News Early Theme Park Entry and Extended Evening Hours coming for resort guests

[Chi84]

Right now if I get on at 7am I know what my first ride will be when I buy but I don’t know what will be left after that. If all the reservations are in advance I know what I’m getting for my money. I’d rather know what I’m getting.

A lot of people do. I’m guessing that’s why they’re going to offer some type of pre-booking.

No one knows, but I doubt it’s going to be something as insubstantial as 1 ride booked 1 day in advance.

 

[GoofGoof]

A lot of people do. I’m guessing that’s why they’re going to offer some type of pre-booking.

No one knows, but I doubt it’s going to be something as insubstantial as 1 ride booked 1 day in advance.

The biggest complaint I’ve seen is people not thinking genie+ was worth what they paid and/or they thought they would get more with it. Allowing advance reservations solves that. You know what you are getting.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Right now if I get on at 7am I know what my first ride will be when I buy but I don’t know what will be left after that. If all the reservations are in advance I know what I’m getting for my money. I’d rather know what I’m getting.

Yes…I totally get that.

But “know what I’m getting” without fee leads to a really dumb 10 years. As tickets rose and hours shrunk to sell ups…we became institutionalized to accept “3”

Myself too…I just have fewer illusions in me. They couple that with cheaper products and less dining.
It’s bad…the results.

Anyway…genie is flawed…so was plus…

Because they mismanaged their capacity as part of an awful strategy in Florida. It was gonna take years to really understand the fallout.
And here we are.

I don’t actually think there’s a way back…because they won’t do what it would take.

Advance reservations aren’t gonna work.
Look at these two questions:
1. Why were they tiered?
2. Why were they on everything?

All answers lead back to rome

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

A lot of people do. I’m guessing that’s why they’re going to offer some type of pre-booking.

No one knows, but I doubt it’s going to be something as insubstantial as 1 ride booked 1 day in advance.

If they offer prebooking then assume the attendance problem is alot worse than you think.
My prediction.

 

[GoofGoof]

That was fastpass+

People would make them with no investment and then just let them clog.
“Negative capacity”

Genie has a lot of warts…but it fundamentally discourages THAT until late in the day.

What they should do is drop the lighting lanes and virtual queues and put hard caps on genie that makes standby the vast majority of seats later in the days…

Fundamentally…the best way to push herds through is standby…

But then you have to increase operating hours to handle it and dump the customer fed STOOPID after hours events.

They’d make more money…theres just nobody left that understands that.

Dropping lightning lane would add 1 or more top attraction to each park making Genie+ more valuable. I don’t know the best answer, but I think based on the announcement they are attempting to address negative guest feedback on genie+. I don’t see them stopping lightning lane or after hours events.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Dropping lightning lane would add 1 or more top attraction to each park making Genie+ more valuable. I don’t know the best answer, but I think based on the announcement they are attempting to address negative guest feedback on genie+. I don’t see them stopping lightning lane or after hours events.

I agree…but they’d have to make it so the genie was the early riser “premium bump”…more or less and the rest can actually get through the lines later in an hour or so so they aren’t completely Peed off/turned off.

That means lengthening the standard day…

And the blue ocean tools think it not necessary.

But WRONG.

And they care not at all for “guest feedback” until it shows in dvc sales and per guest spending…don’t think it has directly just yet.

“Guest satisfaction” has been around forever…but it has become increasing a crutch of the fan masses in Hopes it will blunt what we all know is bad wdw management from the bobs and tight pants Josh.

Late at night…when the demons come…we all know it

 

[Chi84]

The biggest complaint I’ve seen is people not thinking genie+ was worth what they paid and/or they thought they would get more with it. Allowing advance reservations solves that. You know what you are getting.

Genie+ and ILLs worked just fine for us last week. The ILLs allowed us to get Tron, Guardians, etc. and my son turned into some kind of genius getting us everything else at times convenient for us. The big change from when we first used it was being able to modify.

He didn’t mind being on the phone constantly to modify around our changing schedule, but I wouldn’t have been as happy with it. The main difference was the cost. It was around $820 for 6 park days for 4 adults. Keeping the ILLs out of Genie+ is what just about guarantees that you’ll be able to ride the most popular rides.

 

[GoofGoof]

Yes…I totally get that.

But “know what I’m getting” without fee leads to a really dumb 10 years. As tickets rose and hours shrunk to sell ups…we became institutionalized to accept “3”

Myself too…I just have fewer illusions in me. They couple that with cheaper products and less dining.
It’s bad…the results.

Anyway…genie is flawed…so was plus…

Because they mismanaged their capacity as part of an awful strategy in Florida. It was gonna take years to really understand the fallout.
And here we are.

I don’t actually think there’s a way back…because they won’t do what it would take.

Advance reservations aren’t gonna work.
Look at these two questions:
1. Why were they tiered?
2. Why were they on everything?

All answers lead back to rome

The issue with tiering and rides that don’t need FP at all really aren’t solved with genie+ day of service. Everyone books the top tier rides early and then they run out. There’s not more actual capacity.

