Don't wanna be angry, but I am...[Rant]

[Make-Epcot-Great-Again]

So you didn't like Walt's Snow White, Cinderella, Peter Pan, Dumbo, Mary Poppins, Mr. Toad and 20,000 leagues just to name a few. Every one acts like the current ones are the only ones that Disney ever used. They were a staple in the beginning. Walt didn't invent those stories he just made them his own by putting the famous Disney magic on them. The same applies now. Just about every single IP usage today belongs to Disney. He used to pay for the rights to use others ideas, now they own Marvel, Frozen, Pixar and Star Wars (both Disney properties). T0 me as long as they present the stuff in a quality fashion I personally don't care who thought of it to begin with. The largest and most significant original idea was just used as a center for an attraction in a named attraction of a character called Mickey Mouse.

My point is that, at least at the domestic parks, Disney doesn’t build non-IP rides like Space Mountain, The Haunted Mansion, Jungle Cruise, Horizons, Spaceship Earth, BTMRR, PotC etc etc etc anymore. Every new ride needs to be tied to an existing property now. While I certainly love rides tied to IP like Splash Mountain, Peter Pan’s Flight, Mr Toad (RIP), Snow White’s Scary Adventures (RIP) etc etc I think the parks are best served when there’s a balance between the two. Every ride built since Everest is tied to IP and I think that’s detrimental to the parks. Jungle Cruise was a day one ride at DL alongside the IP rides but and my issue is that recent history leads me to believe that they’ve abandoned building non-IP like Jungle Cruise. My list of let’s say top 5 Disney rides would consist of mostly (if not entirely) non-IP rides. I’m not against IP rides in totality but more of a somewhat balance would be nice. I’m talking about the parks only and not any media content that’s been produced since the beginnings of the company.... tho I do have a big issue with what has happened with Star Wars since 2012.

 

[Chef Mickey]

I would agree with your observations... Feels like a lot of the magic is slowly going away and the direction is more Amusement park and uninspiring hotels and architecture. I am a lifelong fan, sadly discouraged by a lot of their creative (or lack thereof) decisions...

Are you the Dreamfinder?

 

["El Gran Magnifico"]

Disney is making decisions like a Publicly Owned company does. That's not a defense, nor an excuse. It is what it is. The balance in this relationship since day 1 has been between guest/profit/shareholder. Early on the guest and the experience took precedent. The shareholder does now.

That doesn't mean that Disney isn't a quality vacation. It also doesn't mean that Disney doesn't take the guest into consideration. They do. However, they do just enough to satisfy expectations while achieving balance between cost and experience.

Disney is making cold, calculating, decisions that impact quality, experience, guest satisfaction, and employee morale. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize the Disney objective is: To create an "acceptable" experience for the guest, while continuing to keep costs low. The word "acceptable" is IMO the biggest difference for me when comparing to the earlier years

 

[Goofyernmost]

My point is that, at least at the domestic parks, Disney doesn’t build non-IP rides like Space Mountain, The Haunted Mansion, Jungle Cruise, Horizons, Spaceship Earth, BTMRR, PotC etc etc etc anymore. Every new ride needs to be tied to an existing property now. While I certainly love rides tied to IP like Splash Mountain, Peter Pan’s Flight, Mr Toad (RIP), Snow White’s Scary Adventures (RIP) etc etc I think the parks are best served when there’s a balance between the two. Every ride built since Everest is tied to IP and I think that’s detrimental to the parks. Jungle Cruise was a day one ride at DL alongside the IP rides but and my issue is that recent history leads me to believe that they’ve abandoned building non-IP like Jungle Cruise. My list of let’s say top 5 Disney rides would consist of mostly (if not entirely) non-IP rides. I’m not against IP rides in totality but more of a somewhat balance would be nice. I’m talking about the parks only and not any media content that’s been produced since the beginnings of the company.... tho I do have a big issue with what has happened with Star Wars since 2012.

