Eddie Sotto's take on the current state of the parks (Part II)

Eddie Sotto

Eddie Sotto

Premium Member
BlueSkyDriveBy said:
Seems only fitting, for the kind of designer you've turned out to be.

Having a lack of formal educational training forced you to be more resourceful in finding what you needed. It required you to think outside the box to become who you are. These are the lifetime experiences which define us as problem solvers, deliberately putting ourselves in those MacGyver moments and seeing what sticks and what doesn't.

I doubt you would have become such an imaginative and unorthodox Imagineer had there been a degree path specifically tailored for theme park design.
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True, in that prescribed courses can turn out formulaic students. I could just draw good enough to visualize an idea, and fortunately could also "sell" the vision as a pitchman. Not everyone has both skills, but being a Washer Salesman at Sears was valuable experience! Ya gotta love the "Lady Kenmore" with dual action agitator.

As a rule, I like doing things differently. My wife says that I don't listen as much as I "interpret". Meaning that things come out of my head differently than they go in! So its hard for me to just copy something verbatim. That's why Main Street was such a drag and they made a huge mistake putting a guy like me on it. They wanted a carbon copy and I could not do that. Not in me. Tony knew that, but fueled me evolving it as much as possible. The trick was making it look like you were copying while you were actually changing the whole thing!

I think persistence has something to do with it too. When everyone says "No" you have to get up and knock on a different door. Disney said "go away" to me more than once, so you bide your time someplace else gaining experience. Knott's was receptive but was a means to an end, then Goddard gave me a shot at Jules Verne. Then they see that work and call you because it looks like what they want, and in this case it was Tony! He got it. Thanks to his faith in my potential, I'm here today.
 
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Figments Friend

Figments Friend

Well-Known Member
Eddie Sotto said:
I heard that in the press version Darth is cropped out..
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That is true....
I have seen those versions, but i have to admit i find the original quite fitting for the personalities shown.

You could not have chosen two characters to better represent those present then Dreamfinder and Lord Vader!
Talk about contrast and compare....

:)
 
Figments Friend

Figments Friend

Well-Known Member
Eddie Sotto said:
Here's a nice recap on Tony for those of you who don't know how he got to where he is. I like the fact that Maxine Merlino, the Dean of Arts saw his talent, leveraged his passions and let him pursue his dream rather than force him to do something that was not a part of his imagined career path. She saw rides as theater. Awesome. He could have been forced to make a model of an Opera or something. I'm sure he would have done a masterpiece, but a soulless one. When passion happens,things ignite. She knew that. If you look at how he developed rides to present as a means of getting a job, that shift in focus was a critical part of his career trajectory.

http://herocomplex.latimes.com/unca...ter-on-his-decades-shaping-disneyland-design/

My own career story was atypical too, as there was no place to get a formal education of any kind in the design of theme parks in 1977.
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Totally agree. When passion happens, things ignite indeed. Tony certainly personifies that statement.

Great article...and the photo of Tony 'being twelve' in the queue of Indy is priceless.
:)
 
Figments Friend

Figments Friend

Well-Known Member
BlueSkyDriveBy said:
Seems only fitting, for the kind of designer you've turned out to be.

Having a lack of formal educational training forced you to be more resourceful in finding what you needed. It required you to think outside the box to become who you are. These are the lifetime experiences which define us as problem solvers, deliberately putting ourselves in those MacGyver moments and seeing what sticks and what doesn't.

I doubt you would have become such an imaginative and unorthodox Imagineer had there been a degree path specifically tailored for theme park design.
Click to expand...
Well said...and i agree with your sentiment.
I can relate to this myself, and it is true that without 'formal' training you tend to be a lot more imaginative and resourceful in you approach to a project or challange. You have unique eyes that have not already been 'pre-trained' to focus on the common denominator. This is when the really interesting things tend to happen.

Reminds me of my experience with art school in the 70s and early 80s.
I was forced to go and hated every minute of it.
Certain people in my life assumed that since i was a 'creative' and could draw decently that i needed to 'go to art school'. So when i was a pre-teen i was sent off...and it was a strange experience.

What i hated about art school was that i found they were training people to look at everything the SAME WAY. If you stepped out of the box, or drew something differently in perspective to what the particular task was before you, you were told it was 'wrong' and verbally discouraged.
It was a terrible atmosphere for someone who already had some un-orthodox ways of looking at things...let alone expressing it on paper!

Basically they trained everyone exactly the same way...taught them to look at everything the same way...and draw it the same way.
Maybe it is just me, but that is NOT what art/design is supposed to be about !
You should encourage different views of the same object/topic. Instead, 'copycat' artists and folks who just followed suit were praised.
Those who presented creative alternative views were shunned.

Needless to say i skipped out as soon as i could. Literally. First time i skipped classes...and Mom was bit miffed about that.
Second time they sent me off was when i was in High School...when my art teacher begged me to go. He gave me a scholarship to a prestigious art college in Boston and he was so sincere that i caved in and excepted.
I figured it was free...and maybe my experience at this well known art school would be a lot different then my previous pre-teen experiences.

