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EE Update Feature
- Thread starter Jose Eber
- Start date
I feel like I'm in the Twilight Zone
I realize I'll probably either be ignored or flamed for my comments but I just need to vent. Has anyone that thinks Everest is the cat's meow been on Haunted Mansion, Indy ride, Pirates or Splash Mountain? How can you even begin to compare those highly themed and effects laden attractions with the anemic Everest?
I've worked for WDI, Landmark and other attraction design firms. Maybe I'm looking at it with a jaded or overly critical eye, but can anyone truly say this ride is anywhere near in the same class as Pirates? It's a roller coaster with one animatronic and a lackluster shadow projection effect that looks like a projection as opposed to a shadow.
I will say the exterior is stunning! It is a wonderful addition to the Animal Kingdom atmosphere. The queue line is chock full of detail, but frankly I can see that in the kali queue (another pathetic ride in my opinion). So all in all, it's a fun family coaster with a wonderful exterior and a detailed queue. It's NOTHING MORE. Nothing revolutionary about this attraction...it doesn't raise the bar in any way as Disney attractions once used to do with every new opening. Yes I know it goes backwards and it's a cool track switch. That's very nice but it's nothing compared to how Pirates raised the bar with animatronic shows and dark rides, or how Indy introduced a new ride system, or how Haunted Mansions redefined what a dark ride could be or how Splash introduced detailed show sequences to log flumes.
There are so many missed opportunities in this attraction I don't even know where to start. The first thing to go is usually the show. Well there was some very poor project management, or very low expectations to start. Unfortunately the public has been trained over the last ten years to expect less from Disney and they'll be happy with anything that is half way decent.
Hopefully things will change with the Pixar move. From what I'm hearing from my buddies out at WDI it looks like I may get my wish. Don't mean to offend anyone or cause a big debate, just need to vent a little.
missionspace said:
I realize I'll probably either be ignored or flamed for my comments but I just need to vent. Has anyone that thinks Everest is the cat's meow been on Haunted Mansion, Indy ride, Pirates or Splash Mountain? How can you even begin to compare those highly themed and effects laden attractions with the anemic Everest?
I've worked for WDI, Landmark and other attraction design firms. Maybe I'm looking at it with a jaded or overly critical eye, but can anyone truly say this ride is anywhere near in the same class as Pirates? It's a roller coaster with one animatronic and a lackluster shadow projection effect that looks like a projection as opposed to a shadow.
I will say the exterior is stunning! It is a wonderful addition to the Animal Kingdom atmosphere. The queue line is chock full of detail, but frankly I can see that in the kali queue (another pathetic ride in my opinion). So all in all, it's a fun family coaster with a wonderful exterior and a detailed queue. It's NOTHING MORE. Nothing revolutionary about this attraction...it doesn't raise the bar in any way as Disney attractions once used to do with every new opening. Yes I know it goes backwards and it's a cool track switch. That's very nice but it's nothing compared to how Pirates raised the bar with animatronic shows and dark rides, or how Indy introduced a new ride system, or how Haunted Mansions redefined what a dark ride could be or how Splash introduced detailed show sequences to log flumes.
There are so many missed opportunities in this attraction I don't even know where to start. The first thing to go is usually the show. Well there was some very poor project management, or very low expectations to start. Unfortunately the public has been trained over the last ten years to expect less from Disney and they'll be happy with anything that is half way decent.
Hopefully things will change with the Pixar move. From what I'm hearing from my buddies out at WDI it looks like I may get my wish. Don't mean to offend anyone or cause a big debate, just need to vent a little.
^First off, have you ridden the attraction?
What do you think of Splash Mountain and Big Thunder mountain? Not really revolutionary ride systems -- but I think they are classics.
And Pirates -- are you talking about the WDW one, Paris one or Disneyland one? Disneyland's was revolutionary...
In terms of tech. Space was innovative because of its computer control -- which isn't a totally huge element to the ride -- but nevertheless it had something new. What about the backwards segment is underwhelming?
