Eddie Sotto's take on the current state of the parks (Part II)

[jt04]

I'd like to see them keep Dinoland but lose Dino-Rama. Use that area for transition to Pandora. Maybe they need to install a giant Stargate there to function as transition. Or the Guardian of Forever (which is basically a Stargate too).

Yes, ^ this is tongue in cheek!

If Dinorama goes as you suggested then Dinoland will go. It will simply be too small a land with too little to offer. And it will not be able to expand to fix the problem. Utilizing the Dinosaur ride as a part of the new AvatarLand is a viable solution to ensure the new land will have enough attractions.

And I have figured out how to get guests from DAK to Pandora without using expensive ride technology or "Stargates".:lol: I think it may very well be one of the possibilities they may be considering.

 

[unkadug]

...
And I have figured out how to get guests from DAK to Pandora without using expensive ride technology or "Stargates".:lol: I think it may very well be one of the possibilities they may be considering.

The same way they get people from Tomorrowland to Fantasyland. *Poof* there you are! :lol:

Haven't we had this conversation before? :lookaroun

 

[jt04]

The same way they get people from Tomorrowland to Fantasyland. *Poof* there you are! :lol:

Haven't we had this conversation before? :lookaroun

Yes, and it kills me not to put my idea into writing. It is a huge dilemma. What if I am right!? It might make the people working on the project look like they have a leak. I could imagine innocent people getting in trouble.

Full disclosure, I had this thought before for a different franchise and land and posted it here somewhere. It would work in this case also and very effectively I think.

 

[unkadug]

Yes, and it kills me not to put my idea into writing. It is a huge dilemma. What if I am right!? It might make the people working on the project look like they have a leak. I could imagine innocent people getting in trouble.

Full disclosure, I had this thought before for a different franchise and land and posted it here somewhere. It would work in this case also and very effectively I think.

Well you know what they say...there are no unique ideas....More than likely somebody has already thought of it before you did. (not "you" as in YOU...but "you" as in generalities)

So if nothing else it could be considered a lucky guess as far as they are concerned.


I do remember us discussing how they would treat the transition of TL to FL and back. But I certainly would not want to search those threads!

 

[jt04]

Well you know what they say...there are no unique ideas....More than likely somebody has already thought of it before you did. (not "you" as in YOU...but "you" as in generalities)

So if nothing else it could be considered a lucky guess as far as they are concerned.


I do remember us discussing how they would treat the transition of TL to FL and back. But I certainly would not want to search those threads!

I don't remeber that and I usually remeber stuff like that. I do remember recently discussing what they may be doing for a backstory for the Circus and also a new location for PH. I thought they might give us a few hints at the 40th but nothing. They can't wait much longer because part of the area opens in a few months and then we should know. If I am wrong I will still post what I was thinking.

Anyway, let me try to be cryptic about what I think the may intend for DAK.

One part Kevin Yee's ideas for location near Everest/Dinorama
One part Terminator 4D
One part Nemo near Everest
One part CineMagique (sp?)
One part Jurrasic Park island (from the movie)

Smash it all up, melt it down and sprinkle with pixie dust..... There you have it :lookaroun

too cryptic? :zipit:


:lol:

 

[Lee]

too cryptic? :zipit:

Yes. Unnecessarily so.

We've been over this, jt. You can freely post any idea you have. No jobs will be in danger, no plans will have to change and nobody will accuse WDI of ripping you off.

Let's hear the idea...

 

[jt04]

Yes. Unnecessarily so.

We've been over this, jt. You can freely post any idea you have. No jobs will be in danger, no plans will have to change and nobody will accuse WDI of ripping you off.

Let's hear the idea...

Simply bring guests into the world of Avatar (Pandora) like they wish they could while viewing the movie. A new short film could be added to extend the story (as I believe they do with Terminator 3D at Uni or present it as a documentary style 2D movie with Cameron explaining the world of Avatar and some backstory and then have the screen lift and guests are invited to walk into a fully realized AvatarLand by Cameron. You would literally walk into the story after learning more of the backstory.

