Don't wanna be angry, but I am...[Rant]

[Shouldigo12]

Some folks like to talk in hyperbole. It is a little like baby birds in a nest, or why bears scratch high on trees. They grew up with the notion that louder/higher/bigger = effective. And well...just read any newspaper in 2020 for prime examples. Sadly, it often starts in childhood. The loudest tweeter sometimes gets the most regurgitated worm; so they keep at it.

For me, the classic rides are a big part of the appeal, and those are still there, but the style of my touring has changed dramatically. My trips have always varied: short/long, time of year, hotel, hopping/not hopping, Just WDW/Just US/both/other FL places.

WDW used to be very flexible. If we missed a paper FP, no big deal. We often picked our park by hopping on the first bus that arrived. I booked same-day dining on the way to the park, or we'd just wait for a table. Getting dressed for dinner was relaxing and fun, because we could take our time over a snack and pre-dinner beverage.

With more restrictions, trips got progressively more restricted and less fun. A buzzkill was the trips where getting to an ADR= yelling at everyone that it was time to go NOW! Then we'd arrive and WAIT. A full hour. PAST our ADR time. You know those Snicker's commercials? Multiple times the youngest members of our extended family completely fell asleep. So much for pictures and autographs. The live music helped at many venues, but not always enough. Rushing, just to wait gets progressively more insulting each time it happens.

Some CM's came close to making up for it. The step sisters are especially great at making us laugh. After dinner, the GF pianists sprinkled pixie dust on little girls in taffeta dresses. Live piano music is magic! Storytellers at AKL wove amazing African fairytales around blazing campfires, or else CM's invited all the kids to parade around the lobby playing assorted instruments.

Many WDW magic moments feel spontaneous. It was like winning the lottery, so even after many faded away...it long seemed like they could return at any time. Some bus drivers told jokes, but not all. Some boat captains gave out little trading cards, some didn't. Some trips you got invited to ride in the front of the monorail, some you didn't. That was the magic of it. Every trip some special thing happened, but not the SAME little thing each visit. If you know WDW, you know this about WDW, and wouldn't need to ask. Long time visitors just keep hoping they see Chip frolicking with Dale...

So sure, I still go to WDW, but not at all the way we used to go. To be fair, I've always varied my visits - season, length, where I stay. And to be fair, last summer, we had an amazing housekeeper! I hope she isn't among those who were laid off. Just a super sweet person doing a fantastic job making little bits of WDW magic.

I appreciate the perspective. And I can understand the planning thing; I've seen a many long time fans complain about that. For me, I love it. I've mentioned before I'm a huge planner, I will literally sit at home and plan out vacations just for fun in a similar way to what WDW asks (hotel, what restaurant we visit each day, what entertainment we'll be doing at what time). So for me all the planning is actually a plus because WDW makes it so easy. But, still. I get that for people that want to be more spontaneous or who were use to the old way wouldn't like it. And we're in agreement about the ADRs. If it's too difficult to sit groups right at the ADR time, then they should make that more obvious. At the least I think they should change the ADRs to a window, so instead of booking a restaurant for 8 you would book it for something like 8-8:30.

 

[ppete1975]

I also love Port Orleans Riverside; it's where I stayed my last two trips.

I actually don't remember my first Disney resort. I know we stayed at the Disney Inn (now Shades of Green) when I was 4 or 5, but I don't have any memories of it. I have no idea where we stayed on trips when I was roughly 8 and 12; have literally no memory of the hotel whatsoever. We stayed at Old Key West when I was a teenager -- that's the first one that I actually remember.

dont get me wrong its my hope someday ill stay at the contemporary or the polynesian.. but i cant justify the cost.

 

[UNCgolf]

dont get me wrong its my hope someday ill stay at the contemporary or the polynesian.. but i cant justify the cost.

Neither the Contemporary nor the Polynesian are very high on my list of places to stay. I think Boardwalk Inn is the best deluxe resort overall between aesthetic and location (Beach/Yacht Club are right there too -- I like the Boardwalk Inn aesthetic more, but obviously the pool at BC/YC is the best at Disney), and then probably Grand Floridian and Wilderness Lodge. Animal Kingdom Lodge is incredible but the location isn't the best.

 

[_caleb]

Some of the OP's rant was about how customer service at Disney has changed over the years. I made a point about how customers these days don't value the same sort of treatment folks may have appreciated in the past. I just want to clarify that this doesn't mean the old ways are passé.