You are entitled to your opinion -- but even Walt (gasp) had attractions that were a lame (mule ride anyone?). The lame attractions got replaced and WDI built better ones.
If EE truly sucks -- they will replace it and do something new.
FYI here's a picture of the track/plan wise:
________________________________
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What do you think of Splash Mountain and Big Thunder mountain? Not really revolutionary ride systems -- but I think they are classics.
And Pirates -- are you talking about the WDW one, Paris one or Disneyland one? Disneyland's was revolutionary...
In terms of tech. Space was innovative because of its computer control -- which isn't a totally huge element to the ride -- but nevertheless it had something new. What about the backwards segment is underwhelming?
You are entitled to your opinion -- but even Walt (gasp) had attractions that were a lame (mule ride anyone?). The lame attractions got replaced and WDI built better ones.
If EE truly sucks -- they will replace it and do something new.
FYI here's a picture of the track/plan wise:
________________________________
A cool new Disney podcast: DisneyHD
Jose Eber said:^First off, have you ridden the attraction?
What do you think of Splash Mountain and Big Thunder mountain? Not really revolutionary ride systems -- but I think they are classics.
And Pirates -- are you talking about the WDW one, Paris one or Disneyland one? Disneyland's was revolutionary...
In terms of tech. Space was innovative because of its computer control -- which isn't a totally huge element to the ride -- but nevertheless it had something new. What about the backwards segment is underwhelming?
You are entitled to your opinion -- but even Walt (gasp) had attractions that were a lame (mule ride anyone?). The lame attractions got replaced and WDI built better ones.
If EE truly sucks -- they will replace it and do something new.
FYI here's a picture of the track/plan wise:
Yes I have ridden the attraction. I even worked on part of it as a vendor.
Regarding Splash and Big Thunder - Splash offers a step up in integrating show elements and story with a traditional log flume. It even offered a new log flume feature in the Laughing Place scene. With multiple new animatronics and a few other surprises Splash continued in the tradition of giving the public more than what would normally be expected in a non-Disney ride. Thunder included some nice show scenes on the lifts and flooded mining town. Even more than Everest includes in the ride portion. I will have to say I'm not the biggest Thunder fan, other than I like the ride because it's fun. I probably enjoy the coaster portion of Everest about as much, maybe slightly more due to the extra speed and g-force.
They will not replace Everest because it will be extremely popular. The public has come to expect less from Disney and therefore will accept anything that is fun. Everest is fun because it's a coaster. My point was that everything Disney has done in the last ten years, with a few exceptions, has been just enough to get by. By no means exceeding expectations as Pirates or Mansion or Indy did.
I'm not holding Walt up as the example either. I don't think everything he liked or did was perfect. I'm simply comparing the Disney product of yesterday with the Disney norm. today. I'm just confused as to why Disney fans and the public at large seem to have lost their ability to compare and expect the Disney standards to be maintained.
fundesign said:
Everest delivers things that are not expected in a non-Disney ride on a big scale. There is no other place on Earth except a Disney park where you have a coaster integrated into a 200ft recreation of Everest. Everyone else, puts their raw coasters onto a concrete slab and leaves it at that. The next (rare) stepup up from that, is to put the coaster into a warehouse, such as the Mummy.
Everest is a thing of beauty to look at, high on detail and authenticity, combined with a thrill ride, with an incredible animatronic. That's a pretty good combination to me. It's certainly something that no other company in the world has, or could, pull off.
I agree that there is always more that could be done with an attraction. I would like to see more show scenes, more animatronics, and more unique elements. However, I also recognise that the $100 million + price tag to build the village and mountain puts a financial contraint on things. The line has to be drawn somewhere.
fundesign said:
That statement there says loads about you.
Just because you deem something (EE) inadequate -- doesn't mean it is. Furthermore, you are conveniently judging the public as being inadequate as well -- in their ability to compare.
