but when word of mouth starts to detour these people you have a problem.

Same boat. My standard advice when people ask about planning a trip to WDW is
1) Don’t go, or, if you must…
2) Go to Disneyland instead.

 

[HauntedPirate]

Relax, everyone. WDW's attendance will be fine!

"The recent Harris Poll of 4,166 Americans, including 1,478 middle-class adults, found that three-quarters of the latter group said they were “paying more and more for goods and services,” while more than two-thirds said higher prices for household essentials like groceries, insurance, and rent or mortgage payments were hurting them.

Indeed, while inflation has moderated from a year ago, prices remain high across many categories, meaning households aren’t feeling much relief. Since February 2020, the cost of food at home is up more than 24%. Overall, the purchasing power of a US dollar is just one-third of what it was about 40 years ago.

“Economists aren’t sitting at kitchen tables with middle class America. For most, their paychecks are still chasing their bills and they feel they’re falling further and further behind,” said John Gerzema, chief executive officer of the Harris Poll.

A slim majority of middle-class Americans surveyed by Harris Poll for Bloomberg News said their wages have been keeping up with or exceeding rising household bills. But 63% also said that stagnant wages were hurting their finances and 42% said their costs were rising faster than their wages. "

See? Everything is good. The economy is fine. Leisure travel demand is invincible, and people are practically begging Disney to raise prices so they can go again. Things at WDW will be turning around very, very soon, you'll see. /s

 

[HauntedPirate]

Same boat. My standard advice when people ask about planning a trip to WDW is
1) Don’t go, or, if you must…
2) Go to Disneyland instead.

I'd tell people to go to DLP or TDR, personally. DL would be third on my list.

 

[Lilofan]

Relax, everyone. WDW's attendance will be fine!

"The recent Harris Poll of 4,166 Americans, including 1,478 middle-class adults, found that three-quarters of the latter group said they were “paying more and more for goods and services,” while more than two-thirds said higher prices for household essentials like groceries, insurance, and rent or mortgage payments were hurting them.

Indeed, while inflation has moderated from a year ago, prices remain high across many categories, meaning households aren’t feeling much relief. Since February 2020, the cost of food at home is up more than 24%. Overall, the purchasing power of a US dollar is just one-third of what it was about 40 years ago.

“Economists aren’t sitting at kitchen tables with middle class America. For most, their paychecks are still chasing their bills and they feel they’re falling further and further behind,” said John Gerzema, chief executive officer of the Harris Poll.

A slim majority of middle-class Americans surveyed by Harris Poll for Bloomberg News said their wages have been keeping up with or exceeding rising household bills. But 63% also said that stagnant wages were hurting their finances and 42% said their costs were rising faster than their wages. "

See? Everything is good. The economy is fine. Leisure travel demand is invincible, and people are practically begging Disney to raise prices so they can go again. Things at WDW will be turning around very, very soon, you'll see. /s

NJ casinos and sports betting didn't get the message. They recorded a record $5 billion earnings for 2022. Iger is looking into Disney investing in sports betting , my take is he is chasing the new way to earn income.

 

[wannabeBelle]

Royal Caribbean Group didnt get the message either as mentioned in my earlier post: https://forums.wdwmagic.com/threads/is-attendance-really-down-at-wdw-this-or….981083/post-10756909
Marie

 

[GhostHost1000]

NJ casinos and sports betting didn't get the message. They recorded a record $5 billion earnings for 2022. Iger is looking into Disney investing in sports betting , my take is he is chasing the new way to earn income.

he may late to the game though... we'll see where that goes

I think more people may be betting now because it's easier than before, plus people need extra income to be able to pay for the outrageous disney prices now

 

[HauntedPirate]

he may late to the game though... we'll see where that goes

I think more people may be betting now because it's easier than before, plus people need extra income to be able to pay for the outrageous disney prices now

It's the usual Iger hubris - "We're ESPN, we're the big dog, everyone will flock to us".