Rumor Disneyland Tomorrowland Future - What to do?

[THE 1HAPPY HAUNT]

I say tear down all of tomorrow land except SPACE MOUNTAIN. get rid of autopia and the lagoon, bring in the tron coaster, redo the astro orbitor to where the rockets used to be and make sure they are on a platform, bring a new people mover and rocket rods but done right this time and use the remodel for an expansion of space mountain and make it bigger and longer. that is a tomorrow land I wana see.

 

[yensidtlaw1969]

These are the hourly capacities for the attractions that are either rumored to be, or theoretically on the chopping block for any sort of update..
Buzz Lightyear - 1,700
Star Tours - 1,450
Autopia - 2,800
Magic Eye Theater - 2,300
Nemo Subs - 850
Astro Orbiter - 650

Tron is apparently 3,500. If a similar version of Tron is coming with a similar hourly capacity, that means 6,250 worth of hourly capacity will have been lost in Tomorrowland. This number would just be in order to match the land’s capacity to what it currently is. I wonder how much this would be prioritized when pursuing this update.

I don't believe for a second that TRON has a THRC of 3,500 - The Haunted Mansion is only 3,200 (remember, theoretical) and that's one of the highest capacity ride systems anywhere. Given like attractions - Everest, RNR, Big Thunder - my guess would be it's closer to Buzz territory in terms of capacity. How could TRON possibly put through more people than Pirates??

All this is to underscore that the potential of a new Tomorrowland that really starts from scratch sounds exciting, but I can't help but think the chances of a net-gain from a project that big have to be a little slim . . . Individually you could build a better attraction than the Autopia, than Buzz, than The Magic Eye Theater, but I worry that we'll never get that all at once from current day Disney. Do we really think they're gonna build us 5 new attractions at once that are better than what we have now? AND some sort of exciting redo of Space Mountain (when Space Mountain got one not 15 years ago)?

I'm not saying it couldn't be done, but I'm cautiously optimistic . . . if Disney wanted to throw gobs of money at 5 new attractions I'd have thought they'd do that in Star Wars Land. What makes us think they're really that ready to commit to that much work in Tomorrowland?And even if they are, when's the last time we saw a total land makeover this thorough that really impressed, Fantasyland 1983? It's totally fair that the attraction menu in Tomorrowland needs an overhaul, I just worry that so much money will go to building the land new bones that the actual attractions will get the short end of the stick.

Cautiously optimistic. I sure hope they know what they're doing. This also stems from the fact that I think the last thing Disneyland needs is a New Fantasyland. I understand the impulse, but talk about priorities -- Fantasyland is solid. You could argue nearly every other land in Disneyland - not to mention DCA - needs a makeover, needs real attention, before Fantasyland does. Ripping out the ramble of the Monorail for that, whatever it is, seems like a bold move in an unnecessary direction . . . I'd rather they really focus on nailing Tomorrowland first.

It all sounds very ambitious, I hope they bring their A-Game . . .

 

[britain]

I don't believe for a second that TRON has a THRC of 3,500 - The Haunted Mansion is only 3,200 (remember, theoretical) and that's one of the highest capacity ride systems anywhere. Given like attractions - Everest, RNR, Big Thunder - my guess would be it's closer to Buzz territory in terms of capacity. How could TRON possibly put through more people than Pirates??

All this is to underscore that the potential of a new Tomorrowland that really starts from scratch sounds exciting, but I can't help but think the chances of a net-gain from a project that big have to be a little slim . . . Individually you could build a better attraction than the Autopia, than Buzz, than The Magic Eye Theater, but I worry that we'll never get that all at once from current day Disney. Do we really think they're gonna build us 5 new attractions at once that are better than what we have now? AND some sort of exciting redo of Space Mountain (when Space Mountain got one not 15 years ago)?

I'm not saying it couldn't be done, but I'm cautiously optimistic . . . if Disney wanted to throw gobs of money at 5 new attractions I'd have thought they'd do that in Star Wars Land. What makes us think they're really that ready to commit to that much work in Tomorrowland?And even if they are, when's the last time we saw a total land makeover this thorough that really impressed, Fantasyland 1983? It's totally fair that the attraction menu in Tomorrowland needs an overhaul, I just worry that so much money will go to building the land new bones that the actual attractions will get the short end of the stick.

Cautiously optimistic. I sure hope they know what they're doing. This also stems from the fact that I think the last thing Disneyland needs is a New Fantasyland. I understand the impulse, but talk about priorities -- Fantasyland is solid. You could argue nearly every other land in Disneyland - not to mention DCA - needs a makeover, needs real attention, before Fantasyland does. Ripping out the ramble of the Monorail for that, whatever it is, seems like a bold move in an unnecessary direction . . . I'd rather they really focus on nailing Tomorrowland first.

It all sounds very ambitious, I hope they bring their A-Game . . .

