FP+ only Toy Story Midway Mania

[CDavid]

And FP's will available for everyone.

No, they won't. Ride capacity remains unchanged, and once all FastPass + allotments have been issued for the day, nobody else will be permitted access*. Unless it were an unusually slow day - even for this time of year - demand can still be expected to exceed supply (else the attraction would be nearly a walk-on by the end of the day).

This is an incredibly dumb idea for addressing excessive wait times, even from a management team with a history of dumb ideas over attraction wait times.


* - In theory, as mentioned previously, this test could reduce attraction capacity. If ride vehicles are dispatched with empty seats, because of gaps in the times FP+ riders return, and no standby queue from which to fill them, fewer persons will actually ride than before.

 

[ParentsOf4]

For the record, park admission does not grant you the right nor the privilege to ride any and all rides and attractions. The park operator (Disney in this case), has the right to refuse to let you ride or participate for any reason whatsoever.

Sure, go ahead and twist my words into an extreme version of whatever you want them to say. That's fine! But, in reality, yes, they could do this, but I would hope you know that they wouldn't because it just wouldn't be right and would cause a lot of complaints, not to mention pxxxing people off.

I think I understand what you are trying to say but simply wanted to clarify that "for any reason whatsoever" is an overstatement. I'm sure you didn't mean it this way but Disney cannot violate anyone's civil rights.

Furthermore, I don't want to get into a DAS discussion here but it's possible that this trial run might violate the American With Disabilities Act (ADA) if it does not honor DAS. After all, Disney has stated that DAS complies with ADA, suggesting that not honoring DAS is a violation of ADA. Hopefully, someone consulted with Legal before OK'ing this trial run.

 

[Goofyernmost]

No, they won't. Ride capacity remains unchanged, and once all FastPass + allotments have been issued for the day, nobody else will be permitted access. Unless it were an unusually slow day - even for this time of year - demand can still be expected to exceed supply (else the attraction would be nearly a walk-on by the end of the day).

This is an incredibly dumb idea for addressing excessive wait times, even from a management team with a history of dumb ideas over attraction wait times.

The same number of people can ride the ride in a single day. If there is no other way to get maximum attendance then they have no choice but to issue the equivalent number of FP's. The difference is that the whole park will not be crammed in there all at the same time. They will need to enter during their FP window time ONLY. If you got to ride the ride before you will be able to do it now, you will just need one of their magic fastpasses which will have the equivalent of FP riders and Standby Riders that can physically get on it during a single day. When they have reached capacity they stop issuing FP's. The only difference is being able to choose what time you want to go there. You may need to go when they tell you that they have space available otherwise, you are right, you cannot ride it.

Currently what they have is the same as trying to fit 10 pounds of garbage into a 5 pound bag. At some point it isn't all going to fit in there. My hope is that at some time they throw their hands in the air and scream... "That's it, FP doesn't work, it never has, we can't make everyone happy so lets go back to nothing but standby". From this page to gods ear.

 

[JediMasterMatt]

Somehow the standby line for TSMM at CA is not that bad even at 40+ minutes, maybe it is because I love that park. Or the weather? RSR has the massive wait times, but that ride is AWESOME and worth it. It has both legacy FP and single rider lines. The most coveted piece of paper in DLR is a RSR FP. I once waited an hour in the FP line to get one, 'til I wised up and went single rider.

No matter how hard the concept seems for the folks down in Orlando, the answer to this question ultimately lay in the lap of the guest - you have the capability to "vote" in where you want to invest your time when you visit the park. You choose where you want to queue.

The reason why MM+ and its evil offspring FP+ isn't working in Orlando is that much like an election - the electorate has decided that it only likes a few of the candidates. TDO keeps putting Stitch, Imagination, and the like on the ballot card for their virtual queuing system and they continue to get no votes. FP+ on Stitch can only help Space Mountain's lines when someone decides not to queue for Space either in the virtual world or the physical one by getting in line.

With TSMM, the issue is that there are really only a handful of other things to "vote" for in the entire park. Guests have been voting with their feet by getting in the stand-by line. So, in TDO's opinion, the other attractions in the park aren't pulling their fair share of the load. How do you steer guests away from TSMM? You do so by closing the polling booth it seems and you can rig the election.