Chick-fil-a has built it's business around customer service. They are thriving because of it. I know everyone teases them about having their employees say "My pleasure!" instead of "You're welcome!" but their model is decidedly old-school. You won't find self-serve soda fountains in a Chick-fil-a, and you won't see all the dipping sauces out for customers to help themselves. This does help reduce costs, but it's really to drive more interactions between the customer and employee. They see each of these interactions as an opportunity to create a positive experience with the company. This is actually the Disney way.

The thing is, if you ask customers if they would like to be left alone, they will say, YES! But this is because they're tired of being badgered by salespeople who really don't care about them and don't really know what they're talking about. You can automate everything with technology and minimize guest/employee interactions (what the guests say they want!), but that means missing out on lots of opportunities to create those positive (Disney would call them "magic") moments.

The point is, the answer to changing opinions about customer service doesn't have to be "automate everything." The better answer, in my opinion, is better training. If Disney put time and effort into better training CMs (like they used to!) and "training" guests on what to expect from Disney customer service (this done though clear messaging and consistent service), customer satisfaction would go up, along with safety, security, and spending.

 

[_caleb]

It starts at the hiring, plain and simple. When you hire a naturally happy, smiling person with people skills who genuinely enjoys serving (yes, I said serving) people, the training just gives them helpful tips to do what they already do naturally. When you hire an angry, unhappy person with no people skills you can train them all day long and all you will get is an angry, unhappy person going through the insincere motions and spouting the canned phrases.

Chik-fil-A hires the right people - the rest takes care of itself. Disney used to do this, now it's fog the mirror, wedge that size 18 butt into a pair of size 10 ODV pants and good luck!

I appreciate your perspective (and I think I agree), but I’m not sure it’s quite so simple. Of course, natural people skills help, but people skills can be learned, too. And how do you screen for natural happiness/unhappiness or anger? The best way is to create a pervasive corporate culture of happiness and then to treat employees well so that “happiness” is maintained.

Chick-fil-a pays its employees a higher wage than other quick-serve restaurants do. Their training is borderline indoctrination, and they reward hard work, good leadership, and serving people (like you said).

For Disney, over-the-top smiling, outgoing CMs could actually work against the positive customer experience. They need all kinds of personalities and lifestyles represented so that guests of all kinds can find at least a couple CMs they can relate to and feel comfortable being “served” by.

 

[HongKongFooy]

Chick-fil-a has built it's business around customer service

I placed an order for large fries at a Chick FIL a counter; I left the counter to join a Starbucks line 4 shops away to get two orders going at once to save overall waiting time. But Starbucks due to volume of other drinks to blend took maybe 8 minutes when I thought I'd be in and out in a flash.

I returend to Chick FIL and a bag was waiting for me at pick up. Noticing that the fries were sitting around in a bag for a short time the supervisory looking worker behind the counter threw it away and quickly replaced it with a fresh one. I was in disbelief at the level of initiative and customer service for something fast food.

They just picked up a lifelong customer after that.

 

[ppete1975]

Neither the Contemporary nor the Polynesian are very high on my list of places to stay. I think Boardwalk Inn is the best deluxe resort overall between aesthetic and location (Beach/Yacht Club are right there too -- I like the Boardwalk Inn aesthetic more, but obviously the pool at BC/YC is the best at Disney), and then probably Grand Floridian and Wilderness Lodge. Animal Kingdom Lodge is incredible but the location isn't the best.

so the first hotel in the world i fell in love with is the contemporary (the whole monorail driving through it was seared into my young brain) and now that i know the history, mary blair mural, nixon's i am not a crook speech, the way the rooms were slid in.. my love for mid century i have to say its on my list
the last few years ive really gotten into tiki and so the polynesian is high on my list (not at the price though) even if its where the beatles broke up.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

so the first hotel in the world i fell in love with is the contemporary (the whole monorail driving through it was seared into my young brain) and now that i know the history, mary blair mural, nixon's i am not a crook speech, the way the rooms were slid in.. my love for mid century i have to say its on my list
the last few years ive really gotten into tiki and so the polynesian is high on my list (not at the price though) even if its where the beatles broke up.

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Well done...weaving the two biggest anecdotal stories in the history of wdw into that post

 

[Plowboy]

To be fair, WE actually do have the say/power and could "control" the business operations, but WE aren't willing to sacrifice anything to force the company's hand. The consumer has all the power, but when we accept and pay for products/services we don't like or think are ****, then we're just bowing to the company.

When I say "we" I don't specifically mean this board, but society as a whole. But, yeah, us in this board (the one's that still go, but complain) are "complicit" in the company "taking away the magic" too.

A big yes to this. There is such a thing as the golden rule. "He who has the gold makes the rules". In other words if enough consumers balk at what TDO does and hold off on going, it may just get noticed by Disney management. Now I'm not suggesting boycott, but it is a tool that the consumer can use.