I agree, though I don’t think the Fantasyland project is a “New Fantasyland” but rather “More Fantasyland” in the vaguely unthemed area between Small World and the Subs.

Very odd that Space Mountain is rumored to be revamped. To me this either means the entry areas/environments are being seriously revamped, but probably not the ride itself.

OR some IP is coming to make Space its home.

 

[yensidtlaw1969]

I agree, though I don’t think the Fantasyland project is a “New Fantasyland” but rather “More Fantasyland” in the vaguely unthemed area between Small World and the Subs.

I suppose, in fairness, that's what WDW's New Fantasyland was too, mostly. That's where the real meat of it was, anyway, with some relatively minor redressing on the side.

And don't get me wrong, I'd love to see DL add a Beauty and the Beast ride, or a Frozen ride, or any of the things that have been rumored over the last few years. I suspect something like that will finally be popping up when word gets out. But couldn't we lose the bloated Fantasyland Theatre for any of that, or devise something that somehow fits under the Monorail beam? The Motorboat Cruise area has needed something for the longest time, but it seems such a shame to lose all that winding beamway - it's such a big part of what makes the Monorail at Disneyland exciting to ride. Otherwise it becomes a commuter rail, and a pretty short one.

I also worry about the stylistic approach of Disneyland's Fantasyland - it's so rich and pure in its old-school theatrics. While the Tokyo BATB ride looks spectacular, there's just nothing in DL's Fantasyland on that sort of wavelength, and I worry shaking things up that much spells doom for the older bits with their dizzying charm. I'd die to see a diminutive, blacklight Beauty and the Beast ride in the style of Mr. Toad or Snow White turn up in DL's Fantasyland, but I can't imagine they're considering that. Disney doesn't seem to be in the business of building that kind of attraction anymore. Mermaid feels stuck between the worlds of the old-form classic Disney Fantasyland Dark Ride and the new-form fully realized, highly expensive, overlit and a little artless Disney Dark Ride. The new style aims to impress with technical prowess more than it engages the guest in a dynamic experience.

Not that I don't see the appealing parts of that style of attraction, and those parts do exist, but they rail hard against what DL's Fantasyland is doing. I worry that tucking one in there would signal the start of a stylistic shift DL's Fantasyland just does not need to make. It would be such a loss is that shift took place.

 

[Disneysea05]

It's also a ridiculous ride. When I think "light cycle" I don't think of a large, outdoor roller coaster.... I think an indoor, high speed dark ride with immersive screen, lighting, and physical sets to give the illusion of being inside Tron.

Only a very small portion of it is outdoors, the rest is more or less what you described. My only issue when I rode it was that I expected it to be longer.

 

[captveg]

I, for one, welcome a complete removal of all TL aside from Space Mountain, as well as the removal of the FL theater and motorboat area for what will undoubtedly be the Frozen ride and character restaurant.

While the Tron coaster is a duplicated ride, one thing about its neon asthestics is that it's somewhat IP proof: it looks cool even if you have no idea what Tron is.

In regards to the Astro Orbiter, I really can't blame them for not spending the money right now to move it back up high when they may be tearing down the old station in the near future with this overhaul anyway. It should be no problem to find a brand new up in the air location for it when they redesign the entire land.

It's also possible that they could keep a dark ride or two (or create new ones) that go under the Tron coaster at spots, similar to how TSMM is under its coaster. Imagine looking from Main Street down towards TL with a dark ride on the left and right similar to now but without the lines or AO being right in your face. Then instead of an abandoned PM track you have one curve of the Tron coaster zipping around the top of those two rides on either side. Looking down into the land, there's the new AO spinner, 3 stories up in the air in the helix of the Tron coaster. Space Mountain on the right of that with shops and dining. To the left of AO is the reshaped lagoon and new Monorail station, as well as the pathway to the railroad station with new neon lighting theming. And in the footprint of the Autopia loading station next to the lagoon another smaller indoor dark ride underneath a foothold of the Tron coaster. On the other side of the Lagoon sits the Arendelle section of expanded Fantasyland, using the Matterhorn and Lagoon area as a mild transition to the more thematically modern aesthetics of the area and the "snow covered" northern European village with a port.

I get many have a love for the PM and Monorail tracks, or the subs and autopia. But they (along with the design of the Caurosel building) have hindered a real modern use of that land for decades now. They are simply infrastructure that has lost its original designed purpose and only hinders using that land for attractions modern customers want. Autopia's footprint alone is huge. It's time for an overhaul.

 

[Nland316]

I can’t believe how relatively immediate this overhaul is in our future. This has been something discussed on and off literally Tomorrowland’s last overhaul. I know it’s still rumor at this point with nothing officially confirmed, but these rumors seem to be gaining some sort of traction at long last.

