Former Disneyland annual passholders complain about lack of priority ticket access for parks’ return - OCR/SCNG

[ToTBellHop]

I wonder if Disney didn't consider doubling their capacity for the parks by creating a two tier day ticketing and still staying within required social distancing numbers..

1) open the parks gates at 8am close at 3pm.
2) re-open park gates again at 4pm and close at 11pm.

The hour between 3pm and 4pm would be used to make sure that first group has emptied out to maintain the required capacity for social distancing required.

A schedule like that would automatically double the amount of tickets available for reservation and double ticket revenue for each day.

They must not be worried about selling out too quickly. Plus, as I’ve said, they want overnight visitors. 7 hour tickets preclude them from selling multi-day tickets and alienate vacationers. There’s just no need.

 

[Tamandua]

I wonder if Disney didn't consider doubling their capacity for the parks by creating a two tier day ticketing and still staying within required social distancing numbers..

1) open the parks gates at 8am close at 3pm.
2) re-open park gates again at 4pm and close at 11pm.

The hour between 3pm and 4pm would be used to make sure that first group has emptied out to maintain the required capacity for social distancing required.

A schedule like that would automatically double the amount of tickets available for reservation and double ticket revenue for each day.

I really don't think a lot of people would go for that. There's also the issue of having staffing available for that, which would be challenging at the moment.

 

[Ismael Flores]

They must not be worried about selling out too quickly. Plus, as I’ve said, they want overnight visitors. 7 hour tickets preclude them from selling multi-day tickets and alienate vacationers. There’s just no need.

Didn't they send out surveys talking about the possibility of variable ticketing including tickets for evening entry only? They obviously have been considering the idea for possibly future crowd control including possibly using it as a way of controlling annual pass visiting cycles.

The beauty of using a ticketing system is that out of town visitors with multi day park hopping tickets can be prioritized so that they are able to reserve a day slot for one park while reserving a night slot for the other.

As i understand part of that process will be used in opening day. Their site says that people with park hopping tickets will need to decide what park to start off with then after a certain time they will be allowed to park hop.

 

[Rich T]

EVERYONE including "casual park visitors" were trying to get tickets to touch of disney.

I wasn’t.

 

[Figments Friend]

Me neither, even though I can fly in from Boston to attend the DCA food fair but I'm not allowed into Disneyland Park when it opens.

Or am I....?

( rubs hands together with mischievous grin )

-

 

[ToTBellHop]

Me neither, even though I can fly in from Boston to attend the DCA food fair but I'm not allowed into Disneyland Park when it opens.

Or am I....?

( rubs hands together with mischievous grin )

-

I’d just wait for summer. Who needs the worry?

 

[Figments Friend]

I’d just wait for summer. Who needs the worry?

Indeed.

I prefer Autumn , but will watch from afar how things develop.
Interested to see how Disneyland handles the transition.

-

 

[Curious Constance]

Sure, but Disney would make more money from a dozen different families taking 3-day trips than a single family of APers making 3-dozen 1-day trips. Infrequent visitors tend to stay in the parks longer, which means consuming more food and drinks each day, and are more likely (per day) to buy merchandise to commemorate their special trip.

Assuming each family consists of 2 adults and 2 kids, here are some rough prices:

Infrequent Visitors:
3-day park hopper tickets: $355 x2 + $335 x2 = $1,380
2 meals per person per day: $15 x2 x4 x3 = $360
2 snacks per person per day: $4 x2 x4 x3 = $96
1-2 merchandise items per person: $50 x4 = $200
Subtotal for one family: $2,036
12 family total = $24,432

AP Family:
Signature APs: $1,149 x4 = $4,596
1 meal per person per day: $15 x1 x4 x36 = $2,160
1 snack per person per day: $4 x1 x4 x36 = $576
1-2 merchandise items per person, twice a year: $50 x2 x4 = $400
AP Family total = $7,732

Yes, the AP family would spend more over the course of a year than any one of the infrequent-visitor families, but Disney would bring in more than triple the money from the infrequent visitors. And given that the parks have been filled near capacity more than ever before, the way to make money is by targeting guests who will spend more, rather than simply trying to get bodies through the turnstile.

[Note: When including things like hotels and parking, infrequent visitors become even more desirable, as they pay more per person for the amount of impact they have on the resort infrastructure]

Chapek's quote is a little confusing, as "marginally more valuable" makes it sound like the difference is small, rather than clearly saying that the "profit margins" are far better on infrequent guests. Yes, it's harder to attract infrequent visitors (especially during less desirable times of the year/days of the week, where the AP program initially proved its value), but it's worth the extra work up front to get the massive difference in spending once they arrive.

After things level out, I don't doubt there will be some sort of program to encourage repeat visits from locals to help fill in the gaps, but I hope it will have different goals than simply getting bodies in the park, as was previously the case. Perhaps this will be a paradigm shift in who DLR sees as their bread-and-butter guests; for many years, the focus has been on APs, even though it's always been the infrequent visitors who let them keep the lights on.

