Eddie Sotto's take on the current state of the parks (Part II)

Figments Friend

Well-Known Member
Thought i would re-share this nice photo...of Tony holding that college project we were talking about earlier.
It would have been neat if his 'Mary Poppins - Jolly Holiday' attraction had been built at some point.
Perhaps it will resurface in the future...?

 

Eddie Sotto

Premium Member
Thought i would re-share this nice photo...of Tony holding that college project we were talking about earlier.
It would have been neat if his 'Mary Poppins - Jolly Holiday' attraction had been built at some point.
Perhaps it will resurface in the future...?


There will likely be a ride system that will allow it to be a reality. It may have been ahead of it's time.
 

Eddie Sotto

Premium Member
Visited EPCOT for few hours and rode Test Track. Nice upgrade, Very few guests used the "design and test your car" interactive idea, so to that extent the story was a bit meaningless. The single rider line was so short that it bypassed the design stations. In "Innoventions", I liked the IBM THINK exhibit (very much in the spirit of 64 NYWF/Eames and refreshingly modern) and the "Sum of all Thrills" Design a Coaster KUKA Arm ride was busy too.

It was interesting to see lots of families willing to ride Test Track separated in the single rider line. Made me wonder if we are losing the "shared" experience.

The only EPCOT let down was that there was a big Starbucks logo looming over a construction fence in Communicore. I guess the future is also about Global homogenization. Loved walking EPCOT anyway. Always great.
 
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Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
Visited EPCOT for few hours and rode Test Track. Nice upgrade, Very few guests used the design and test your car interactive idea, so to that extent the story was a bit meaningless. The single rider line was so short that it bypassed the design stations.
In my opinion with, the interactive idea, the story was meaningless. It is one of the only attractions that to me was an obvious smoke and mirrors presentation. (not counting Haunted Mansion, of course and that was part of it's way of having a story) I am still convinced and no one has explained how TT isn't. The "design" factor is total nothing in reality. Just a thing to do and with the help of suspension of disbelief becomes part of the ride. Nothing more.
 

Omnispace

Well-Known Member
Visited EPCOT for few hours and rode Test Track. Nice upgrade, Very few guests used the design and test your car interactive idea, so to that extent the story was a bit meaningless. The single rider line was so short that it bypassed the design stations. In "Innoventions", I liked the IBM THINK exhibit and the "Sum of all Thrills" Design a Coaster KUKA Arm ride was busy too.

The only let down was that there was a big Starbucks logo looming over a construction fence in Communicore. I guess the future is also about Global homogenization. Loved walking EPCOT anyway. Always great.

Thanks! Always interesting to read your impressions. Corporate partnerships used to be the sign of Disney's commitment to quality. Now they are viewed as global homogenization. I can't help but feel the same way though.
 

Sped2424

Well-Known Member
Thought i would re-share this nice photo...of Tony holding that college project we were talking about earlier.
It would have been neat if his 'Mary Poppins - Jolly Holiday' attraction had been built at some point.
Perhaps it will resurface in the future...?

I would love an attraction that starts off like a carousal and you hear Bert say "Very nice indeed if you don't wanna go anywhere" then you hear Mary say "who says we are not" gus appears in the middle of the carousal much like the film pulls a lever and your horses begin to leave the carousel.
 

ford91exploder

Resident Curmudgeon
Thanks! Always interesting to read your impressions. Corporate partnerships used to be the sign of Disney's commitment to quality. Now they are viewed as global homogenization. I can't help but feel the same way though.

True but in the past there might be a 'coffee pavillion' sponsored by Starbucks where all phases of coffee production were detailed perhaps with operating displays of the machinery used and at the end perhaps a coffee bar so you could indulge in your favorite caffeinated beverage.

Now its just a Starbucks plunked down in the middle of the park with nothing to make it special
 

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
True but in the past there might be a 'coffee pavillion' sponsored by Starbucks where all phases of coffee production were detailed perhaps with operating displays of the machinery used and at the end perhaps a coffee bar so you could indulge in your favorite caffeinated beverage.

