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FP+ meltdown part x
- Thread starter marni1971
- Start date
G00fyDad
Well-Known Member
Where did the other 9 cards come from?
ford91exploder
Resident Curmudgeon
I bring you this gem from 'The Board Which Must Not Be Named'
“We have been giving Disney our vacation dollars for 3+ decades. In those 30+ years and I would say about 35 visits we have NEVER done a single rope drop. We are not rope drop people. Vacation to us is not getting up and running to a park at 6/7 am so we can do what we paid for. Now with this horrible FP+ system, we will be lucky to do one headliner attraction a day. Stand by lines as I predicted are growing and slowing to highest average levels ever. Disney only wants you in their parks to spend money on food and souvenirs(and soon FP’s), not to see their attractions. I’m sorry Disney, it was a good run, thanks for the memories.”
And another voice from the same place
“Very disappointing to see the unfortunate regression from “Magic Your Way” to “Magic Our Way (like it or not)” by WDW execs.”
Remember this is coming from Pixie Dust Central.
“We have been giving Disney our vacation dollars for 3+ decades. In those 30+ years and I would say about 35 visits we have NEVER done a single rope drop. We are not rope drop people. Vacation to us is not getting up and running to a park at 6/7 am so we can do what we paid for. Now with this horrible FP+ system, we will be lucky to do one headliner attraction a day. Stand by lines as I predicted are growing and slowing to highest average levels ever. Disney only wants you in their parks to spend money on food and souvenirs(and soon FP’s), not to see their attractions. I’m sorry Disney, it was a good run, thanks for the memories.”
And another voice from the same place
“Very disappointing to see the unfortunate regression from “Magic Your Way” to “Magic Our Way (like it or not)” by WDW execs.”
Remember this is coming from Pixie Dust Central.
BrerJon
Well-Known Member
I think it's even more specific than that. Many of the people who dislike the new system *are* the commando planners who like to cram a lot in - but dislike the new system because people like that (and I include myself) like to be in control, and in the old system we could follow touring plans, take shortcuts etc., that put us ahead of the crowd. With MyMagic+, Disney has taken a lot of that control away and people feel robbed of their powers in a way.
The group who liked to make a vague plan but never really followed anything and ended up spending a lot of time in two or three long lines - they're doing very well under the new system, and that may well be a majority of guests.
Then the third group, the locals and casual visitors, and those who don't know what they're going to feel like riding a week in advance, or whether they're going to want to go on a water ride in a rainstorm, they too are having issues with the new system.
I think part of the reason for the bad reactions is we expected NextGen to be a waste of money but I don't think anyone expected it to downgrade the experience as much as it has for many, so that has come as a bit of a shock. The reports you see all over the place of people coming back having had a worse time is because for most it's the first time they've been there since the Bands came in.
The vacations people are coming back from now are those booked based on memories of pre-Fastpass+ vacations, hence the disappointment.
Now that the shock has worn off, and we know to expect higher crowds on the walkway, longer lines in standby, higher prices and worse offerings due to budget cuts, we will factor this in when booking vacation and while it may make people go for less time, less often, or stay at cheaper hotels, I think future visits will become enjoyable again because we all know what to expect now.
voodoo321
Well-Known Member
3 extra cards each for the fast passes. Don't ask me why. I was fishing through my pockets to find the right ones at each ride. They all looked the same as my park passes. I didn't seperate them at the time the CM gave them to me. It wasn't terrible, but a little silly. I also was advised to take a picture of the kiosk screen for my return times. They said they had no way to send them to my phone or give me a printout. I was trying to hurry and took a blurry pic. I had to go somewhat by memory.
I've experienced MagicBand/FP+ twice so far. Last NYE when it first launched to all resort guests and again this past Sep/Oct when it had deployed to AP holders as well.
Now my NYE trips tend to be highly orchestrated from the day I arrive (December 29) through NYE itself. I know which park I plan to be in each day when I go and book my rooms 11 months in advance. I go primarily for fireworks, parades and decorations. I'll take in a few of my favorite attractions, but most of them were after dark during late night EMH hours.
I am not a RopeDropper and have never plan. Nor do I Commando Park tour. I don't need to go on every attraction to get my money's worth. I'm perfectly happy doing 3-5 a day and just soaking up the atmosphere. That's why I get an Annual Pass so I don't feel like I'm wasting my money if I haven't done a solid 10 hours worth of attractions.