 

[SuddenStorm]

Keep the subs, it's such an insanely unique ride. Yes, I know other sub style rides exist- but none are the same ride system, or as iconic. Overhaul it... make it fresh, but don't get rid of it.

Shorten the Autopia to allow space for Fantasyland expansion. Build a new fleet of cars.

Either put in a new musical animatronic show in the Carousel theater... or demo it and put in a new attraction.

Ditch Buzz Lightyear, put in a new unique non IP ride. Ditch Star Tours, put in a new IP free ride. No simulators or screen based attractions, or shooters. Something new, unique, and in the spirit of what Disney's Imagineers used to come up with.

Put the Rocket Jets back in their proper location... and build a new Peoplemover, updating any infrastructure necessary to do so. Disneyland needs more lengthy attractions that aren't based on the hot new property. Something slow paced and relaxing would be welcome.

Ditch the Pizza Port and put in a new attraction. Get rid of the theater and put a restaurant in there.

I think Disneyland's Tomorrowland is beautifully laid out. I don't want a full demo. It's current state is only abysmal due to management mistakes and neglect. Decades of management being cheap and relying on band aid fixes. What's there can be repurposed and rebuilt to make the land fresh, but I shudder to think of what modern WDI would dream up... and I highly doubt it'd be better than what was there in the '80s.

And while this is more wishful thinking than anything... bring back Baxter and give him complete creative control over the land. Let him fix the mistakes he was involved with back in '98. We're not gonna have his generation around forever, and Disney should cherish the opportunity to have people who trained directly under Walt era designers working on the park.

 

[captveg]

I can’t believe how relatively immediate this overhaul is in our future. This has been something discussed on and off literally Tomorrowland’s last overhaul. I know it’s still rumor at this point with nothing officially confirmed, but these rumors seem to be gaining some sort of traction at long last.

I think it came down to needing something like Star Wars on the other side of the park to shift the crowds and make people less bothered by the shutting down of an entire land. Much easier to justify an overhaul of TL / East side of FL when the customer interest is now focused on the opposite side of the park. Add to that the new Marvel in DCA and MMRR in Toontown opening in the next couple years drawing those crowds, too. Never a better time to finally reshape TL again in a major way.

 

[Californian Elitist]

Demolish everything except Space, Autopia (update), and the Subs (re-theme). Return to the original purpose of Tomorrowland.

No Tron, please.

 

[DrAlice]

I really want a new Tomorrowland, but after seeing what Disney has done in recent years (Pixar Pier and Mission:Breakout, I'm looking at you..), I just don't trust Imagineering to get this right. IMO, Tomorrowland will take "out of the box thinking" to get it right, and current management seems to only be able to slap IP reskins on clones of rides that already exist. Now, if they take the creative will that went into designing and building Galaxy's edge, you'll have my attention. I'm just fearful that they won't do that here. Really hope I'm wrong.

 

[rle4lunch]

What's this over at blogmickey talking about the monorail getting yanked out? apologies if this is in a different thread.

 

[George Lucas on a Bench]

What's this over at blogmickey talking about the monorail getting yanked out? apologies if this is in a different thread.

Now that's a bad idea. I know a lot of Disney people suggest things like this in the name of progress and always outrageously quote "Disneyland is not a museum" because they don't have their own opinion, but this is obviously wrong.

 

[britain]

What's this over at blogmickey talking about the monorail getting yanked out? apologies if this is in a different thread.

Where on blogmickey?

 

[Phroobar]

Disneyland is a theme park. Everything, include the Castle, is fair game for being yanked out.

 

[rle4lunch]

Where on blogmickey?

my apologies, micechat hinted to it.
https://www.micechat.com/223809-tom...dN9Bswq38b4_Ycc9hL-eteU3ktHSGVug82xhtWv5BZT1s

 

[truecoat]

my apologies, micechat hinted to it.
https://www.micechat.com/223809-tom...dN9Bswq38b4_Ycc9hL-eteU3ktHSGVug82xhtWv5BZT1s

Reduced, not yanked out.

 

[SuddenStorm]

I agree with all this but just to play devils advocate they can say that the benches can be removed on really busy days where the planter in front of HM couldn’t be.

But then again, when is it not busy at Disneyland?

It's interesting that there's an attitude that there needs to be less seating on busy days to increase walkways.

I'd think that on busy days, there needs to be more seating. Since they're stripping every planter, maybe they should be adding benches in the new space.

Also, I imagine the reservation system is going to stop widespread pandemonium for at least the first month (honestly, they should keep the reservations for a good six months... seems like a great way to have the land opening without killing the park experience) so I wonder how much of Project Stardust is even necessary in the long term.

 

[SuddenStorm]

Disneyland is a theme park. Everything, include the Castle, is fair game for being yanked out.

 

[George Lucas on a Bench]

Maybe they should just demo everything except Star Wars Land.