I went in August 2021 right before genie+ when there was no fast pass at all and it worked out great. With a few rope drop days we never waited more than 20 mins for anything the whole trip. Rise was still on virtual queue but outside of that no FP at all. Crowds were light so it worked great. I imagine on busier days it would be less positive.

I had no issue with 3 advance reservations with FP+. We always got the rides we wanted. Easier to get up early 1 day and book it all for a trip in advance then get on each day at 7am. If they further limited advanced reservations based on accommodation level that would further reduce the clog.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

The issue with tiering and rides that don’t need FP at all really aren’t solved with genie+ day of service. Everyone books the top tier rides early and then they run out. There’s not more actual capacity.

I went in August 2021 right before genie+ when there was no fast pass at all and it worked out great. With a few rope drop days we never waited more than 20 mins for anything the whole trip. Rise was still on virtual queue but outside of that no FP at all. Crowds were light so it worked great. I imagine on busier days it would be less positive.

I had no issue with 3 advance reservations with FP+. We always got the rides we wanted. Easier to get up early 1 day and book it all for a trip in advance then get on each day at 7am. If they further limited advanced reservations based on accommodation level that would further reduce the clog.

Genie mitigates some of this…cause you gotta be there. That’s the correction from +

But it solves nothing…I agree with you there.

Prebooked exposed the huge ops problems I covered in the q’s.

There’s no way to not have the same with prebooks. They already have acknowledged that by going to genie and NOT doing prebooks.

Every ride system should be in park. Only way it can be flexible to the park

 

[Chi84]

The issue with tiering and rides that don’t need FP at all really aren’t solved with genie+ day of service. Everyone books the top tier rides early and then they run out. There’s not more actual capacity.

I went in August 2021 right before genie+ when there was no fast pass at all and it worked out great. With a few rope drop days we never waited more than 20 mins for anything the whole trip. Rise was still on virtual queue but outside of that no FP at all. Crowds were light so it worked great. I imagine on busier days it would be less positive.

I had no issue with 3 advance reservations with FP+. We always got the rides we wanted. Easier to get up early 1 day and book it all for a trip in advance then get on each day at 7am. If they further limited advanced reservations based on accommodation level that would further reduce the clog.

Rope drop and standing in lines won’t work for us; we would have to forgo WDW if there was no ride reservation system.

We did get more rides this time around but that didn’t justify the cost. We were happier with FP+. Then again, we visit often and are not terribly ride-centered. We just want to know we can ride the few that we really enjoy.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Rope drop and standing in lines won’t work for us; we would have to forgo WDW if there was no ride reservation system.

We did get more rides this time around but that didn’t justify the cost. We were happier with FP+. Then again, we visit often and are not terribly ride-centered. We just want to know we can ride the few that we really enjoy.

So are we and there in lies the problem:
They’re still amusement parks…and have to be run as such.

It’s never going to be all “us” because they Profit off masses. They need them so they have to push them through and + made that harder. It would have collapsed if they had continued. Everything would be prebooked with massive lines and complaints.

Iger said “we’re trying for lower attendance” in 2015? When he needed an easy excuse for getting out over the skis

He lied. Never for a day did they want that and never will. It doesn’t fit the machine.

But here we are trying to…mercifully finally…trying to get on the same page on this truth. It is the truth.

We’re all growing as people…Cept me

 

[Chi84]

So are we and there in lies the problem:
They’re still amusement parks…and have to be run as such.

It’s never going to be all “us” because they Profit off masses. They need them so they have to push them through and + made that harder. It would have collapsed if they had continued. Everything would be prebooked with massive lines and complaints.

Iger said “we’re trying for lower attendance” in 2015? When he needed an easy excuse for getting out over the skis

He lied. Never for a day did they want that and never will. It doesn’t fit the machine.

But here we are trying to…mercifully finally…trying to get on the same page on this truth. It is the truth.

We’re all growing as people…Cept me

They’re more than just theme parks, though. They also need people doing all the other things at an expansive resort that includes dining, resort amenities, shopping, etc. But entering the parks has become so expensive now that people feel they’re wasting time doing anything else. It’s really too bad.

 

[GoofGoof]

Rope drop and standing in lines won’t work for us; we would have to forgo WDW if there was no ride reservation system.

We did get more rides this time around but that didn’t justify the cost. We were happier with FP+. Then again, we visit often and are not terribly ride-centered. We just want to know we can ride the few that we really enjoy.

I agree. We are mostly in the same boat. That trip was not our normal pattern, we prefer later nights and not so early mornings. They were still on Covid hours so everything closed early anyway and we ended up flexing most of our big meals to lunch mainly because we had 8 people and couldn’t get ADRs a lot of places at dinner time but it worked out well even if it was an accident, so we were asleep a whole lot earlier than norm most nights which made the mornings more pleasant.

