Is attendance really down at WDW this or…

[Laketravis]

I think people make way too much of "the competition."

I'm sure WDW would rather see Universal expand Orlando vs. open a new park in Kansas or something.

Or Texas

 

[Laketravis]

For the next few years, there will be increased interest in Orlando because of EU. WDW just has to capitalize on that.

Double edged sword - if it does increase attendance for WDW, without current changes it only means even more disappointed customers and growing bad press.

 

[Splash4eva]

Sure, but why would that exact same thing not apply to free genie + for deluxe guests? It's not about the fact people can afford it, it's about giving people the perception of added value if you stay on site with one of their deluxe hotels.

ME basically when looking at packages imo “coerced” people to stay. Forced them to avoid a rental car (granted i still got one) and kept them in bubble. Genie is strictly about money and people staying Deluxe usually are not gonna be concerned about that where someone is gonna go from say moderate to deluxe. Just my opinion on matter

 

[GhostHost1000]

Bob…how can we get bookings to increase? We need to do something big.

Bob - “best I can do is bringing back Soarin over the world”

 

[Drdcm]

I think people make way too much of "the competition."

I'm sure WDW would rather see Universal expand Orlando vs. open a new park in Kansas or something. The person going to Kansas is gone. The person going to Orlando is reasonably likely to make WDW part of their trip at least some of the time.

Naturally, everyone expects folks to check out the shiny new toy. There is zero reason to panic when that happens. Some will split their trips. Others will not. I would still expect WDW to see at least a marginal rise in attendance. They benefit from this opening overall.

For the next few years, there will be increased interest in Orlando because of EU. WDW just has to capitalize on that.

I'd be curious to see the attendance numbers around when Harry Potter first opened for comparison.

I agree with you and am not necessarily thinking this is doom and gloom for Disney. I do think 5-6 years out once EU hype dies down, it could go either way.

For example, I don’t live in the area, and when I go I have 4-5 days, all of which would go to Disney. I MIGHT take an extra trip to do EU and probably do Disney as well. So, in that case Disney wins. I might also my usual annual trip and instead do Disney for 4 days and EU for one day. If EU is any good, Disney is going to have to win over that day in the future because i only get so many PTO days and am not going to be able to stay longer. For many of us, vacation days are a limited resource and the market is becoming saturated in Orlando.

 

[Jrb1979]

I agree with you and am not necessarily thinking this is doom and gloom for Disney. I do think 5-6 years out once EU hype dies down, it could go either way.

For example, I don’t live in the area, and when I go I have 4-5 days, all of which would go to Disney. I MIGHT take an extra trip to do EU and probably do Disney as well. So I. That case Disney wins. I might also do Disney for 4 days and EU for one day. If EU is any good, Disney is going to have to win over that day in the future because i only get so many PTO days and am not going to be able to stay longer. For many of us, vacation days are a limited resource and the market is becoming saturated in Orlando.

Right now I don't think Disney has a problem. The problem is going to be 10-20 years down the road. Right now they are doing ok cause of the above 40 crowd due to nostalgia and the attractions they have.

People overlook that a lot of today's kids aren't as big into Disney IP as in years past.

 

[Drdcm]

Right now I don't think Disney has a problem. The problem is going to be 10-20 years down the road. Right now they are doing ok cause of the above 40 crowd due to nostalgia and the attractions they have.

People overlook that a lot of today's kids aren't as big into Disney IP as in years past.

Sure. That could definitely factor in moving forward.

It would be interesting to see what kids from the 2010s choose to watch in the future. Or if kids now will still re-watch movies like Encanto when they’re 20.

I’m weird, but go back over and over to the early classics, but not so much the movies that came out when I was a kid in the 90s. I gravitate towards those from the 60s and 70s

 

[monothingie]

I think people make way too much of "the competition."

Nintendo and Pokemon should be setting alarm bells off with corporate.

I'm sure WDW would rather see Universal expand Orlando vs. open a new park in Kansas or something. The person going to Kansas is gone. The person going to Orlando is reasonably likely to make WDW part of their trip at least some of the time.

Naturally, everyone expects folks to check out the shiny new toy. There is zero reason to panic when that happens. Some will split their trips. Others will not. I would still expect WDW to see at least a marginal rise in attendance. They benefit from this opening overall.

For the next few years, there will be increased interest in Orlando because of EU. WDW just has to capitalize on that.

When you leverage very popular IP and enough development (hotels, dining, shopping, water parks, theme parks) to support a multi-day stay with more affordable prices than Disney, they should be panicking. EU will be the showcase of Central Florida for while. They've also have already announced phase expansions (Zelda) which will continue to attract guests. Disney has Blue Sky.

I'd be curious to see the attendance numbers around when Harry Potter first opened for comparison.

It basically boosted USO to a full fledged destination and set the path forward for additional hotel, shopping, and park development.

 

[Disstevefan1]

I miss the free beer samples and the staff at Sea World Orlando gave me generous servings back in the day at the Busch beer pavillion.

Oh, yes the free beer was great!
Then later that building became a PIZZA BUFFET!!! THAT WAS GREAT!!
I have not been there in a while, I am looking forward to visiting someday again.

 

[Andrew25]

I have not been there in a while, I am looking forward to visiting someday again.

