Frozen ride replacing Maelstrom?

[sshindel]

You guys seem to be. It's apparently supposed to be some kind of cross between community college and the local science center.

I know it's hard to believe this, but there was a time in the Disney company when there was more to what they did than making money. Sure, making money was a very important factor, but they strove to do more than that.
And as many people have pointed out, they never had a problem making money in the park.

Now, they have to have festivals that take up nearly 1/3 of the year in order to draw people in and keep them spending money. Food and Wine, Garden Festival, Candlelight Processional. Upcharge events.
If one believes the TEA numbers (I know, big IF), EPCOT's growth last year was the smallest of all major parks in Orlando not called SeaWorld. It grew well under every other park. And this is with 120 days of the year being "special events" that are meant to draw in extra crowds.

 

[sshindel]

And more.

I can't be bothered typing it all out, but the parks design and construction period was something of a renaissance.

Those involved with planning and purse strings really thought they could change the world.

Take my word or don't. Doesn't bother me. Just at least believe my 30 something years of researching every detail of this once great park shows I know kind of what I'm talking about.

I just wanted to go back and quote this because that bolded section above says everything.

 

[Captain Chaos]

I'm stupider for reading this nonsense.... Why do I bother anymore?

 

[lazyboy97o]

I know it's hard to believe this, but there was a time in the Disney company when there was more to what they did than making money. Sure, making money was a very important factor, but they strove to do more than that.
And as many people have pointed out, they never had a problem making money in the park.

Now, they have to have festivals that take up nearly 1/3 of the year in order to draw people in and keep them spending money. Food and Wine, Garden Festival, Candlelight Processional. Upcharge events.
If one believes the TEA numbers (I know, big IF), EPCOT's growth last year was the smallest of all major parks in Orlando not called SeaWorld. It grew well under every other park. And this is with 120 days of the year being "special events" that are meant to draw in extra crowds.

The park has gone nearly 20 years without setting an attendance record, has less capacity and shorter operating hours.

 

[aladdin2007]

I'm stupider for reading this nonsense.... Why do I bother anymore?

lol I was just thinking something like that, what happened here? I think the viking ship derailed....while we wait on frozen news,, Have they finished the rock work/waterfall at all yet? Are the ugly tarps still up? How long has it been now?

 

[wdisney9000]

Lets review some of @dadddio 's reasons for EPCOT needing Frozen in WS:

1. His kids will like it

2. WS is boring

3. EPCOT was built to make profits (@lebeau addressed that one perfectly)

4. People wont be bored and leave EPCOT if there is a Frozen attraction? (i think thats what he said to @lazyboy97o)

5. EPCOT is NOT a community college. (Glad I learned that before I transferred my credits)

All valid reasons and Im sure each one was examined thoroughly by Disney Imagineering.

 

[CDavid]

People decry the loss of some of the educational aspects in Epcot, but it seems to me that those only served a narrow group of guests and were not things that most people wanted to do over and over.

Epcot was never solely about educating and inspiring people in their lives. It was about making money. Toward that end, it's not really in their best interest to bore people. Therefore, while you clearly don't care if others weren't wowed by Epcot 1.0, the company better care.

Despite a pervasive myth to the contrary, the highest annual attendance Epcot ever achieved was original Epcot Center with its roster of inspiring, emotionally moving, thought provoking "E" ticket omnimovers. If the idea is to make money, then one would think Disney would have built upon and expanded the success of Epcot as constructed. But for all the wholesale changes, introduction of thrill rides, and simpler (dumbed down) storylines for attractions attendance has been virtually flat for many years. It may have seemed to you like not something people would want to experience over and over, but that's only your opinion, and apparently most guests disagreed with you.

We all tend to let personal opinion cloud our judgement; It is often surprisingly difficult to truly take an objective position. While statistics can be manipulated, the actual attendance numbers don't lie - and they tell a compelling story about the success of Epcot Center as opposed to Epcot in 2014.

Oh, I forgot. Maelstrom is the best ride ever.

Again, that's just an opinion, and neither the popularity nor quality of the current attraction has any bearing on the thematic inappropriateness of Frozen in World Showcase.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Despite a pervasive myth to the contrary, the highest annual attendance Epcot ever achieved was original Epcot Center with its roster of inspiring, emotionally moving, thought provoking "E" ticket omnimovers.

I guess you missed the part where that is not a fact and just my opinion.

 

[mahnamahna101]

It's a Small World moving to World Showcase has a better chance of happening than a Frozen overlay to Maelstrom... so really neither will. It's TDO after all

 

[cw1982]

It's a Small World moving to World Showcase has a better chance of happening than a Frozen overlay to Maelstrom... so really neither will. It's TDO after all

Evidence of the bolded part? Many of the people here who are usually right about what's going on with the insiders have said the Frozen thing is happening. I know that doesn't make it gospel, but still makes it seem more likely than your statement IMO.