You could be right or it could be that they do that more when building a new park. In established parks they already have their originals and add to it with more of the identifiable IP rides and shows. For the most part they are reacting to public demand which will keep WDW and others operating. People like to identify with something they are familiar with. Disney can get away with originality a lot easier with a new park build. There is still a balance of old originals (not necessarily non-IP's) to comfort everyone, but a new park needs new ideas a lot more then the old ones do. Besides it really isn't about who thought of the idea, it is about the quality and imagination that goes into the telling of the story no matter where it originated from. That has always been the Disney magic and it still holds true. Star Wars, for example, is not an original Disney creation, but I challenge anyone to find a more detailed, immersive, imaginative and awe inspiring land and attractions then one will find there. That is the magic. The attractions are original if they can not be found anywhere outside of the Disney bubble. No one has built it before exactly like Disney. The shows and attractions are 100% Disney IP's.

A good example of an attraction idea that went against the concept of the publics need to associate with something they can identify with would have to be TGMR. I feel that even the most avid fan of that ride rode it because of the Wizard of Oz section and maybe the western or crime shows in it. Otherwise it was a snore. The majority of the people had either a passing knowledge of the movies depicted or never heard of them. They did, however always look forward to the Oz section. Why? Because that was a movie that they had seen over and over again because of its seasonal TV bookings. They didn't understand that the show was about movies that built the Hollywood that we know today, it was history. Yet, the question was repeatedly asked... "why don't they put more recent movies in that we are familiar with? Why? Because that wasn't the message of the show and so very few were able to grasp that.

 

[HongKongFooy]

. To me as long as they present the stuff in a quality fashion I personally don't care who thought of it to begin with.

I care a great deal..... I prefer fresh and new.

Rehash, in the context of themeparks and rides, shows a lack of imagination and creativity or worse shows a lack of confidence.

 

[Goofyernmost]

I care a great deal..... I prefer fresh and new.

Rehash, in the context of themeparks and rides, shows a lack of imagination and creativity or worse shows a lack of confidence.

That fine for you, but if the only ideas you can accept have to originate from the office of Disney imagineers then your world becomes a whole lot smaller. It was easier to be original back in 1955 when they were the only game in town. That is no longer the case.

 

[Lilofan]

Disney is making decisions like a Publicly Owned company does. That's not a defense, nor an excuse. It is what it is. The balance in this relationship since day 1 has been between guest/profit/shareholder. Early on the guest and the experience took precedent. The shareholder does now.

That doesn't mean that Disney isn't a quality vacation. It also doesn't mean that Disney doesn't take the guest into consideration. They do. However, they do just enough to satisfy expectations while achieving balance between cost and experience.

Disney is making cold, calculating, decisions that impact quality, experience, guest satisfaction, and employee morale. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize the Disney objective is: To create an "acceptable" experience for the guest, while continuing to keep costs low. The word "acceptable" is IMO the biggest difference for me when comparing to the earlier years

Theme parks really don't want to hear guest feedback anymore. Part of the layoffs included cast that ask guests in the park how their vacation is and gather feedback.

 

[JIMINYCR]

That is true. Change is always going to happen and someone is always going to dislike it. I'd say, for me at least, it is not the changes that upset people. It is the changes have rarely outshined what was there before. Coupled with the skyrocketing prices and constant nickel and diming, that's not a great look. I would also say that the complete and utter disregard for thematic integrity in favor of IP shoehorning, has made many of us Disney fanboys unhappy.

Thats so true. I cant think of many replacements that were put in and the guests said This was a better attraction and worth it. Frozen, maybe was because it thrilled the kids who fell in love with the movie and its songs and so the popularity drew a huge demand for it.

 

[_caleb]

Well they certainly are trying to push less customer/staff interaction(even pre-covid) with preordering no front desk check in. I realize that is where we are headed as a society, but it's the staff that sets Disney apart from most other companies.
As for designs and streamlined stores and hotel rooms you are absolutely right. Disney World used to be a place that was like no other. Staying at a resort, even a moderate one like POR was like a little trip to another time and place. It's losing more of that, form is following functionality, well really it's all about functionality. I think you can have both, but often it's just cheaper to ignore the form.

I believe this is actually why Disney is changing these things. In previous generations, the full, undivided attention of a CM felt like good customer service. The CM could answer any questions, say kind things, and create a positive interaction.

But times have changed. These days, interaction with a CM causes anxiety in a lot of guests. Guests don’t need to go to CMs for information, because they have all the info they need (which is often more accurate) online. CMs can slow down a transaction: tapstiles are more efficient that showing a CM my paper FP, and the CM at the register is just tapping the same interface I could in a self-checkout point-of-sale.