Of course I know you are asking me to detail this concept so you can say "they would never do that because....." so let me explain how this could be done.

Since it is just a film all the support areas for the Nemo show (which is hopelessly lost in a theming limbo where it is located) could be demolished and just the stage and seating kept. Then the 'warehouse' we have speculated about could be attached. There are other backstage support functions that could also be relocated as necessary. The warehouse could extend and even use the land under Dinorama. This could be phase 1. They could reopen the small theater in CMM to absorb some of the lost capacity along with the new interactive games. They could even relocate FotLK into a larger theater for capacity before closing Nemo. The Nemo show could be relocated to the Studios perhaps downsized a bit if necessary.

I don't want this to be too speculative. I just think this fits a lot of the rumors we have heard and seems quite possible. I just tried to put the pieces of the puzzle together here.

 

[Cosmic Commando]

The same way they get people from Tomorrowland to Fantasyland. *Poof* there you are! :lol:

Haven't we had this conversation before? :lookaroun

I really don't get why people are so fixated on how we will get to Pandora. Since when is that what we worry about in theme parks? If you're in the South Seas of Adventureland, just walk by some bathrooms and you're in the Old West! One second you're in a medieval fair, then you're in front of the Mansion on the banks of the Hudson! Discovery Island... bridge... East Africa! Boom! The transition from Harambe to the Flights of Wonder stage to Anandapur to Everest is actually masterfully done, but that's the exception. The rules of time and space are very fluid in a theme park. Just give me a winding path or a cave to go through or something so you can't see the rest of the park while in Pandora, and I'm good.

Everyone wants to walk around Pandora, not ride the hypersleep simulator.

 

[RSoxNo1]

I really don't get why people are so fixated on how we will get to Pandora. Since when is that what we worry about in theme parks? If you're in the South Seas of Adventureland, just walk by some bathrooms and you're in the Old West! One second you're in a medieval fair, then you're in front of the Mansion on the banks of the Hudson! Discovery Island... bridge... East Africa! Boom! The transition from Harambe to the Flights of Wonder stage to Anandapur to Everest is actually masterfully done, but that's the exception. The rules of time and space are very fluid in a theme park. Just give me a winding path or a cave to go through or something so you can't see the rest of the park while in Pandora, and I'm good.

Everyone wants to walk around Pandora, not ride the hypersleep simulator.

Transition areas are important. Often times it's what helps to separate that mystical "feel" of a Disney park. Comparatively, a park like Islands of Adventure has intricate theming in each of it's individual lands, but the areas of transition are forced at best.

 

[Eddie Sotto]

Steve Jobs dies

Today Apple lost it's Walt. Truly a sad day as Steve's good taste raised the bar of design globally. I actually admire Apple more than Disney and I hope they don't wander the halls saying "What would Steve do?". He'd push everyone harder and strip away every contrivance down to the essence of what works. I have such appreciation for his drive for perfection and making the industry follow that course. He proved that there is a place for great design and that people will pay for it. Like Walt, he did not talk down to us, he led us with new technology and weaned us off the old. I remember the loss of the CD drive on the MB Air because he knew wireless was coming. He led that and was right.

http://www.appleinsider.com/article...germore_comment_on_passing_of_steve_jobs.html

The Disney board will miss it's largest shareholder as well. I wish he had been more involved! He leaves a gaping iHole that will be impossible to fill. He left his doughnut shaped "Progress City" HQ for his staff to build and I'm sure they will. Thank you Steve.

 

[Cosmic Commando]

Transition areas are important. Often times it's what helps to separate that mystical "feel" of a Disney park. Comparatively, a park like Islands of Adventure has intricate theming in each of it's individual lands, but the areas of transition are forced at best.

The transition is important, yes, but not the travel. The architecture, the landscaping and the music change with the theme and often you don't even notice the change. I think Disney is really masterful at it. I'm just saying that when you apply the "we must have a spaceship ride to Pandora otherwise it won't make any sense" level of realism to any park, nothing makes sense. Guests have always traveled very freely across time and space in a Disney park, but that doesn't mean that the transitions are handled poorly.