You don’t post often, but when you do, it brings tears to the eyes.

Makes me even prouder of myself to have instantly solved your Splash Mountain riddle 15 years ago.

 

[1HAPPYGHOSTHOST]

I wasn’t.

ok.

 

[CaptinEO]

Sure, but Disney would make more money from a dozen different families taking 3-day trips than a single family of APers making 3-dozen 1-day trips. Infrequent visitors tend to stay in the parks longer, which means consuming more food and drinks each day, and are more likely (per day) to buy merchandise to commemorate their special trip.

Assuming each family consists of 2 adults and 2 kids, here are some rough prices:

Infrequent Visitors:
3-day park hopper tickets: $355 x2 + $335 x2 = $1,380
2 meals per person per day: $15 x2 x4 x3 = $360
2 snacks per person per day: $4 x2 x4 x3 = $96
1-2 merchandise items per person: $50 x4 = $200
Subtotal for one family: $2,036
12 family total = $24,432

AP Family:
Signature APs: $1,149 x4 = $4,596
1 meal per person per day: $15 x1 x4 x36 = $2,160
1 snack per person per day: $4 x1 x4 x36 = $576
1-2 merchandise items per person, twice a year: $50 x2 x4 = $400
AP Family total = $7,732

Yes, the AP family would spend more over the course of a year than any one of the infrequent-visitor families, but Disney would bring in more than triple the money from the infrequent visitors. And given that the parks have been filled near capacity more than ever before, the way to make money is by targeting guests who will spend more, rather than simply trying to get bodies through the turnstile.

[Note: When including things like hotels and parking, infrequent visitors become even more desirable, as they pay more per person for the amount of impact they have on the resort infrastructure]

Chapek's quote is a little confusing, as "marginally more valuable" makes it sound like the difference is small, rather than clearly saying that the "profit margins" are far better on infrequent guests. Yes, it's harder to attract infrequent visitors (especially during less desirable times of the year/days of the week, where the AP program initially proved its value), but it's worth the extra work up front to get the massive difference in spending once they arrive.

After things level out, I don't doubt there will be some sort of program to encourage repeat visits from locals to help fill in the gaps, but I hope it will have different goals than simply getting bodies in the park, as was previously the case. Perhaps this will be a paradigm shift in who DLR sees as their bread-and-butter guests; for many years, the focus has been on APs, even though it's always been the infrequent visitors who let them keep the lights on.

I mean I had a Signature AP and I had to eat food just like the peasants that only had tickets.

The "locals" thing is overstated. I lived 2 hours away before the shut down. When I went it was from rope drop til anywhere from 4pm-10pm.

A TON of people in my same town and workplace had passes and AP magnets. Everyone assumes the APs are just Anaheim people popping in, but you have people coming from all over California and even out of state with APs.

A few years ago I even had a Disney World AP despite living in California.

You also need to calculate how the APs end up enticing people to visit more times than they would under normal circumstances.

These things have a lot of factors.

Yes a wealthy family staying at the Grand for a week buying expensive table service meals and merchandise is a big win for the resort. But that clientelle is smaller than you think.

Im not saying Disney needs passes, in fact I don't like the idea of having to visit x number of times to get a "return on investment". I just hope they price their tickets flexibly enough that they dont need to rely on passes anymore.

 

[SuddenStorm]

Not every AP holder lived in California. I can imagine if they hadn't cancelled the program, or if they gave former AP holders priority access for reservations, that'd twist the knife for out of stater's who had AP's.

 

[truecoat]

We could maybe do with less fist fights in toon town. Is a high price much of a barrier anymore though? How many stimulus checks handed out in the last year have broken the riff-raff barrier in a lot of places?

So people on the poor end of the scale are riff-raff? Or is it a certain color?

 

[Tamandua]

So people on the poor end of the scale are riff-raff? Or is it a certain color?

I think the context implies that lower income people are considered "riff raff" by many corporations, which is why casinos on the strip have lower minimums "to keep the riff raff out."

Dunno why everyone has to turn everything into a racial issue when it's clear from the context that it's not the case. Whenever people jump to such conclusions, I just assume it's their own prejudices informing their outrage.

 

[DrAlice]

So, it's been awhile since I've been to the parks. What were the typical expiration dates on Single and Multi-Day tickets? Was it one year from purchase? What was the return policy?

As an out-of-towner, I'd like to go. I'm even willing to play the "stalk the website" game to try and get a reservation. However, I don't want to be stuck with tickets that I can't use because I can't get reservations in a time frame that works for me (travel and work constraints, etc.).

I keep checking the website to see if they add this fine print somewhere. I haven't found it yet, but I'm going to assume they aren't changing from previous expiration date and cancellation policies. Anyone remember what those were?

 

[ToTBellHop]

So, it's been awhile since I've been to the parks. What were the typical expiration dates on Single and Multi-Day tickets? Was it one year from purchase? What was the return policy?