For Disney, CMs can actually be one of the weaker links in their customer service. CMs have bad days, are underpaid, and often don’t have the authority they need to actually do their jobs. CMs don’t always have the latest/most accurate information. As we’ve seen in other threads on these boards, some CMs selectively choose which park policies they will enforce based on their own personal opinions. CM training has been reduced so much it can hardly be considered training at all.

I know many of us will lament the changes. We have fond memories of positive interactions with friendly and knowledgeable CMs who made the “Disney difference.” A few CMs still approach their jobs in this way, but for the most part, those days are over. Disney doesn’t use CMs like this anymore.

 

[The Empress Lilly]

I don't want to be mad at the Disney Company, I really don't! They have provided such an escape for me especially during my tumultuous childhood. Won't go into details of that, but you could imagine the need for a positive outlook such as something simple as a Disney World commercial and how much that gave to a child going through something somewhat severe and traumatizing.

However, over the last few short years, their business decisions have left me and my previous love for the place in a lot of question. I get that things need to change over time as changes are needed and are a big part of life to keep things moving forward, as well as for a company and that company's future prospects.

[Please know that I am not looking at the place in Rose Colored glasses (if that is even the correct saying). I have seen and dealt with bad and have become quite observant to which is what at a logical standpoint...not exactly sure as to why I have to point this out, but there you go.]

But, the re-imagining to take out per se' the Disney creative side of things just to help with customer flow, increase in sales, ways to provide more merchandise, has slowly over time began to weigh heavily in the back of my mind.

I don't hate IPs, I don't hate re-imaginings but Disney how somehow been able to take the "Disney" out of Disney for me.

Please don't hate (too much) as this is totally personal opinion, but don't feel discouraged to comment.

How do you all feel with Disney World and the current direction it is heading?

Angry...no. angry I'm not. Immorality, meanness, injustice make me angry. But TWDC is just a soulless, non-personal entity. Meanness, though, perhaps can be levied at TWDC management. Come to think of it, injustice too at the treatment of their employees.

Sad, despondent, yes. This no longer the Disney I used to love. Confused too - WDW is an object of love I imprinted on as a youngster. I feel no longer wanted as a guest, which in any other setting (except airlines) would mean my taking my business elsewhere immediately and without regret, but which leaves me feeling rejected and confused in the case of WDW.

What frustrates me is that they had me as a customer for life. And a good customer too. They brushed me aside for a few dollars more from a different audience they coveted slightly more.

Specifically: aiming WDW ever lower on the cultural ladder (FW's nerd wonderland into 'look kids...there's Moana!'), exhorbitant prices and endless upcharges (begone, second rate $130 ticket pauper), cost cutting, and reducing WDW too much from a creative product in its own right to a character vehicle (look kids, it's Moana!...at breakfast, at the ride, at the gondola, at the fireworks show, at dinner, on the bedsheet, at the other ride, at)

 

[cookiee_munster]

I don't want to be mad at the Disney Company, I really don't! They have provided such an escape for me especially during my tumultuous childhood. Won't go into details of that, but you could imagine the need for a positive outlook such as something simple as a Disney World commercial and how much that gave to a child going through something somewhat severe and traumatizing.

However, over the last few short years, their business decisions have left me and my previous love for the place in a lot of question. I get that things need to change over time as changes are needed and are a big part of life to keep things moving forward, as well as for a company and that company's future prospects.

[Please know that I am not looking at the place in Rose Colored glasses (if that is even the correct saying). I have seen and dealt with bad and have become quite observant to which is what at a logical standpoint...not exactly sure as to why I have to point this out, but there you go.]

But, the re-imagining to take out per se' the Disney creative side of things just to help with customer flow, increase in sales, ways to provide more merchandise, has slowly over time began to weigh heavily in the back of my mind.

I don't hate IPs, I don't hate re-imaginings but Disney how somehow been able to take the "Disney" out of Disney for me.

Please don't hate (too much) as this is totally personal opinion, but don't feel discouraged to comment.

How do you all feel with Disney World and the current direction it is heading?

I feel like this is felt by a lot of people on here (myself included)

Unfortunately when you look at the company from a business perspective, merchandise is where its at. A lot of films these days really do require sales from merchandise. I can't remember where i read it, but it was a pie chart on the amount of money made by the new star wars movies, and merchandise/toy sales just wiped the floor over movie ticket revenue, i was shocked.

