Eddie Sotto's take on the current state of the parks (Part II)

[RSoxNo1]

Check out the cup below, it has Disney symbolism on it for sure, but also a nice little silhouette of a Coke bottle. Obviously, there was a conscious decision made somewhere to more prominently feature the Coke brand. (I doubt the company did it out of some love for Coke . . . )

While I love the old cups . . . does Disney really want to be associated primarily with high-fructose beverages which are being blamed for childhood obesity and diabetes? Seriously, from a nutritional standpoint Disney gets away with a lot, they don't publish how much trans fat/carbs/cholesterol goes into their food.

The mayor of New York wanted to make large cups like the big one below illegal . . .

This is an excellent point. Considering how much of an effort they're making to change their menus so that fries are no longer the default options for meals (at Flame Tree BBQ last week the default options were cole slaw or grapes as a side). Disney doesn't want to risk the food lawsuits that are going to continue over the next 10 years, and a subtle switch from a smaller coke bottle to a larger coke bottle on their in park cups is substantial in the eyes of some of these lawsuits.

 

[Pixiedustmaker]

Let's hope they ran out and give them the benefit of the doubt. In this day and age of tweeting, blogging and instagramming, having your brand cleverly displayed on the food you serve is to create a reason for your guests to send a picture and advertise the value added of your visit. To make this part of the experience too generic (I'm even counting in those all Red cups with "DisneyParks" and silhouettes of Turkey Legs, etc.) is to miss a crucial opportunity.

Visited Carsland a couple weeks ago . . . wish that Disney sold their own brand of fruit smoothies, or 100% fruit juice made from real fruit with no sugar added. Couldn't help but think that it is a real "missed opportunity" that Disney is not addressing the obesity/diabetes epidemic (which is increasingly affecting children) . . . stopped at Filmore's . . . it was like six dollars for half a cup of fruit! Disney's first thought is to sell what tastes good . . .

If Disney is reading this, they should sell cheap 100% fruit juice blends everywhere in the park as an alternative to Coke. Seriously, . . . I didn't try what they had at Filmore's, and had Diet Coke, but that's still not a great beverages as it suppresses kidney function and might cause fat to be redistributed to abdominal areas. Why not provide more healthy options?

Its interesting to discuss the artistic ramifications . . . but what really counts is what is served in the cup, IMHO.

 

[Pixiedustmaker]

This is an excellent point. Considering how much of an effort they're making to change their menus so that fries are no longer the default options for meals (at Flame Tree BBQ last week the default options were cole slaw or grapes as a side). Disney doesn't want to risk the food lawsuits that are going to continue over the next 10 years, and a subtle switch from a smaller coke bottle to a larger coke bottle on their in park cups is substantial in the eyes of some of these lawsuits.

Red grapes are a very nutritious food item. Cole slaw is made from mayo, which is made by whipping up whole eggs with vegetable oil. Yeah, probably not a healthy food item.

Disney also doesn't publish pertinent nutritional information because their "franchises" such as the Blue Bayou don't have more than 12 locations. Though if you counted all of their restaurants in DLR, they might well have to publish nutritional info like McDonalds and other places have to.

Hungry Bear has sweet potato fries . . . I won't bore you with the physiology of different carbohydrates, but if they are deep fried . . . like most fries . . . they can hardly be considered a healthy food item. Its a "show food" items that superficially looks healthy, but really isn't that much better than the standard option.

Centuries ago, only the world's royalty could afford meats and fatty/high sugar foods, (interestingly some Egyptian mummies have shown evidence of diabetes), but nowadays I can't help but feel that only high income folks can afford to eat healthy.

Disney charges crazy high prices for fruits in the parks . . . well above what such items cost in cafeterias in the real world, and they aren't big enough (fruit cups too small).

 

[Pixiedustmaker]

Seriously, what Disney should do is sell large cups (with Mickey or whatever makes the place magical), which can be used to get relatively cheap re-fills of healthy re-hydration options in the park, like maybe a dilute strawberry juice. Store bought juices can have a lot of sugar added to them, I make my own juices, but I dilute them down . . more filling less calories.

