Former Disneyland annual passholders complain about lack of priority ticket access for parks’ return - OCR/SCNG

[ToTBellHop]

Yeah. It's not like they would ever give APs 100%, or even a majority of availability. There are so many ways Disney could have handled this better. I think it's fair to criticize them over it. Then again, what else is new? Even in the best of times people were constantly complaining about something. I do think maybe Disney has gotten too used to this idea that there's unlimited demand for Disneyland because swarms of people were going to downtown Disney and touch of Disney when there weren't a lot of other things for people to do. I think the pent up demand will fall off quickly. Disney world was selling heavily discounted tickets for locals this winter. Even with reduced capacity, people had lost interest in going with so much of the experience unavailable and the masks making it so uncomfortable.

People would have raised holy hell if 1 million pass holders were competing for 10,000 reservations each day.

The company had been saying for awhile that there were too many APs. They will never find an easier time to reset than a 13-month closure. All these former-APs who want the world to know how much money they give Disney will still be able to give Disney their money.

You were always paying money for access to the parks with any further perks never guaranteed. You will still be able to purchase access to the parks though the pricing model will change. Buy a park hopper and go two weekends in a row and you’ll probably feel satisfied until their new repeat-visitor program starts.

 

[Californian Elitist]

It's like when people complained about how crowded it was ... But didn't want to stop going which only contributed to the crowds.

Facts. Both annual passholders and non annual passholders who complained about crowds were the main ones returning every year as well.

 

[Disney Analyst]

Disney did the right thing. They had no way to honour the program and all its former members with the capacity restraints, after a year closure.

Add in people who bought day tickets, they of course had to prioritize them and not give out special offers to the former AP holders.

People have to get over it. Buy a day ticket... wait for a new AP program to come out in 2022, whatever it is. But the whining online is a bit too much for me.

 

[ToTBellHop]

Disney did the right thing. They had no way to honour the program and all its former members with the capacity restraints, after a year closure.

Add in people who bought day tickets, they of course had to prioritize them and not give out special offers to the former AP holders.

People have to get over it. Buy a day ticket... wait for a new AP program to come out in 2022, whatever it is. But the whining online is a bit too much for me.

Or buy a Universal AP and ride SLoP 743 times this year.

 

[CaptinEO]

Facts. Both annual passholders and non annual passholders who complained about crowds were the main ones returning every year as well.

I visited on Saturdays and they were glorious every time.

 

[Stevek]

It doesn’t look like any previous passholder is getting some sort of purchasing advantage here.

I feel like Disney should have done something for those that were still annual passholders before they closed the program.

Correct, I didn't mean to insinuate that me or any other former passholder should get preferential treatment...merely that there will always be someone who is unhappy and it's next to impossible for Disney to please everyone. I'm really not sure what Disney could have done beyond refunding money. Said another way, they've chosen to alienate all APs, new old, lapsed vs trying to appease a portion of them.

 

[ToTBellHop]

Correct, I didn't mean to insinuate that me or any other former passholder should get preferential treatment...merely that there will always be someone who is unhappy and it's next to impossible for Disney to please everyone. I'm really not sure what Disney could have done beyond refunding money. Said another way, they've chosen to alienate all APs, new old, lapsed vs trying to appease a portion of them.

How many of DISNEY’S GREATEST FANS do we think they’ll actually lose?

 

[Californian Elitist]

Correct, I didn't mean to insinuate that me or any other former passholder should get preferential treatment...merely that there will always be someone who is unhappy and it's next to impossible for Disney to please everyone. I'm really not sure what Disney could have done beyond refunding money. Said another way, they've chosen to alienate all APs, new old, lapsed vs trying to appease a portion of them.

Oh for sure. At this point, it is what it is. All people can do is try to make a reservation for the date or dates they want and hope for the best.

 

[Stevek]

They went about it in a bad way.

They were silent on the subject for a long time, then claimed if you dont want a refund you could get an extension on your pass. People waited almost a year and then they said "just kidding, we're actually stopping all annual passes".

Basically it took me a year to get the unused portion of my AP money back that I couldve had much earlier if they hadn't lied by offering an "extension option" that they revoked.

They backed themselves into a corner by making their pass options so complicated, it was unfeasible for post-covid operation.

Furthermore, when I bought my Flex Pass I had the option to, and paid for the parking add on and was told to do so by the CM because I'd be "grandfathered in" as long as I maintained a pass.