This leads into IP's. When you base an attraction around a popular IP merchandise for that will obviously sell a lot more. And that's what the head honcho's are looking for. go on the ride and exit right through the gift shop $$$$$$$. This is pretty much why the park is still hanging onto the hype from the 90's renaissance films, and now of course you have the likes of Frozen fever taking hold of kids which will never die out. It may fade a bit, but Frozen really is the Little Mermaid, Beauty & the Beast, Aladdin for kids today. The company are going to milk this franchise as MUCH as they possibly can.

I really do worry that we really won't see any true none IP based attractions ever again because of this. Fantasy Springs at Tokyo Disney Sea really did it for me. I know the park has Mermaid Lagoon, but still, pretty much everything else was original/none IP.

It's ironic isn't it? wanting to see "less disney IP" in a Disney Park but yeah, we all know how well imagineering can create something without a billion dollar frachise behind it.

 

[ppete1975]

No disrespect but i don’t understand these comments. If you dont like something dont go or support. If i go to a restaurant and it used to be great but the last 5 times tastes like cat food, dont go back. Find somewhere else to enjoy and spend your money. Lifes too short and theres a world to explore.

 

[PostScott]

I don't want to be mad at the Disney Company, I really don't! They have provided such an escape for me especially during my tumultuous childhood. Won't go into details of that, but you could imagine the need for a positive outlook such as something simple as a Disney World commercial and how much that gave to a child going through something somewhat severe and traumatizing.

However, over the last few short years, their business decisions have left me and my previous love for the place in a lot of question. I get that things need to change over time as changes are needed and are a big part of life to keep things moving forward, as well as for a company and that company's future prospects.

[Please know that I am not looking at the place in Rose Colored glasses (if that is even the correct saying). I have seen and dealt with bad and have become quite observant to which is what at a logical standpoint...not exactly sure as to why I have to point this out, but there you go.]

But, the re-imagining to take out per se' the Disney creative side of things just to help with customer flow, increase in sales, ways to provide more merchandise, has slowly over time began to weigh heavily in the back of my mind.

I don't hate IPs, I don't hate re-imaginings but Disney how somehow been able to take the "Disney" out of Disney for me.

Please don't hate (too much) as this is totally personal opinion, but don't feel discouraged to comment.

How do you all feel with Disney World and the current direction it is heading?

Well theres alot of factors that come into play, but I think the biggest one would be the change in leadership. Iger's "mantra" was basically to acquire all the IPs and grow the Disney brand. His focus was not to tell original Disney stories; and with that, the parks drastically changed with the company. It's a very lucrative business model that won't be going away anytime soon as long as it brings in the big bucks.

 

[PostScott]

No disrespect but i don’t understand these comments. If you dont like something dont go or support. If i go to a restaurant and it used to be great but the last 5 times tastes like cat food, dont go back. Find somewhere else to enjoy and spend your money. Lifes too short and theres a world to explore.

While yes thats logical, I think it's good to critique the things that you enjoy. A restaurant (most of the time) don't carry the same affect as Disney parks do. People here just want to see Disney the way they they're nostalgic to. However, I do understand your point.

 

[KBLovedDisney]

Sad, despondent, yes. This no longer the Disney I used to love. Confused too - WDW is an object of love I imprinted on as a youngster.

1,000x this ^^^^^^^

That is exactly how I feel. I was trying to convey that in my original post but you have been able to put my exact feelings into two three sentences.

This is no longer the Disney I used to love.

:’(

 

[KBLovedDisney]

No disrespect but i don’t understand these comments. If you dont like something dont go or support. If i go to a restaurant and it used to be great but the last 5 times tastes like cat food, dont go back. Find somewhere else to enjoy and spend your money. Lifes too short and theres a world to explore.

No worries. I can understand your view point.
Personally, like another poster said, my childhood was massively imprinted on by Disney World and with how they changed, it is like you have been with someone for many years and you thought you knew them and felt comfortable in their presence. And then time goes by and their appearance and personality start to change to something unrecognizable. This leaves a person like myself in confusion and sorrow. Does that make sense?

