HKDL gets new castle, frozen land and marvel land.

[Supersnow84]

 

[PiratesMansion]

Still a little skeptical that Frozen will supply what I feel Hong Kong truly needs, but I must admit that it looks stunning.

 

[Supersnow84]

Do you think it needs a big E ticket right now or something else entirely

Again it’s kinda hard to judge when it technically has functionally deeper offerings than Shanghai but loses at time spent due to less guests

 

[PiratesMansion]

Do you think it needs a big E ticket right now or something else entirely

Again it’s kinda hard to judge when it technically has functionally deeper offerings than Shanghai but loses at time spent due to less guests

It needs more genuine E tickets.

There's a deep bench of a supporting lineup, but Mystic Manor is the only attraction that WOWs, IMO.

 

[Supersnow84]

I’d say HK has 3 true e tickets but on the balance 3 out of 16 is pretty poor especially when 1 out of the 3 is basically the worst version of a ride in 5 out of 6 parks

Though since HK is going to live or die based on the GBA it probably comes down to what they see is wrong with the park, do they want more e tickets, does anyone who is a regular HK visitor want quinjet as the 4th e ticket etc or do they want something totally unique

 

[SplashJacket]

I’d say HK has 3 true e tickets but on the balance 3 out of 16 is pretty poor especially when 1 out of the 3 is basically the worst version of a ride in 5 out of 6 parks

Though since HK is going to live or die based on the GBA it probably comes down to what they see is wrong with the park, do they want more e tickets, does anyone who is a regular HK visitor want quinjet as the 4th e ticket etc or do they want something totally unique

If Grizzly was actually good, it would be a completely different story. Instead it just feels like transitions between turn around instead of a legitimate coaster anywhere

 

[J4546]

If Grizzly was actually good, it would be a completely different story. Instead it just feels like transitions between turn around instead of a legitimate coaster anywhere

Ive never been to HK but I thought Grizzly coaster was considered very good? It has lift hills, a launch and a backwards section of track, seems great in vids imo

 

[momo123]

Few points HKs own population can't support a park the area surrounding HK has a population of around 220 or so but again there's a border to cross visas etc to deal with where as Shanghai is located in a more denser area and a city with 26 or so million residents ( HK is china's 15th largest city).

Im from HK and I've been to the park around 8 times and with different family members and friends visiting from around Asia and the west. What I've found the most notable attractions that most people enjoyed are the marvel, Winnie the Pooh, Toy Story land & grizzly gulch the most (what has surprised me is no one mentioned mystic which for me is the best ride but that's cause Im kind of a enthusiast & know the background etc of the ride the tech etc) What I mean to say is IP stuff is popular most asians didn't grow up with a lot of Peter Pan Snow White etc myself included the only classic Disney I watched regularly was Aladdin.

Since Frozen is opening in November I personally have 3 different family groups planning to visit because there kids love frozen.

 

[momo123]

Ive never been to HK but I thought Grizzly coaster was considered very good? It has lift hills, a launch and a backwards section of track, seems great in vids imo

Yes it is very popular ride in the HK park I'd say more popular than mystic

 

[SplashJacket]

Ive never been to HK but I thought Grizzly coaster was considered very good? It has lift hills, a launch and a backwards section of track, seems great in vids imo

Honestly worse than every coaster at Magic Kingdom in WDW other than Barnstormer.

The entire ride is completely forceless. It’s a long ride, but the entire ride is spent at track switches or transitioning between track switches. It’s entirely forceless going between the switches. There’s no real coaster elements, or bunny hills, or any real thrill.

It tries to be Everest or Hagrids, but fails miserably. It’s okay, it’s still a coaster, it’s still long, but fails to be much fun. Pretty area though.

But imagine if Hagrid’s didn’t have the moving launches, or if Everest lacked its big stop, high G sections, or intense backwards segment. You just go backwards smoothly and calmly. The track length is long but most of it is completely washed in every sense of the word.

 

[PiratesMansion]

If Grizzly was actually good, it would be a completely different story. Instead it just feels like transitions between turn around instead of a legitimate coaster anywhere

I think worse than every non-Barnstormer MK coaster is a bit harsh. I think it's better than SDMT at least.