Nope.
It was EXACTLY the same !!
Talk about frustrating...

I can understand wanting to keep everyone on the same page when covering the basics of art...tools, techniques, etc....but why they always seemed to encourage bland single-view options instead of creative exploration i will i guess never figure out.

Hopefully today's schooling is MUCH better...and actually lets people who have a creative gift get 'creative' !
 
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Omnispace

Omnispace

Well-Known Member
Figments Friend said:
Well said...and i agree with your sentiment.
I can relate to this myself, and it is true that without 'formal' training you tend to be a lot more imaginative and resourceful in you approach to a project or challange. You have unique eyes that have not already been 'pre-trained' to focus on the common denominator. This is when the really interesting things tend to happen.

Reminds me of my experience with art school in the 70s and early 80s.
I was forced to go and hated every minute of it.
Certain people in my life assumed that since i was a 'creative' and could draw decently that i needed to 'go to art school'. So when i was a pre-teen i was sent off...and it was a strange experience.

What i hated about art school was that i found they were training people to look at everything the SAME WAY. If you stepped out of the box, or drew something differently in perspective to what the particular task was before you, you were told it was 'wrong' and verbally discouraged.
It was a terrible atmosphere for someone who already had some un-orthodox ways of looking at things...let alone expressing it on paper!

Basically they trained everyone exactly the same way...taught them to look at everything the same way...and draw it the same way.
Maybe it is just me, but that is NOT what art/design is supposed to be about !
You should encourage different views of the same object/topic. Instead, 'copycat' artists and folks who just followed suit were praised.
Those who presented creative alternative views were shunned.

Needless to say i skipped out as soon as i could. Literally. First time i skipped classes...and Mom was bit miffed about that.
Second time they sent me off was when i was in High School...when my art teacher begged me to go. He gave me a scholarship to a prestigious art college in Boston and he was so sincere that i caved in and excepted.
I figured it was free...and maybe my experience at this well known art school would be a lot different then my previous pre-teen experiences.

Nope.
It was EXACTLY the same !!
Talk about frustrating...

I can understand wanting to keep everyone on the same page when covering the basics of art...tools, techniques, etc....but why they always seemed to encourage bland single-view options instead of creative exploration i will i guess neveure out.

Hopefully today's schooling is MUCH better...and actually lets people who have a creative gift get 'creative' !
Click to expand...

I can completely understand your frustration. I didn't go to art school but it was very similar -- just as one reaches the moment in their life where they feel the most creative you are asked to conform. I can understand the importance of learning basic skills and self-discipline but there needs to be more flexibility as with Tony's instructor who let him design a ride instead of a stage production.
 
Eddie Sotto

Eddie Sotto

Premium Member
Figments Friend said:
It may well have been.

I was told Tony himself personally requested those three characters to appear onstage with him during the presentation of his award.
I was amused and delighted when i learned of this recently.

Tony, you GO boy...!
:happy:
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I spoke with Tony also and he did know about Figment because he had to tell them where it was, but I don't think he knew about Darth Vader or requested it.
 
Figments Friend

Figments Friend

Well-Known Member
I was thrilled to see Dreamfinder and his little buddy show up for Tony's presentation. That was great...and so fitting.
It is somewhat moving in a way to see these characters still remembered and embraced by the masses when the original JII attraction was decimated all those years ago.
It is equally emotional knowing that one of Tony's greatest attractions is no longer around for us to enjoy.
Thankfully we have the memories, and of course grainy videotaped relics to revisit now and then.

Speaking of videotaped relics - Absolutely loved the old 'Dreamfinder's School of Drama' video shown featuring a young Tony and the creative team that worked on the Imagination pavilion. That was hilarious.

At first i was wondering why Darth Vader was there for the presentation, but then realized it was likely connected to Star Tours and Tony's involvement with that attraction.
It was not until after the photos started to circulate that it became a visual amusement to see all of them together onstage, and the representing characters.

If Lord Vader was indeed a surprise...and 'crashed' the party....then more power to him. The photo(s) are priceless..!
:)
 
Figments Friend

Figments Friend

Well-Known Member
Omnispace said:
I can completely understand your frustration. I didn't go to art school but it was very similar -- just as one reaches the moment in their life where they feel the most creative you are asked to conform. I can understand the importance of learning basic skills and self-discipline but there needs to be more flexibility as with Tony's instructor who let him design a ride instead of a stage production.
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Completely agree...and thanks for relating.

Tony was lucky...and had a instructor who took the time to see further potential in him and cater to what was obviously his interest and passion.
That is a rare find.
When you come across a teacher like this, you should feel blessed...exspecially these days.
It seems like many are just shuttled though and given the basics without any real depth to the experience for the student.

Those that take the time to dwell deeper into the personal goals and aspirations of a particular student, or a class of students as a whole, is unique and important. I realize not everyone can receive 'special attention'...but when you have a exceptional person who is obviously showing some talent, this should be encouraged and not diffused in any way.
 