Our Sep/Oct trips are three weeks long and involve offsite & onsite stays. So while I could book 2 weeks of attractions for my onsite stay, I also had to work with a limit on how much I could use my AP for my offsite stay. (The system doesn't play nice when you mix availability windows. It stopped letting me book FP+s for the second half of my trip because it gave me a 14 day limit on my AP.)
No problem, I thought. I'm going during a less busy time and besides they flood the system with availability day and week of. Last NYE I was able to book headliners and change my times at will during my stay.
However, this last trip was the complete opposite of NYE. I found I could not find availability when and where I wanted. Some things never came up during my trip. Others only came up at odd late hours. Attractions that never had Standby times exceeding 20 minutes were pulling in 45 min waits. I didn't experience any problems redeeming a FP+ but I had a very hard time adding family members to my FP+ times. By the time they got their tickets and joined me in the system, there was no FP+ availability left. Or it was for hours after my times. One CM solved the problem by overriding the system and just unlocking my brother's band for all the attractions we went on. So basically he could redeem a FP+ at any time throughout the day and stay with us. Another told us to just trade MagicBands so one of us would skip the attraction and let a guest go in our place.
Because of the availability problem I didn't feel I had the ability to modify my schedule "on the go" as advertised all year. Instead I felt beholden to my FP+ bookings. That turned my relaxing vacation into a stressful workout. I came away hating it. I was so beaten down that my last 3 days I opted not to go to any parks. I just hung out at my resort instead.
I'm not sure why my experience last NYE was so different from this Autumn. Crowds during NYE are insanely heavy. I'm used to that. And crowds this Autumn were heavier than previous years. But my expectation of availability and being able to adjust my schedule "on the go" was not met. I'm suspecting they are not holding back as many FP+ as they did during NYE. If that's the case, and FP+ has gotten to be as bogged down as the old ADR system, then it's even more useless to me than the paper FP+ system.
Sadly I returned from WDW this last trip so upset about my experience I told everyone NOT to visit WDW for a good year or two. I haven't felt that way in the last 15 years I've been visiting. I do have two more trips planned myself. (I'm a DVC member so visiting 3 times a year is a regular thing for me.) However, I'm already planning to spend fewer days in the parks and more visiting SeaWorld and Universal or other Orlando destinations.
Now my NYE trips tend to be highly orchestrated from the day I arrive (December 29) through NYE itself. I know which park I plan to be in each day when I go and book my rooms 11 months in advance. I go primarily for fireworks, parades and decorations. I'll take in a few of my favorite attractions, but most of them were after dark during late night EMH hours.
I am not a RopeDropper and have never plan. Nor do I Commando Park tour. I don't need to go on every attraction to get my money's worth. I'm perfectly happy doing 3-5 a day and just soaking up the atmosphere. That's why I get an Annual Pass so I don't feel like I'm wasting my money if I haven't done a solid 10 hours worth of attractions.
Our Sep/Oct trips are three weeks long and involve offsite & onsite stays. So while I could book 2 weeks of attractions for my onsite stay, I also had to work with a limit on how much I could use my AP for my offsite stay. (The system doesn't play nice when you mix availability windows. It stopped letting me book FP+s for the second half of my trip because it gave me a 14 day limit on my AP.)
No problem, I thought. I'm going during a less busy time and besides they flood the system with availability day and week of. Last NYE I was able to book headliners and change my times at will during my stay.
However, this last trip was the complete opposite of NYE. I found I could not find availability when and where I wanted. Some things never came up during my trip. Others only came up at odd late hours. Attractions that never had Standby times exceeding 20 minutes were pulling in 45 min waits. I didn't experience any problems redeeming a FP+ but I had a very hard time adding family members to my FP+ times. By the time they got their tickets and joined me in the system, there was no FP+ availability left. Or it was for hours after my times. One CM solved the problem by overriding the system and just unlocking my brother's band for all the attractions we went on. So basically he could redeem a FP+ at any time throughout the day and stay with us. Another told us to just trade MagicBands so one of us would skip the attraction and let a guest go in our place.
Because of the availability problem I didn't feel I had the ability to modify my schedule "on the go" as advertised all year. Instead I felt beholden to my FP+ bookings. That turned my relaxing vacation into a stressful workout. I came away hating it. I was so beaten down that my last 3 days I opted not to go to any parks. I just hung out at my resort instead.
I'm not sure why my experience last NYE was so different from this Autumn. Crowds during NYE are insanely heavy. I'm used to that. And crowds this Autumn were heavier than previous years. But my expectation of availability and being able to adjust my schedule "on the go" was not met. I'm suspecting they are not holding back as many FP+ as they did during NYE. If that's the case, and FP+ has gotten to be as bogged down as the old ADR system, then it's even more useless to me than the paper FP+ system.
