Is attendance really down at WDW this or…

[Lilofan]

I think it's far simpler. It boils down to a few basic factors:

1. WDW has become a worse product.

2. WDW has become a more expensive product.

3. People have less purchasing power due to various economic factors

4. Disney keeps pi$$ing everyone off

The first two points describes every airline I have flown on.

 

[Jrb1979]

IPger Disney is completely devoted to becoming a Universal clone

Attendance in the future will reflect that.

IMO that is a bad idea. Disney's last thrill ride that was good is Tower of Terror.

The first two points describes every airline I have flown on.

They don't describe Cedar Fair or Herschend parks. Most of those parks still hold value.

 

[Smiley/OCD]

The older baby boomers are expiring…is I think the point

The Disney parks will have a bit of a crisis of core clientele as that happens.

You gonna trust X??

I wouldn’t

No, it says the younger BB are turning 70…I’m in my late 50’s…last time I counted on my fingers, I’ve got 10+ before I hit that…enjoy your weekend at the parks…lol

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

No, it says the younger BB are turning 70…I’m in my late 50’s…last time I counted on my fingers, I’ve got 10+ before I hit that…enjoy your weekend at the parks…lol

Yeah…they’re backwards on that…but the larger point of boomers still probably holds

 

[BlakeW39]

IMO that is a bad idea. Disney's last thrill ride that was good is Tower of Terror.

Everest at opening was pretty amazing imo. But yes. Disney is too scared to create actual thrill rides. GOTG doesn't impress me. It's a thrill ride for babies. The good WDW 'thrill' rides are really dark rides that have thrilling elements. Hyrbids if you will. So Splash, Tower, Everest, DL's BTMR.

 

[Lilofan]

IMO that is a bad idea. Disney's last thrill ride that was good is Tower of Terror.


They don't describe Cedar Fair or Herschend parks. Most of those parks still hold value.

Off the top of my head I don't even know what states those parks you mentioned even exist in. Are they another version of Six Flags?

 

[James Alucobond]

IPger Disney is completely devoted to becoming a Universal clone

Attendance in the future will reflect that.

I’m not sure I’d call it a cloning of Universal. Universal themselves did not follow this model until relatively recently as well. I think it’s just an unfortunate outcome of the “forever IP” arms race the media companies that own both parks have engaged in over the past couple decades.

 

[Jrb1979]

Off the top of my head I don't even know what states those parks you mentioned even exist in. Are they another version of Six Flags?

Cedar Fair owns Knott's, Cedar Point and Kings Island. Herschend owns Dollywood, Silver Dollar City and Kentucky Kingdom

 

[hopemax]

The older baby boomers are expiring…is I think the point

The Disney parks will have a bit of a crisis of core clientele as that happens.

You gonna trust X??

I wouldn’t

Since I started this... whether you want to call them Boomers or Jones, the point was the youngest are turning 60, which means we have another decade to go before the tail end of this biomass, that has had a finger on the scale since their birth, works its way out of the labor market and eventually economic system.

Anya was disagreeing with me saying real Boomers are turning 70.

The Jones sub-designation refers to cultural / sociological differences between the start and end of the biomass. The 1964 date is a well-established date, when you are doing what I am, talking about the volume of bodies. Employed bodies. Bodies that are functional to spend and travel. I guess the cultural definition would matter if there is evidence that it's only early Boomers who have been shoveling money to Disney all this time and the Joneses were doing other entertainment / vacation things.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Since I started this... whether you want to call them Boomers or Jones, the point was the youngest are turning 60, which means we have another decade to go before the tail end of this biomass, that has had a finger on the scale since their birth, works its way out of the labor market and eventually economic system.

Anya was disagreeing with me saying real Boomers are turning 70.

The Jones sub-designation refers to cultural / sociological differences between the start and end of the biomass. The 1964 date is a well-established date, when you are doing what I am, talking about the volume of bodies. Employed bodies. Bodies that are functional to spend and travel. I guess the cultural definition would matter if there is evidence that it's only early Boomers who have been shoveling money to Disney all this time and the Joneses were doing other entertainment / vacation things.