Disney could lead on this issue, (heck they plaster McQueen all over kid's shampoo), but let's face reality . . . the goal is too serve wonderful tasting stuff which means using butter and salt, a long with sodas for a beverage. I can see people getting indignant over the change in cups, but the big issue of childhood obesity doesn't exist inside of the parks.

Oh . . . and Disney wouldn't have to plaster Coke over the cups!

 

[Pixiedustmaker]

Here's Fimore's Menu (From The Mouse for Less)

Large Bag of Chips (Cheetos, Doritos, potato chips and more) - $2.99
Fuji Apple Crisps - $2.99
Ocean Spray Craisins- $3.69

Whole Fruit - $1.79
Dasani Water - $2.79/$3.29
Smart Water - $3.49
Zico Premium Coconut Water - $3.59
Simply Orange or Lemonade - $4.29
Honest Tea - $3.59
Vitamin Water - $3.69
PowerAde - $3.19
Fuze - $3.59
Assorted Soft Drinks - $2.99

Mango Slices - $3.69
Berry Bowl - $3.49
Watermelon - $2.79
Sedless Grapes- $2.79
Pickle - $2.79

I didn't see the whole fruit for $1.79 . . . if so Filmore's will get some of my business soon. But seriously, all of the stuff was bottled! Most bottled stuff has added sugar (not sure about "Simply" Orange), but let's face it: you can't hydrate with a little bottle of orange juice, (replace some electrolytes, yes.) It also has a higher solute concentration than gatorade, and may make you thirsty for pure water.

I would propose designing a fruit drink made on property which can be poured into paper cups and which has a solute (osmolality) similar to gatorade and soda. This would make it cheaper, and not have too many calories, plus would hydrate very well. A cool large cup of a blueberry drink would really hit the spot in Carsland.

Anyway, I was promised a specially made fruit blend but didn't see it here. Maybe the Cozy Cone has this . . . but I think Disney could do a whole lot more.

 

[Cosmic Commando]

Seriously, what Disney should do is sell large cups (with Mickey or whatever makes the place magical), which can be used to get relatively cheap re-fills of healthy re-hydration options in the park, like maybe a dilute strawberry juice. Store bought juices can have a lot of sugar added to them, I make my own juices, but I dilute them down . . more filling less calories.

Disney could lead on this issue, (heck they plaster McQueen all over kid's shampoo), but let's face reality . . . the goal is too serve wonderful tasting stuff which means using butter and salt, a long with sodas for a beverage. I can see people getting indignant over the change in cups, but the big issue of childhood obesity doesn't exist inside of the parks.

Oh . . . and Disney wouldn't have to plaster Coke over the cups!

The only thing that irks me a little bit, and I have heard some similar statements across the interwebs... I've heard a saying somewhere, "Don't worry about what you eat between Thanksgiving and Christmas, worry about what you eat between Christmas and Thanksgiving." I really only eat out while on vacation, so I want to splurge when I'm there! Yeah, maybe I'll follow my 1,500 calorie turkey leg up with a trip to the all-you-care-to-eat buffet, but I'll only do that once every few years! Unfortunately, lawsuit culture + lack of personal responsibility = lots of bad stuff.

 

[ChrisFL]

I'm still sad there's no more "D" globe logo butter at WDW anymore....that was gone how many years ago?

 

[Eddie Sotto]

I'm not anti comfort foods as vacations can be about that, but having alternatives is good too. I think those red cups are ugly and they are obviously a nod to "Coke Red" as they are a part of their participation exposure. In the old days Coke had to be a bit more subtle and the park imagery more dominant. I was artistically involved in those negotiations back then.