Sadly I returned from WDW this last trip so upset about my experience I told everyone NOT to visit WDW for a good year or two. I haven't felt that way in the last 15 years I've been visiting. I do have two more trips planned myself. (I'm a DVC member so visiting 3 times a year is a regular thing for me.) However, I'm already planning to spend fewer days in the parks and more visiting SeaWorld and Universal or other Orlando destinations.
Longhairbear
Well-Known Member
I follow your reports on the "other" site as well. We have no plans to visit WDW because of FP+, MDE and all the rest of that crap. We are very happy using our DVC points at the DLR instead. There is no way I'm going to spend money for airfare to enjoy, or not, the magic that is MDE, and fastpass plus. That's not an enticement by any means. We'll book our DVC at some point to visit Florida, not Fastpassland.
What's come from all of this is that we spend our points on higher end luxury short stays to help burn up our points from our DVC than we normally would spend for a week at a villa in WDW. We got a one bedroom with full kitchen the week before Christmas at VGC for a long weekend. After park closing we enjoy cocktails at Trader Sam's till closing. Sleep in, make Eggs Benedict in our villa for brunch, saunter out to DCA from the Grand California entrance into the park, and get Fastpass for Soarin later in the day. That's a relaxing vacation. Someone explain to me why I need to put up with the pre booking crap in Florida?
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GymLeaderPhil
Well-Known Member
If I wanted to keep a down to the minute agenda, call/escalate issues to multiple departments, track meetings, require IT to fix something, and rush to show up for things on time, I could have stayed at the office and been paid to show up.
The payoff for those few short enjoyable minutes on an attraction or sitting down to eat does not justify the absolute hassle and mess they've made with these changes.
The payoff for those few short enjoyable minutes on an attraction or sitting down to eat does not justify the absolute hassle and mess they've made with these changes.
tsaintc
Well-Known Member
As a long time WDW and legacy fast pass veteran, I was very pleased with our first exposure to FP+ this past summer. And, I am looking forward to its continued use.
Is it perfect, no, nothing is.... However, we like to maximize FPs, and I no longer had to run all over the park while my family was off having fun.
BTW, whether or not you personally choose to recognize the innovation of the program, at least the experts in industry do:
Announcing The Winners Of The 2014 Innovation By Design Awards (FastCompany)
Scroll down about 1/3 of the page.
I do not recollect seeing this as a major news item on this site.
Is it perfect, no, nothing is.... However, we like to maximize FPs, and I no longer had to run all over the park while my family was off having fun.
BTW, whether or not you personally choose to recognize the innovation of the program, at least the experts in industry do:
Announcing The Winners Of The 2014 Innovation By Design Awards (FastCompany)
Scroll down about 1/3 of the page.
I do not recollect seeing this as a major news item on this site.
ford91exploder
Resident Curmudgeon
I think your experience is closer to the average experience had by most guests.
I'm on the far edge of the bell curve in that every single trip beginning with the tests they subjected we the unwilling guests in the beginning of this process i've needed to spend hours on the phone and at GR to get MM+ to work. DW and I no longer even bother to TRY getting FP's.
Last trip in August last day of trip, MM- would not let us in the parks, Went to GR and GR saw that our premier passports were valid, but there was some sort of 'undefined error' which even the blueshirts scratched their heads about. In the end Disney gave us 1 day hoppers because they COULD NOT FIX the issue. If I would have had FP's they would not have been valid.
If I want to sit on the phone for hours with tech support I can stay at work and get paid for it. DVC is nice though as a base to explore central florida #DisneyFAIL
devoy1701
Well-Known Member
It's interesting that you say that. This past Saturday was the first time we had visited Magic Kingdom in over 4 years. I know that there are some new sections that have opened during that time, but even so, the park felt "foreign" to us. This is a park that my wife and I had spent 30-40 days a year in for the better part of 5 years. We knew it inside and out. FP+ takes away any advantage. At least we still know where the rocking chairs are and which bathrooms are the least visited...
pax_65
Well-Known Member
Absolutely true - that's the next step. Out of its concern for guests like me who demand more flexibility, Disney will generously allow us to purchase FPs for all attractions in the morning as we enter the park. Heck, we'll probably be able to do it from our smart phones to avoid all lines.
Just another example of paying extra for something that used to be included with your regular park admission.