I say this as an AP, lower your expectations...

 

[Minnesota disney fan]

When my son was 5 (2010), going to WDW was better than Christmas. By the time he was 10 (2015), Harry Potter stole his attention and Uni was the new Santa Claus. He had no interest in going back to WDW. At all.

Last summer for his 18th birthday, I told him we could go wherever he wanted. We spent seven days at Uni. That's a stretch for me because I can do both parks in one day and maybe go back a second day. But he enjoyed all seven days (and the ability to slow the pace down), never once mentioning that maybe we could go to WDW for a day or two.

The first and last time he's been back to WDW since 2015 was a couple of years ago when I took an entire high school marching band. Three days at WDW and one day at Uni. It was almost unanimous that they enjoyed Uni more.

Going forward, there's no doubt in my mind he will not be self-motivated to return to WDW because there is simply nothing there that caters to his interests. Never mind the cost.

One thing I noticed in December and last week was a much more "mature" crowd at WDW compared to years past. CM's even agreed when I would ask if it seemed like the overall demographics of visitors was aging. Old folks like me and even older continue to go. And complain. But go.

I wonder if more Gen Z's like my son have absolutely no interest.

My grown "kids" and grandkids have no interest in WDW at all, due to their ages and due to the well known situation at WDW compared to when they were younger. They love Universal, SEa World, etc, so Disney has lost another 2 generations of "kids" who are not interested. I think that losing us and future generations will one day bite them in the b*tt . We were disney fanatics, but now are Universal fanatics. I just spent 5 days there and it was Not enough time to explore it all and take it all in. Next time I am going for a week or so. I still have some nostalgia for WDW but not enough to make me want to go back anymore.

 

[John park hopper]

My grown "kids" and grandkids have no interest in WDW at all, due to their ages and due to the well known situation at WDW compared to when they were younger. They love Universal, SEa World, etc, so Disney has lost another 2 generations of "kids" who are not interested. I think that losing us and future generations will one day bite them in the b*tt . We were disney fanatics, but now are Universal fanatics. I just spent 5 days there and it was Not enough time to explore it all and take it all in. Next time I am going for a week or so. I still have some nostalgia for WDW but not enough to make me want to go back anymore.

My kids and grandkids are the same way. I can identify with your post 100%

 

[Grimley1968]

A recurring theme the past couple of days in this thread among several posters has been the role of nostalgia in guest loyalty and keeping them coming back to WDW. It seems some posters (I count myself among them) have reached a point where even strong, almost family-level nostalgia isn't enough to overcome the recent direction WDW parks have taken.

For myself, the beginning of the break with nostalgia vs. reality was WDW changing FP to FP+. I could see they were doing preparatory work to monetize what had been theretofore included with the tickets, and screwed up a good thing in the process. Probably the last straw for me was the realization that we had to focus on a phone app at a precise time of day and beat thousands of others doing the same thing just to get a reservation for the privilege of waiting in a line hours later for an attraction. I haven't been to WDW since Genie, Genie +, LL, etc. came into play, and for that I'm glad. We've been to Florida many times since that last trip, but have no desire to visit WDW. It's just too much work, for too much money, for too little reward.

 

[Disstevefan1]

I say this as an AP, lower your expectations...

That's the beauty of SeaWorld. I have no expectations and the AP price is cheaper than WDW and UNI

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

It will be interesting if the family from Denver use the majority of their finite number of vacation days at Universal instead of Disney going forward.

Disney will only react AFTER they see what happens to THE MONEY!

“But everyone in Denver is rich…and semi retired so they don’t have to worry about time off. They also have bad taste”

- Bob 3:16

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I say this as an AP, lower your expectations...

Considering the outlay required…sea world is a beautiful park. It’s not as detailed as a Disney park…but they’re not representing themselves as such.

It’s a nice balance between the “all in” parks up the street and Six Flags Over a Bucket of Hurl

 

[Eric Graham]

That's the beauty of SeaWorld. I have no expectations and the AP price is cheaper than WDW and UNI

Does Sea World still have the all you can eat and drink at Discovery Cove. That was awesome. Or was that just when they were owned by a beer company?

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

…all this talk of the disconnect between Disney and Gens Y, Z, Alpha and Beta…

It should scare the crap out of the Disney hierarchy. Maybe they should sell to Bezos now when they can get a good price?

Honestly…even some in Gen X are becoming skeptical/defectors…and realize how high its tolerances was for cynicism in the first place

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Does Sea World still have the all you can eat and drink at Discovery Cove. That was awesome. Or was that just when they were owned by a beer company?

Yeah…but the prices will let you know it.

Regularly in the $400s for any days not the slowest of the year

 

[Eric Graham]

…all this talk of the disconnect between Disney and Gens Y, Z, Alpha and Beta…

It should scare the crap out of the Disney hierarchy. Maybe they should sell to Bezos now when they can get a good price?

Honestly…even some in Gen Z are becoming skeptical/defectors…and realize how high its tolerances was for cynicism in the first place

He just sold 24 million in stock this month. Guess he needed the money...I wish I were a CEO and I could just sell stock and get golden parachutes. Or be like Peleton and buy magnificient homes when the economy is tanking...