 

[mahnamahna101]

Evidence of the bolded part? Many of the people here who are usually right about what's going on with the insiders have said the Frozen thing is happening. I know that doesn't make it gospel, but still makes it seem more likely than your statement IMO.

....my bad. Excuse me while I mourn Phase 2 of WS' death (Gran Fiesta Tour was Phase 1). But I can't see them investing in even a Frozen overlay. Of course, it'd get 3 hr lines just by calling it Frozen - The Ride

 

[cw1982]

....my bad. Excuse me while I mourn Phase 2 of WS' death (Gran Fiesta Tour was Phase 1). But I can't see them investing in even a Frozen overlay. Of course, it'd get 3 hr lines just by calling it Frozen - The Ride

Lol... I just didn't know if the rumors had changed that quickly. Nothing surprises me around here these days

 

[WDWDad13]

Parking garages, scheduled refurbs and third party shopping malls don't count.

You should've visited in 1987. THAT was a lot.

I did visit in 87. My point is they aren't "coasting". If they were, we wouldn't see anything new happening anywhere and that's simple not the case and that's obvious

 

[lebeau]

I did visit in 87. My point is they aren't "coasting". If they were, we wouldn't see anything new happening anywhere and that's simple not the case and that's obvious

Your definition of "coasting" is different than mine.

You seem to think that if Disney does anything at all, they are not coasting.

That's like saying someone isn't lazy because they got out of bed in the morning.

I expect a little more than the bare minimum.

I suppose I should make my point stronger by insisting that it is "obvious", huh?

 

[mahnamahna101]

I did visit in 87. My point is they aren't "coasting". If they were, we wouldn't see anything new happening anywhere and that's simple not the case and that's obvious

If it's not an attraction, area or park... I wouldn't count it. Plus Disney had to play catch-up since they spent 6-7 yrs doing mostly nothing.

Parking garages, hub redevelopment and new DVCs aren't anything to hype up

 

[WDWDad13]

We've been over this before. You've never seen so much construction at Walt Disney World because things have been neglected for so long. Those years when not much of anything was being built you - not surprisingly - didn't see much construction. Given the size and pressing needs within WDW, construction efforts you are seeing now are woefully inadequate.

The construction going on now isn't because things have been neglected. If you look at it that way, you could make a case for any construction that it could have been done sooner and had been neglected until that time.

The expansions of the hub, AK, and Disney Springs is a big deal and that's obvious by the amount of construction going on

What I love is when people complain about Disney not doing anything and then turn around and also complain about them doing something (bad show, disruption, my favorite ride is down, etc etc)

my theory - some people are just going to complain even if it's perfect

 

[WDWDad13]

Your definition of "coasting" is different than mine.

You seem to think that if Disney does anything at all, they are not coasting.

That's like saying someone isn't lazy because they got out of bed in the morning.

I expect a little more than the bare minimum.

I suppose I should make my point stronger by insisting that it is "obvious", huh?

Wouldn't the bare minimum be doing nothing? Isn't that "obvious"

 

[WDWDad13]

If it's not an attraction, area or park... I wouldn't count it. Plus Disney had to play catch-up since they spent 6-7 yrs doing mostly nothing.

Parking garages, hub redevelopment and new DVCs aren't anything to hype up

So if it's not an "attraction" it's nothing? Disney is WAY more than just rides...at least to those of us who can enjoy it

 

[sshindel]

The construction going on now isn't because things have been neglected. If you look at it that way, you could make a case for any construction that it could have been done sooner and had been neglected until that time.

The expansions of the hub, AK, and Disney Springs is a big deal and that's obvious by the amount of construction going on

What I love is when people complain about Disney not doing anything and then turn around and also complain about them doing something (bad show, disruption, my favorite ride is down, etc etc)

my theory - some people are just going to complain even if it's perfect

Look, I'm one of the first people to jump on the "they are building in MK, DAK, Springs, DVC, and maybe DHS" bandwagons. In the case of EPCOT though, it's just not the case.
If they do Frozen, it's not really building something new ala Pandora or even Disney Springs. It's taking the easy way out, like they did with Ellen, The Seas, Soarin, and Grand Fiesta (which I admittedly like due to a love of the Three Caballeros, but still admit it's the easy choice and not the correct one).
It further dilutes the product. It further dilutes the reason EPCOT was built in the first place.

 

[WDWDad13]

Look, I'm one of the first people to jump on the "they are building in MK, DAK, Springs, DVC, and maybe DHS" bandwagons. In the case of EPCOT though, it's just not the case.
If they do Frozen, it's not really building something new ala Pandora or even Disney Springs. It's taking the easy way out, like they did with Ellen, The Seas, Soarin, and Grand Fiesta (which I admittedly like due to a love of the Three Caballeros, but still admit it's the easy choice and not the correct one).
It further dilutes the product. It further dilutes the reason EPCOT was built in the first place.

If we're back on the Epcot needs major tlc ....I'll also be the first to say is and DHS does too

Glad to see DTD and AK getting overhauls now I'm hoping Epcot and DHS do next