Now its just a Starbucks plunked down in the middle of the park with nothing to make it special
Yea, I suppose, but, then there is that pesky little thing called feeding the hungry that has nothing at all to do with themes. If it did, however, what better theme could it have then a place to buy coffee and food products. Seems like the perfect theme for the purpose. BTW, I don't drink coffee and I don't think I can come up with any reason why I will be using the handy, dandy Starbucks location, so I am not defending it, just trying, in my cute way to point out the silliness of the whole Starbucks discussion. WDW will still be WDW with our without an active Starbucks, but, if people get pleasure out of it...just turn your head the other way as you pass by. Out of sight, out of mind.
 

ford91exploder

Resident Curmudgeon
Yea, I suppose, but, then there is that pesky little thing called feeding the hungry that has nothing at all to do with themes. If it did, however, what better theme could it have then a place to buy coffee and food products. Seems like the perfect theme for the purpose. BTW, I don't drink coffee and I don't think I can come up with any reason why I will be using the handy, dandy Starbucks location, so I am not defending it, just trying, in my cute way to point out the silliness of the whole Starbucks discussion. WDW will still be WDW with our without an active Starbucks, but, if people get pleasure out of it...just turn your head the other way as you pass by. Out of sight, out of mind.


Because people go to Disney because it provides unique experiences, Take those away what reason do I have to go there, I happen to LIKE Starbucks coffee very much and it's far better than the Nescafe Disney had before. That being said I can go to 7000 starbucks stores in the US and get a Venti Drip, But at EPCOT Starbucks could have been so much more,

Teaching people about the origins (Ethiopia and the dancing goats) and historical and modern production of coffee and why 'Fair Trade' coffee is important. That would be worth a trip to see for coffee enthusiasts. Instead we get just another Starbucks, opportunity lost by the unimaginative beancounters at TDO
 

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
Because people go to Disney because it provides unique experiences, Take those away what reason do I have to go there, I happen to LIKE Starbucks coffee very much and it's far better than the Nescafe Disney had before. That being said I can go to 7000 starbucks stores in the US and get a Venti Drip, But at EPCOT Starbucks could have been so much more,

Teaching people about the origins (Ethiopia and the dancing goats) and historical and modern production of coffee and why 'Fair Trade' coffee is important. That would be worth a trip to see for coffee enthusiasts. Instead we get just another Starbucks, opportunity lost by the unimaginative beancounters at TDO
Yup, I can see them lining up for that, can't you? I don't drink coffee, like I said, so I have no horse in this race, but, seriously there is way to much faux anxiety about this. It's coffee, be it Starbucks, Nescafe, Chock full of Nuts (that would have been a good brand for a Disney location). Not everything needs to be themed. How would you feel about restroom themed like a Peruvian Rainforest. Not necessary? Correct! That is a place for a human function as is drinking and eating. The opposite end of the restroom story.:confused:
 

Omnispace

Well-Known Member
Perhaps the perception is more that Starbucks has been reducing variety in our everyday lives thus having something so commonplace in a theme park makes it a bit less special. Still, if they have decided to build a futuristic themed location at Epcot I'll give them a pass.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
My biggest issue with Starbucks is that the offerings of each location are not adjusted to fit the theme of the location. It's all the same Starbucks I can get anywhere.

Slightly off topic, a local Target recently added a Starbucks. If you were to sit and enjoy your beverage you would be treated to a spectacular view of the backside of the Starbucks on the other side of the parking lot.
 

ford91exploder

Resident Curmudgeon
My biggest issue with Starbucks is that the offerings of each location are not adjusted to fit the theme of the location. It's all the same Starbucks I can get anywhere.

Slightly off topic, a local Target recently added a Starbucks. If you were to sit and enjoy your beverage you would be treated to a spectacular view of the backside of the Starbucks on the other side of the parking lot.



There is a intersection in Toronto which has a Starbucks on EACH CORNER!!!!!!
 

