GAC to Become DAS

[mr spalding]

Is there any of particular reason why parents of autistic children have been the most vocal opponents of the new system?

Because they have the most to lose (FOTL unlimited FastPass). Whereas, those who are physically disabled (like my child ), the GAC really didn't help them as much due to having to wait for alternative ride vehicles. It is those wheelchair bound and can't transfer who are really getting the shaft on this deal because they now will be waiting longer to ride than anyone else.

 

[GoofGoof]

Because they have the most to lose (FOTL unlimited FastPass). Whereas, those who are physically disabled (like my child ), the GAC really didn't help them as much due to having to wait for alternative ride vehicles. It is those wheelchair bound and can't transfer who are really getting the shaft on this deal because they now will be waiting longer to ride than anyone else.

That isn't good. I didn't realize this would impact guests in wheelchairs too. I thought the GAC and wheelchair guests were 2 different systems. So under the new system will a guest in a wheelchair need to get a DAS and come back at a reserved time or will they still be able to just use the alternate or ADA accessible entrance? This is all so confusing.

 

[startraveler]

Because they have the most to lose (FOTL unlimited FastPass). Whereas, those who are physically disabled (like my child ), the GAC really didn't help them as much due to having to wait for alternative ride vehicles. It is those wheelchair bound and can't transfer who are really getting the shaft on this deal because they now will be waiting longer to ride than anyone else.

That's my fear, too. When I used a GAC (had one, didn't always use it) it basically made my wait the same rather than shorter than the able bodied visitors as many have thought. It allowed me to enter the fast pass line, as a path to go to get into the wheelchair line. (Most of the time I was unable to make the return times when I got regular fast passes.) I do think there needs to be some recognition of the "special car" issue in all this.
Good example for those who don't know is Nemo. The line is continually moving. So someone has to push me back and forth in the dark, up a grade and then when we get to the front of the line, we are pulled aside and taken out a side door into the pavilion where we get in line behind all the other people in wheelchairs. We wait for the one car we can use. If there are five people in front of us, we wait for it to go around 5 times. Basically all the people in the main line who were behind us are through the line and gone on to other things by the time we get on. With the GAC, we went directly to the wheelchair line.
I am grateful that there are a few rides I can ride. I don't complain about paying the same as everyone else (many venues give discounts to patrons with physical disabilities). I did however appreciate how Disney made things easy for me, as everything is difficult and it takes so long to do everything. I know some have said I should just stay home. It is one of the few places I can actually go on vacation and I will not stop going, but I do wish people here would understand our position and stop saying that taking away that accommodation finally makes our experience equal to theirs - creates a level playing field - one where we don't have it better than they do. And yes, Disney has gone beyond the law in trying to make things magically for guests who have limited ability to partake in all the attractions.
A little story: My favorite experience is my last time on Pirates, almost 10 years ago now. I was waiting for Bertha at Jungle Cruise. It was the wheelchair boat and it had already been put away for the night. A manager was there working out schedules and called the boat back out. We then got to wait a while and talk with him. He asked about other attractions in his areas. Told him I couldn't do splash, big thunder, pirates at all He said what would I like to do. I said I'd love to do Pirates one more time since I hadn't been able to do it since I was little. He said to meet him at Pirates at park opening the next morning. It was Memorial Day Monday, but we showed. He got another manager and their boss and we went around back and to the other side of the ride. Together with my parents all of them lifted me and carried me onto the boat and they were waiting for me at the end of the ride. I know they could have been in trouble, so I never wrote or anything to Disney about this special "accommodation" But this made my trip. It is not Disney's commitment to the law that makes things magical for guests, it is their commitment to making people happy that has made vacationing there special for me. If it becomes all legal, a lot of what makes it special is lost.
I'm not going for a few months, so I'll just have to see how it works for me by then and make adjustments.
Not complaining. Just educating.

 

[Admiral01]

It could be my imagination, but after 5 days on property at the parks, I noticed far fewer wheel-chair guests than in past visits.

Could this be a result of fewer people unfairly taking advantage of the new system?

 

[mr spalding]

It could be my imagination, but after 5 days on property at the parks, I noticed far fewer wheel-chair guests than in past visits.

Could this be a result of fewer people unfairly taking advantage of the new system?

I had a feeling that this would happen. As a parent of a disabled child who is wheelchair bound, I can't tell you how many times I witnessed people using wheelchairs who miraculously were able to hop right on out and embark on the first ride vehicle while we sat waiting for an accessible ride vehicle.