 

[Pixiedustmaker]

The only thing that irks me a little bit, and I have heard some similar statements across the interwebs... I've heard a saying somewhere, "Don't worry about what you eat between Thanksgiving and Christmas, worry about what you eat between Christmas and Thanksgiving." I really only eat out while on vacation, so I want to splurge when I'm there! Yeah, maybe I'll follow my 1,500 calorie turkey leg up with a trip to the all-you-care-to-eat buffet, but I'll only do that once every few years! Unfortunately, lawsuit culture + lack of personal responsibility = lots of bad stuff.

You probably have a lot more self-control than most guests at the resort, and it is possible to eat at home and yet eat very unhealthy foods, yet eat healthy food at restaurants. Binge eating does stress the pancreas, to a certain extent, though if rarely done the effects are much less than someone who "pigs out" at the end of each week. Nothing the less binge eating increases your risk of developing diabetes and other diseases . . .

From my point of view, food in the parks is a big part of the vacation, they've got internet sites which replicate recipes served in Disney restaurants, and they use a lot of butter, and often times they aren't very healthy. Nonetheless, the Disney brand is powerful, eating super tasty Disney foods and drinking soda has become, in a way, associated with this brand. Why did Coke give away super cheap Coke products to Disney? Because they are taking advantage of the tens of millions who visit Disney parks, and they want to capture some of that "wholesomeness".

Disney guests come to associate Coke products with Disney, and Cokes hopes that they will buy more Coke because of it, in that way, Coke is using Disney for long term behavior modification, and that's kind of disturbing.

I think Disney ended their long time partnership with McDonalds because they don't want to get associated with the childhood obesity epidemic. And recently they made some major changes to protect kids, (http://www.hlntv.com/article/2012/06/05/disney-junk-food-advertising-ban).

Nonetheless, Coke is desperate to rehabilitate its image, and plastering their symbol all over Disney cups is sort of part of this war against beverages loaded with sugar and few nutritional benefits.

 

[Pixiedustmaker]

I'm not anti comfort foods as vacations can be about that, but having alternatives is good too. I think those red cups are ugly and they are obviously a nod to "Coke Red" as they are a part of their participation exposure. In the old days Coke had to be a bit more subtle and the park imagery more dominant. I was artistically involved in those negotiations back then.

Disney must have made a killing selling Coke products in the parks over the years, and obviously still do when you've got movie prices for soda and popcorn. I would guess that Coke decided to press for the Coke logo to be more prominently displayed. Coke makes stuff besides Coca-Cola, but this branch of their business is under attack due to the obesity/diabetes epidemic, no wonder that the classic Coke bottle is part of this advertising.

I think that one day, somebody is going to pressure Disney to drop the deal with Coke, like they did with McDonalds. Some schools have baned vending machines selling soda. I could see parents groups wanting first the image of Coke bottles banned, then the size of sodas decreased.

Only, Disney will fight this as the Coke deal is lucrative.

The old cups and napkins were great, and was a great way to make the parks a bit more special than going to a baseball game.

 

[flynnibus]

I would guess that Coke decided to press for the Coke logo to be more prominently displayed

Coke pressed Disney?? here's were your 'adventure' goes off the deep end.

Do you think it would take more then a casual flirt from Disney to Pepsi to jump all over and roll up with a sweatheart deal with a golden stack of cups designed anyway Disney pleased?

You're just making up theoreticals rather than taking reality into account.

The old cups (as you since posted) PROMINATELY featured Coke... more so then the previous generation of cups as well.

It's simple.. these are not Disney-specific cups anymore. That means Disney has decided 'whatever' the investment is to get Disney specific products in this space, at this time, is not necessary. It's a Disney choice - no one else's.

Please let's not take Eddie's thread and turn it into the cup thread.

 

[Eddie Sotto]

Well, it is and it isn't if you want to keep the sponsor money. Here's a story.

Back in the Mike Ovitz years, Coke was a sponsor, and since CAA, Mike's Hollywood Agency repped them (remember the polar bears?), they wanted a better value for their participation and he decided to help them activate their brand in the parks. Coke did not like to be tied to nostalgia like Coke Corner and want to look younger, so they tolerate those locations because they sell alot. To them, those Tiffany Lamps make them look out of touch and old fashioned. I know.