ChrisFL

ChrisFL

Premium Member
Omnispace said:
Thanks!!! I remember the rows of "fuzzy spheres". I seem to remember them moving or jiggling a bit but that might just be my faulty memory. Also, does anyone know about the eye looking down at you through the microscope -- did it move at all?? ..or was that just an illusion as one passed under it?? I'll admit that the narration on ATIS was almost too dramatic to be taken seriously but it was such a noisy ride that a lot of time one couldn't hear it clearly anyway. I mostly remember the attraction being a cacophony of sounds and a very dramatic ride path through these amazing sets and effects and the narration adding a sense of dramatic tension. If some of that crazy experience could be recreated today I'd ride it in a minute.

inside-crystal02.jpg
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There is the virtual version that someone made:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KA3uFkF1A9o
 
Omnispace

Omnispace

Well-Known Member
ChrisFL said:
There is the virtual version that someone made:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KA3uFkF1A9o
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I love this virtual version of ATIS. I immediately ordered one of the DVD's in support when it came out. It does an excellent job capturing the feel of the ride. The only fault I can find is that the narration actually started when one first saw the falling snowflakes, with the word Mag-ni-fi-ca-tion completing that scene. In this version he starts the narration in the microscope tunnel.

I'm honored that my suggestion to include fly-throughs of the ride was included on the disc. They give a good idea how the attraction was put together, showing how the AtomMobiles moved through the scenes. I'm not sure if the disc is still for sale but it's a nice package to get.
 
Omnispace

Omnispace

Well-Known Member
Eddie Sotto said:
I spoke with Tony also and he did know about Figment because he had to tell them where it was, but I don't think he knew about Darth Vader or requested it.
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It would be funny if Bob Iger had suggested Darth Vader. Perhaps Indiana Jones or Brehr Bear would have been good alternative choices for Tony's achievements but when one has just bought the rights to Star Wars one has to keep that marketing synergy going.
 
Eddie Sotto

Eddie Sotto

Premium Member
Omnispace said:
It would be funny if Bob Iger had suggested Darth Vader. Perhaps Indiana Jones or Brehr Bear would have been good alternative choices for Tony's achievements but when one has just bought the rights to Star Wars one has to keep that marketing synergy going.
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I cannot imagine Bob being ok with that photo op...Princess Leia might have been a better choice.
 
Californian Elitist

Californian Elitist

Well-Known Member
I was browsing on Curbed LA and found an article in regards to an exhibit at the A+D (architecture and design) Museum. The exhibit is called "Never Built: Los Angeles", and it displays concepts and ideas for Los Angeles that never came to be. One of the ideas included a "hanging" monorail, shaped like a bullet, that was supposed to transport Angelenos at high speeds in 1909. @Eddie Sotto this reminded me of the proposed design of Disneyland's monorail, of which you mentioned not too long ago. I think this concept may have been a little too ahead of its time in 1909.

I'd really like to check this exhibit out. I hear Disneyland in Burbank is part of the exhibit, as well as a man-made island proposed to go on the coast of Santa Monica.

This week, Tesla founder/real-life Tony Stark proposed plans for the Hyperloop: a magical transportation system that Musk says could shuttle people between Los Angeles and San Francisco in just 35 minutes in multi-passenger pods shot through an elevated tube. Genius, maybe! But someone totally had that idea like a century ago, sort of. In 1909, inventor Fletcher E. Felts got a patent for the Elevated Suspended-Track Automotor-Railway, a "torpedo-shaped monorail ... moving along an elevated track supported by steel towers that looked like Erector Set centurions guarding the empty space below." Felts wanted to run a line between Pasadena and Los Angeles: "The main route would have begun in Eagle Rock and proceeded through canyons in both Mount Washington and Elysian Park, terminating downtown."

He said the monorail could run at speeds up to 100 mph and that total travel time between LA and Pas would be just eight minutes. But that was just the beginning--he wanted a line running from LA up to San Francisco, with speeds up to 150 mph: "[H]e planned a running time of three hours, 39 minutes, including stops in Santa Barbara, San Luis Obispo, Paso Robles, and San Jose." While Taft-era Twitter surely could not shut the hell up about the idea, it somehow failed to take off.
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2013.08_feltsmonorail-thumb.jpg


http://la.curbed.com/archives/2013/...erfast_elevated_transit_between_la_and_sf.php
 
Eddie Sotto

Eddie Sotto

Premium Member
Marty has never been one to fuel controversy, so it depends on your expectations. There are some passages that have him speaking out about park operator Dick Nunis. From what I hear, it's most interesting as a compliment to "Disney War" as Marty had a seat at the table during those years. So his take, as kind it may be, is from a different viewpoint and adds additional perspective.

Here's a link to the "Never Built LA" site. Sounds interesting.
http://aplusd.org/exhibitions-current#prettyPhoto
 
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