Game of Thrones season 8 announced

[Princess Leia]

And while Dany is burning the city we do not get one close up of her. It might of helped if you could see what she looked like while destroying the city. Was she determined and calculating? Was she smiling and showing detachment to all the people she was killing?

I made the same comment to my sister. Once she went mad, we never saw her again, only in the background with Drogon. I thought that was an interesting choice

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

And while Dany is burning the city we do not get one close up of her. It might of helped if you could see what she looked like while destroying the city. Was she determined and calculating? Was she smiling and showing detachment to all the people she was killing?

I read somewhere that they wanted to focus on the impact of such an attack on the people being hurt by it. For whatever that's worth.

 

[Willmark]

Dany has has this destiny hinted at for seasons and seasons... and it became very clear the last few episodes where her mind was going, specifically after the blow thrown at her by Jon about who he truly is.

She had a vision in Season 2 or 3 of the throne room in ruins, ash floating around. She told Lady Olenna that she would not become The Queen of the Ash.... all foreshadowing.

My only issues were with Cersei basically rolling over and letting them win... she always had tricks up her sleeve, but she was sort of delusional during that entire battle. And I really hope she has somehow survived being buried by rocks so she can die in a far more epic way. Also, how hilarious was Cersei sneaking past The Hound? She was like "Oh my, let me just squeeze past you there."

Otherwise, I am not as upset as everyone is on the internet... the series is still amazing to me.

Agreed.

Ive read the series four times fully since 1999 and sections numerous times over. I read ADoD in three days when it came out. I’ve watched the series twice fully and watch YouTube vids about it all the time.

Right now I’m reading Fire and Blood book 1 of the history of the Conquest to about 150 years before the War of the Five Kings. Additionally I’ve read the Dunk and Egg novellas.

Safe to say I’m a fan and I agree.

Dany has been the villain all along, in the books it’s subtle in the TV series less so.

Around the time of Season 4-5 (around 2015) I read all five books again while Mrs Willmark was getting into the TV series around season 2.

What struck me at that time was the actions of seasons 4,5,6 and how they were beginning to telegraph Daeny’s true character even then.

I’m surprised peopled didn’t see this coming. I think the shock I’d be said people saw what they wanted to in her, not what she actually is.

 

[Princess Leia]

So, here are the characters that are left living for the final episode (broken down by regions):

King’s Landing

• Daenerys Targaryen
• Jon Snow
• Grey Worm
• Tyrion Lannister
• Arya Stark
• See Davos Seaworth

Iron Islands

• Yara Greyjoy

The North

• Ser Brienne of Tarth
• Sansa Stark
• Bran Stark
• Gendry Baratheon*
• Bronn*
• Samwell Tarly*
• Gilly*
• Podrick Payne*
• Yohn Royce

*I think they’re still North

Really North

• Tormund Giantsbane (I’d be surprised if we saw him in the show again)

Predictions for next week: someone kills Dany, Grey Worm falls on his own spear out of guilt, and then someone on the ‘good side’ also dies, because it’s Game of Thrones and it would be too tidy for Dany to not burn someone else on the side of the living.

 

[Disney Analyst]

That moment when you realize The Night King was trying to stop this from all happening...

 

[Willmark]

Jaime is my favorite character. Hands down. His narration in the books is particularly great. The show did him dirty. Daenerys going mad has been a question mark since about Season 2 or 3, so I’m not completely surprised she did, but I hate how abruptly it happened. Another 3 or 4 episodes would have been nice to develop that.

Jaime though... what in the seven hells did they do to him???? They kept him with Cersei far longer than he stayed in the books. And then this season, it was like whiplash.

• Episode 1. Arrives in Winterfell to warn people that Cersei isn’t helping.
• Episode 2. Knights Brienne
• Episode 3. Fights for the living ALONGSIDE BRIENNE
• Episode 4. CONSUMMATES RELATIONSHIP WITH BRIENNE.... and then leaves her to go back to Cersei
• Episode 5. Kills Euron, dies with Cersei.

They screwed up with him. Royally.

One of the most surprising things in my first read of the series was when you (as a reader) become sympathetic to him.

Great writing imo.

 

[LittleBuford]

I’m surprised peopled didn’t see this coming. I think the shock I’d be said people saw what the wanted to in her, not what she actually is.

Plenty of people who disliked Dany are also surprised by the extent and abruptness of last episode’s shift. We’ve never seen her slaughter innocent civilians before; on the contrary, she locked up her dragons after one of them killed a single child.