By only dumping guests into FP+, you control the guest behavior. You can now force them to go spend time in one of the other fine quality DHS attractions like ToT, or RnRC, or Star Tours, or Muppets, or... well... maybe go see the same shows you've already seen... or play a game on your phone I guess.

The reason why California Adventure's TSMM guest behavior is so much different is that it does have plenty of other candidates on the guests ballot. Guests would rather ride a true E-ticket in RSR than TSMM.

That's the difference.

 

[GrumpyFan]

I think I understand what you are trying to say but simply wanted to clarify that "for any reason whatsoever" is an overstatement. I'm sure you didn't mean it this way but Disney cannot violate anyone's civil rights.

Furthermore, I don't want to get into a DAS discussion here but it's possible that this trial run might violate the American With Disabilities Act (ADA) if it does not honor DAS. After all, Disney has stated that DAS complies with ADA, suggesting that not honoring DAS is a violation of ADA. Hopefully, someone consulted with Legal before OK'ing this trial run.

Yes, thanks. It was more of a generalization. They can close an attraction to guests in general, but not to just a particular guest or group.
However, I believe they can deny access to an attraction on an individual basis, if they feel that the attraction's safety equipment is unaccommodating for their needs, true? As in height, or even weight restrictions.

But, in regards to the test, I can't see how this would be a violation of ADA, since they are allowing equal access to everyone regardless of their disability.

 

[CDavid]

Furthermore, I don't want to get into a DAS discussion here but it's possible that this trial run might violate the American With Disabilities Act (ADA) if it does not honor DAS. After all, Disney has stated that DAS complies with ADA, suggesting that not honoring DAS is a violation of ADA. Hopefully, someone consulted with Legal before OK'ing this trial run.

At the risk of further opening this can of worms, In a company the size of Disney I wouldn't be completely shocked if legal wasn't consulted (poor internal communication happens sometimes). More specifically, though, what happens when all FP's have been distributed for the day, and a DAS guest shows up to ride? If the number of such guests is as small as it should be, exceptions can easily be made, but at the (likely) risk of further angering guests without a DAS.

 

[msteel]

Anyone who has ridden TSMM during this period, is there any sign of construction going on in the standby queue?

I admit that the queue work would seem like the last thing they would do for the 3rd track, but it seems possible that they could do something like putting a door in between the existing queue and SS1 in this amount of time, while shutting down the standby line at the least disruptive time of year.

 

[rct247]

A few questions...

The nearest in park kiosks to Toy Story Midway Mania are not nearby, do they have a mobile kiosks set up where the old Fastpass machines are to help guests easily make their FP+ selection?

Is the standby line completely empty or did they cover the signage and use the standby line as the FP+ line?

How long is the wait for those returning with FP+?

Any reports from the front lines on how other guests are taking this? How the cast members are doing? How Guest Relations is doing?

 

[djkidkaz]

I'm just thinking that couldn't toy story as we know it go to standby only and maybe they could even bring back single rider? Then they could use soundstage 1 as the fp only version? Maybe this is just a test to see how a fp only side functions.

 

[Captain Chaos]

He meant fast pass as being the other way they are offering you aside from standby. He was refering to in general, not this week.

If that's what was meant, that's not how it sounded in his post. Sounded like he said they were offering another way by removing stand by during the test. Just a little confusing on my part. That's why i asked.

 

[BrerJon]

The fastpass kiosk in the morning is going to be like the good old days.

Surely Fastpass+es for TSM are booked up weeks in advance aren't they? I'll be amazed if anyone who didn't book way in advance gets to ride it this week.

 

[CDavid]

The same number of people can ride the ride in a single day. If there is no other way to get maximum attendance then they have no choice but to issue the equivalent number of FP's. The difference is that the whole park will not be crammed in there all at the same time. They will need to enter during their FP window time ONLY. If you got to ride the ride before you will be able to do it now, you will just need one of their magic fastpasses which will have the equivalent of FP riders and Standby Riders that can physically get on it during a single day.

