Figments Friend
Well-Known Member
While we all revere Tony Baxter, the head hanchos at WDI/Disney are on a first name basis with him and many others. The folks above Tony in hierarchy were hired for a specific reason, and it wasn't specifically to hold the great imagineers in homage, but they probably feel they have to make a name for themselves and that they hold their own style, and sensibilities above that of the old crowd.
Maybe some of the younger WDI bosses rode Splash and Big Thunder as college students/kids and just look at them as part of the landscape, versus Tony Baxter's style. The WDI memo sort of shortchanges Tony, IMHO, as just a hired hand who worked on a lot of projects, versus paying homage to his vision.
All organizations have big egos, and if an imagineer/group of imagineers does a successful project without Tony Baxter, then I could see them concluding that their way is just as right as his and ignoring him. Obviously, I think it is best to utilize all of the talent they have, especially talent like Tony's.
Certainly, WDI bosses have big egos, and they aren't going to tell new recruits, "Tony Baxter is a jewel, I want you to learn from him, even though I've got decades of experience, Tony really understands what Walt liked, which is also what the general public still likes."
There is more than one way to skin a cat, given that Carsland got it right. But there is a lack of leadership/supervisory oversight as WDI is, *in my very humble opinion*, is building stuff that will need to be gutted and re-imagined 5-10 years from now, versus the "keeper" attractions that Tony referenced which are great on the 20th ride through, such as Pirates, HM and Peter Pan. For example:
1. DCA's Mermaid. I'm so bored when I went on what must have been my 10th time on this attraction, it felt like painful homework: that I have to take our niece on Mermaid when we go to DCA because she must like it even though she really doesn't and has never said it was her favorite ride at DLR. Two days ago asked my 5 year old niece (who loves Ariel/Melody/Ursula) if she liked the ride . . . finally got out of her that Ursula is "weird" and not right somehow. Told my brother about Tony Baxter's plan for Mermaid, and he lit up when I told him about the gigantic Ursula in the ocean scene and he said, "That's what I was waiting for, something like that." I seriously doubt Mermaid will be in DCA in 20 years in the condition it is in. It needs to be retooled into a Tony Baxter experience, versus using screens to just cover the main plot points in the film.
They need to do something "astonishing" like have the "Under the Sea" scene, but have it so it is more detailed, and with ride vehicles which zip around the scene, may suspended ride vehicles that can move in the vertical axis randomly while they move horizontally . . . anything so the ride isn't such a chore.
2. Monsters Inc. They re-used the Superstar Limo ride system, and the ride goes so slow the magic is lost . . . plus it ain't that magical given Monstropolis is pretty much like New York. It is easy to see how the swinging door scene is made to look bigger with mirrors . . . not very magical. My favorite part of the ride is the queue with the "Blort" and other stuff in the fake vending machine. A walk-on I rarely ride twice even if I don't have to wait.
3. Toy Story Midway Mania. Kinda fun playing a video game, but I wish we had more Toy Story dark scenes so I could feel I'm in their world. Have been on this ride maybe eight times, not a mus-do, and I doubt I'll really super want to do it after the 20th time, and if I did it would be for the little bit of dark ride and Andy's room at the exit.
I'm sure I'll be happy riding Mater's and RSR on the 50th ride through and beyond as there is so much story with RSR. You've got the scenic drive section past the waterfall and when you narrowly miss the truck it scares you because you feel like you took your eyes off the road, brilliant. Then you've got warm hearted Mater, Radiator Springs with the cars you're imaging, and the thrill part, which sort of makes this ride two good rides combined into one great ride. Mater's is a keeper because everybody loves Mater and the ride provides some surprisingly thrills, plus I really feel I'm in the world of Cars and experiencing something in Mater's junkyard versus just Mater's likeness glued on a ride. If they added an animatronic Mater DJ that would be great, though it might distract people exiting the ride vehicles.
BVS, nice eye candy, but the Pig Cafe has horrible acoustics and I hate to spend time there, and there ain't anything to ride except for the Red Car Trolley which is used for shows. I could see Tony Baxter emphasizing that this "land" (themed corridor, IMHO, not a bonafide land), needs a couple attractions, preferably one being an E-Ticket such as a dark ride into the early days of animation starring Mickey/Oswald. Guests want to dream about/romanticize the early days of animation, why not let them do it with a great ride?
I don't know what personality conflicts may have occurred between Tony and other longtime imagineers . . . but Tony was basically right, yes? It just goes to figure that a guy who has a proven track record for success, and who analyzes what the Disney difference is, would much more than not be "right" concerning the overall design of attractions.
Great post, Pixiedustmaker.
I agree with many of your points.
I appreciate you taking the time to respond.
The LM ride really threw me at DCA when i rode last Summer, as i was under the impression Tony was involved in this. I guess that comes from the nice little piece he did on the Mermaid Dvd release a few years ago...that great Bonus Feature video segment where he takes us on a ride-through of a ride 'never made'. I remember how that segment on the Dvd really raised some eyebrows and caused a sensation in the fan community when it was originally released. People really wanted that ride to be built that was being shown in the video! I was pretty excited about what i saw too...and it is a darn shame the final realized version of the Mermaid attraction is no where near as good or enveloping.
So i am wondering, what happened to that original vision for the ride besides obvious 'value engineering'?
Was Tony ever really involved in this project, or did he drop out/ lose interest..? Was he ever really heading this project to begin with? He seemed pretty into it in the video...and excited about the original concept he was presenting.
I have a hard time believing the finished versions of Mermaid at DCA and WDW came from his hand, but then again , being robbed of your original budget always hurts any project, no matter who is the lead.