Disney World unfairly slammed for wages.

[raven]

Again, when you hire on as a CM at WDW, you know exactly what you'll be making before you even start. Heck, all of their starting rates are clearly listed on their employment website for anyone to see.

To hire on and then be mad at your pay is just idiotic.

Partially correct. But as I stated in my other post, you aren't told all of the expectations and details about your job at Casting. They give you a general description. In my case they said "It requires a lot of bending, lifting and working around water." They failed to leave out the details about the unsafe work environment, hazardous chemicals and lack of basic human communication among management and staff. They leave these out because they know no one in their right mind would accept such a job.

I was so excited to transfer from my Disney job in Michigan to here knowing that everything the company stood for would be in my lap. My eyes were openned quickly even though for the first year I tried to ignor it. Now you see it every day and are expected to just smile and ignor the problem.

 

[devoy1701]

without getting into the politics or anything of the like, i am going to give my .02 cents.

I am entertained that people who complain about the declining guest experience in the parks are the same people defending Disney and their wages.

People have stated that "disney has every right to pay what they pay" and that is a correct statement.

HOWEVER. I DO NOT go to Disney for a Walmart or Burger King experience.
I DO NOT stay at a Disney Resort for a Motel 6 experience.

If you are going to be charging 4 & 5 Diamond prices, I expect 4 & 5 Diamond Service.

The same goes for theme parks. I am NOT going for a regional amusement park experience. These parks are being marketed and sold as a World Class life changing family experience, and they brand their customer service as legendary, and as part of the experience. So if I am going to be charged 80.00 a day per person, I expect the same level of service I would get a Ski Resort that costs the same.

So I have LONG argued that Disney should not be hiring people who are "walmart" caliber, and in order to do that, they need to pay more so they can get the quality of people who can provide the experience that people are being charged for.

I argue that Disney is actually robbing the customer, and in turn robbing the share holder of long term value by NOT paying it's Cast Members more.

The problem is (that has been pointed out in other threads along the same topic of employee quality) is that there are not 50,000 people in the WDW area that have that caliber of skill/care that are wanting to work for Disney. Regardless of if Disney started paying better or filtering new hires better... WDW is too big and demands too many people to maintain that quality that the workforce has to offer.

 

[OFTeric]

I find this funny because if those wages went up a lot the guest experience would either be way more expensive or would just be cut.

Well there is an interesting thing to look at.

1 Day Park price at WDW in the year 2000: $46.00 - starting CM wage 6.00
1 Day Park price at WDW in the year 2004: $54.75 - starting CM wage 6.50
1 Day Park price at WDW in the year 2010: $79.00 - starting CM wage 7.25

So prices HAVE DRASTICALLY GONE UP over the past 10 years, and one could argue that the guest experience has also gone down, and that the interaction with CM's has also gone down.

So you tell me where this extra money is going.

hat tip to all ears for the ticket data http://allears.net/tix/tixincrease.htm

 

[stlbobby]

I find this funny because if those wages went up a lot the guest experience would either be way more expensive or would just be cut.

Again this is a false assumption. If the company raised wages and maintained the same bottom-line number for salaries you are right.

But, and I think this is what the other poster meant, if the company raises wages and accepts the short-term loss of margin it will pay dividends in the long run by increasing guest satisfaction and spending.

The problem with these strategies is it initially looks bad on the balance sheet and company officers, whose compensation is tied to that balance sheet directly or through stock prices, are reluctant to take that long-term approach.

 

[Tom]

This is a false assumption. If the union overused it's power and decided to extort the company than yes it could happen, but it isn't a forgone conclusion. It is more than possible that by having a more satisfied and professional workforce customer satisfaction and productivity would increase, increasing profits. An effective union can streamline human resources procedures such as filing grievances and pay structures saving the company time and money. Also by raising wages and benefits WDW would attract a better class of worker that could find better ways of doing things again saving the company money.

It is a longterm business strategy as opposed to a bottom-line strategy.

In my opinion the best bet for a company is to pay their employees well, not ridiculous but well, develop talent, and create a fair and pleasant environment, preventing turnover and the need for employees to form a union that can then demand too much. Just my personal view.

I completely understand and agree with what you're saying about the premise of unions, but Communism looked good on paper too

 

[Mr. Morrow]

Well there is an interesting thing to look at.

1 Day Park price at WDW in the year 2000: $46.00 - starting CM wage 6.00
1 Day Park price at WDW in the year 2004: $54.75 - starting CM wage 6.50
1 Day Park price at WDW in the year 2010: $79.00 - starting CM wage 7.25

So prices HAVE DRASTICALLY GONE UP over the past 10 years, and one could argue that the guest experience has also gone down, and that the interaction with CM's has also gone down.

So you tell me where this extra money is going.

hat tip to all ears for the ticket data http://allears.net/tix/tixincrease.htm

My point exactly the experience has gone down but not improved.

