Disney(World) vs. Disney(land)?

[jt04]

More thoughts. Cruise line bookings reported up 38% year over year and apparently this is included in the Q4 guidance of total bookings up 1%. If this is the case, Walt Disney World is officially in serious, serious trouble.

Perhaps they could expand the MK and add a state of the art land to DAK. Oh, wait!

 

[jt04]

I mean, he's been in basically this EXACT spot before, and was an absolute success. Turned DL around in time for it's 50th.

Welcome to Team Optimism. Never thought I would win you over!

 

[pheneix]

Now they get to Orlando. International visitation flat. Europe down, Latin America up. The falloff in bookings is coming domestically.

 

[JCtheparrothead]

I have an idea I'm throwing out ( and releasing any claim to so it could be used ) ...

First, I'm against the idea of cloning Radiator Springs Racers. Beyond just wanting something to be unique to DCA, I worry the ride would lose much of its charm divorced from the rest of Carsland. I certainly wouldn't expect near the merchandise to be moved were the ride cloned and not the entire land.

With that said, I started thinking through how to accomplish what Disney wants (a mega-hit ride like Radiator Springs Racers and a sure-fire success like Radiator Springs Racers would be) while also providing something different and a little more suited for DHS. Something with that would bring the cache that RSR has, but tweaked for DHS. While brewing over this the answer hit me...

Cars - World Grand Prix. A ride that can use the system of Radiator Springs Racers while also providing new sights and scenes. If we're going to get something from the world of Cars, let DCA have Cars 1 and DHS have Cars 2. It works for the ride; you still can have indoor scenes explaining the race, and then you still need the race portion. You can even further strengthen a "Cars Lot" portion of Pixar Studios, all tied together by Cars 2 with the World Grand Prix and an updated Lights, Motor, Action highlighting the Cars 2 spy motif.

The main thing I would hope Disney could incorporate would be a World Grand Prix Jr, an intertwining (or at least connected) Cars-esque Speedway, so all ages could enjoy the fun.

Good idea.

 

[sweetpee_1993]

It is only down (IF it is) because of increased competition from Legoland and people delaying visits awaiting the FLE.

Tempest in a tea cup.

I'm no insider so don't go flamin' on me too hard. I'd just like to point out that my family may not be the only one who is kinda tired of spending $10k for annoying disappointment. And we haven't gone to Legoland. We are in no way excited about the FLE. There is also the factor that some people are sorta "over" WDW in it's current state. And I say that in the nicest way. Really.

 

[jt04]

Now they get to Orlando. International visitation flat. Europe down, Latin America up. The falloff in bookings is coming domestically.

Much of this is the poor employment picture in this country. Even people that have jobs are worried and much less likely to choose an expensive vacation.

Imagine if we get conditions that would allow the economy to grow. Remember, Iger is done this with an incredibly underperforming economy.

Skies the limit should we get sensible economic policies that allow for growth.

 

[sweetpee_1993]

More thoughts. Cruise line bookings reported up 38% year over year and apparently this is included in the Q4 guidance of total bookings up 1%. If this is the case, Walt Disney World is officially in serious, serious trouble.

Not sure if that 38% includes numbers because of the Fantasy addition to the fleet but I can certainly say for me & mine that we are opting for DCL over WDW right now primarily because of the difference in quality & overall satisfaction for the vacation dollar.

 

[xdan0920]

Much of this is the poor employment picture in this country. Even people that have jobs are worried and much less likely to choose an expensive vacation.

Imagine if we get conditions that would allow the economy to grow. Remember, Iger is done this with an incredibly underperforming economy.

Skies the limit should we get sensible economic policies that allow for growth.

How do you explain DLR then? If the economy is the issue, it should be effecting resorts across the board.

 

[menamechris]

Bob Iger absolutely destroyed any hint of any additional capital investment coming to WDPR aside from New Fantasyland and Shanghai Disneyland. I would presume that Avatarland is implied when they speak of expeditures going forward but it was not mentioned by name.

Well...this doesn't sound promising..

 

[jt04]

How do you explain DLR then? If the economy is the issue, it should be effecting resorts across the board.

The recent trend towards "staycations" only bolsters DL's business model. Not to mention all the adds to DCA over the last year or two.

The weak global economy hurts WDW more because International travel is so critical. It is why it is so important that central Florida and not just WDW become known as a great tourist destination. Uni is doing their part.

 

[Brewmaster]

How do you explain DLR then? If the economy is the issue, it should be effecting resorts across the board.

I've noticed he does this frequently. It's a classic trick to never have to admit you're incorrect (or under informed as it were). In this instance he argues that DLR is enjoying growth due to the capital investment to the DCA reboot, and that WDW is fine, never been better really, and is next on the list of cash hand outs and will reap the same benefits (thereby subconsciously admitting that there is a problem and that staleness exists in the parks). Secondly when faced with the fact that Florida's numbers are in deed down (especially in their hallmark European visitor numbers)' he simply blames the economy (what an albatross that is).

 

[ScoutN]

Random thoughts from conference call as I listen to it:

Bob Iger absolutely destroyed any hint of any additional capital investment coming to WDPR aside from New Fantasyland and Shanghai Disneyland. I would presume that Avatarland is implied when they speak of expeditures going forward but it was not mentioned by name.