 

[RunnerEd]

The transition is important, yes, but not the travel. The architecture, the landscaping and the music change with the theme and often you don't even notice the change. I think Disney is really masterful at it. I'm just saying that when you apply the "we must have a spaceship ride to Pandora otherwise it won't make any sense" level of realism to any park, nothing makes sense. Guests have always traveled very freely across time and space in a Disney park, but that doesn't mean that the transitions are handled poorly.

I think the transitions in the MK are handled very well. The pavement under your feet, the architecture, and the back ground music change; in some areas subtly and in some, more drastically but the guest always notices that something is different. That being said, some type of transport to Pandora would be very cool.

 

[Eddie Sotto]

The transition is important, yes, but not the travel. The architecture, the landscaping and the music change with the theme and often you don't even notice the change. I think Disney is really masterful at it. I'm just saying that when you apply the "we must have a spaceship ride to Pandora otherwise it won't make any sense" level of realism to any park, nothing makes sense. Guests have always traveled very freely across time and space in a Disney park, but that doesn't mean that the transitions are handled poorly.

It will be interesting to see how story driven this transition will be. Part of the magic and power or a world is it's reveal. It's magical appearance or transformation or gradual dissolve from one place to another. Disney parks borrow from the "cross dissolve" in films where each world softly fades over the other with a neutral ground in the middle. We usually use landscaping that is common to both worlds as a bridge and the music fades in and out. Sometimes a portal does this as it does in DL Toontown or the MSUSA RR Station at Disneyland. This is a "fade to black/fade in" type transition. "Dissolves" usually happen in movies because the change if edited directly (smash cut) would be too jarring, so in that respect, so can a land if the premise changes. Tomorrowland just happens, you don't have to take a "Time Machine" to get there, the transition does that, although I'd love that to be one way to arrive.

FWIW, i'd like to see a ride that reveals in a story then dramatically ends in Pandora and you get off the ship and explore it yourself like a Tom Sawyer Island experience, filled with interactives and maybe even other rides. Like Kevin's description, (i.e. the indoor Mermaid area at TDS), it's a ride feeding an indoor land. If you did not want to do the ride, maybe you can enter another way so this is not forced on you, but I would love to see someone do that right. This has not been done because there is the argument that the capacity of the ride limits the land or it's going down, but you could have more than one way to get there.

We tried to make the JC take you to Indy at DL, dropping you off at the distant Temple in the Jungle (African Veldt) with a footpath back, that way if the JC went down or you need to meet someone there, etc. you could.

 

[RunnerEd]

It will be interesting to see how story driven this transition will be. Part of the magic and power or a world is it's reveal. It's magical appearance or transformation or gradual dissolve from one place to another. Disney parks borrow from the "cross dissolve" in films where each world softly fades over the other with a neutral ground in the middle. We usually use landscaping that is common to both worlds as a bridge and the music fades in and out. Sometimes a portal does this as it does in DL Toontown or the MSUSA RR Station at Disneyland. This is a "fade to black/fade in" type transition.

FWIW, i'd like to see a ride that reveals in a story then dramatically ends in Pandora and you get off the ship and explore it yourself like a Tom Sawyer Island experience, filled with interactives and maybe even other rides. Like Kevin's description, (i.e. the indoor Mermaid area at TDS), it's a ride feeding an indoor land. If you did not want to do the ride, maybe you can enter another way, but I would love to see someone do that right. This has not been done because there is the argument that the capacity of the ride limits the land, but you could have more than one way to get there. We tried to make the JC take you to Indy at DL, dropping you off at the distant Temple (African Veldt) with a footpath back.

