If you do not think Universal smelled blood in the water before...

[flynnibus]

In Universal's defense, Transformers, Minions and Walking Dead have all paid off handsomely. For that matter, Jurassic Park has held up better than I thought it would. Whoever is in charge of picking their IPs seems to have a good eye.

I agree in the sense of what the park 'has been'... I guess my comment was more about the aggressive expansion they are planning. Is HP an anomaly, or what they can pull off every time? Just thinking when you plan your future hotel growth, etc... you don't want to over estimate and then collapse under your own weight (EuroDisney..). HP has shown 'yes, we can grow'... but at what kind of rate? I wouldn't want HP as an anomaly to distort those kind of plans... follow me?

 

[danlb_2000]

Jimmy you are a hoot! It is much harder to imagine that there will NOT be another million or more people on top of the million people Phase One already brought in. Most of the attendance this year will not come from Potter fans but from theme park fans and travelers. You continue to assume that Universal is only benefiting because of the Potter IP and yet it has been proven time and time again that a quality new attraction product will increase Gate revenue regardless of the IP. Those Disney corporate drones that you worship know very little about why theme parks are successful and in fact could care less as long as they can continue to rape from the brand that the early Disney innovators built.

Your comment about the SDMT benefiting Universal had me laughing harder than Happy the Dwarf. If you think that that short little mediocre family coaster (not to take away from its beauty but it's no Splash Mountain) will draw anymore than some Disney theme park fans and those that normally fall for Disney's misleading marketing I've got a Diamond Mine to sell you. Diagon Alley on the other hand will be a fully immersive land adding four new attractions to Universal's roster (2 of which are full blown E-tickets) notwithstanding the IP it is based on. Of course if this were Disney they would also count Leaky Cauldron and the highly detailed restrooms as attractions also. Let me add once again that these new attractions will be innovative and will be enjoyed by millions far more than some of those same millions that get off SDMT and think that the small coaster with one show scene was a mildly amusing experience.

When I walk through Diagon Alley, even though it is still only partially complete, I get the sense that it will once again raise the bar in Theme Park quality for domestic parks. The sheer size and detail and complexity will be jaw dropping. I walk around the mostly complete Fantasyland and I shake my head thinking about how much it lacks in detail and substance.

What you are saying is not at all common sense especially when you continue to believe that because Potter is a fad that Universal won't be successful with Diagon Alley. People will love it, they will tell others about it, and it will draw even more than Phase One. Mark my words.

 

[Funmeister]

I agree in the sense of what the park 'has been'... I guess my comment was more about the aggressive expansion they are planning. Is HP an anomaly, or what they can pull off every time? Just thinking when you plan your future hotel growth, etc... you don't want to over estimate and then collapse under your own weight (EuroDisney..). HP has shown 'yes, we can grow'... but at what kind of rate? I wouldn't want HP as an anomaly to distort those kind of plans... follow me?

Do you think part of the thinking behind Potter is to strengthen the base of the resort itself so they can afford to take bigger risks on other IP?

 

[Disneyhead'71]

Jimmy's Thick- Walt Disney World is "Unsinkable"!

 

[Disneyhead'71]

Do you think part of the thinking behind Potter is to strengthen the base of the resort itself so they can afford to take bigger risks on other IP?

Like this one:

 

[TubaGeek]

I agree in the sense of what the park 'has been'... I guess my comment was more about the aggressive expansion they are planning. Is HP an anomaly, or what they can pull off every time? Just thinking when you plan your future hotel growth, etc... you don't want to over estimate and then collapse under your own weight (EuroDisney..). HP has shown 'yes, we can grow'... but at what kind of rate? I wouldn't want HP as an anomaly to distort those kind of plans... follow me?

HP is an anomaly in the fact that an IP of that magnitude is unlikely to appear again in the next 50 years. What is not an anomaly, though, is quality theming complimenting innovative and game-changing attractions.

 

[TalkingHead]

HP is an anomaly in the fact that an IP of that magnitude is unlikely to appear again in the next 50 years. What is not an anomaly, though, is quality theming complimenting innovative and game-changing attractions.

And HP has been/will be a gateway drug for some visitors. I wonder if going to Diagon will be a "life after Disney" moment for anyone.

 

[KJC]

And HP has been/will be a gateway drug for some visitors. I wonder if going to Diagon will be a "life after Disney" moment for anyone.

I grew up in a Disney family and Universal was always a day trip. That switched even before Harry potter because we loved the perks for staying on site. We're going back to Disney again next month for the first time since 2011. Universal we do four times a year n0w.

Part of the appeal is there always seems to be something new going on. My favorite new thing, even more than any new ride, is the expanded Springfield. Disney will never, ever be able to match how it feels for me to be in the Simpsons world come to life.

But having watched the parks get more and more crowded every year, I can tell you it's not just Potter driving the growth. The despicable me minions and the transformers are just as popular and that merchandise is selling like crazy! Both properties are very relevant to today's kids, and my generation was as defined by the simpsons as the one after me was by potter.

Disney isn't going anywhere and I do enjoy the nostalgia of occasional visits back. But all the magic is at universal these days, for me at least. As a kid who grew up on Disney and loved to see what was new each time we went back, I feel like I'm forever waiting for them to get back in the game. I used to think the uni renaissance would get them going again and it would be a win win for Orlando. But they just don't seem to have any interest in responding.

 

[the.dreamfinder]

I think Jimmy is also looking long term, I think he actually believes that Disney is untouchable. Since they were first, and king of the theme parks business for so long he believes that people will just keep coming to matter what Disney does. Pretty much everything he said is based on the incorrect belief that the status quo cannot change.