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
My biggest issue with Starbucks is that the offerings of each location are not adjusted to fit the theme of the location. It's all the same Starbucks I can get anywhere.
You know, I've heard read that a number of times. I'm not trying to be a smart (you choose) but I do not understand that statement. There are baked goods in the Main Street Bakery plus other things, I don't know yet what is in the Epcot one. Even if I did I do not have a clue what would constitute the theme of the location. Just for the sake of clarity...what would you consider appropriate? Even the argument about stuff that I can't get outside the parks I still don't understand. I can get hot dogs, cheeseburgers, french fries, salads, even Mickey bars (without the ears). Edy's Ice Cream...check out the Ice Cream display at Walmart, pickles, fruit, Coke's, popcorn, candy. I don't understand how one thing is different from the other. Might we not be expecting just a bit more then is necessary or even possible? Brand names are brand names and yes Starbucks is a company, Nestles is a company, Coca Cola is a company, Edy's is a company. Help me understand what the problem is.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
You know, I've heard read that a number of times. I'm not trying to be a smart (you choose) but I do not understand that statement. There are baked goods in the Main Street Bakery plus other things, I don't know yet what is in the Epcot one. Even if I did I do not have a clue what would constitute the theme of the location. Just for the sake of clarity...what would you consider appropriate? Even the argument about stuff that I can't get outside the parks I still don't understand. I can get hot dogs, cheeseburgers, french fries, salads, even Mickey bars (without the ears). Edy's Ice Cream...check out the Ice Cream display at Walmart, pickles, fruit, Coke's, popcorn, candy. I don't understand how one thing is different from the other. Might we not be expecting just a bit more then is necessary or even possible? Brand names are brand names and yes Starbucks is a company, Nestles is a company, Coca Cola is a company, Edy's is a company. Help me understand what the problem is.
Think of an early 20th century coffee shop. Do you picture people sipping Frappachinos and skinny lattes? Do these items pop up in an image of 1920s-1940s Los Angeles and Hollywood? Universal killed the idea that themed food is too much to ask for with the Three Broomsticks. No hot dogs and burgers. No Coca-Cola products.
 

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
Think of an early 20th century coffee shop. Do you picture people sipping Frappachinos and skinny lattes? Do these items pop up in an image of 1920s-1940s Los Angeles and Hollywood? Universal killed the idea that themed food is too much to ask for with the Three Broomsticks. No hot dogs and burgers. No Coca-Cola products.
I guess I see what you are saying, however, there is a limit to just how realistic my themeing needs to get. I enjoy seeing buildings that look a little like I would have found in 1920 but I sure damn don't want to live in 1920. I like my current world to much and I am not in the least stimulated by no air conditioning, strips of flypapers hanging down, sitting next to EVERYBODY, that doesn't have deodorant and takes a bath once every two weeks whether they need it or not. I like nostalgia as much as anyone, but I don't want to actually be in it, just a simulated experience with creature comforts. Instead of restrooms should they have outhouses? Where do we stop with authenticity?
 
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lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
I guess I see what you are saying, however, there is a limit to just how realistic my themeing needs to get. I enjoy seeing buildings that look a little like I would have found in 1920 but I sure damn don't want to live in 1920. I like my current world to much and I am not in the least stimulated by no air conditioning, strips of flypapers hanging down, sitting next to EVERYBODY, that doesn't have deodorant and takes a bath once every two weeks whether they need it or not. I like nostalgia as much as anyone, but I don't want to actually be in it, just a simulated experience with creature comforts. Instead of restrooms should they have outhouses. Where do we stop with authenticity?
Romance is not historical recreation. It's an image, an idealization. There is no issue of guest convenience, health or safety in not offering trendy drinks in an unrelated experience.
 

ford91exploder

Resident Curmudgeon
Romance is not historical recreation. It's an image, an idealization. There is no issue of guest convenience, health or safety in not offering trendy drinks in an unrelated experience.


Exactly!, Starbucks COULD have stretched and had a few of the coffee drinks which were popular at that time and at EPCOT they could have explored coffee and perhaps had drinks which were unique to EPCOT, Maybe even a tie in with the Land - Dragonfruit tea cooler perhaps since Disney grows Dragonfruit in the greenhouse.

Disney has ALWAYS has had tie ins with food companies, Sunkist in DL which HAD Orange products which were only found at DL, Carnation Milk Bar they were ALL national brands but they made their Disney presence unique and special.

Whats annoying about the Starbucks is that it's a generic starbucks just like it's 7000 cousins
 

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