 

[Gabe1]

....I definitely agree with your statement that too much pushing can lead to a negative outcome. I do civil engineering and construction for 'a living' ...and at the advent of the ADA Laws ...a few clients I worked with were some of the major oil companies / gas station owners. As you may recall, gas stations always had public / customer usable restrooms. When ADA kicked in ....ALL those gas stations were required to upgrade the restrooms to be ADA compliant. When you have 20,000 gas stations ....that's a sizable undertaking with an equally sizable price tag. So ...what did the oil companies do? They got rid of the restrooms...period. They had one ...internal restroom for employee use only ...and the public got none ...because there is no requirement to HAVE to give restroom access to anyone but an employee.

....Disney has no obligation to go above and beyond ....and if they are backed into a corner ...they may change their attitude about any special accommodation.

That was a great analogy. And I am old enough to remember that with the gas station restrooms, we use to drive to Florida when I was small and in many areas that is where we would stop, gas up and go...later as I was older Dad had to stop for gas and then pull into a Holiday Inn for the rest of our business of the stop.

Our train station in my little Hamlet had a unisex restroom, tiny. Now it has none, it is a storage closet.

 

[Gabe1]

The simple fact is most people with a significant enough disability are not riding the big e ticket rides like Space Mountain etc that everyone is this thread has been claiming have been having issues to due to GAC abuse. TSMM and Soarin have had no changes in wait time since the DAS was implemented, these rides just have horrible rider throughput and nothing short of a redesign is going to fix that..

Depends on what angle you are looking at it. More guests are now in the standby queue this week and it is reaching ridiculous levels almost as soon as the park opens because paper FPs are so few in number. Re-entry is still being abused this week at Toy. All FP+ were booked for this week and not showing as an option for MME. Once the standby queue reaches 2 hours for Toy how many more quest will join the queue to make it 3 hours. Could not book Toy this week any day, any time.

Today it took 2.5 hours to finally get loaded on Toy. That is not normal for early morning in October.

 

[GoofGoof]

So the vile piece of trash admits she is just trolling for attention. I knew she couldn't be real...

I don't know anything about the lady and I don't really care either. I just clicked on a link someone posted to her Facebook page. At the bottom it says "this page is purely entertainment. If you are looking for information to help your child, please search your local autism community". I don't think that means she is trolling. She is just putting out a disclaimer that her site shouldn't be used as an expert resource. I am pretty sure she really has an autistic kid and is posting things about that. Everyone deals with situations and adversity differently. Some people would probably curl up in a ball and cry every day, some would drink heavily, some people would react in other ways. I think she probably uses this site as an outlet and a way to cope with the ups and downs of life. I do think her stand against Disney is misguided and the lawsuit is foolish, but that alone doesn't make her a vile piece of trash IMHO.

 

[Goofyernmost]

That isn't good. I didn't realize this would impact guests in wheelchairs too. I thought the GAC and wheelchair guests were 2 different systems. So under the new system will a guest in a wheelchair need to get a DAS and come back at a reserved time or will they still be able to just use the alternate or ADA accessible entrance? This is all so confusing.

I honestly don't think that DAS is going to interfere with that continued process. I really don't believe that a disabled person will be deprived of anything that they had before, in fact, if it does work to lessen the abuse it might even be beneficial, shortening the length of wait for those folks. Give the system a chance to work, before passing judgment. Go with the same expectations as before. If your demands are within the confines of reasonable accommodation, and that fills your actual needs (not necessarily how we would like it to be) I doubt anything will be harmed by it. I don't see how it can.

 

[startraveler]

That isn't good. I didn't realize this would impact guests in wheelchairs too. I thought the GAC and wheelchair guests were 2 different systems. So under the new system will a guest in a wheelchair need to get a DAS and come back at a reserved time or will they still be able to just use the alternate or ADA accessible entrance? This is all so confusing.

In the past, I had to show a GAC to use the special car at Toy story. It was wrong i'm sure, but I had to go and get a GAC to go up the ramp. It was probably poor training, but I always showed one after that. Don't know about the DAS.

 

[RandomPrincess]

That isn't good. I didn't realize this would impact guests in wheelchairs too. I thought the GAC and wheelchair guests were 2 different systems. So under the new system will a guest in a wheelchair need to get a DAS and come back at a reserved time or will they still be able to just use the alternate or ADA accessible entrance? This is all so confusing.

