Economy does in Fantasyland

[FutureBelle93]

^So true, i mean disneyland doesn't have much land which disneyworld has a vast majority of land to explore on. They could do so much with the parks, Space moutain, redo Fantasyland, Indiana Jones Rides, anything really but they dont which really surprises me. Especially with Disneys 40th coming around and the whole Potterland thing i hoped disney would get a jump on it.

 

[hoke2007]

^So true, i mean disneyland doesn't have much land which disneyworld has a vast majority of land to explore on. They could do so much with the parks, Space moutain, redo Fantasyland, Indiana Jones Rides, anything really but they dont which really surprises me. Especially with Disneys 40th coming around and the whole Potterland thing i hoped disney would get a jump on it.

I really think that Disney is underestimating Universal. WDW should be announcing new rides and attractions now so that it can be built by WDW 40th celebration. Instead all we hear is that plans to update and enhance WDW are being scrapped. I haven't heard anything about the $1 billion budget for DCA being slashed. It's an absolute shame that WDW doesn't get the love it deserves.

 

[WDWGoof07]

I'm really bummed out about this move. When I first heard about the Fantasyland update, I was super excited. I can't remember the last time I was that excited. Then I read that Disney has decided to push back those plans, or cancel them all together. At the same time, DCA is getter $1 billion in improvements. It just isn't fair. WDW has gotten the shaft far too many times. First it appears that the Space Mountain rehab, which was going to be amazing, gets cut down into a very dismal rehab. And now they are walking away from major improvements for Fantasyland. It's disappointing. Very disappointing.


Sorry for the rant. I'm just so upset about Disney giving WDW a cold shoulder.

I couldn't agree more.

I almost wonder whether or not WDW was better off under Eisner (animation/movies...that's another story...). I mean we all thought we were in for a real treat when Iger and Lasseter took over, but WDW hasn't gotten squat in terms of actual attractions or even rumored attractions for that matter. DCA is getting $1.2 Billion to get fixed up, but DHS and DAK are both in need of some expansion over here, too. And MK could have benefitted greatly from some new rides in Fantasyland. Don't get me wrong I like the parks the way they are, but Disney can't get caught flat-footed by just shutting down until the economy improves. Universal is still moving forward with Harry Potter and Rip Ride Rockit, and Sea World is going forward with the new Manta coaster...who's going to be ahead of the game when the economic panic subsides? Waiting to build until the economy improves is too late, the time to build is now. Now is not the time to open something huge, but this is the time to build.

This is why I don't oppose cloning rides, especially if Disney wants to use the current economic climate as an excuse. Disney can promote a ride for two resorts and get more returns on that ride while only investing in R&D and such once.

Lasseter really needs to get off his high horse at DL and think about WDW. MK could have its first new E-Ticket in years, a small family coaster, and a smaller dark ride. If they can spend all that money to fix DL's ugly stepsister, then they can certainly set some aside to polish up the crown jewel of their theme park empire.

On a side note...if the DCA makeover can still happen since they already had a budget approved, does that mean that some DHS improvements can still happen? I thought that DHS had a significant budget, albeit smaller than DCA's, to make some improvements. Are those still on?...Star Tours 2?...Monsters Inc. Coaster?...a Backlot Tour replacement? (honestly I thought putting Radiator Springs Rally here was a given considering the monstrous budget for this ride alone...I never thought Rasulo would ever justify building that thing just in DCA)

 

[hoke2007]

I couldn't agree more.

I almost wonder whether or not WDW was better off under Eisner (animation/movies...that's another story...). I mean we all thought we were in for a real treat when Iger and Lasseter took over, but WDW hasn't gotten squat in terms of actual attractions or even rumored attractions for that matter. DCA is getting $1.2 Billion to get fixed up, but DHS and DAK are both in need of some expansion over here, too. And MK could have benefitted greatly from some new rides in Fantasyland. Don't get me wrong I like the parks the way they are, but Disney can't get caught flat-footed by just shutting down until the economy improves. Universal is still moving forward with Harry Potter and Rip Ride Rockit, and Sea World is going forward with the new Manta coaster...who's going to be ahead of the game when the economic panic subsides? Waiting to build until the economy improves is too late, the time to build is now. Now is not the time to open something huge, but this is the time to build.

