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FastPass+ Most Certainly Not Coming Back As It Was

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mikejs78

Premium Member
Or it's easy to use rational logic and objectively look at what was offered at one point versus what is offered now.

Not that there's anything wrong with thinking it's better now than ever; that's great if that's been your experience! A lot of it is subjective, of course, and I'm certainly not saying every single thing is worse now than it used to be. It's not of course not 100% worse across the board. But there are things that are objectively worse now than they were 20+ years ago. Some of them are Disney's fault/choice and some of them aren't -- e.g. I suppose Disney could artificially lower crowd levels with a capacity cap if they wanted, but that's not realistic.

There are plenty of people, including on this forum, who look at the present through rose colored glasses ("everything I am experiencing at this moment is always the best thing that's ever happened") the same way some people look at the past through them.
Are there things that Disney doesn't do right? Sure. But they are constantly adding and removing things. Of course there are things one could say are objectively worse, but there are others that you could say are objectively better. And quantifying those things are more subjective than objective.
 

mikejs78

Premium Member
Except that was a period that was actually very much in decline. Looking at things in isolation and misconstruing them doesn't prove anything.

Disney of the last 30 years goes in spurts... especially in WDW. Do something, then ride it till everyone thinks the end is near, then do some more... then repeat.

Instead of looking at a moment in isolation - look at the larger sampling, the trends, and each in context.
2001 pre-9/11 was a period of decline?
 

dovetail65

Well-Known Member
Except that was a period that was actually very much in decline. Looking at things in isolation and misconstruing them doesn't prove anything.

Disney of the last 30 years goes in spurts... especially in WDW. Do something, then ride it till everyone thinks the end is near, then do some more... then repeat.

Instead of looking at a moment in isolation - look at the larger sampling, the trends, and each in context.
Disney from start to now is on a long term upswing. Say what anyone will, the long term strategy as it goes, changing or not, lulls for a few years here and there or not, is working. For me the complete WDW experience is better.

The only thing I might yearn for, even though Disney is still isolated, is a smaller feel we had as kids. We seemed to drive 10 to 15 minutes or more from the first border through a tropic jungle(compared to chicago) to get to the inner part of WDW. It had a far more isolated feel to me. We stayed at the Dutch Inn at Lake Buena Vista and the Contemporary one year(same trip) and back then Walt's dream of isolation worked so well. I get it, Disney needed the bigger roads as more parks were added, but for me that is the thing I miss most. Even though I still get a feeling once I cross the borders coming in or going out out, that certain long drive through the FL foliage can never be brought back. I still rather have the 4 parks and ease of getting around, for a few years getting from place to place wasn't the best ordeal, as far as time goes anyhow.
 

Touchdown

Well-Known Member
My rule think twice about >30 min wait only do it 2-3 times a day, and really think about doing >60 min wait and if you must only do that once (and it counts towards you 2-3 30 min waits.)
 

Jedijax719

Well-Known Member
My rule think twice about >30 min wait only do it 2-3 times a day, and really think about doing >60 min wait and if you must only do that once (and it counts towards you 2-3 30 min waits.)
And, see, that is where Disney will inevitably have problems. There are so many people (like us) who have used FP's and don't expect to wait more than 30 minutes for a ride because of the system that Disney has offered for free. Not saying it has to be free but when the choice becomes paying $100's of dollars to get what had been free or wait for very long lines (on top of already spiked prices and reduced perks), it will be a very hard sell for many. They will have to really on two types of guests: (1) those who don't know any better and have thus never been there before and (2) those who are "addicted" (for lack of a better term) and absolutely must go.

If Disney can make back their lost COVID money from those two groups, then good on them. If not, then I'd say they would need to adjust their methods and not cost guests $100's of dollars for that service.
 

TrojanUSC

Well-Known Member
So what they have is a version of DVC for the Parks... you have to buy in up front (get your ticket) before you can rent a room (schedule a park day).

It's only a matter of time before they start offering "Disney Park Memberships."

That's exactly what they are going to do in Anaheim.
 

Touchdown

Well-Known Member
And, see, that is where Disney will inevitably have problems. There are so many people (like us) who have used FP's and don't expect to wait more than 30 minutes for a ride because of the system that Disney has offered for free. Not saying it has to be free but when the choice becomes paying $100's of dollars to get what had been free or wait for very long lines (on top of already spiked prices and reduced perks), it will be a very hard sell for many. They will have to really on two types of guests: (1) those who don't know any better and have thus never been there before and (2) those who are "addicted" (for lack of a better term) and absolutely must go.

If Disney can make back their lost COVID money from those two groups, then good on them. If not, then I'd say they would need to adjust their methods and not cost guests $100's of dollars for that service.
That’s my rule at any theme park, and thanks to rope drop and closing I will have no problem still touring Disney Parks. I happen to enjoy less popular rides too.
 

Jedijax719

Well-Known Member
That’s my rule at any theme park, and thanks to rope drop and closing I will have no problem still touring Disney Parks. I happen to enjoy less popular rides too.
We were there in March 2018 during spring break and there were still a lot of people there for rope drop. We only learned after the fact that the crowd levels were around 9/10. We had things planned out and never even noticed the crowds. The only long wait was Jungle Cruise, but that was because of them helping a special needs guest in a wheel chair so the long wait was more than welcome so that the guest could enjoy themselves. I'm more than cool with that.