There's a double meaning there.

 

[BryceM]

I think Jimmy Think is way off base

I simplified it even further for you, and everyone else.

 

[TalkingHead]

But having watched the parks get more and more crowded every year, I can tell you it's not just Potter driving the growth. The despicable me minions and the transformers are just as popular and that merchandise is selling like crazy! Both properties are very relevant to today's kids, and my generation was as defined by the simpsons as the one after me was by potter.

Absolutely agree with you. I'd gone to Universal several times pre-Potter and enjoyed it. But even as good as IOA was when it opened (heck, it opened with Spider-man, still one of the best rides in Orlando), Potter changed things. It was the first time I remember thinking Universal had genuinely Disney-quality atmosphere.

Maybe years from now Universal will say, "It all changed with a boy wizard" and put it on t-shirts.

 

[BryceM]

Absolutely agree with you. I'd gone to Universal several times pre-Potter and enjoyed it. But even as good as IOA was when it opened (heck, it opened with Spider-man, still one of the best rides in Orlando), Potter changed things. It was the first time I remember thinking Universal had genuinely Disney-quality atmosphere.

Maybe years from now Universal will say, "It all changed with a boy wizard" and put it on t-shirts.

I actually preferred the old IOA to the current IOA. The park flowed better (obviously). The theming in Merlinwood was some of the best I've ever seen. I loved The Enchanted Oak Tavern, the music, the Dueling Dragons. Sigh. I still love Potter to death, but I do really miss that part of The Lost Continent. It felt just as magical as Potter. And plus, you could actually enter Jurassic Park from the right side of the park without a giant castle just behind the gates, haha.

IOA is still my favorite theme park though.

 

[flynnibus]

HP is an anomaly in the fact that an IP of that magnitude is unlikely to appear again in the next 50 years. What is not an anomaly, though, is quality theming complimenting innovative and game-changing attractions.

Sure... but the whole point was about pacing and 'how much growth' can they really sustain? Its quite the business decision to have to make. Do you draw a line and pace yourself? Or do you go all out 'if you build it, they will come' and just build as much as you can pull off. Guaging the true demand and building to it, but not beyond is the true magic.

Diagon Alley will be the first true indicator... do they get incremental, or substantial growth from it 12+ out? If they get another 30+% boost sustained... do they accelerate or pace themselves? It will be fun to watch

 

[flynnibus]

Do you think part of the thinking behind Potter is to strengthen the base of the resort itself so they can afford to take bigger risks on other IP?

Pure speculation... but I would imagine it was just 'how do we get even MORE HP?' One of those.. if I build a tiny example... and it goes ape... expand it!

I have to imagine a bit of the HP merchandise spike was due to pent up demand.. which will be less this time around... but they appear to have all corners covered... atmosphere... desired setting... headliner attractions... shopping. They have things people are chomping at the bit to see... something Disney hasn't had since EE.

 

[flynnibus]

Like this one:

LOTR is another one of those properties that has such wide roots it can be made to last. Fantasy, both soft (elves and greenery) and harsh (ogre/metal/stone), magic, commonly recognized races, etc. The works and others have established widely known genres that have lasted generations and is approachable by those who don't even know the LOTR books themselves.

 

[drew81]

Jimmy's Thick- Walt Disney World is "Unsinkable"!

Didn't they say the same thing about the Titanic?

 

[Hakunamatata]

Didn't they say the same thing about the Titanic?

Oh I think Disney is still capable of delivering some sweet chin music if they so desired. Getting them to desire it is the question.

 

[TubaGeek]

Oh I think Disney is still capable of delivering some sweet chin music if they so desired. Getting them to desire it is the question.

100% accurate. Disney could knock Uni out of the park if they tried. But they don't.

 

[Tony Perkis]

100% accurate. Disney could knock Uni out of the park if they tried. But they don't.

Sorry, but I don't agree with this. At all. Disney hasn't been able to come up with a ride concept as advanced at Spider-Man, let alone Potter. Their last true "game changer" was Indiana Jones. In the mid 90's.

It's simply pathetic that their idea of innovation is a 4K 3D version of Star Tours and Soarin'.

 

[ParentsOf4]

Sorry, but I don't agree with this. At all. Disney hasn't been able to come up with a ride concept as advanced at Spider-Man, let alone Potter. Their last true "game changer" was Indiana Jones. In the mid 90's.

It's simply pathetic that their idea of innovation is a 4K 3D version of Star Tours and Soarin'.

When the Yeti worked, Expedition Everest (opened in 2006) was a pretty awesome experience, in keeping with the best traditions of Disney.

Soarin' (opened in 2001 in CA) was an innovative ride system and something with strong cross-generational appeal. It's really in the spirit of what Walt Disney wanted to achieve, something to be enjoyed by kids, parents, and grandparents.

Mission: Space (opened in 2003) was an innovative attraction.

Under Eisner, WDI showed that it was capable of some really good theme park experiences. Whether you liked him or not, Eisner insisted that new attractions be rolled out at the theme parks on a regular basis.

The problem is that, under Iger, the flow of creativity has been stemmed by a culture more focused on cost. Even something as popular as Toy Story Mania (opened in 2008) was approved largely because it was inexpensive for an attraction (roughly $80M).

Management in Orlando hates spending money on attractions because they don't see the revenue growth to justify those expenditures. They are more worried about their bonuses than making WDW a better place and there's no one in Burbank forcing them to innovate.

After some lean years, Universal is once again marching forward with rides.

WDW is still sitting on the sidelines, playing around with plastic wristbands.