I like Grizzly, but it doesn't feel satisfying in the way Big Thunder does. It's less detailed and the mountain feels less thoughtfully designed (a TR on here made the apt point that BTM feels like the ride was built around the mountain and Grizzly feels the opposite), and the first third of the ride does nothing.

It's still a fun ride, but not the 100% home run I was hoping for when I visited.

 

[Supersnow84]

Few points HKs own population can't support a park the area surrounding HK has a population of around 220 or so but again there's a border to cross visas etc to deal with where as Shanghai is located in a more denser area and a city with 26 or so million residents ( HK is china's 15th largest city).

Im from HK and I've been to the park around 8 times and with different family members and friends visiting from around Asia and the west. What I've found the most notable attractions that most people enjoyed are the marvel, Winnie the Pooh, Toy Story land & grizzly gulch the most (what has surprised me is no one mentioned mystic which for me is the best ride but that's cause Im kind of a enthusiast & know the background etc of the ride the tech etc) What I mean to say is IP stuff is popular most asians didn't grow up with a lot of Peter Pan Snow White etc myself included the only classic Disney I watched regularly was Aladdin.

Since Frozen is opening in November I personally have 3 different family groups planning to visit because there kids love frozen.

So would you say the continuing lower attendance despite the park continuing to expand is more coming from the fact that HK isn’t big enough alone to pull say 10 million for the park but for most people from the GBA it’s too much effort to bother crossing the border into HK to go to Disneyland, so the park is kinda stuck, limited in absolute numbers by how much patronage it gets from HK and international tourists who use HK to dodge Chinese visas

 

[Supersnow84]

If Grizzly was actually good, it would be a completely different story. Instead it just feels like transitions between turn around instead of a legitimate coaster anywhere

I think it’s a bit harsh to put part of the failings on big grizzly, Shanghai pulls 2 hour queues on 7DMT regularly and big grizzly is far better than 7DMT even if people think it’s worse than the 4 big thunders

 

[momo123]

So would you say the continuing lower attendance despite the park continuing to expand is more coming from the fact that HK isn’t big enough alone to pull say 10 million for the park but for most people from the GBA it’s too much effort to bother crossing the border into HK to go to Disneyland, so the park is kinda stuck, limited in absolute numbers by how much patronage it gets from HK and international tourists who use HK to dodge Chinese visas

I think this is a major point people always forget to take into account lets take a look at other cities with parks with small populations. Take universal Singapore for example it has 13 rides now (had 15 earlier with madagascar) it has more thrill rides than hk in a smaller space but look at its numbers it also has a population around it with 200+ million its peak attendance was 4.4m. Few things of note also the space does have more to do than just universal casinos and shopping area and a water park.

Also now consider Hk has two theme parks so that's another problem to consider (this divides local attendance between the two parks) essentially the two parks have very similar attendance numbers they both peaked in 2014 at 7.5m for Disney and 7.8m for Ocean park.

I think this is a serious problem no one mentions the only solution I see long term is ocean park becoming a aquarium and zoo but for that to happen the government needs to invest big in Disney (future planning) then shut OP sad but that's the only way I think Hk numbers go up and stay up.

 

[Supersnow84]

It seems strange Disney didn’t plan for this and expect this, unless they truly planned for the park to be a quick cheap and nasty cash grab (but why expand it then)

I guess maybe Disney assumed that flow over the border would become easier because even with ocean park they are unlikely to be hitting 10 million even without Shanghai ruining the numbers, if there was free flow the GBA would be a massive boon to the park

LegCo in the last meeting was discussing “sacrificing” ocean park for Disneyland but I don’t know if that was an actual sentiment or more like a hypothetical “if we gave you the entire city budget what would you do with it”

 

[Mark_E]

For arguments sake between Hong Kong and Shanghai in terms of rides...

Toy Story lands both have 3 rides (one different for each park)
Each park has a Teacups/Carousel/Dumbo
Pooh - Both parks
Crystal Grotto = It's a Small World
Buzz, Jet Packs, Tron = Ant Man, Orbitron and Space Mountain

Then it gets harder to compare, but....
Seven Dwarfs MT - Grizzly Mountain (outdoor coaster)
Soaring - Iron Man (Simulator style attractions)
Peter Pan - Mystic Manor (two great dark rides)
Pirates - Frozen Ever After (Indoor boat rides)
Rapids - Jungle Cruise (Outdoor boat attractions)

That leaves us with Canoes & Zootopia for Shanghai, and Oakens Coaster for HKG. Of course some of these are very different, but on paper the atraction line-ups are not so different. Of course Shanghai also has the totally unique challenge trails. Really, it shows a few more attractions at Hong Kong would make a huge difference, and as I mentioned before, even porting things like Soaring or TSMM would go a long way.