I was only a 6 year pass-holder but feel like we did get the short end of the stick VS other theme parks.

They were silent because they had no clue what was going to happen with regards to reopening. Had the pandemic lasted 6 months, there would likely be a lot of very happy APs as they would have continued. I think that as time went on, their plan changed (ie extension went away) and it allowed them to rethink the whole AP thing to the point we are at now (no AP). I don't think it was a "just kidding" moment by any stretch, they just realized that if they were going to rip off the band aid, the prolonged closure presented the best opportunity to do so. I will say it is definitely disappointing that it took that long for you to get your refund...but again, I don't think they lied about an extension option, their AP plan just changed.

 

[Stevek]

How many of DISNEY’S GREATEST FANS do we think they’ll actually lose?

As I said earlier, they lost me as an AP a handful of years ago for various reasons. We try to visit once a year now. Disney tickets/ap's are the classic leaky bucket. Disney knows they will lose some APs every year but there is always someone else willing to fill up the bucket.

 

[CaptinEO]

They were silent because they had no clue what was going to happen with regards to reopening. Had the pandemic lasted 6 months, there would likely be a lot of very happy APs as they would have continued. I think that as time went on, their plan changed (ie extension went away) and it allowed them to rethink the whole AP thing to the point we are at now (no AP). I don't think it was a "just kidding" moment by any stretch, they just realized that if they were going to rip off the band aid, the prolonged closure presented the best opportunity to do so. I will say it is definitely disappointing that it took that long for you to get your refund...but again, I don't think they lied about an extension option, their AP plan just changed.

As I mentioned I do think they had no options, but thats entirely due to their own fracturing of the pass options.

Theres no way they could tell a Signature Pass Owner that they have to make reservations just like the Flex Pass owners.

That being said its not like Disney or anyone would've predicted the pandemic.

 

[DanielBB8]

As I said earlier, they lost me as an AP a handful of years ago for various reasons. We try to visit once a year now. Disney tickets/ap's are the classic leaky bucket. Disney knows they will lose some APs every year but there is always someone else willing to fill up the bucket.

They don’t lose enough APs at the perfect price point. The California AP is closed to sales for years because this is renewed by most. They subsequently added the Flex Pass, which costs about the same (approx $600 to $700), but reservations are required. APs are very popular, but expensive.

 

[Disney Analyst]

They were silent because they had no clue what was going to happen with regards to reopening. Had the pandemic lasted 6 months, there would likely be a lot of very happy APs as they would have continued. I think that as time went on, their plan changed (ie extension went away) and it allowed them to rethink the whole AP thing to the point we are at now (no AP). I don't think it was a "just kidding" moment by any stretch, they just realized that if they were going to rip off the band aid, the prolonged closure presented the best opportunity to do so. I will say it is definitely disappointing that it took that long for you to get your refund...but again, I don't think they lied about an extension option, their AP plan just changed.

Precisely. Had they opened last summer as planned, AP program would have continued. Once they realized the opening was no where in sight, reality snuck in.

How could you possibly honour the program for all APs, who have varying renewal dates, with limited capacity and reservations needed? Weren’t there near or over 1 million AP holders?

I can’t even fathom any sort of logistic that would make that work after a year closure, and Disney has known they had an AP problem in California for many many years.

I think they ultimately made the best decision. Start fresh when they can with a new program. And quite frankly it’s kind of crazy that they even honoured discounts for legacy pass holders once refunds were sent out.

 

[Tamandua]

As I mentioned I do think they had no options, but thats entirely due to their own fracturing of the pass options.

Theres no way they could tell a Signature Pass Owner that they have to make reservations just like the Flex Pass owners.

That being said its not like Disney or anyone would've predicted the pandemic.

They had options. Tons of options. They could have done what any of the other parks were doing, or anything else in between. The reality is that there will probably be a 2-3 month ramping up period, and then capacity will be back around what it was. If that's the case, they could have paused everyone's APs until then, or given a bonus period, or let APs choose one of several options based on their preference. Instead they decided to cancel everyone's passes just so they could sell them back for more money with less value. That's a crappy move.

I don't care about legacy passholder priority for reservations, but I think Disney should give legacy passholders a substantial discount on whatever the new pass system is, or let them grandfather in previously held perks like parking. Otherwise they look pretty bad compared to all the other theme parks.