After the announcement of Pandora, I was (unfortunate enough) to be traveling through the Atlanta airport where they have 5 terminals and are building a 6th. Connecting the terminals is an underground train as well as a moving sidewalk and a standard sidewalk for those who aren't in a hurry that want to walk. It goes in and out as a loop on either side of the tunnels. I thought that an arrangement like that would work very well for traveling back and forth to Pandora. Of course it would need to be themed to space travel instead of utilitarian concrete but an arrangement like that would really be cool AND efficient so that people aren't waiting for an hour just to gain access to the area. It would also completely carry guests from Earth to Pandora; hopefully without the poisonous atmosphere

 

[trs518]

I saw this write up on the speaking engagement that Eddie did a little while ago.

http://land.allears.net/blogs/lauragilbreath/2011/10/disneyanamania_something_for_e_1.html

 

[Eddie Sotto]

I saw this write up on the speaking engagement that Eddie did a little while ago.

http://land.allears.net/blogs/lauragilbreath/2011/10/disneyanamania_something_for_e_1.html

I had not seen that, thanks for posting. I believe Jeanine, a poster on this thread was there (we met) and wrote this article. Funny pic of me as a 12 year old with my DL model in tow. Thanks Jeanine, if that's you!

 

[Eddie Sotto]

After the announcement of Pandora, I was (unfortunate enough) to be traveling through the Atlanta airport where they have 5 terminals and are building a 6th. Connecting the terminals is an underground train as well as a moving sidewalk and a standard sidewalk for those who aren't in a hurry that want to walk. It goes in and out as a loop on either side of the tunnels. I thought that an arrangement like that would work very well for traveling back and forth to Pandora. Of course it would need to be themed to space travel instead of utilitarian concrete but an arrangement like that would really be cool AND efficient so that people aren't waiting for an hour just to gain access to the area. It would also completely carry guests from Earth to Pandora; hopefully without the poisonous atmosphere

I know this is a fanboi sheer geekout, but back in the days of Sony Walkman I used to listen to the Peoplemover music (Magic Highways) on that Atlanta Airport train. I loved riding on that thing.

 

[Eddie Sotto]

Killing Lincoln

BTW- I'm enjoying the Audio version of "Killing Lincoln", all about the context and untold details of the Lincoln assassination. Did you know JW Booth and Lincoln's Son shared the same girlfriend?

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/bill...ry-thriller-killing-lincoln/story?id=14609968

 

[RunnerEd]

I know this is a fanboi sheer geekout, but back in the days of Sony Walkman I used to listen to the Peoplemover music (Magic Highways) on that Atlanta Airport train. I loved riding on that thing.

In far too many days before 9/11 and the ensuing security upgrades, my Boy Scout troop went on a trip to Atlanta and one of the stops was to the Atlanta Airport to ride the underground train. It was so cool that it was the thing that we talked most about!

 

[MouseketeerCole]

On the subject of the Jungle Cruise/Indiana Jones transition you planned, Eddie, I've always felt a little bit puzzled by how it would have worked. Indy and Jungle match up aesthetically because of the 1930s theming that was brought in, but tonally they're quite different (no mother-in-law elephant jokes in Indiana Jones) - how would you have reconciled that?

And also, wouldn't it have essentially been a sacrifice of one of Disneyland's most successful rides? I can understand the desire to build up a big, multi-stage experience, but it sounds as if it would mean Jungle Cruise would no longer have been able to be experienced on its own - it would just become a (huge) preshow for Indy.

What was the ultimate reason the plan wasn't used?

On another note, I remember talk on here about the new Heathrow Airport ULTra pod system. Well, a few friends and I were staying in a hotel within walking distance of Heathrow last week and after getting back at around 11pm decided we walk over and take a ride. They are FANTASTIC. They use amazing boarding stations where you pick your destination on a computer screen, a door opens to your stationary pod, then when you're seated and press go, the pod pulls out into the track and off it shoots. And (after choosing French for the return journey) it even has cool details like the language you pick at the computer console is the language it speaks to you once in the pod and throughout the journey. Oh, and a dynamic graphic showing how far along your journey you are, and how far there is to go. It just feels cool - and I can just imagine picking 'Epcot Area Resorts > Boardwalk' at the end of an evening at Walt Disney World.