 

[Supersnow84]

Hong Kong also has 3 top tier stage shows that regularly fill up (especially FOTLK), Shanghai only really has the (awful) pirate spectacular and the frozen singalong, momentous is also better than illuminate (though that might be due to Shanghai’s wonky projections)

The depth of overall offerings at the two parks is relatively similar but Shanghai is pulling twice as many guests as HK’s best ever year in operation, I don’t think 1 or 2 more attractions to make HK “the obvious choice on paper” is really going to change much

 

[momo123]

Hong Kong also has 3 top tier stage shows that regularly fill up (especially FOTLK), Shanghai only really has the (awful) pirate spectacular and the frozen singalong, momentous is also better than illuminate (though that might be due to Shanghai’s wonky projections)

The depth of overall offerings at the two parks is relatively similar but Shanghai is pulling twice as many guests as HK’s best ever year in operation, I don’t think 1 or 2 more attractions to make HK “the obvious choice on paper” is really going to change much

As I said earlier the parks aren’t that different in offerings I’d say the only real unique attraction is camp discovery and HK has nothing similar to offer.

I’d say in many ways the parks are essentially evenly matched so the question comes up what’s wrong I think my point earlier about population and travel dynamics are a big factor. Maybe something is needed to drive locals & more importantly people to HK from around Asia and the mainland.

I think frozen was a huge hit in China and around Asia in general let’s see if that helps if it does help then I think the park will understand what’s needed to make it a success (hopefully they don’t just give a frozen to Shanghai how they also have tsl)

I think going forward I could see the relationship change with HK more keen to expand and Disney more reluctant I think is a possibility because for the government Disney provides jobs, secondary economic benefits in tourism etc. Disney on the other hand needs to make money and probably don’t want to throw it at a park that just doesn’t have the market to actually be able to make a major profit. Even with the current expansion we can see Disney taking it easy they could easily as in the past aggressively push new options to the government to approve but haven’t as half or around $2.5-2.7 billion of the money will come from them.

 

[SplashJacket]

Hong Kong’s issue is a aggressive mediocrity throughout.

Toy Story Land is mediocre, inferior to Shanghai’s. Space Mountain is nothing comparable to Tron, vastly inferior. Iron Man is vastly inferior to Star Tours. Ant Man is vastly inferior to Buzz (which many people complain is sterile).

Fantasyland and a lot of the park just feels small and cheap. Adventureland is interesting. Their jungle cruise is interesting, but I wouldn’t necessarily say it’s better or worse.

Shanghai feels expansive and grand, Hong Kong feels small and choked. Disneyland feels quaint and intimate.

To me, especially after Frozen, the park is mostly fine, but is still dying for a true headliner attraction.

Animal Kingdom has FoP. Hollywood Studios has Rise. Epcot has Guardians. DCA has RSR. Disneyland park has Rise and Indy. Shanghai has Pirates. DisneySea has Journey. Tokyo Disneyland has BatB.

Hong Kong needs a mega E-ticket + attraction. Give something for people to awe at for years and talk about.

I love Mystic Manor, I think it’s a perfectly executed E-ticket, but at the end of the day, it’s still only an E-ticket. It’s scale just doesn’t push it into the realm of headliner.

I’m not sure how good the Avengers E-ticket would’ve been, but sounded like it at least had the potential to fill Hong Kong’s most needed hole.

 

[BrianLo]

I actually think this expansion plan as originally envisioned was fairly perfect for the park. Despite the sentiments the castle retheme played well to the public and is important for the night show overhaul. Frozen looks gorgeous, within Disneyland scaling and provides a strong Fantasyland expansion that was sorely needed.

The Marvel ride was going to be the "F-ticket" that the park most certainly needs.

I do think Frozen may move the meter more than we are expecting, at least this part of the project was carried through. If that further plays well to locals and continues the AP wave HK is experiencing it gets the park back off such a negative tailspin.