Why don't you compare your attitudes to the public at large -- maybe you are wrong. If everyone is enjoying it and you aren't -- maybe you have a problem with enjoying fun things!
Maybe its you that is too harsh a critic.
Who's your next target -- you've got the masses pegged as being off, WDI -- is there anyone left?
Get a sense of humor and do the ride on your own without your critical co-workers and just enjoy it for what it is -- a 100 million dollar attraction with a snow capped theme!
J.
________________________________
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peter11435
Well-Known Member
Excellent post.wdwmagic said:Everest delivers things that are not expected in a non-Disney ride on a big scale. There is no other place on Earth except a Disney park where you have a coaster integrated into a 200ft recreation of Everest. Everyone else, puts their raw coasters onto a concrete slab and leaves it at that. The next (rare) stepup up from that, is to put the coaster into a warehouse, such as the Mummy.
Everest is a thing of beauty to look at, high on detail and authenticity, combined with a thrill ride, with an incredible animatronic. That's a pretty good combination to me. It's certainly something that no other company in the world has, or could, pull off.
I agree that there is always more that could be done with an attraction. I would like to see more show scenes, more animatronics, and more unique elements. However, I also recognise that the $100 million + price tag to build the village and mountain puts a financial contraint on things. The line has to be drawn somewhere.
I don't know people always want to compare attractions. It really is pointless. After having been on Everest seven times now I can say that it is truely a great attraction.
Jose Eber said:
It's simple: Pirates - almost 120 animatronic figures, Everest - 1. I'm not sure why everyone is boasting about the Yeti. He looks good but the presentation is mediocre. His movement is no more impressive than Universal's old Kong figure. Splash - 13 show scenes, Everest - I'll give it 5 being generous. Total effects for Everest, a very generous 6...all done before. Nothing groundbreaking there. Compare that with TOT, Indy, Pirates, Mansion and even Thunder. I could go on and on comparing rides that deliver bang for the buck with Everest but that is only part of the point I'm making.
Look, I know the realities of E-ticket design/build. Nothing ever turns out as great in reality as it did on paper. My point is, the bar used to be raised with almost every new attraction built. When you got off the ride for the first time your overall impression is that your expectations have been exceeded. Where did Everest raise the bar? It's ANOTHER mountain with a roller coaster and an animatronic thrown in for good measure.
As far as going backwards...did it in Norway and Mummy. It's just faster and longer at Everest. Definitely fun. Where is the "wow" factor? I'm not saying it's awful, I'm just saying it's not up to Disney standards just as 90% of the attractions in the last 10 years. Several people I know had the same impression of Everest. We got off thinking, "ehhh, that was nice". Same impression as Philarmagic, Mission Space, Soarin' etc. Just good enough to pass but definitely far from excellent.
The_CEO said:
They most certainly did! It's not easy to design and build a structure like that. This was a HUGE project full of challenges and unexpected obstacles. Not unlike any other project of this scale. The difference between this one and Indy for example is the final product. Back in the early 90's people judged by a different standard.
t3techcom18
Well-Known Member
fundesign said:
Then why do you say that this isn't any better than the classics, and doesn't even follow the WDI tradition? Everest is now a major landmark and threshold for WDI, and should certainly be counted as one. They worked their rear ends off to get this as realistic as possible, even going on trips to the Himalayan regions. To spend money on that to make a truly immersive experience: a whole lot. But what does it come to: the experience. The experience that Everest offers is so much that, a little more, and you would be in Asia. Sure, WDI has not put a lot of effort into some rides lately, but that doesn't mean they stink; they always worked their rear ends off for anything, and with this, massively. After what I've seen and experienced of Everest, it's the best ride WDI has created, as a full experience, and even greater at times, after ToT. and THAT says a whole lot.
imagineersrock
New Member
To each his own.fundesign said:
If you consider Philharmagic, Mission: Space, and Soarin' "just good enough to pass," I can see why you're not a fan of Everest.