 

[Willmark]

So, here are the characters that are left living for the final episode (broken down by regions):

King’s Landing

• Daenerys Targaryen
• Jon Snow
• Grey Worm
• Tyrion Lannister
• Arya Stark
• See Davos Seaworth

Iron Islands

• Yara Greyjoy

The North

• Ser Brienne of Tarth
• Sansa Stark
• Bran Stark
• Gendry Baratheon*
• Bronn*
• Samwell Tarly*
• Gilly*
• Podrick Payne*
• Yohn Royce

*I think they’re still North

Really North

• Tormund Giantsbane (I’d be surprised if we saw him in the show again)

Predictions for next week: someone kills Dany, Grey Worm falls on his own spear out of guilt, and then someone on the ‘good side’ also dies, because it’s Game of Thrones and it would be too tidy for Dany to not burn someone else on the side of the living.

The series as a whole, tv and books is about not getting what you want, the characters that is. Quite often really it’s the opposite.

Thus Jon who has never wanted any of this is the best choice to be king. Not whether he should or wants to.

After all the series is called the Song of Ice and Fire, pretty much means either Jon or Dany has to go.

 

[LittleBuford]

This is an amusing read:

What Was Bran Doing While King’s Landing Burned to the Ground?

www.theringer.com

 

[Janir]

Agreed.

Ive read the series four times fully since 1999 and sections numerous times over. I read ADoD in three days when it came out. I’ve watched the series twice fully and watch YouTube vids about it all the time.

Right now I’m reading Fire and Blood book 1 of the history of the Conquest to about 150 years before the War of the Five Kings. Additionally I’ve read the Dunk and Egg novellas.

Safe to say I’m a fan and I agree.

Dany has been the villain all along, in the books it’s subtle in the TV series less so.

Around the time of Season 4-5 (around 2015) I read all five books again while Mrs Willmark was getting into the TV series around season 2.

What struck me at that time was the actions of seasons 4,5,6 and how they were beginning to telegraph Daeny’s true character even then.

I’m surprised peopled didn’t see this coming. I think the shock I’d be said people saw what the wanted to in her, not what she actually is.

It seemed too forced. Dany's been portrayed as thinking of herself as a savior of the masses, but portrayed as someone that can go off the rails when provoked . She had her win in hand in a way that gave her everything she wanted without extra bloodshed. She looked like she was "set off" like she's been before but with nothing to set her off when she started torching the city. If she was angry and provoked about Missandei's death, I could see her attacking the Red Keep towers itself and leaving most of the city alone. Go after Cersei in the highest towers, even if Cersei isn't there anymore but moved to a safer location. Dany could have gone directly after Cersei as being the focus of her rage and anger vs the people for not rising up for her.

 

[Willmark]

Plenty of people who disliked Dany are also surprised by the extent and abruptness of last episode’s shift. We’ve never seen her slaughter innocent civilians before; on the contrary, she locked up her dragons after one of them killed a single child.

Dany character arc is about power, the absence of it (early on) then to overwhelming power (when the dragons are grown.) Then it becomes about loss and the inability to use that overwhelming power for something she’s strived for her whole life.

When one looks at her actions from the beginning to now she’s just another bad Targaryen ruler. She equates power to ruling. She’s loved in Essos but can’t fathom why she isn’t in Westeros. Burning the Tarlys shows just how bad a ruler she is, just as bad as Joffrey; send them to the Wall. Tywin would have never made that blunder. He talks about that if a ruler makes it so a lord never knees don’t be surprised when they don’t (paraphrasing here).

The executions in Mereen? She just rounded up nobles and executed them whether they we’re guilty or not. Slavery is horrendous. So is crucifying innocent men which some of the leaders in Slavers Bay were.

I think this is a perfect time for me to be reading Fire and Blood and I can’t wait for the second of the books because she’s now far worse that the worst Targaryen king ever on the Iron Throne, Aegon the Unworthy. Of course whether that happens in the books who knows? I don’t think he ever will finish them.

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

One of the most surprising things in my first read of the series was when you (as a reader) become sympathetic to him.

Great writing imo.

The well rounded and developed characters is a major achievement of the series. Cersei is such a fun character because she's clearly evil but you can also appreciate what a bad- she is. In those moments where she imprisons her enemy next to her dying daughter, or blows up her enemies en masse, you're actually enjoying it.

She also suffers just enough injustices that you're sympathetic to her at times.

 

[Willmark]

The well rounded and developed characters is a major achievement of the series. Cersei is such a fun character because she's clearly evil but you can also appreciate what a bad-*** she is. In those moments where she imprisons her enemy next to her dying daughter, or blows up her enemies en masse, you're actually enjoying it.

She also suffers just enough injustices that you're sympathetic to her at times.

I have a hard time with TV Cersei. As of Book 5 she is nothing like TV Cersei.

She was closest to form in Seasons 1-2; Hell I even liked TV Cersei up until Season 5. After that? Ugh.