 

[Disney Analyst]

They had options. Tons of options. They could have done what any of the other parks were doing, or anything else in between. The reality is that there will probably be a 2-3 month ramping up period, and then capacity will be back around what it was. If that's the case, they could have paused everyone's APs until then, or given a bonus period, or let APs choose one of several options based on their preference. Instead they decided to cancel everyone's passes just so they could sell them back for more money with less value. That's a crappy move.

I don't care about legacy passholder priority for reservations, but I think Disney should give legacy passholders a substantial discount on whatever the new pass system is, or let them grandfather in previously held perks like parking. Otherwise they look pretty bad compared to all the other theme parks.

No other parks had the AP base Disneyland had... the other parks need APs, and have way less logistics to figure out.

And I am sure pricing will go up, but I personally think the logistics alone killed the current AP program.

 

[drizgirl]

Not every APer spent just one day at the parks at a time. Just like there were APers, such as myself, who stayed both at on and off property hotels and some weren’t always local or even from California. Also, some DL APers were notorious for scheduled/timed visits, where they’d visit once every two weeks and sometimes even more frequently than that, AND would spend money in the parks each time.

If a family of two comes for five days once in the year, they will have likely spent less than a larger family of APers who’ve spent money on not only passes for the year, but also purchase food and merchandise for each visit, which could be dozens of times per year.

Disneyland APs could never be put into a specific box because they weren’t all the same.

But the visiting family will have also taken up less park resources in the course of the year.

Vacationers spend more money for each park entry (sometimes by far) AND also spend money in the parks on food and souvenirs. Disney wants it all. They want the most per capita as they can get.

Just because you made stays out of your visits doesn't mean you were typical.

 

[Californian Elitist]

But the visiting family will have also taken up less park resources in the course of the year.

Vacationers spend more money for each park entry (sometimes by far) AND also spend money in the parks on food and souvenirs. Disney wants it all. They want the most per capita as they can get.

Just because you made stays out of your visits doesn't mean you were typical.

I wasn’t insinuating anything about typical behavior. The point of that post was to point out that DL guests couldn’t be put into boxes because they never strayed completely to one type of guest. Nothing more than that.

 

[Stevek]

They had options. Tons of options. They could have done what any of the other parks were doing, or anything else in between. The reality is that there will probably be a 2-3 month ramping up period, and then capacity will be back around what it was. If that's the case, they could have paused everyone's APs until then, or given a bonus period, or let APs choose one of several options based on their preference. Instead they decided to cancel everyone's passes just so they could sell them back for more money with less value. That's a crappy move.

I don't care about legacy passholder priority for reservations, but I think Disney should give legacy passholders a substantial discount on whatever the new pass system is, or let them grandfather in previously held perks like parking. Otherwise they look pretty bad compared to all the other theme parks.

The reality is that yes, Disney had other options but they have known for years that they had a significant problem with the current AP program, the crowds and the dollars APs were spending relative to day guests/vacationers.

Not sure it's really a crappy move, any more crappy than continuing to increase passes every year. AND, we have zero idea what the new AP program will be, so impossible to say they will sell them back for more money with less value (but I would not be surprised if that's the case). And even if they do, what's the problem with that. Simple supply and demand has dictated what Disney does on these passes for years. Keep increasing prices, APs still get bought.

How fans react will dictate if whatever new strategy they come up with is successful. History has shown that no matter what Disney does, APs will whine all the way to the ticket booth when they addictively pay for something they feel is too expensive. I mean, what a great business model...let's keep raising prices and we see zero decrease in demand!

 

[el_super]

Instead they decided to cancel everyone's passes just so they could sell them back for more money with less value. That's a crappy move.

Not less value. The increased value of the passes, would be coming in the improved guest experience from having fewer people in the park. So it's really no different than any other price increase. More money = better experience.

 

[Stevek]

Not less value. The increased value of the passes, would be coming in the improved guest experience from having fewer people in the park. So it's really no different than any other price increase. More money = better experience.

And at the end of the day, value is in the eyes of the one paying for it. What I may find a value (less crowds at a higher price) may not be a value to others which is fine at the end of the day. It's a bummer that Disney is pricing some people out but quite honestly the only way to make it a better overall experience would be to remove APs (or make them an absolute luxury OR remove monthly payments) and set a reasonable daily ticket price.