For me, however, those 4 attractions make my must-see list. -And I happen to think they are much better than just "good enough." ...And judging by the amount of people who applaud, cheer, and come off those attractions with an ear-to-ear grin, I'm not the only one who feels that way.
As Steve said, there is always room for improvement... But to say that the Everest experience (From queue to exit gift shop) is anything less than an instant-classic E-Ticket, I have to disagree.
EpcotServo
Well-Known Member
Fundesign, why do you act like we are comparing EE to Pirates or Mansion? Nobody has. I don't think anyone expected it too. We're just saying that it's a groundbreaking coaster, that is combined with some great show elements, a great story, and some great engineering behind it. If you say that it does nothing new, you are very wrong. First of all it has a new design of track stock, a brand new way of taking away the click-clack of the rollback on the lift hills, and an amazing AA figure that moves way faster and smoother than Kong ever did. I agree that you can't beat the classics, but after riding EE I had the same feelings as after my first ride on Indy at DL. And, keep in mind the ride still isn't 100% done yet.
Actually EpcotServo -- the noiseless lift is in existence and isn't too terribly new.
Personally, I avoid Philharmagic (rehashed old cartoons) and Mission Space, so I agree on those points.
Personally, I think over the last 20-30 years things have gotten less innovative or entertaining at the newer Disney Parks....
BUT -- I don't know -- who's is doing it better? I think Disney is still trying hard -- maybe another Walt is out there and will start some things up -- but sorry, the whole industry is in the condition you are talking about, its not just EE and WDI, its Sally, GGE, Universal Creative etc. don't just harp on WDI.
I don't know -- its not my line of work, so I really don't care...its 100 million bucks spent on a rollercoaster... and you probably need double that these days to pull off an Indy.
But no one budgets like that. You first fundesign!
J.
Personally, I avoid Philharmagic (rehashed old cartoons) and Mission Space, so I agree on those points.
Personally, I think over the last 20-30 years things have gotten less innovative or entertaining at the newer Disney Parks....
BUT -- I don't know -- who's is doing it better? I think Disney is still trying hard -- maybe another Walt is out there and will start some things up -- but sorry, the whole industry is in the condition you are talking about, its not just EE and WDI, its Sally, GGE, Universal Creative etc. don't just harp on WDI.
I don't know -- its not my line of work, so I really don't care...its 100 million bucks spent on a rollercoaster... and you probably need double that these days to pull off an Indy.
But no one budgets like that. You first fundesign!
J.
BwanaBob
Well-Known Member
I "see" his point too.Legacy said:
I also see the counter-point.
I think the common thread in the posts made clear is that the rides can NOT be compared against each other. They are unique in their own ways... and worthy of being branded Disney.
Things have changed.
I see fundesign as the "General Grizz" of WDI.
orlandorealtor
New Member
We were driving home from the vet, via WDW, around 4pm today and suddenly my car starting pulling toward the Animal Kingdom exit. I figured we could run in and take a quick couple rides on Everest then head home. We walked up to the entrance and a very nice old couple handed us a couple of fast passes (strangely this is the third time this has happened to me at Everest). We got in line, were the next ones to board, then they 'evacuated' the mountain and had everyone leave the building and line. Bummer.
And no steam effect.
We then ended (and began) our day with a trip of the Kilimanjaro Safaris where we sat in front of a woman who pretty much narrated the whole ride!! So annoying. Like many of us, I've experienced the 'narrator' on such rides as The Haunted Mansion and Pirates of the Carribean, but on the Safari? She was reciting the radio broadcasts from Wilson!!!!
And no steam effect.
We then ended (and began) our day with a trip of the Kilimanjaro Safaris where we sat in front of a woman who pretty much narrated the whole ride!! So annoying. Like many of us, I've experienced the 'narrator' on such rides as The Haunted Mansion and Pirates of the Carribean, but on the Safari? She was reciting the radio broadcasts from Wilson!!!!