Guardians of the Galaxy coming to Energy Pavilion at Epcot

[lazyboy97o]

While there has always been overlap, they also attract different types of families looking for different types of experiences. As I previously mentioned, HM and SWA were never intended to be as overt as AE was. I strongly agree that HoP doesn't appeal to kids, or even a lot of adults, but there's nothing in there that's inappropriate for them content wise. I'll leave you with this question. If the tech was available, do you think Walt or the first gen. Imagineers would've built something like AE? Be honest.

Walt was long committed to building a "spook house" and already had the history of scaring scaring little kids. The basic narrative of The Haunted Mansion's development with Claude Coats and Marc Davis disagreeing over tone suggests that Walt never told Coats to shut up. That you reference content and technology just further highlights your lack of familiarity with the attraction. The attraction was built around audio set in darkness, not wild technology or graphic imagery. But even this hypothetical ignores that the ExtraTERRORestrial Alien Encounter is a narrative experience, a form that was almost nonexistent amongst the work of the first generation of Imagineers and only rose to true prominence in the 1980s. The dominate template of "...and then something goes horrible wrong" introduced not only a different storytelling structure but also a necessary cynicism to enable the continued mishaps of theme park excitement.

 

[Lee]

Let's not forget that one of the principal actors in AE was Jeffery Jones. He was arrested and convicted as a sexual offender against children in 2003. The story generated a lot of bad press for Disney. AE closed in October, 2003. Coincidence?

Yep.
That was not a factor at all.

 

[Lee]

I still have my alien encounter coffee mug and when you pour the coffee in the picture on the side of the mug turns into the alien.

I've still got my toy alien. And a grand opening shirt.
And probably a Skippy plush around here somewhere...

 

[Donaldfan1934]

Walt was long committed to building a "spook house" and already had the history of scaring scaring little kids. The basic narrative of The Haunted Mansion's development with Claude Coats and Marc Davis disagreeing over tone suggests that Walt never told Coats to shut up. That you reference content and technology just further highlights your lack of familiarity with the attraction. The attraction was built around audio set in darkness, not wild technology or graphic imagery. But even this hypothetical ignores that the ExtraTERRORestrial Alien Encounter is a narrative experience, a form that was almost nonexistent amongst the work of the first generation of Imagineers and only rose to true prominence in the 1980s. The dominate template of "...and then something goes horrible wrong" introduced not only a different storytelling structure but also a necessary cynicism to enable to continued mishaps of theme park excitement.

I'm familiar with how the development was. You can tell there are two tones in the attraction and that is something I think Mark and Claude blended together well. Aside from all the theme park tropes coined in the 1980's, the point is that they were going for spooky atmoshpere back then and not $#*+ your pants sensory experiences.

 

[Lee]

I said most not all. Yes, obviously kids get scared on those type of rides, but the ratio between scared and not was probably fairly different between the coasters and AE.

Not really.
The anecdotal stories told to me would indicate that the ratio was fairly close.
Problem was that parents "expected" the kids to be scared of the coasters, especially Space, so we're less prone to pressure them to ride.
Despite the numerous warnings, they were "surprised" by AE because they didn't expect a show to get the same reaction.
The kid cries...mom and dad are ticked off/feeling guilty for taking them into the show...so they complained.

Also, do not underestimate the power of the plush in this situation. It was a HUGE contributing factor.
Had Stitch, who was very popular at the time and guaranteed an increase in merchandise sales, not been available...AE would have remained much longer. (It wasn't as if there were so many complaints that they would have closed the show and left the space dormant.)

They probably sold enough Stitch merch in a week to offset the tiny budget they gave Kevin Rafferty to convert the show...

But, anyway....back to Guardians at Epcot. Boooooo!

 

[V_L_Raptor]

Total lie...Groot is Dutch not Norwegian

Yeah, the other part is the Norway pavilion is going to turn into a Netherlands tribute. The snowgies will be replaced with tulips and Olaf's going to dangle from the arms of a windmill.

 

[V_L_Raptor]

Is the problem lack of good Imagineers, or management that won't give them the freedom or money to do really good work?

(This is what you get when I stay up late and post on forums. Heh.)