If you have a wheelchair and no other issues (say a broken leg) you do not need a DAS you will go through the regular line except for lines that are not wheelchair assessable. Then they will send you through the Wheelchair entrance. If you have other issues that make waiting in line a problem you can get the DAS.

 

[englanddg]

First let me say that people are all different. When it comes to disabilities people will have different disabilities that will not allow them to stand in line for 2 plus hours or come back in an hour or two to a ride. We cannot single out any one group of people. My DH and I are old. We cannot stand for 2 hours in a line, nor can we come back in an hour. We can't walk that much. We don't want to use wheelchairs nor do we want to use motorized chairs. We try to walk as much as we can. But anyone knows that when you get old the legs and feet don't work as well. So the new DAS system does not work for us. We went to Disney 3 to 4 times a month and spent money in our favorite restaurants, and bought clothing and trinkets. We didn't go on EVERY ride. We may have ridden 2 or 3 rides a trip. But now we can’t enjoy those anymore. We were told by Guest Services to use a wheelchair if we can't walk. But like someone said, the last time we went there were a lot less wheelchairs. I think Disney has lost some of those handicap people. Every situation is different. Most of the people I see in wheel chairs are old or have children that are disabled; they just want to have a little fun. But Disney has taken the “Magic” out for the people who truly needed the GAC. Now they seem to treat us like dirt because we need assistance. It is not the happiest place on earth anymore for the disabled.

I guess you never waited 90 minutes in the 80s for 2k Leagues when the queue was cramped even for me at age 10 or so, much less my 3 heart attack diabetic grandfather who took me and his cane who kept telling me not to swing on the chains because I was so bored in line.

The "magic" is gone, eh? Have the rides changed?

I suspect society has changed. And not in a good way. When demands are placed that everyone with their own specific conditions (which you indicated "everyone is different") that the provider of an amazing experience must accommodate because people gripe without any consideration (or advice, other than complaining and moaning) for operational concerns...

Yeah, I'm not sure that change has been a good thing.

What if I'm too fat to ride a ride (like, say, some of the roller coasters over at Legoland FL, which have very small seats)...does that mean that Legoland should spend millions to refit their rides so that my 300 lb frame can fit in them?

What if they choose not to? Do I have a right to be upset at them if they choose not to? Do I have the right to sue them?

Should I be, since I am (factually) 6'2" tall, be upset that I find the Swiss Family treehouse a bit cramped, and I have trouble fitting into the "house" outside of Winnie the Pooh (which, for the record, is NOT wheelchair accessible)...so should Disney forgo scope, scale, and forced perception to be sure that a kid with a fully motorized wheelchair can roll through that "house"?

What about Tom Sawyer Island? I suppose the whole thing should be shut down because it surely isn't wheelchair friendly in any scope...I mean, really, grown adults have trouble in some of those caves!

Or Typhoon Lagoon...I suppose the whole park should be shut down.

I know I'm taking it to an extreme...but, there used to be a term called a "killjoy". I don't see why you or anyone else having a disability should have any "preferred" access at all. Accomodation != "preferred" and != "killing the magic". That's YOUR choice...no one else's.

I got to experience the "transfer queue" at Kilimanjaro Safari this past trip because a CM thought that the kid and I in the FP lane were with the family in front of us and mis-directed us to the "alternate line"...and I can say, I wholly get that those who have to transfer, or can't tranfer, wait a long time, as they have to wait for a specific vehicle. We watched something like 10 trucks pass by us before our truck was even boarded. Of course, I didn't complain, but I was met with GAC folks who felt that I was trying to "creep" on their "rights". Including one who said I should pretend I was with their family so I don't "get in trouble"...in trouble for what? I went where the frigging CM TOLD ME TO GO!

That being said, I think waiting in that line (after they realized I wasn't trying to rip off their GAC "privileges" and exposing my kiddo to people with varying conditions was a good experience for her. We had a great conversation with a lady in a wheelchair, who took a liking to her, and frankly, she did as all kids (and most adults) do, and not see them as any different than normal people (remember, this is about EQUALITY, right? RIGHT???)

So, sorry to rant...but, this attitude just annoys me. So sorry Disney tried to do something for an operational reason and "stole" your "magic"...

Meh...just meh.

 

[englanddg]

Your being 300 lbs is your choice not Disney's. My being disabled is not my choice.