Oh I agree with you completely…and often make the same point

Those that shovel “there are 5 more to take their place” are not looking at the bigger pattern past next week

 

[BlakeW39]

Off the top of my head I don't even know what states those parks you mentioned even exist in. Are they another version of Six Flags?

hahaha kind of, lol I mean they're regional amusement parks like Six Flags are, although it may be overly simplistic to just call them 'other versions' of Six Flags. I guess their similarities to Six Flags vary depending on the specific park you're talking about

 

[Tha Realest]

Since I started this... whether you want to call them Boomers or Jones, the point was the youngest are turning 60, which means we have another decade to go before the tail end of this biomass, that has had a finger on the scale since their birth, works its way out of the labor market and eventually economic system.

Anya was disagreeing with me saying real Boomers are turning 70.

The Jones sub-designation refers to cultural / sociological differences between the start and end of the biomass. The 1964 date is a well-established date, when you are doing what I am, talking about the volume of bodies. Employed bodies. Bodies that are functional to spend and travel. I guess the cultural definition would matter if there is evidence that it's only early Boomers who have been shoveling money to Disney all this time and the Joneses were doing other entertainment / vacation things.

Another problem with the post Boomer generation is that those parents (particularly those with means) are far more adventurous than their parents. Meaning, I know a lot more parents that are just as likely to take their kids to someplace like Fiji or lengthy European trips than Orlando for a week. Most of my peers view WDW as a “one and done” if that, versus a regular thing.

 

[Tha Realest]

Oh I agree with you completely…and often makes the same point

Those that shovel “there are 5 more to take their place” are not looking at the bigger pattern past next week

Do you think there’s a danger where, for whatever reason, Disney is turning off families with younger children (whether it’s because they’re culturally conservative or pricing) and chasing after Millennials or childless Gen X’ers?

 

[BlakeW39]

I’m not sure I’d call it a cloning of Universal. Universal themselves did not follow this model until relatively recently as well. I think it’s just an unfortunate outcome of the “forever IP” arms race the media companies that own both parks have engaged in over the past couple decades.

That's fair, but I do think Disney is becoming the slightly lesser version of Universal....sure, that might just be a byproduct of their IP mandate, but also consider that even without IP the new WDW attractions have been largely mediocre..... outside of GOTG, which imo is not thrilling enough to justify its lack of good effects (it just never managed to 'convince me' that I was in space).

so it should stand to reason that if Disney becomes more like Universal, but they aren't as good at being Universal as Universal is.... attendance between the two should equal out over time...outside the MK

 

[Jrb1979]

That's fair, but I do think Disney is becoming a slightly lesser version of Universal....sure, the reasoning for that may just be that it's a byproduct of their IP mandate, but also consider that even without IP the new attractions have been largely mediocre..... outside of GOTG, which imo is not thrilling enough to justify its lack of good effects (it just never managed to 'convince me' that I was in space).

so it should stand to reason that if Disney becomes more like Universal, but aren't as good at being Universal as Universal is.... attendance between the two should equal out over time...outside the MK

I agree with that. It's why IMO they should stick to what they are good at. That is family oriented rides that are well themed. Stay away from the thrills cause IMO they don't do them well. Stick to the multi generational family who travels together.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Ok..springs is packed

But that may be a pricing indictment too

 

[Jrb1979]

Ok..springs is packed

But that may be a pricing indictment too

Isn't that more of a locals hangout

 

[Trauma]

Ok..springs is packed

But that may be a pricing indictment too

It’s probably just time get start drinking.

 

[BlakeW39]

Long term I think we could see MK drop in terms of Orlando market share. And I'm talking aside whatever happens right after EU. I'm calling it.....

 

[Ayla]

Since I started this... whether you want to call them Boomers or Jones, the point was the youngest are turning 60, which means we have another decade to go before the tail end of this biomass, that has had a finger on the scale since their birth, works its way out of the labor market and eventually economic system.

Anya was disagreeing with me saying real Boomers are turning 70.

The Jones sub-designation refers to cultural / sociological differences between the start and end of the biomass. The 1964 date is a well-established date, when you are doing what I am, talking about the volume of bodies. Employed bodies. Bodies that are functional to spend and travel. I guess the cultural definition would matter if there is evidence that it's only early Boomers who have been shoveling money to Disney all this time and the Joneses were doing other entertainment / vacation things.

I wasn't disagreeing with you.