Among adding the "Cool Spots" to sell more Cola, roaming salespeople pre parades, and additional signage, the cup became a big deal (as I believe they pay for a part of them). My department was tapped by Ovitz to design mockups of the cups that showed the Coke imagery at various sizes in relation to Disneys. Mike kept wanting Coke imagery to be bigger. It felt like he was working for them! Coke's perspective was to sell more product everywhere and they even got mad when we made the Toontoon "talking" drinking fountains (as it made drinking water fun!) We ended up doing many versions and getting frustrated, but Ovitz was the new President and he was asking me to personally handle it, so what do you do? We kept making some alternates that tastefully blended the Coke logos into the parks. He had me driving them to his home on the weekends!

Finally, Michael Eisner realized what was going on with the cups, stepped into the room, and looked at all the versions, was frustrated that it had gone that far, and over rulled Ovitz by choosing one that had Coke imagery but still left Disney predominant. That was gonna be the end of it. To be fair, back in Walt's day there were Coke cups that had no park ID and were the diamond pattern variety, so it's been all over the place. I tried to find an image of the Ovitz cup mentioned, but came up empty. If they keep the red ones, I guess the glass is half full! End of cup story.

 

[flynnibus]

Thanks for sharing Eddie. It seemed like Ovitz was really hooked on the coke

I guess it depends on how far the two are in bed together. Disney can certainly turn around and entertain other vendors.. I guess it's a question of just how far Coke is pumping dollars into the company beyond the simple vendor supplier.

 

[peterpanic74]

Wow, great story. Thanks for sharing.

 

[Cosmic Commando]

I honestly didn't think Eddie would have a cup story!

 

[Pixiedustmaker]

Coke's perspective was to sell more product everywhere and they even got mad when we made the Toontoon "talking" drinking fountains (as it made drinking water fun!)

What an interesting story. Coke did have a program called "H2NO" and the goal was to get folks to drink Coke products over tap water (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H2NO). I heard that in decades past, Coke basically gave Disney Coke products for free to the parks, and all they got was free advertising. Maybe that has changed, especially since the plastic bottles are more expensive per ounce for Coke to produce than just supplying the syrup.

 

[Pixiedustmaker]

It seemed like Ovitz was really hooked on the coke

Ovitz founded CAA, which in a big deal signed Coca-Cola in the early 90's and then they came out with the polar bear commercials. It was a big deal at the time because CAA didn't sell themselves as being in advertising. Here's the thing about tinseltown . . . everybody knows everybody else at the top, much like any other industry. I've heard a lot of amazing stories and coincidences over the years, its a small town really.

 

[alissafalco]

Please let's not take Eddie's thread and turn it into the cup thread.

We might as well, the cups thread has been locked anyway.

 

[Eddie Sotto]

This goes way beyond any cups thread.

Prior to this episode, I interviewed at CAA in an attempt to create my own position there and leave WDI. My goal was to innovate new products that used both the celebrities and brands now repped by CAA. CAA could own a piece of the new innovation that resulted from this collaboration and my commission would include that. They did not "get it". So I went back and formed the concept studio at WDI and began innovating new products between Disney and it's sponsors, like Nestle and Kodak. In time, I was planning to show the results to CAA, but was shocked when Ovitz moved to Disney. I later told him the story and he was not aware of my plan but loved it and wanted me to continue pursuing it for him at the Mouse. Of course, at Disney you don't get anything for doing that. Oh well. A few years later after Ovitz departed, William Morris, Endeavor and CAA formed new departments to do what I had proposed as a service. One was headed by the guy I interviewed with at CAA that first turned me down, then he came to WDI with Ovitz, we worked together, then he went back to CAA and ran said department! That's Hollywood.

 

[flynnibus]

..and business in general unfortunately.. No idea is truly protected until it's in the market.

It's great to hear about these twists and turns in your career tho Eddie. Loving in