As an out-of-towner, I'd like to go. I'm even willing to play the "stalk the website" game to try and get a reservation. However, I don't want to be stuck with tickets that I can't use because I can't get reservations in a time frame that works for me (travel and work constraints, etc.).

I keep checking the website to see if they add this fine print somewhere. I haven't found it yet, but I'm going to assume they aren't changing from previous expiration date and cancellation policies. Anyone remember what those were?

1. Unless otherwise stated, the amount paid for any wholly unused, expired Disneyland® Resort theme park ticket, except for special event tickets and Annual Passports, may be applied towards the purchase of a new theme park admission ticket at the current price so long as the new ticket purchase price is equal to or greater than the amount paid for the original ticket. Please visit a Main Entrance ticket booth, a Disneyland® Resort hotel Front Desk or Concierge, or a Guest Relations location in a theme park to apply any eligible ticket amount towards a new ticket purchase. The amount paid for any theme park ticket may not be redeemed for cash or used for any other goods or services other than for another theme park admission ticket. No credit or refunds will be given for the non-use of any portion of a theme park admission ticket’s entitlements (e.g., using a 4-day ticket for 3 days of admission; using a Peak 1-Day ticket on a Value season date; not using Disney MaxPass on its validity day; etc.).

 

[PiratesMansion]

So, it's been awhile since I've been to the parks. What were the typical expiration dates on Single and Multi-Day tickets? Was it one year from purchase? What was the return policy?

As an out-of-towner, I'd like to go. I'm even willing to play the "stalk the website" game to try and get a reservation. However, I don't want to be stuck with tickets that I can't use because I can't get reservations in a time frame that works for me (travel and work constraints, etc.).

I keep checking the website to see if they add this fine print somewhere. I haven't found it yet, but I'm going to assume they aren't changing from previous expiration date and cancellation policies. Anyone remember what those were?

I think right now the official expiration is sometime next year, but I imagine they're going to update it at least once more before it becomes final.

It would seem unsporting to enforce expiration dates for out-of-staters who technically can't go yet, so I imagine final expiration dates will be set at some time after non-Californians are let back in.

 

[DrAlice]

1. Unless otherwise stated, the amount paid for any wholly unused, expired Disneyland® Resort theme park ticket, except for special event tickets and Annual Passports, may be applied towards the purchase of a new theme park admission ticket at the current price so long as the new ticket purchase price is equal to or greater than the amount paid for the original ticket. Please visit a Main Entrance ticket booth, a Disneyland® Resort hotel Front Desk or Concierge, or a Guest Relations location in a theme park to apply any eligible ticket amount towards a new ticket purchase. The amount paid for any theme park ticket may not be redeemed for cash or used for any other goods or services other than for another theme park admission ticket. No credit or refunds will be given for the non-use of any portion of a theme park admission ticket’s entitlements (e.g., using a 4-day ticket for 3 days of admission; using a Peak 1-Day ticket on a Value season date; not using Disney MaxPass on its validity day; etc.).

Yes, I've seen this. However, this is in reference to people making reservations on tickets they bought before the shut down. I'm talking about NEW purchases on April 15.

 

[chadwpalm]

So, it's been awhile since I've been to the parks. What were the typical expiration dates on Single and Multi-Day tickets? Was it one year from purchase? What was the return policy?

As an out-of-towner, I'd like to go. I'm even willing to play the "stalk the website" game to try and get a reservation. However, I don't want to be stuck with tickets that I can't use because I can't get reservations in a time frame that works for me (travel and work constraints, etc.).

I keep checking the website to see if they add this fine print somewhere. I haven't found it yet, but I'm going to assume they aren't changing from previous expiration date and cancellation policies. Anyone remember what those were?

Typically Single and Multi-Day tickets are good for at least a year, but Covid has caused expirations to be extended. It's probably a safe bet that if you got tickets on the 15th, they'd be good until at least the end of 2022, which is where the pre-covid ticket extensions go until. Tickets are typically non-refundable and non-transferrable. They let you upgrade them for a higher-cost ticket, but not downgrade to a lower-cost ticket.

For Multi-day tickets, that expiration would be for the first day you use it. Once you use your first day you have 13 days to use the rest.

 

[RollerCoaster]

The problem is Disney isn't showing any loyalty to passholders. This is especially disturbing considering that passholders have literally kept them up.and running during the most difficult times, such as after 9/11.

That's utter nonsense to claim that passholders kept Disney up and running during times like after 9/11. Disney has managed to weather an event that is far worse than 9/11. Passholders generate a lot of gate revenue, but they're far from necessary for Disney to survive and thrive.

Disney doesn't owe the passholders anything. Their passes were cancelled, money refunded, and thus the relationship has ended!

 

[cmwade77]

Perhaps not all APs are "locals", but 50% of attendance coming from APs is hardly overblown.

On any given day, attendance was about 60% - 75% locals. This means 40% to as little as 25% were tourists. Yes, tourists do go to Disneyland, but no where near the number that are locals. This also means at least 10% are locals that aren't passholders.