This is why I don't oppose cloning rides, especially if Disney wants to use the current economic climate as an excuse. Disney can promote a ride for two resorts and get more returns on that ride while only investing in R&D and such once.

Lasseter really needs to get off his high horse at DL and think about WDW. MK could have its first new E-Ticket in years, a small family coaster, and a smaller dark ride. If they can spend all that money to fix DL's ugly stepsister, then they can certainly set some aside to polish up the crown jewel of their theme park empire.

On a side note...if the DCA makeover can still happen since they already had a budget approved, does that mean that some DHS improvements can still happen? I thought that DHS had a significant budget, albeit smaller than DCA's, to make some improvements. Are those still on?...Star Tours 2?...Monsters Inc. Coaster?...a Backlot Tour replacement? (honestly I thought putting Radiator Springs Rally here was a given considering the monstrous budget for this ride alone...I never thought Rasulo would ever justify building that thing just in DCA)

Exactly. MK deserves to get some love. The Little Mermaid attraction must be built here, and not some cut-down version. We should get the exact same version that DCA is getting, maybe even with some enhancements that the DCA version doesn't have. The Beauty and the Beast attraction that is to take the place of Snow White should blow our minds. And the Seven Dwarfs roller coaster should be very immersive and detailed. I want to see Fantasyland become what it should be.

As for DHS, Pixar Place should be expanded to include the Monsters Inc. attraction that has been rumored for a while and possibly the Ratatouille attraction that DLP is getting.

AK should get another E-ticket ride in the next 5 years or so and some smaller C-tickets. I've always wanted to see JTTCOTE built here, so hopefully that happens. But I probably shouldn't hold my breathe...

 

[Disneyson 1]

I think that we can all agree that Universal WILL be a contender for 2 day's worth of Disney's money. Perhaps this will inspire them to create immersive rides with no corners cut.

Also, I are in agreement on the new ride arguments.

 

[hoke2007]

I think that we can all agree that Universal WILL be a contender for 2 day's worth of Disney's money. Perhaps this will inspire them to create immersive rides with no corners cut.

Also, I are in agreement on the new ride arguments.

Yep. Disney better get their acts together and invest a lot of money in making WDW better than ever before

 

[TP2000]

Lasseter really needs to get off his high horse at DL and think about WDW. MK could have its first new E-Ticket in years, a small family coaster, and a smaller dark ride. If they can spend all that money to fix DL's ugly stepsister, then they can certainly set some aside to polish up the crown jewel of their theme park empire.

You may not realize it, but you just hit the nail right on the head as to why Lasseter is so focused on new rides for Anaheim. He lives and works in California. He used to work at Disneyland in college. He hangs out at Disneyland on weekends. I've seen him repeatedly over the last year at Disneyland with his family and a VIP Tour Guide leading them around.

John Lasseter is a Disney theme park nerd, and Disneyland is his home park. He loves the place. So of course he wants the most attention paid to Anaheim.

It's a shame that the WDW executive team can't stand up and say "HEY! What about us?!". But from what I've seen of the WDW executive team in Meg Crofton and Al Weiss, they just sort of mindlessly read their approved talking points off the teleprompter while using the words "magic", "dreams" and "celebrate" as much as humanly possible. :hammer:

 

[hoke2007]

You may not realize it, but you just hit the nail right on the head as to why Lasseter is so focused on new rides for Anaheim. He lives and works in California. He used to work at Disneyland in college. He hangs out at Disneyland on weekends. I've seen him repeatedly over the last year at Disneyland with his family and a VIP Tour Guide leading them around.

John Lasseter is a Disney theme park nerd, and Disneyland is his home park. He loves the place. So of course he wants the most attention paid to Anaheim.

It's a shame that the WDW executive team can't stand up and say "HEY! What about us?!". But from what I've seen of the WDW executive team in Meg Crofton and Al Weiss, they just sort of mindlessly read their approved talking points off the teleprompter while using the words "magic", "dreams" and "celebrate" as much as humanly possible. :hammer:

It is too bad. I thought that Lasseter was going to focus on Disneyland for a year or two and then focus on WDW for the same amount of time. I just wish the Disney would realize that without WDW, Disney wouldn't be what it is today. WDW is in rough shape and the company is turning its back on them.