 

[KBLovedDisney]

I guess I have to ask about the concern about layoffs. Has anyone figured out what it costs to pay someone when there is limited or no income to speak of. The 23000 layoffs (company wide) on the payroll for an average of 7 hours and an average of $8.50 an hour is $1,368,500.00 per day. Do we want them to go broke, because they can, you know. Also, I don't know how unemployment works in Florida or California, but if one is still working they probably cannot collect it so a layoff means they can. Also in the business world large companies such as Disney are self insured when it comes to unemployment, so in a sense they are still paying them. There is no definite indication that they won't hire them all back once this crap is over. I think it is unfair to fault them for dealing with a Pandemic that they didn't create and expect that it is a wise move to continue to pay down the reserve that they had. They have some areas were they really can't lay anyone off. Animal Kingdom comes to mind. It has thousands of animals that need to be fed and cared for no matter what is going on outside.

I think my biggest complaint I have about the layoffs is that in comparison to construction and refurbishing, they could have held off on all of that and paid employees and routine maintenance on older rides. IMHO, it feels like the looks of the parks took precedence over paying its employees. I know I may be wrong but that was my take away.

 

[KBLovedDisney]

You wanna know the what the crazy thing is though? Somehow Disney World has such a strong pull on us that no matter how angry or upset we may get at their decisions, I want to go back...even during a worldwide pandemic and I miss the place like crazy.



I know it is so hypocritical but I am sure I am not alone.

 

[Shouldigo12]

I believe this is actually why Disney is changing these things. In previous generations, the full, undivided attention of a CM felt like good customer service. The CM could answer any questions, say kind things, and create a positive interaction.

But times have changed. These days, interaction with a CM causes anxiety in a lot of guests. Guests don’t need to go to CMs for information, because they have all the info they need (which is often more accurate) online. CMs can slow down a transaction: tapstiles are more efficient that showing a CM my paper FP, and the CM at the register is just tapping the same interface I could in a self-checkout point-of-sale.

For Disney, CMs can actually be one of the weaker links in their customer service. CMs have bad days, are underpaid, and often don’t have the authority they need to actually do their jobs. CMs don’t always have the latest/most accurate information. As we’ve seen in other threads on these boards, some CMs selectively choose which park policies they will enforce based on their own personal opinions. CM training has been reduced so much it can hardly be considered training at all.

I know many of us will lament the changes. We have fond memories of positive interactions with friendly and knowledgeable CMs who made the “Disney difference.” A few CMs still approach their jobs in this way, but for the most part, those days are over. Disney doesn’t use CMs like

this anymore.

I would say that guests and customers don't like as much interaction now is probably pretty accurate. I can say for certain that where I work, every once in awhile the managers demand that we start being friendlier, greet every customer, tell them your day, thank them for coming, etc, or get written up. And these demands are always met with an immediate increase in customer complaints. "Why do they keep stopping me to talk when I'm shopping. Why are they telling me their name when they have a name tag on. Why do I have to tell five employees I don't need help before I'm left alone" and so on. Most people just really don't like that in-your-face friendliness. The only people we get a positive response from are people around the 60-70 age bracket, and even they get annoyed by it sometimes. So yes, I think the new Disney customer service is at least in part because that's what the newer generations prefer.

 

[Dog Ate Mouse]

Honestly when it comes to the layoff's, in these times what do you expect. I am more concerned about the restaurants around where i live in hopes they can remain open. A lot of little stores I loved has closed there doors for good. I love WDW and all it has and had to offer. Right now I am not thinking about WDW due to life in general needs to come back. My wife and I are blessed to be working. I am concerned for all that need and want to work that cannot due to jobs went away or companies laid off and small business has closed. We try to support our local restaurants but it is getting chilly up hear in Southern NJ. Restaurants are only allowed to have 25% seating capacity with no talks of yet increasing this. It is getting chilly to eat outside. Now starting to worry about some of the places I eat at cannot stay a float with 25% seating capacity. Our Gov has no plans of increasing indoor dining. So when I think of of WDW, I look at it as my local area needs to be taken care of first and people needs to get back to work and start earning paychecks. Now is not the time for my wife and I to think about going to WDW and spending when I am trying to help business in my local area stay a float. We are having stay-cations and support local attractions and business in hopes that a lot of places we love and visit and eat at stays open.

Things change, some for the better and some not. But this world and WDW will be constantly evolving to fit the times and mood of the industry. WDW was a big part of my childhood and still is. But right now need to take care of life first and when that makes a come back then will think WDW and spending some money to stay and eat and enjoy the parks. My priorities have changed right now and hopefully will change again when times get good again.