 

[UNCgolf]

so the first hotel in the world i fell in love with is the contemporary (the whole monorail driving through it was seared into my young brain) and now that i know the history, mary blair mural, nixon's i am not a crook speech, the way the rooms were slid in.. my love for mid century i have to say its on my list
the last few years ive really gotten into tiki and so the polynesian is high on my list (not at the price though) even if its where the beatles broke up.

View attachment 505115

I do like the monorail running through the lobby at the Contemporary, but beyond that it just doesn't have a ton going for it compared to other Disney hotels. It looks like it was far more interesting back when the whole concourse area was open (now they have part of it partitioned off for a gift shop) and there were live shows where the California Grill is now.

The Polynesian is neat and I like the retro feel of it (although that might be going away with this new refurbishment), but I've just never felt a draw to actually stay there.

 

[ppete1975]

I do like the monorail running through the lobby at the Contemporary, but beyond that it just doesn't have a ton going for it compared to other Disney hotels. It looks like it was far more interesting back when the whole concourse area was more open (now they have part of it partitioned off for a gift shop) and there were live shows where the California Grill is now.

The Polynesian is neat and I like the somewhat retro feel it has (although that might be going away with this new refurbishment), but I've just never felt a draw to actually stay there.

I kind of agree with you. My last trip i made extra effort to walk around both hotels.. Shockingly the contemporary was kind of bland and boring (guest level) - the still impressive monorail station.
And most of the cool stuff at the polynesian can be done by visitors and doesnt require a stay.
i am also fearful of what might happen with the new refurb, and i really wish the waterfall was still there.

 

[HongKongFooy]

Ya there's something right about Poly's overall throwback 60's and 70's Hawaii feel and charm

It's got some Hawaii 5 O, Elvis wearing a lei and Brady Bunch's 3 part episode centered around a bad luck tiki going on.

...... just love the feel of the place

 

[NelleBelle]

I have definitely seen a difference in service at the parks. Whenever we've gone to WDW over the past few years, the CMs at the resorts don't seem as friendly. We've certainly run into that at the parks. I will say that when we were at DLR last year, we definitely noticed that we had more positive interactions with the CMs than we did at the parks at WDW, from the CMs at the turnstiles to the CMs in shops to the ride attendants.

But neither park can hold a candle to the customer service that Disney has on it's cruise ships! Having been on other cruise ship lines, it's not just "cruise ship" customer service. It's old-school Disney customer service. The last cruise we were on, we fell in love with our waitstaff. They knew our names even when working other areas of the ship! We had a server that recognized us from our very first cruise and he wasn't even our server! The whole reason we sail on DCL isn't just for the "Disney" atmosphere (although it definitely is nice), we certainly could find way less expensive cruises--especially when it's just DH and myself going--but we only sail on DCL because of the customer service. Just wish that all of the Disney Parks & Resorts were able to have the same level of customer service as DCL.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Ya there's something right about Poly's overall throwback 60's and 70's Hawaii feel and charm

It's got some Hawaii 5 O, Elvis wearing a lei and Brady Bunch's 3 part episode centered around a bad luck tiki going on.

...... just love the feel of the place

 

[KBLovedDisney]

After reading everyone's thoughts on my original post of angry banter against Disney, I must say, I have really had to sit back and think about my feelings towards it.

I can't hate Disney. I have a deep love for it and always will. No matter the changes the company makes to the World, I get the same Disney feels every time I walk into the Magic Kingdom. Every...darn....time.

The recent company moves (within the recent past 10 years) have not been the greatest and thanks to the pandemic, the most recent moves of the company left me dumfounded and I acted on my emotions of anger.

I can't cut out Disney from my life. Like my name on this blog site, I love Disney, and most likely always will.

 

[UNCgolf]

Actually quite easy - you can tell in five minutes from an interview if the person has an outgoing, positive, smiling disposition. If they don't, you can train them day and night, and it won't get better - just more fake.

Decades ago Disney focused on hiring a certain fresh-faced, positive, happy profile and the results created (the now sadly gone) Disney employee mystique/brand. Now even Chik-fil-A and In-N-Out do a better job of having consistently positive and professional employees. The Disney standard is no longer discernible from Six Flags or Universal. Actually, I take that back, I've had much more consistent positive interactions at Universal parks than at Disney parks over the past few years. YMMV.

And note, nowhere did I say anything about "over the top". Over the top employees are just annoying and not professional, positive, service employees.

Maybe Disney needs to follow Chick-Fil-A's lead and pay their employees more than competitors.

I'm not sure how easy that would be, though, because I feel like whenever one of them raises pay, the other immediately does as well so as not to fall behind and lose employees.