 

[WDWGoof07]

You may not realize it, but you just hit the nail right on the head as to why Lasseter is so focused on new rides for Anaheim. He lives and works in California. He used to work at Disneyland in college. He hangs out at Disneyland on weekends. I've seen him repeatedly over the last year at Disneyland with his family and a VIP Tour Guide leading them around.

John Lasseter is a Disney theme park nerd, and Disneyland is his home park. He loves the place. So of course he wants the most attention paid to Anaheim.

It's a shame that the WDW executive team can't stand up and say "HEY! What about us?!". But from what I've seen of the WDW executive team in Meg Crofton and Al Weiss, they just sort of mindlessly read their approved talking points off the teleprompter while using the words "magic", "dreams" and "celebrate" as much as humanly possible. :hammer:

Yeah I've read some articles online that Lasseter favors DL. Which is a shame really because WDW has some history behind it and four parks that are beautiful but need just as much attention as the parks out west. DCA shouldn't stall progress in other parks just because it has to be brought up to the Disney standards it should have met in the first place. Lasseter really does a disservice to WDW and its core audience by siphoning away creative talent. If only WDW management would stand up for themselves and demand real improvement that isn't a marketing promotion.

 

[hoke2007]

Yeah I've read some articles online that Lasseter favors DL. Which is a shame really because WDW has some history behind it and four parks that are beautiful but need just as much attention as the parks out west. DCA shouldn't stall progress in other parks just because it has to be brought up to the Disney standards it should have met in the first place. Lasseter really does a disservice to WDW and its core audience by siphoning away creative talent. If only WDW management would stand up for themselves and demand real improvement that isn't a marketing promotion.

I agree. Lasseter, while brilliant, is totally ignoring WDW. I've never really heard about a rehab/new ride at WDW receiving more money, but it seems like projects at Disneyland are getting more money than they know what to do with. I'd just like them to realize that Disneyland is pretty dang good right now and WDW is hurting. Give rides the rehabs they deserve, build amazing new rides with proper budgets, and WDW would be back on track.

 

[sleepybear]

Yes, some attractions could definitely use a rehab, but WDW has received quite a bit of attention in recent years. Pirates and HM were refurbished beautifully, and look at all the new stuff we got:

Everest
Soarin'
Toy Story Mania
Lights Motor Action
The Seas With Nemo and Friends

That's all in the past three years. Not too shabby

 

[mcjaco]

And, please, let's not talk queues ... they may be nice or not, but they are waiting areas largely. Kali River Rapids, one of the worst attractions at WDW, has a wonderful queue. It still sucks!

Why not? Earlier you said you liked DL's MS queue better than MK's? You related it back to the overall theming.

 

[mcjaco]

Every individual has their own perspective on virtually everything, however, I don't see how anyone can look at and ride WDW SM and say it's fine, leave it alone. It's gotten so shabby! It's old and worn out and it shows everywhere you look. I'm not saying change Space Mountain to something else. No one here is saying that, but it does need to be FULLY rehab'd. The ride should be as smooth as possible to complete the illusion of flying through space and it needs to be pitch dark with some visuals using current available technologies. The sound added in DL's version definitely enhances the experience, adding drama. I've ridden both in recent years. I already knew WDW's version was in sad shape and needed a rehab bad, but after we went on DL's new version, going on WDW's just made me sick. And I don't even want to think of what kind of safety issues may be going on in there.

I never said it didn't need to be rahabbed. It is rickety, and showing it's age. That can be fixed, with track and wheel work.

I was arguing that stating DLP or TDL or DL's SM is far superior, is simply not true, if you're only comparing ride quality(smoothness seems to be the sticking point) againt each other. Heck, DLP's is a completely different animal that any of the other SM's, so it shouldn't even be in the same category.

 

[tirian]

I couldn't agree more.

I almost wonder whether or not WDW was better off under Eisner (animation/movies...that's another story...). I mean we all thought we were in for a real treat when Iger and Lasseter took over, but WDW hasn't gotten squat in terms of actual attractions or even rumored attractions for that matter.

...

