FP+ only Toy Story Midway Mania

[Suwithoutane]

I'm de

Think of college classes each attraction has different blocks of time allotted remember one of the goals of NGE was crowd management so each attraction has different blocks of time and this allows TDO to shape your day.

So in an area attractions could be closed while dining and shopping are available and for that block of people No FPs would be available for attractions during the 'shopping' window so their only option would be to dine or shop the trick will be to calibrate those windows so people don't leave the park.

I'm definitely willing to accept a theory of crowd shaping/herding, but I feel like they rely on some people eating while others ride while others shop - if they were to heard everyone to the food by blocking out rides, they'd have a run on the restaurants, or shopping, whichever. I 100% buy them shaping an individual's day by using an algorithm forcing their fastpass reservations far apart, by skewing availability, and elongating their stay (thereby encouraging shopping/dining in the down time) but they'd still have to have continuous availability on attractions to accomplish this without creating a strain elsewhere. They'd just have to take whoever would have been working the rides and stick them at registers or in restaurants to make up for it. I'm sure they're completely budget driven, I just can't see how saving 4 hours here or there of minimum wage salary would make up for the logistical nightmare of taking huge numbers of people out of queues in already often overcrowded parks. Then again, this is Disney, so who knows...

 

[jakeman]

Each to his own. I seem to recall most of my darkest visions for WDW occurring, I'm not an optimist I'm a realist I see the world as it is not as I'd like it to be.

Would this be your theory that they are cooking the books based on the number of cars in the hotel parking lot?

The fact that you have visions at all regarding WDW means you should probably get out more.

 

[Suwithoutane]

There is a persistent rumor that EMH is not long for this world. Which I tend to believe as WDW could easily replace EMH with extra FP for on site guests and cut the staffing required to run EMH.

THIS is completely believable, and if they're worried about budget, makes a ton of sense. I'd rather the extra pf+ here anyway!

 

[Next Big Thing]

This screams of an unnecessary way to support the 3 track approach. That's already happening, so I'm not sure the benefit of this test. It's not going to show them throughput issues because you're not going to get a bunch of people to wait in a fictitious standby line and not ride. I really don't understand the objective behind this test.

Also, can anyone confirm that they are shutting out DAS users as well - that seems highly unlikely.

Maybe they are looking at the test to see how many AREN'T showing up for their FP+ times to see if it's worth adding a single rider line to the FP+ tracks? That would help fill any empty spots and ensure the ride runs at full capacity.

 

[jakeman]

Maybe they are looking at the test to see how many AREN'T showing up for their FP+ times to see if it's worth adding a single rider line to the FP+ tracks? That would help fill any empty spots and ensure the ride runs at full capacity.

Or how many FP+ they can distribute in a day and run at full capacity with no wait with your statement factored in.

 

[ford91exploder]

I'm de


I'm definitely willing to accept a theory of crowd shaping/herding, but I feel like they rely on some people eating while others ride while others shop - if they were to heard everyone to the food by blocking out rides, they'd have a run on the restaurants, or shopping, whichever. I 100% buy them shaping an individual's day by using an algorithm forcing their fastpass reservations far apart, by skewing availability, and elongating their stay (thereby encouraging shopping/dining in the down time) but they'd still have to have continuous availability on attractions to accomplish this without creating a strain elsewhere. They'd just have to take whoever would have been working the rides and stick them at registers or in restaurants to make up for it. I'm sure they're completely budget driven, I just can't see how saving 4 hours here or there of minimum wage salary would make up for the logistical nightmare of taking huge numbers of people out of queues in already often overcrowded parks. Then again, this is Disney, so who knows...

The one advantage of FP based everything is that you know exactly how many people are waiting and where and most importantly when. It then becomes a matter of production scheduling and there is a lot of expertise in that field for hire.

 

[Bairstow]

Think of college classes each attraction has different blocks of time allotted remember one of the goals of NGE was crowd management so each attraction has different blocks of time and this allows TDO to shape your day.

So in an area attractions could be closed while dining and shopping are available and for that block of people No FPs would be available for attractions during the 'shopping' window so their only option would be to dine or shop the trick will be to calibrate those windows so people don't leave the park.

That's nonsensical. Even if Disney wanted to synchronize an entire park's worth of guest behavior, they would need to double or triple the infrastructure (attractions, shops, restaurants) to handle all these needs at the same time.

 

[ford91exploder]

Would this be your theory that they are cooking the books based on the number of cars in the hotel parking lot?

The fact that you have visions at all regarding WDW means you should probably get out more.

As to getting out this year has been good for about a half million frequent flyer miles. - perhaps it's the lack of O2 at altitude as cabins are usually pressurized at the 6000-8000 ASL equivalent.

As to empty resorts

I think @WDW1974 and @ParentsOf4 addressed that one as well since the deluxe resorts were running this summer at 60-70 percent full for cash guests (explaining the empty lots) and DVC runs at 90+% percent. TDO is planning to convert much of the Deluxe cash inventory to DVC villas. The Poly is the first victim of this new program.

 

[CDavid]

Maybe they are looking at the test to see how many AREN'T showing up for their FP+ times to see if it's worth adding a single rider line to the FP+ tracks? That would help fill any empty spots and ensure the ride runs at full capacity.

Perhaps, but they should easily be able to determine that without undertaking such a test: They already know how many FP+ have been issued, and one would assume they routinely track how many FP+ actually enter the queue. Regardless, you could track returning FP+ without closing off the standby line.

This test is certainly leading up to the addition of a third track, and the rumors that the existing two tracks would become FP+ only; As we can see, running FP+ without standby creates some new problems, and actually lowers attraction capacity (ironic given the proposal to increase capacity with a new track).