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

Plenty of people who disliked Dany are also surprised by the extent and abruptness of last episode’s shift. We’ve never seen her slaughter innocent civilians before; on the contrary, she locked up her dragons after one of them killed a single child.

Burning the Tarlys shows just how bad a ruler she is, just as bad as Joffrey; send them to the wall. Tywin would have never made that blunder. He talks about that if a ruler makes it do a lord never knees don’t be surprised when they don’t (paraphrasing here).

The executions in Mereen? She just rounded up nobles and executed them whether they we’re guilty or not. Slavery is horrendous. So is crucifying innocent men which some of the leaders in Slavers Bay were.

I think this is where the disconnect lies. No one should be surprised that she is prone to madness, but all of her major actions have really portrayed her as good. Freeing the slaves, telling Yara to stop it with the raping and pillaging, etc.

The bad things noted above are true, but they're so small and subtle when compared to the good. They don't really register strongly with me. I think it's the same for a lot of people, such that we're asking how did someone who freed slaves go to murdering millions of innocents?

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

I have a hard time with TV Cersei. As of Book 5 she is nothing like TV Cersei.

She was closest to from in Seasons 1-2; Hell I even liked TV Cersei up until Season 5. After that? Ugh.

I just started reading the first book for the first time, and it's really good. It's a little boring by virtue of knowing what happens, naturally, but I recognize quality.

I figured I'd read it to get a bit more detail story wise, but I'm hesitant because of the common question - will the book series actually be completed?

 

[Willmark]

I just started reading the first book for the first time, and it's really good. It's a little boring by virtue of knowing what happens, naturally, but I recognize quality.

I figured I'd read it to get a bit more detail story wise, but I'm hesitant because of the common question - will the book series actually be completed?

There are still surprises.

Obviously the TV show can’t cram it all in, they also condense a lot of characters and stories.

 

[LittleBuford]

Dany character arc is about power, the absence of it (early on) then to overwhelming power (when the dragons are grown.) Then it becomes about loss and the inability to use that overwhelming power for something she’s strived for her whole life.

When one looks at her actions from the beginning to now she’s just another bad Targaryen ruler. She equates power to ruling. She’s loved in Essos but can’t fathom why she isn’t in Westeros. Burning the Tarlys shows just how bad a ruler she is, just as bad as Joffrey; send them to the wall. Tywin would have never made that blunder. He talks about that if a ruler makes it do a lord never knees don’t be surprised when they don’t (paraphrasing here).

The executions in Mereen? She just rounded up nobles and executed them whether they we’re guilty or not. Slavery is horrendous. So is crucifying innocent men which some of the leaders in Slavers Bay were.

I think this is a perfect time for me to be reading Fire and Blood and I can’t wait for the second of the books because she’s now far worse that the worst Targaryen king ever on the Iron Throne, Aegon the Unworthy. Of course whether that happens in the books who knows? I don’t think he ever will.

Again, none of this addresses the fact that all of her anger thus far has been directed at her enemies and other “guilty” groups (slavers, rival soldiers, etc.). Firebombing a whole city that has just surrendered is on another level entirely, and many viewers—not just us Dany fans—didn’t see it coming. Even the showrunners can’t offer a consistent explanation for it: Was it a conscious strategy (“Let it be fear”), was it congenital madness, or was it a snap decision she made upon seeing the Red Keep?

The way her treatment of the Tarlys is remembered really baffles me. Everyone seems to forget that she offered them full mercy (the chance to live and retain their lands and titles) if they bent the knee, which is a pretty sweet deal for enemy combatants in a pseudo-medieval world. When Randyll refused and Tyrion mentioned the Wall as an alternative to execution, the former said something like, “She can’t send me there—she’s not my queen.” How, then, was she doing something unexpected or unusual by executing them in the end? It’s telling that Jon’s execution of a young boy has never been held against him.

 

[Willmark]

but I'm hesitant because of the common question/ will the book series actually be completed?

And as far as this? Who knows?

I’ve long since given up hope he’s going to actually finish the series. He has himself painted into a lot of corners in the books.

In book 5 he COULD have started wrapping some stuff up but chose to add more.

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

One take on the writing I read today made a good argument.

GRRM came up with story as he went, letting the story unfold in a natural way.

With the show, they seemed to have an ending and a deadline, and wrote backwards from there. Hence it feels like a lot of the actions by characters are because they had a checklist of things they needed to to in order to get us where we are now.

 

[Disney Analyst]

Are the residents of Kings Landing not just as guilty as the Slave owners? That is my question. Why should I feel bad for them? I mean, sure that mother/daughter moment got me in the feels, sure... But overall Kings Landing has always been a nasty place.