WDPR profits were massively juiced by Tokyo Disney's revenues coming back and a new cruise ship. DIsney is reporting Domestic Parks attendance as up 1% on the quarter. We know how Disneyland's summer has played out so it goes without saying that WDW is running off the rails. The conference call also notes that numbers of rooms occupied was on par with prior year but available inventory has increased. This means that WDW is having major trouble selling new construction and is cannibalizing existing inventory with new product. And that was reflected in Q3 which ended June 30. For the bean counters, July absolutely sucked for Walt Disney World with water parks being the only bright spot against lower theme park attendance and noticably lower room sales. This is also reflected with lower Magical Express ridership and fewer dining packages sold. Whether Disney bothers confirming this during the Q&A segment is anybody's guess.

EDIT: My question was already answered. Disney reporting that Q4 room bookings up 1% with prices higher at 4%. No breakdown of how these numbers breakdown with respect to DLR, WDW, and now Aulani. My educated guess is that WDW is modestly down, DLR is at or near capacity on higher prices, and Aulani may just be plodding along. Or Aulani could be doing gangbusters and WDW is noticably down. The only constant is Disneyland's blockbuster summer. Thank you Disney for your thorough guidance to concerned investors. Geez.

Excellent breakdown, sir! Very much appreciated! Do you see DVC as another mechanism that possibly enhances the attendance to Uni or SEA parks? We are actually staying on DVC points next week with no plans of going into a WDW park. Uni and SEA offerings!

 

[TP2000]

Those coming attractions are coming because they knew at TDA what could happen in that market if Potter showed up. And, no, they didn't expect Transformers to be as big as it has turned out to be as well.

I 'think' that you'll see constuction walls at DL's T-land soon after Christmas (that's almost UNI speed!)

That's great news for Disneyland and Tomorrowland, as Tomorrowland is the most disjointed and meaningless corner of the entire Anaheim resort now. Now that DCA just leapfrogged several other Disney parks in America to suddenly become the second or third best behind the Castle parks, it's good news that TDA knows they need to focus back on Disneyland Park ASAP.

But why couldn't TDO have had those same long-term instincts and been planning for this better? I would think blunders on this scale would lead to forced resignations; actually thinking Dueling Dumbos and a Sprinkler Train would be some sort of legit pull to get people to the parks this summer, for example. The NextGen thing is a big mess too, but that's so big and has been bought off on so many execs above and beyond anyone in TDO (Rasulo, Staggs, and mostly Iger) that it will continue to be a sacred cow for years even after it fails in the marketplace.

But really... TDO?!? It took them this long to figure all this out?!?

 

[jt04]

I've noticed he does this frequently. It's a classic trick to never have to admit you're incorrect (or under informed as it were). In this instance he argues that DLR is enjoying growth due to the capital investment to the DCA reboot, and that WDW is fine, never been better really, and is next on the list of cash hand outs and will reap the same benefits (thereby subconsciously admitting that there is a problem and that staleness exists in the parks). Secondly when faced with the fact that Florida's numbers are in deed down (especially in their hallmark European visitor numbers)' he simply blames the economy (what an albatross that is).

Actually what I said was that TDO has managed to keep WDW successful despite the global downturn and the lack of infusion of capital in new park attractions. That is what TDO needed to do while Iger bailed out and then plugged the leaks at the DLR.

Now the pendulum swings towards WDW with the opening of the FLE on Dec 6th and the Pandora project. For starters.

Indeed.

 

[misterID]

Jt's defense of TDO and the state of WDW in this thread seems very familiar...


Move along folks, nothing to see here. Everything is fine.

 

[jt04]

That's great news for Disneyland and Tomorrowland, as Tomorrowland is the most disjointed and meaningless corner of the entire Anaheim resort now. Now that DCA just leapfrogged several other Disney parks in America to suddenly become the second or third best behind the Castle parks, it's good news that TDA knows they need to focus back on Disneyland Park ASAP.

Interesting that you did not hear this news from Al lutz about 10 days ago when he posted the same info. I am suprised as a DL fan you do not read him more.

TDO had to wait for the DLR to get all its ducks in a row which they finally have.

 

[pheneix]

Excellent breakdown, sir! Very much appreciated! Do you see DVC as another mechanism that possibly enhances the attendance to Uni or SEA parks? We are actually staying on DVC points next week with no plans of going into a WDW park. Uni and SEA offerings!

Very likely. DVC owners are basically committed to trips to Orlando for the next 40 years and there are a lot of them. Universal's guests have to stay somewhere, right?

 

[ScoutN]

Very likely. DVC owners are basically committed to trips to Orlando for the next 40 years and there are a lot of them. Universal's guests have to stay somewhere, right?

It boils down to the fact that my other notices how stagnant the creativity in the parks are. Even extended family that have been a handful of a times since early '08 has noticed and decided not to venture down there (one is taking his family out west, one guess where!). We have already nixed a day at WDW for our Dec. trip in favor of BGT's CT this year. Rumbles have it they are taking a ton from BGW's highly successful CT down there. Ahh, how wonderful an event in Florida with actual, all-out decor... Can you imagine if SWO eventually does that?

 

[jt04]

Very likely. DVC owners are basically committed to trips to Orlando for the next 40 years and there are a lot of them. Universal's guests have to stay somewhere, right?

Well they can't stay at my house.

 

[TalkingHead]

When WAS the last time you visited the Florida parks (or any Disney parks), JT?