Incorrect. Obesity is not always "a choice"...it is recognized as a disability, and is not always a choice of the obese. It's not a simple matter of calorie intake or physical activity alone, but could be related to a myriad of other disorders, mental and physical.

Your response shows your own arrogance, if that's the only part of my post that you can respond to.

Someone who lost a limb is "disabled not by their own choice", but many of them go through physical therapy and learn to walk and interact with their environment in pretty much the same way someone with the limb does, including waiting in lines.

Someone who is blind is "disabled not by their own choice", but many of them learn to interact and participate in society because they want to, including waiting in lines.

Someone who is deaf is "disabled not by their own choice", but many of them learn to...ok, I think you get the point.

 

[englanddg]

Your being 300 lbs is your choice not Disney's. My being disabled is not my choice.

I'll add, you being disabled wasn't Disney's choice either...so why are you blaming them for your condition?

 

[Gabe1]

First let me say that people are all different. When it comes to disabilities people will have different disabilities that will not allow them to stand in line for 2 plus hours or come back in an hour or two to a ride. We cannot single out any one group of people. My DH and I are old. We cannot stand for 2 hours in a line, nor can we come back in an hour. We can't walk that much. We don't want to use wheelchairs nor do we want to use motorized chairs. We try to walk as much as we can. But anyone knows that when you get old the legs and feet don't work as well. So the new DAS system does not work for us. We went to Disney 3 to 4 times a month and spent money in our favorite restaurants, and bought clothing and trinkets. We didn't go on EVERY ride. We may have ridden 2 or 3 rides a trip. But now we can’t enjoy those anymore. We were told by Guest Services to use a wheelchair if we can't walk. But like someone said, the last time we went there were a lot less wheelchairs. I think Disney has lost some of those handicap people. Every situation is different. Most of the people I see in wheel chairs are old or have children that are disabled; they just want to have a little fun. But Disney has taken the “Magic” out for the people who truly needed the GAC. Now they seem to treat us like dirt because we need assistance. It is not the happiest place on earth anymore for the disabled.

Interesting. My folks are old too. One in late 70s other early 80's. One diabetic and advanced arthritis the other had a hip replacement. Never a GAC, they are happy to be somewhat mobile at their advancing age and they are proud of it even if they are limping around the queues. Tired, they go back to the resort or home for a nap. Kinda a full circle to when I went to Disneyland with them when I was small, when I was tired they took me back to the resort.

If aging is now a disability wait until the baby boomers are all senior citizens. Yikes.

 

[GoofGoof]

And here we go...can't we all agree that both old and fat can be disabilities. Being that I'm getting old and I'm a few cheeseburgers over the fat line I think I can say that without offending. Remember, people are all different. We cannot single out any one group of people.

 

[GoofGoof]

I get your point. It was a courtesy that Disney did for the disabled. But now that is gone. Why didn’t they prosecute the people that were abusing the system instead of deleting it for people who needed it? As my mother used to say… Wait just wait. Someday you will need assistance. Will you refuse it if you need it? You may be healthy now, and your family may be healthy now, but there is always a chance that you may need assistance. I guess that you won’t’ take that assistance if it is offered to you. You have no clue what it is like to be disabled, unable to walk or be in pain 24/7. You are blessed.

They should have prosecuted the offenders if they could catch them. I don't think anyone here would disagree with that. Unless some of the abusers are hiding here posting. I know of a few posters on this sight who proudly brag about stealing soda from WDW, but I haven't found anyone who is willing to admit they abused the GAC system.

 

[luv]

From what I've heard/read GAC "abuse" was a much bigger issue at Disneyland than at Florida.

Edit: specifically the problem of local card-owners lending their cards to friends/family.

Nobody had to lend anyone their GAC. Everyone who walked in and asked for one got one.

This is still confusing people, just like that totally BS "news" article did. I still wonder if Disney wasn't behind that first news article, but I'm suspicious like that.

Every single person who walked up and said they wanted a GAC got one. It was no secret. Loads of people who convinced themselves they needed it got them. Others who didn't even fool themselves got them.

It was a huge problem, which Disney completely ignored until it was time to roll out FPP.

 

[Bairstow]

Anyone who walks up and says they want a DAS card gets one too.

 

[Nemo14]

This is still confusing people, just like that totally BS "news" article did. I still wonder if Disney wasn't behind that first news article, but I'm suspicious like that.

I totally agree!