Yes, the same numbers of guests can ride as did previously, but not necessarily the same particular guests as before. Much like the changes at Be Our Guest (also ostensibly a test) and the Anna & Elsa meet & greet, there are always a few people for whom this change will work better and others (majority of the people in the standby line the latter part of the day, probably) who will be inconvenienced or shut-out altogether. If you arrived at the Studios after all FP's were gone, or the return times didn't work for your plans, or anything else really you had the option of waiting standby. But not now.

Attraction capacity is fixed regardless of how the queue is managed; There are a finite number of FP+ "slots" available daily. So, yes the same number of guests will still get to ride, but no, an FP+ is not actually available to everyone.

Currently what they have is the same as trying to fit 10 pounds of garbage into a 5 pound bag. At some point it isn't all going to fit in there. My hope is that at some time they throw their hands in the air and scream... "That's it, FP doesn't work, it never has, we can't make everyone happy so lets go back to nothing but standby". From this page to gods ear.

Now this I agree with wholeheartedly! It'll never happen, but we would all be better off if it did (but just try explaining that to many guests, including some on these boards!).

 

[BrerJon]

Attraction capacity is fixed regardless of how the queue is managed; There are a finite number of FP+ "slots" available daily. So, yes the same number of guests will still get to ride, but no, an FP+ is not actually available to everyone.

Last week at Epcot I arrived at 3pm, decided to look into Maelstrom Fastpass availability, as the line was over an hour. The CM at the kiosk pretty much laughed when I asked if any were left for the day. 'No, they're long gone'.

But I decided to ride anyway, taking the standby line, which actually moved faster than the posted wait time.

Had the new Fastpass+ only system been in place, any guests in a situation like mine would have been shut out. Somewhere along the line, a guest who likes to make up their day as they go along, deciding when to get in a line based on current wait times, is going to stop going to the parks when planning becomes compulsory on everything, and this attempt to ensure guests spend more money in shops than time in line could even cause them to lose money.

 

[muteki]

They need to find a way of testing things out without blocking out paying customers the whole day. Did they learn nothing from the Soarin fiasco?

 

[DManRightHere]

I feel sorry for whoever is working the main entrance of that ride.

I'd also be an upset guest if FP were the only way to ride.

Then again, Disney does have the legal writings on availability of attractions, but this is just taking advantage of people.

 

[TheRabbit]

I feel sorry for whoever is working the main entrance of that ride.

I'd also be an upset guest if FP were the only way to ride.

Then again, Disney does have the legal writings on availability of attractions, but this is just taking advantage of people.

Yes, but this isn't an 'availablility of attractions' matter. The ride is open to the public and working safe and fine. Disney is just not allowing certain guests to ride the ride.

 

[tigger1968]

I would assume they're releasing day of FP to combat the lack of people with standby. Similar to the Anna/Elsa test

Yes, it would be inconvient if you could not get a FP and could not chose to wait in standby. But, until we hear otherwise, I'm guessing there are more FP released during the day today to meet demands.

My thoughts exactly. I would think Disney would want to simulate a full ride capacity, which means making more fastpasses available during the test.

As far as the assertions that some are making about your entitlement to be provided access to any ride, my thought is this....you wouldn't be griping if the ride was 101, or was in a soft opening, or operating on a limited schedule, or any other number of scenarios that limit access or capacity, so get over it. The bigger picture here seems to be Disney trying to address the capacity issues for this attraction, and in the VERY short term, a 4 day test of methods to bring an additional 33% capacity to this ride are going on. Anything that will bring some added capacity to that traffic jam is ultimately a win for everyone in my opinion.

 

[CDavid]

The bigger picture here seems to be Disney trying to address the capacity issues for this attraction, and in the VERY short term, a 4 day test of methods to bring an additional 33% capacity to this ride are going on.

Please explain what you meant here. Attraction capacity is fixed; This test does nothing to change the total daily capacity of the attraction, with no increase or decrease. All it does is change how the existing capacity is distributed, and the manner in which wait times are managed.

 

[BrerJon]

Then again, Disney does have the legal writings on availability of attractions, but this is just taking advantage of people.

If a guest complains and Disney smugly points to the small print legal text, you can bet that guest won't be coming back any time soon.

 

[DManRightHere]

If a guest complains and Disney smugly points to the small print legal text, you can bet that guest won't be coming back any time soon.

Their not going to give handouts to every guest that complains this week either.

I'm not saying Disney never does the right thing.