Depends. Could really be a little bit of column A and a little bit of column B. I think that teasing out a definitive answer on this would take a complete statistical workup, but it would appear that all Disney has managed to provide for analysis these past few years is a raft and a half of really shoddy data points.

Of course, if you first plot historical quality (going back to Disneyland, of course) against time, you might end up with a graph that would be a great design for a roller coaster. (Put some nice IP clipart on it and you can apply for a job as a ride/show designer with your brand new, ready-made portfolio.)

 

[V_L_Raptor]

Sorry I went against the hive narative of "almost everything prior to the late 1990's is nearly infallible". I respect and mostly agree with a lot posters here, but I find the atmosphere here can sometimes be hard to express yourself and share a "contrarian" opinion.

Not to put too fine a point on it, but your account says that you're 19. Is it at all possible that holding forth at such length on something you did not experience is not, in fact, boosting your argumentation skills, but is instead making you look like you're just trying to get one over on the people who are old enough to have seen and experienced the ride... and, in fact, did?

 

[V_L_Raptor]

Interesting. "Should not" implies that they allowed shorter kids on?

In any event, it is absurd to suggest that the park couldn't have ONE attraction with restrictions like that. Pretty sure IJA at DL has a slightly-lower 46" requirement and features disturbing and macabre imagery that no one complains about.

"Should not" implies the mouse-gloves approach to parents who were already getting huffy and entitled. "May not" and "are not allowed" would have started a revolt just at the notion of something being forbidden.

 

[marni1971]

If you feel my opinion is unwarranted, read my reply to @Mark Devries above. Hopefully I stated it in a clearer light for others to understand.

I think the issue is that others don't agree with you on this nor will they.

Not that that's wrong in itself though. It is a discussion board. That's what opinions are for. But if an opinion is stated long enough and people still don't agree with it, it may be time to accept that.

 

[Donaldfan1934]

Not really.
The anecdotal stories told to me would indicate that the ratio was fairly close.
Problem was that parents "expected" the kids to be scared of the coasters, especially Space, so we're less prone to pressure them to ride.
Despite the numerous warnings, they were "surprised" by AE because they didn't expect a show to get the same reaction.
The kid cries...mom and dad are ticked off/feeling guilty for taking them into the show...so they complained.

Also, do not underestimate the power of the plush in this situation. It was a HUGE contributing factor.
Had Stitch, who was very popular at the time and guaranteed an increase in merchandise sales, not been available...AE would have remained much longer. (It wasn't as if there were so many complaints that they would have closed the show and left the space dormant.)

They probably sold enough Stitch merch in a week to offset the tiny budget they gave Kevin Rafferty to convert the show...

But, anyway....back to Guardians at Epcot. Boooooo!

Just to finally end this once and for all, this is my trump card. http://www.themeparktourist.com/fea...ive-extraterrorestrial-alien-encounter?page=4
The article posted, Disney had to close its scariest attraction. Here's why., is an expertly written in depth look of the attraction at hand. It covers everything we've discussed in this thread and then some. It covers everything from the factors that lead to its creation to its ultimate fate as SGE. I think you should read the whole article to get the true nature of the beast, but if you don't have time, I'd suggest you go to page 5 where there's a run down of the perfect storm of factors that ultimately lead to its demise. Whether you loved the attraction or hated it, this article will give you a fuller sense of what the attraction was and how people felt about it. I hope this will further enrich your knowledge of Disney theme parks as we move out discussion back to GotG in UoE.

 

[Donaldfan1934]

I think the issue is that others don't agree with you on this nor will they.

Not that that's wrong in itself though. It is a discussion board. That's what opinions are for. But if an opinion is stated long enough and people still don't agree with it, it may be time to accept that.

Correct. I always do my best to reach the ideal middle ground in an argument, but sometimes you have realize there just isn't any between you and who you're arguing with. I've seemed have reached that with @odmichael and @tirian, but not so much with most others who've replied to my posts.

 

[marni1971]

Just to finally end this once and for all, this is my trump card. http://www.themeparktourist.com/fea...ive-extraterrorestrial-alien-encounter?page=4
The article posted, Disney had to close its scariest attraction. Here's why., is an expertly written in depth look of the attraction at hand. It covers everything we've discussed in this thread and then some. It covers everything from the factors that lead to its creation to its ultimate fate as SGE. I think you should read the whole article to get the true nature of the beast, but if you don't have time, I'd suggest you go to page 5 where there's a run down of the perfect storm of factors that ultimately lead to its demise. Whether you loved the attraction or hated it, this article will give you a fuller sense of what the attraction was and how people felt about it. I hope this will further enrich your knowledge of Disney theme parks as we move out discussion back to GotG in UoE.