 

[ford91exploder]

That's nonsensical. Even if Disney wanted to synchronize an entire park's worth of guest behavior, they would need to double or triple the infrastructure (attractions, shops, restaurants) to handle all these needs at the same time.

It's insane I agree but with the complete focus on cost accounting they would rather have lines in the shops and restaurants than build new attractions. Besides a new shop or dining venue can be brought online in weeks with a cost in the low millions. See Oakens for an example of same

 

[Bairstow]

It's insane I agree but with the complete focus on cost accounting they would rather have lines in the shops and restaurants than build new attractions. Besides a new shop or dining venue can be brought online in weeks with a cost in the low millions. See Oakens for an example of same

It's insane because your model makes less money than the current one.

 

[ford91exploder]

It's insane because your model makes less money than the current one.

You are conflating gross revenue with gross margin. This model reduces gross revenue but increases gross margin which is what The 'street cares about by significantly reducing OPEX.

 

[jakeman]

As to getting out this year has been good for about a half million frequent flyer miles. - perhaps it's the lack of O2 at altitude as cabins are usually pressurized at the 6000-8000 ASL equivalent.

As to empty resorts

I think @WDW1974 and @ParentsOf4 addressed that one as well since the deluxe resorts were running this summer at 60-70 percent full for cash guests (explaining the empty lots) and DVC runs at 90+% percent. TDO is planning to convert much of the Deluxe cash inventory to DVC villas. The Poly is the first victim of this new program.

This is going to be my last post on this because it's off topic, but that's not what you postulated. You flat out accused Disney of forging their hotel occupancy numbers in official filing documents. That's not "discussing a DVC conversion".

It's insane

That's really the only two words you needed.

 

[Buried20KLeague]

I respectfully disagree. I have never waited less than 35 minutes standby for TSMM in California and it's a very lousy line. The standby line in Florida has it's faults, but at least there's something interesting to look at.

IMO, the boring switchbacks are countered by the fact you're constantly moving. In Cali, there's a sense you're "making progress" in the standby line at TSMM. In the Florida line you feel like you're camping out overnight... Then moving 5 feet and camping out again.

I will ALWAYS choose a long standby line (distance wise) that constantly moves over a short standby line that I spend more time standing still in.

I will never spend a FP on TSMM in Florida. Not when I can do it in Cali without one, and with the far superior ToT and RnRC down the block. Not for a glorified video game that I literally own. I can walk in my basement and play TSMM. Right now if I want. The exact same game with the exact same graphics and so forth. Heck, I could have my kids push me around and spin me in an office chair in between scenes if I want the full experience.

 

[RSoxNo1]

Maybe they are looking at the test to see how many AREN'T showing up for their FP+ times to see if it's worth adding a single rider line to the FP+ tracks? That would help fill any empty spots and ensure the ride runs at full capacity.

Again, that doesn't prove anything when Standby isn't an option. They have 6 years of data that shows the redemption rate for Fastpass.

 

[jencor]

There is a persistent rumor that EMH is not long for this world. Which I tend to believe as WDW could easily replace EMH with extra FP for on site guests and cut the staffing required to run EMH.

I would hope something that big and my trip has been set up some days in taking advantage of it and the marketing I get from Disney still discusses it, that they will not come in tomorrow and say not EMH starting now. I do agree and see it going away, but I hope that there would be something more then just a FP or more to replace it. Maybe bringing another hour to the parks. (I know I'm dreaming)

 

[RSoxNo1]

IMO, the boring switchbacks are countered by the fact you're constantly moving. In Cali, there's a sense you're "making progress" in the standby line at TSMM. In the Florida line you feel like you're camping out overnight... Then moving 5 feet and camping out again.

I will ALWAYS choose a long standby line (distance wise) that constantly moves over a short standby line that I spend more time standing still in.

I will never spend a FP on TSMM in Florida. Not when I can do it in Cali without one, and with the far superior ToT and RnRC down the block. Not for a glorified video game that I literally own. I can walk in my basement and play TSMM. Right now if I want. The exact same game with the exact same graphics and so forth. Heck, I could have my kids push me around and spin me in an office chair in between scenes if I want the full experience.

I've played the game on the WII and it's similar but not identical. I'd also say it's worse. Having said that, I get the argument, it really is an odd choice for an attraction setup. I like it, I don't know why.

 

[azox]

Soooo I've just been on TSM;

1) yes as many have predicted on here there is a general riot of angry guests parked outside the attraction with atleast 4 managers trying to deal with the complaints

2) the ride is running at full capacity but with Fastpass+ guests only. Ride supervisors are counting the number of empty cars, as there was no queue to get on the ride. there were 5 empty carriages that went through whilst we were waiting to get on. Ride supervisors were reporting empty carriages to more managers who were stood in the unload area.

3) I was told that as part of the test each morning more fastpass+ tickets would be released every morning during the test.

I can only assume that they're spending the week trying to optimise the number of fastpass+ tickets they need to release to keep a constant flow of guests going through the ride with limited queuing but also no empty carriages. I'd expect them to increase the number available throughout the week until they get the optimum capacity.

Thanks for posting this, it makes much more sense. (though it seems like something they could have waited to do after they add more track as not to upset customers.)

 

[JimboJones123]

It's a 4 day test, not the apocalypse. The only way you can test true guest behavior is by getting real data.

I think we are in agreement????

 

[evilzorac]

I never post here and have less and less desire to visit WDW. But on this subject am I totally crazy thinking that if they want to "fix" the capacity issues at TSMM & Soaring, how about building more great family rides at each of these parks? Why spend so much money, waste so much time, and alienate so many devoted fans trying to invent some magic (joke intended) that will somehow fix the issue? Oh and if they want to increase sales at restaurants & merch how about better products? Am I totally off base?