 

[Benjamin_Nicholas]

A nickel ain't worth a dime anymore

Disney is in business to be in business, especially in the current financial climate. Profits and shareholders mean a lot.

I don't blame them for monetizing as much as they can. Airlines have done the same. I can't fault it.

It's an easier pill to swallow when you quickly realize that Disney is not for everyone anymore.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

After reading everyone's thoughts on my original post of angry banter against Disney, I must say, I have really had to sit back and think about my feelings towards it.

I can't hate Disney. I have a deep love for it and always will. No matter the changes the company makes to the World, I get the same Disney feels every time I walk into the Magic Kingdom. Every...darn....time.

The recent company moves (within the recent past 10 years) have not been the greatest and thanks to the pandemic, the most recent moves of the company left me dumfounded and I acted on my emotions of anger.

I can't cut out Disney from my life. Like my name on this blog site, I love Disney, and most likely always will.

Then you’re sold...and you’ve made your intentions known to them.

It isn’t such a binary choice. It’s not a) love Disney b) hate Disney

You can love Disney - as most of the board “skeptics” have over the years...and still have a productive stance.

It’s “I love Disney...but they still have a lot to prove. No guarantees”

I think that’s more than reasonable.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

A nickel ain't worth a dime anymore

Disney is in business to be in business, especially in the current financial climate. Profits and shareholders mean a lot.

I don't blame them for monetizing as much as they can. Airlines have done the same. I can't fault it.

It's an easier pill to swallow when you quickly realize that Disney is not for everyone anymore.

It never was. But he concept of longterm loyalty/merit is something any business should have to reckon with...in the market. It’s natural and serves a very important function.

Apple today...after having some noticeable bumps the last 5 years...released an expensive flagship product that does nothing interesting.
It should be rejected.

Or does “I love apple...nothing is gonna change that...” make sense?

All just disposable products.

 

[Mr Starky]

I don't want to be mad at the Disney Company, I really don't! They have provided such an escape for me especially during my tumultuous childhood. Won't go into details of that, but you could imagine the need for a positive outlook such as something simple as a Disney World commercial and how much that gave to a child going through something somewhat severe and traumatizing.

However, over the last few short years, their business decisions have left me and my previous love for the place in a lot of question. I get that things need to change over time as changes are needed and are a big part of life to keep things moving forward, as well as for a company and that company's future prospects.

[Please know that I am not looking at the place in Rose Colored glasses (if that is even the correct saying). I have seen and dealt with bad and have become quite observant to which is what at a logical standpoint...not exactly sure as to why I have to point this out, but there you go.]

But, the re-imagining to take out per se' the Disney creative side of things just to help with customer flow, increase in sales, ways to provide more merchandise, has slowly over time began to weigh heavily in the back of my mind.

I don't hate IPs, I don't hate re-imaginings but Disney how somehow been able to take the "Disney" out of Disney for me.

Please don't hate (too much) as this is totally personal opinion, but don't feel discouraged to comment.

How do you all feel with Disney World and the current direction it is headin

I don't want to be mad at the Disney Company, I really don't! They have provided such an escape for me especially during my tumultuous childhood. Won't go into details of that, but you could imagine the need for a positive outlook such as something simple as a Disney World commercial and how much that gave to a child going through something somewhat severe and traumatizing.

However, over the last few short years, their business decisions have left me and my previous love for the place in a lot of question. I get that things need to change over time as changes are needed and are a big part of life to keep things moving forward, as well as for a company and that company's future prospects.

[Please know that I am not looking at the place in Rose Colored glasses (if that is even the correct saying). I have seen and dealt with bad and have become quite observant to which is what at a logical standpoint...not exactly sure as to why I have to point this out, but there you go.]

But, the re-imagining to take out per se' the Disney creative side of things just to help with customer flow, increase in sales, ways to provide more merchandise, has slowly over time began to weigh heavily in the back of my mind.

I don't hate IPs, I don't hate re-imaginings but Disney how somehow been able to take the "Disney" out of Disney for me.

Please don't hate (too much) as this is totally personal opinion, but don't feel discouraged to comment.

How do you all feel with Disney World and the current direction it is heading?

There's SO MUCH I could say in response here. I'll just say, that the magic has faded. When a FANTASYLAND getaway bows to the will of a Socialist PC gang, and intends to change their rides as a result, then you have just dragged the REAL world into the FANTASY getaway. Magic gone. I haven't been inside the Parks since 2005. For many reasons. And I NOW live in SoFlo. Just a little more than 3 hours away from WDW. But I cannot find the good feeling I once had for it. Maybe down the road. IDK. I hope the magic returns.