With respect, some of us here know far more than articles of opinion such as this.

Our "knowledge is enriched" from elsewhere.

You're right in that this should be about GotG though. Perhaps AEs demise should have its own thread if it's felt the discussion should carry on. Again.

 

[Ripken10]

With respect, some of us here know far more than articles of opinion such as this.

Our "knowledge is enriched" from elsewhere.

You're right in that this should be about GotG though. Perhaps AEs demise should have its own thread if it's felt the discussion should carry on. Again.

It was a good attraction, but I have to agree with #5 and 6, especially #5. It just didn't feel like it belonged in the Magic Kingdom.

 

[seabreezept813]

Interesting. "Should not" implies that they allowed shorter kids on?

In any event, it is absurd to suggest that the park couldn't have ONE attraction with restrictions like that. Pretty sure IJA at DL has a slightly-lower 46" requirement and features disturbing and macabre imagery that no one complains about.

The advertisements were very similar to Tower of Terror. People screaming, etc. Visually it should have been obvious that the ride was scary. Disney as a whole is really for the 10+ crowd. Many of the major rides or shows have at least moments of being scary. I remember my stepdaughter crying in It's Tough to be a Bug at age 7 because of the spiders. Of course, then she wanted to go back in again. If you bring younger kids it's great, but just like any theme park they will not be ready to experience everything.

 

[Mike S]

I would rather it go where it could sort of make sense instead of taking over half of Future world East, since WDW only adds lands now and we can't just have one Guardians attraction. If they are going to spend the money anyway maybe umm... put it in DHS in a new building.

I agree wholeheartedly that GotG should be in DHS. I'm just saying that if Disney is set on putting this in Epcot then I'd prefer a great ride in the wrong park than a ride that's both in the wrong park and just a reskin of a somewhat mediocre ride. WoL is just a phase 2 thing that might not even happen so Guardians probably won't be taking over half of Future World East.

 

[Bocabear]

I agree wholeheartedly that GotG should be in DHS. I'm just saying that if Disney is set on putting this in Epcot then I'd prefer a great ride in the wrong park than a ride that's both in the wrong park and just a reskin of a somewhat mediocre ride. WoL is just a phase 2 thing that might not even happen so Guardians probably won't be taking over half of Future World East.

They never get to phase 2...lol and if they do, it is not even close to what was originally planned... so whenever they say "Phase2" that just means that is all... it will never happen...

 

[Donaldfan1934]

With respect, some of us here know far more than articles of opinion such as this.

Our "knowledge is enriched" from elsewhere.

You're right in that this should be about GotG though. Perhaps AEs demise should have its own thread if it's felt the discussion should carry on. Again.

True, but some were arguing how it was recieved outside of the fan community. just wanted to clear some of that up is all. Now let's all move on and Get back on topic.

 

[odmichael]

I agree wholeheartedly that GotG should be in DHS. I'm just saying that if Disney is set on putting this in Epcot then I'd prefer a great ride in the wrong park than a ride that's both in the wrong park and just a reskin of a somewhat mediocre ride. WoL is just a phase 2 thing that might not even happen so Guardians probably won't be taking over half of Future World East.

Yeah, let's not get our hopes up that Disney would renovate an abandoned pavillion.

 

[ParentsOf4]

Walt Disney once said:

[Disneyland] will get better as I find out what the public likes.​

The point is, Walt wanted to hear from the public and build what was going to be popular.

Who thinks the current Universe of Energy or shuttered Wonders Of Life are popular?

Who thinks replacing those with GotG wouldn't be insanely popular?

Who will refuse to experience GotG at Epcot because it's "thematically inappropriate"?

Admittedly, I don't think like an Imagineer nor do I aspire to be one. Instead, I prefer to experience a new attraction and its surrounding before deciding if I like it.

Still, I believe GotG "fits" within Future World and could be the best thing to happen to Epcot in decades.

Let the flaming begin ...