Btw, we went to Sea World San Antonio last week and they didn't have any capacity rules. Still, the park was much more than manageable (we didn't go on many rides-mostly shows-and had no problems getting SOAKED in the splash zones). It was hot as @#$% but that's pretty obvious lol. And it was a HECK of a lot cheaper than Disney ($55 per person). We probably spent overall about $200-$220 for the day including lunch and souvenirs for 3 people (as opposed to spending that much per person at a Disney or Universal ). We stayed on the Riverwalk at the Hyatt Regency for less than the price of the cheapest Disney resort. Point is that there are much cheaper vacations out there and, while Disney is seen as the #1 family destination, it would be nice if they had to compete. Right now, it seems like they don't.
 

LittleBuford

Well-Known Member
They could just increase park capacity....that ride has a very poor loading procedure that is sonewhat difficult for the more round guests. This is all due to you know...not building anything.....
I hear this argument all the time, but to my mind, the Magic Kingdom is already amply stocked with things to do, and were they to add attractions, the attendance figures would rise correspondingly. The truth is that the parks are crowded and always will be. FP made that manageable for me.
 

UNCgolf

Well-Known Member
I hear this argument all the time, but to my mind, the Magic Kingdom is already amply stocked with things to do, and were they to add attractions, the attendance figures would rise correspondingly. The truth is that the parks are crowded and always will be. FP made that manageable for me.

I don't actually think that's true now that attendance is so high on a daily basis. I really don't see new attractions suddenly resulting in 5,000+ new people showing up at the park every day -- it might for a short period of time when they were brand new, but it's unlikely it would have any long-term effect.

They still need to add significantly more capacity to the other parks first, though. All three of them could use 4 or 5 additional attractions.
 

flynnibus

Premium Member
2001 pre-9/11 was a period of decline?

There were plenty of bad decisions around then... and WDW really went into coast mode for most of the early 2000s. The uptick before that point was the millennial celebration and the attraction clones that brought... and the investment in DAK before that. The stuff people complain about is not just 'new stuff' but also the change in how the product is managed. Things like the wand and other questionable 'additions' could be seen for what they were even then.
 

matt9112

Well-Known Member
I hear this argument all the time, but to my mind, the Magic Kingdom is already amply stocked with things to do, and were they to add attractions, the attendance figures would rise correspondingly. The truth is that the parks are crowded and always will be. FP made that manageable for me.

Theres alot to do yes. But sadly i feel you are mistaken...MK has far more to do than the other three WDW parks however it also gets a MASSIVELY higher attendance figure. This means there is a combination of two factors or this wouldn't be the case. Factor 1 is some people visit only the MK and do not even go to the other 3. (I imagine this is common for folks with young kids doing an otherwise universal or generic orlando trip) or factor 2 most people go to MK multiple days on there vacation vs not so much for the other three parks.

Because it is manageable for you dosen't mean theres not an inherent problem. How many people bought a ford pinto...i mean it drives right? Thats your argument.

The strategy to be fair that disney has attempted has been to grow the other three parks however on paper this never draws people from the MK. They just extend there trips and or visit the other parks more. The massive attendance gap the MK enjoys over the other three parks arguably necessitates growth.

We know disney isn't going down that road so be prepared for upcharges galore and an overall costlier experience. But alass what works for you.
 

Roy G. Dis

Well-Known Member
We really enjoyed our trip to MK today with no thrill rides ( very young kids). It was a 5 on touring plans and we used the touring plans as a compass for our day but with most of the rides we went on being sub 20 minutes we got to be way more spontaneous than ever before. I'm sure capacity limits played a huge role here.... but I was still surprised at how easy it was.

I was also never much for fireworks or parades and it was awesome walking out of the place at 30 minutes to close and not having to navigate all the masses and traffic control waiting for the show to start; our toddlers will get the same joy out of a White Sox post game fireworks show.
 

larryz

My Last Trip was in 2018
Premium Member
That's exactly what they are going to do in Anaheim.
Well, I don't want to say "I told you so," but 'way back in 2018...
I foresee WDW and the other parks going to a "membership" model like Costco or Sam's Club.

This will be "Walt's Club" and it'll cost you $1,000 per family unit just to be able to make resort reservations, buy park tickets, or book a cruise vacation.
 

LittleBuford

Well-Known Member
I don't actually think that's true now that attendance is so high on a daily basis. I really don't see new attractions suddenly resulting in 5,000+ new people showing up at the park every day -- it might for a short period of time when they were brand new, but it's unlikely it would have any long-term effect.

They still need to add significantly more capacity to the other parks first, though. All three of them could use 4 or 5 additional attractions.
I respect that you and others feel this way. While I always welcome new additions, I personally don't think the parks are quite as in need of them as many here believe, nor do I think they would really help mitigate the crowds. Perhaps data pertaining to earlier expansions (Pandora, for example) could shed some light on the matter.
 
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