For me personally FP+ worked really great. We try to go when crowds are lower anyway and we usually have a 10 day ticket so multiple days in each park means the tiers are not an issue. On moderate to low crowd days each park (except maybe MK) only has a handful of rides needing fast pass and we would book those in advance and usually not before 11am so if we felt like going closer to park opening we’d take advantage of lower lines until our FPs kicked in but if we decided to sleep in or get there later we didn‘t miss out.

I have no issue waiting 30 mins or less, but most rides don’t justify a wait longer than that in my opinion. I have never used Lightning Lane so I will probably need to consider that on my next trip for a few rides but I’m hoping the advance reservations come back in some form for the rest of the rides.

 

[GoofGoof]

It’s never going to be all “us” because they Profit off masses. They need them so they have to push them through and + made that harder. It would have collapsed if they had continued. Everything would be prebooked with massive lines and complaints.

I get what you are saying to an extent, but the system was in place for 7 years and didn’t collapse. Attendance may have gone up some in that time, but they also added a few rides to each park too. In the 7 years FP+ existed everything was pre-booked and I’m sure at busy times the lines were massive because of it and there were probably complaints. From people I’ve talked to the lines recently were also massive and people complained mostly because they paid for genie+ and didn’t perceive they got good value.

I’m not buying that the issue is pre-booking. The issue is not enough ride capacity for any FP system to function properly. Whether it’s booked 60 days prior or “day of“ the ride capacity doesn’t change. I think it’s a matter of preference. Some people don’t like planning ahead and being locked into times. Others would rather lock it in and know what they are getting.

Unless Disney either significantly increases ride capacity (not happening anytime soon) or limits the number of people using the system (no direct talk of that outside of surge pricing which is supposed to do that some) there is no solution to the “not enough capacity“ issue. The only way they could limit usage would be to make it a resort guest service with a steep price for anyone not staying on property, similar to how Universal has Express Pass for deluxe resort guests only but still offers it for sale to everyone else at a price almost nobody would pay. For Disney they could stagger it and offer 3 advance reservations for deluxe resort guests, 2 for all other resort guests and 1 for anyone not staying in a Disney Resort. Deluxe resorts are still close to 5,000 rooms which is only like 20% of total (Disney owned plus partner rooms). And resort guests are probably 50% of total visitors. So 10% of visitors get 3, 40% get 2 and 50% get 1. That reduces usage by almost half.

 

[mikejs78]

A lot of people do. I’m guessing that’s why they’re going to offer some type of pre-booking.

No one knows, but I doubt it’s going to be something as insubstantial as 1 ride booked 1 day in advance.

My guess is one ride per day 7 days in advance, and maybe add the option to select times.

 

[GoofGoof]

My guess is one ride per day 7 days in advance, and maybe add the option to select times.

1 ride for genie+ 7 days in advance in addition to allowing 7 day advance booking for the top ride in each park through paid lightning lane? Also would 7 days in advance for hotel guests mean they could book all the days of their stay 7 days in advance of their check-in day similar to old FP+? If not I’d prefer 14 days or even 30 in advance for people staying more than 7 nights. Biggest advantage to advance booking is not having to wake up early on vacation and try to book something.

 

[Chi84]

My guess is one ride per day 7 days in advance, and maybe add the option to select times.

I’m going to guess something more substantial. But no one knows.

 

[Jrb1979]

I’m going to guess something more substantial. But no one knows.

I agree but I don't see how they go back to more than 1 per day ahead of time. The thing is on many days availability on most rides run out by mid day and that's with allowing only 1 at a time. You go back to 3 ahead of time most days there would be nothing left at park open.

Every one keeps looking at it from a resort guest perspective. The problem is more people visit WDW from off-site then on.

 

[GoofGoof]

I agree but I don't see how they go back to more than 1 per day ahead of time. The thing is on many days availability on most rides run out by mid day and that's with allowing only 1 at a time. You go back to 3 ahead of time most days there would be nothing left at park open.

Every one keeps looking at it from a resort guest perspective. The problem is more people visit WDW from off-site then on.

This is what happened with FP+. They technically allowed you to book additional reservations once your advance 3 were done but there was nothing left worth booking. There simply is not enough capacity a lot of days for people to get in more than 3 reservations.

I agree that the resort guests probably make up half or less of total park guests. I think offering an advantage to resort guests is a good way to encourage people to stay on property which maximizes profit for Disney. It would make a lot of sense for them to offer advance bookings based on accommodation level. Disney has been reluctant to do that outside of EMHs in the past, but who knows what they are thinking this time.

 

[Chi84]

I agree but I don't see how they go back to more than 1 per day ahead of time. The thing is on many days availability on most rides run out by mid day and that's with allowing only 1 at a time. You go back to 3 ahead of time most days there would be nothing left at park open.

Every one keeps looking at it from a resort guest perspective. The problem is more people visit WDW from off-site then on.

That’s why I said no one knows. If a had a nickel for every time someone said Disney would never go back to any type of pre-booking I would have enough money to finance my next WDW trip.