Buried20KLeague
Well-Known Member
Don't worry... I certainly didn't expect you to understand.
Eye rolling cast members should be canned. Their very job is to get with the program. If they can't do that, they need to go.
Every board has negative people reporting negative experiences and there certainly has been several people over there who have been on the hate train about FP+ ever since FP+ was first announced. That being said, the first post that you dug up from back in January was made by a person who goes negative pretty frequently and has for years. It is not surprising to see him posting some hate about FP+.
The second post that you cited is interesting for a couple reasons. First, it is also from that ancient thread but what's really telling is what you snipped away from it. It was mostly a rant about not being able to get more than three FPs. In fact, the entire point of his post can be summed up in this sentence that you snipped away: "I enjoy planning my Disney vacations and can appreciate reserving FP's in advance, but not at the expense of sacrificing additional FP's beyond the 3 that they're granting us."
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wogwog
Well-Known Member
I shortened your post to respond to only your math. Depends on what you define a "smattering" is. I will say a "smattering" is not a very accurate number. Told to me by multiple people, neighbors and social friends who deal with Disney surveys and GR the "smattering" is more like 40%. Some of those sources are at a high enough level at WDW that I believe them....... Right now there are millions of people that like (not love, only like) the MM+/FP+ system and only a smattering of those who dislike (or even hate) the system. However, in the future it may prove that something else comes along that these people that are dissatisfied right now will love and others will hate. .....
This seems to be OK with the Disney plan. Annual visitors and one and done crowd must be sufficient for them. Maximize profit per visitor and let a new group in the gates next week.
I have not quit enjoying the Disney brand. I am a Central Florida resident, sail multiple DCL cruises every year, visit Disneyland California a week annually and get to one of the out of country parks every year or so through fortunate business and pleasure travel. I visited HK Disneyland more days last year than WDW down the road from me. That is even with friends and relatives that would allow me unlimited free visits to WDW. I will drop in to Paris Disneyland in November, weather permitting. I find the stale WDW parks depressing and the whole - reserve the visit months in advance - reminds me a bit of Mr. Orwell's 1984. I only visit WDW when I have out of town visitors. Even some of them have changed to Disneyland California for their Mouse fix.
Anecdotally I have more than a few Central Florida neighbors and acquaintances who have ceased renewing annual passes this year.
The new system works for many andI hope all of them have a good time. But WDW has a long way to go to win back the "smattering".
ford91exploder
Resident Curmudgeon
Thanks @wogwog I'm thinking this is what may have triggered Lovable Lou's epic rant the other day - Let's face it love him or loathe him he eats, breathes and sleeps WDW (if only TDO did the same) and I'm sure he sees the rising tide of dissatisfaction more clearly than most and he's afraid it will go viral after that no amount of spin control out of Celebration Place will stop it.
A good first step for Disney would be to build a new TDO HQ on property just like TDA so they SEE the issues at the parks, If Georgie K and or his minions had to wait an hour at the Brown Derby or 1900, I'm sure we'd see more restaurant capacity opening, If they SEE GR comping tickets because accounts are broken they might hire some professionals to FIX the issue once and for all, If they SEE the gate allowing people in without scanning tickets because MM+ has crashed yet again without a fallback system, Well you get the general idea.
For those who have worked with ISO9000 and Six Sigma as well as Kaizen for Japanese customers a 40% REPORTED failure rate is absolutely unacceptable under all of these systems and in most companies would get the process owners demoted or fired unless there was a really GOOD reason (supplier fraud comes to mind and yes it DOES happen). If the manager was old school Japanese they might commit seppuku (yes it STILL happens - I've always thought that would be a good tradition to import to the US).
But apparently to Brand Advocates a 40% failure rate is OK as long as it's a 'Magical Failure' and it's OK with them that a large proportion of visitors have a less than magical vacation as long as 'most' people have a good experience.
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In my opinion, that one line boils down the problem that many have with FP+.... FP+ takes away any advantage. ...
BrerJon
Well-Known Member
But you know what they're like, even if they did come to the parks a lot they'd be escorted by an army of plaids, any basic sit-down restaurant meals would have the chef creating custom fine dining for them a world away from the slop served to DDP guests, rides would be straight on through the exit... the only way for what you describe to happen is if they did it 'undercover boss' style and went in as civilians without plaids to assist them.
Is there anyone with any authority over WDW who doesn't have an ego the size of the moon and could stomach mucking in with everyone else like that for even a day? I doubt it, but if they did it would be really eye opening.