On a side note...if the DCA makeover can still happen since they already had a budget approved, does that mean that some DHS improvements can still happen? I thought that DHS had a significant budget, albeit smaller than DCA's, to make some improvements. Are those still on?...Star Tours 2?...Monsters Inc. Coaster?...a Backlot Tour replacement? (honestly I thought putting Radiator Springs Rally here was a given considering the monstrous budget for this ride alone...I never thought Rasulo would ever justify building that thing just in DCA)

Eisner seemed to operate only in extremes. When he was wrong, he was really wrong—like making animation a cookie-cutter operation, putting Pressler in charge of DL, and eventually cutting back spending and maintenance in all the parks (DCA, DAK, DHS). He also didn't understand Disney's unique, BROAD heritage that covers much more than just pixie dust; hence we got the cardboard wand and giant plastic hat.

But when Eisner was right, he was really right, too. He expanded WDW into a true resort and for about fifteen years, allowed it the budget necessary to be cutting edge. Heck, Eisner greenlighted Splash Mountain, Indiana Jones, Disneyland Paris, Expedition: Everest, Test Track, and several beautiful hotels. Of course, he also went nuts and greenlighted DCA and too many hotels at WDW, but that's covered in his "wrong" category.

It seems that since Walt died, the company cannot simply let both American properties thrive on their own. When WDW got all the attention, DL suffered; now it's the opposite. Rasulo's "Disney Parks" vision is partly to blame because it reduces all the parks to candidates in a bread line, and ignores that WDW and DL are two completely different business models. Of all the U.S. parks, DCA really does need the most attention right now, but WDW cannot be ignored.

Ironically, WDW has still come out ahead so far: Epcot's version of "Nemo" turned out to be better than the tiny porthole version in the Submarine Voyage at DL, and DHS' TSMM boasts a much better queue and area theming than the one in DCA.

 

[jmuboy]

>>>Ironically, WDW has still come out ahead so far: Epcot's version of "Nemo" turned out to be better than the tiny porthole version in the Submarine Voyage at DL, and DHS' TSMM boasts a much better queue and area theming than the one in DCA. <<<

While everyone has opinions, I have to share mine. EPCOT's Nemo ride is fun, but DL's submarine version overall takes the cake! There is no comparison.

 

[jmuboy]

>>>I'd just like them to realize that Disneyland is pretty dang good right now and WDW is hurting. Give rides the rehabs they deserve, build amazing new rides with proper budgets, and WDW would be back on track.<<<

Funny, 10 years ago we were saying the exact opposite!

But there defininitely needs to be some balance, especially where the MK is concerned. But coming from someone who is familiar with the theme park buisness I can see how tempting it is for mgmt to spend their money elsewhere while the MK (even as stale as it has become) generates cash hand over fist.

 

[tirian]

While everyone has opinions, I have to share mine. EPCOT's Nemo ride is fun, but DL's submarine version overall takes the cake! There is no comparison.

I understand everyone has an opinion, but many people, including much of the DL-centric fan sites, consider Epcot's version more successful only because you can actually see what's going on. Obviously, the submarine aspect cannot be beat: would you rather be in a clam-mobile or a submarine? :lol: But when you look at the entire Seas pavilion, from the entrance queue to the ride and Turtle Talk, as well as REAL fish and dolphins swimming throughout the aquarium, it trumps the plastic fish in DL.

At least DL still has its sub lagoon.

 

[tirian]

But coming from someone who is familiar with the theme park buisness I can see how tempting it is for mgmt to spend their money elsewhere while the MK (even as stale as it has become) generates cash hand over fist.

Yep, which is why the MK is concentrating on refurbing what it has before it adds any new attractions.

This isn't news, folks; Disney has been saying this since the IASW refurb in 2005.

 

[Pete C]

Ironically, WDW has still come out ahead so far: Epcot's version of "Nemo" turned out to be better than the tiny porthole version in the Submarine Voyage at DL, and DHS' TSMM boasts a much better queue and area theming than the one in DCA.

Epcot's seems inferior to me. Sure, the portholes are small, but the ride is almost 4 times as long and features a complete story.

 

[kcnole]

WDW does have a celebrity imagineer working on our side in Rhode at least. While he may not have the clout of Lasseter he's got some considerable pull.