 

[stlbobby]

I completely understand and agree with what you're saying about the premise of unions, but Communism looked good on paper too

I'm not denying unions can have a detritus effect, I even cited UAW in my original post, but if the workforce is continuously disgruntled it will eventually affect profits.

Like I said the smart owner keeps people happy enough that a union is unnecessary.

 

[Tom]

Like I said the smart owner keeps people happy enough that a union is unnecessary.

I couldn't agree with this more!

 

[DisneyJoe]

Well there is an interesting thing to look at.

1 Day Park price at WDW in the year 2000: $46.00 - starting CM wage 6.00
1 Day Park price at WDW in the year 2004: $54.75 - starting CM wage 6.50
1 Day Park price at WDW in the year 2010: $79.00 - starting CM wage 7.25

So prices HAVE DRASTICALLY GONE UP over the past 10 years, and one could argue that the guest experience has also gone down, and that the interaction with CM's has also gone down.

So you tell me where this extra money is going.

There is not a 1 to 1 correspondence between ticket prices and wages. Tickets also pay for park operational expenses - fireworks, supplies, paint, electricity, gas, air conditioning, park expansions/ride or attraction maintenance...etc.

 

[OFTeric]

There is not a 1 to 1 correspondence between ticket prices and wages. Tickets also pay for park operational expenses - fireworks, supplies, paint, electricity, gas, air conditioning, park expansions/ride or attraction maintenance...etc.

Thank you, I am very aware of this. I am also very aware of the maint budgets for the parks, and that they were higher in 2000 than they are today.

 

[raven]

There is not a 1 to 1 correspondence between ticket prices and wages. Tickets also pay for park operational expenses - fireworks, supplies, paint, electricity, gas, air conditioning, park expansions/ride or attraction maintenance...etc.

...which all take low-paid employees to do for them. I think wat the poster was getting at is that even though prices have went up (as well as entertainment and guest experience) the pay rate to accomodate these things is relatively the same.

 

[s8film40]

There is not a 1 to 1 correspondence between ticket prices and wages. Tickets also pay for park operational expenses - fireworks, supplies, paint, electricity, gas, air conditioning, park expansions/ride or attraction maintenance...etc.

Well the money definetly didn't go there, Maybe somewhere else?

 

[theRIOT]

HOWEVER. I DO NOT go to Disney for a Walmart or Burger King experience.
I DO NOT stay at a Disney Resort for a Motel 6 experience.

If you are going to be charging 4 & 5 Diamond prices, I expect 4 & 5 Diamond Service.

Exactly.
Doesn't anyone remember the 'Disney Difference?'
It was an honor to be employed by the mouse and everyone knew it. They had the best, expected the best and they charged guests accordingly.

Somewhere down the line the difference was thrown out. Expectations were lowered while the price we pay to visit went up and up. You know it and I know it.

I love visiting the parks as much as the rest of you guys. I've been 6 or 8 times since I left in '05, but you can't tell me we're getting the best value for our vacation dollar. We can't be. There is still a lot to enjoy, but every year they take a little more away, and prices rise a little more.

The CM's are being expected to put on the magic - no matter what. We step on stage - smiling thought the heat, the humidity and the humiliation of being belittled by a company we once idolized.

Safety. We've all seen what's happened to the No. 1 goal. Bus drivers hitting children other vehicles. Monorail pilots being killed by a lack of care and staffing.

Courtesy. There is still plenty of this going around if you know where to look.

Show. This one is going the way of the buffalo - and not slowly.

Efficiency. The WDC is become a master of parting us with our $$$ quite efficiently.

</rant>

 

[hokielutz]

This is a false assumption. If the union overused it's power and decided to extort the company than yes it could happen, but it isn't a forgone conclusion. It is more than possible that by having a more satisfied and professional workforce customer satisfaction and productivity would increase, increasing profits. An effective union can streamline human resources procedures such as filing grievances and pay structures saving the company time and money. Also by raising wages and benefits WDW would attract a better class of worker that could find better ways of doing things again saving the company money.
/QUOTE]


What productivity are you talking about?? Being able to sell desserts and more Mickey Bars??

Also, don't forget how much it costs to administer a Union organization.

 

[wdwfan22]

Exactly.
Doesn't anyone remember the 'Disney Difference?'
It was an honor to be employed by the mouse and everyone knew it. They had the best, expected the best and they charged guests accordingly.

Somewhere down the line the difference was thrown out. Expectations were lowered while the price we pay to visit went up and up. You know it and I know it.

I love visiting the parks as much as the rest of you guys. I've been 6 or 8 times since I left in '05, but you can't tell me we're getting the best value for our vacation dollar. We can't be. There is still a lot to enjoy, but every year they take a little more away, and prices rise a little more.

The CM's are being expected to put on the magic - no matter what. We step on stage - smiling thought the heat, the humidity and the humiliation of being belittled by a company we once idolized.

Safety. We've all seen what's happened to the No. 1 goal. Bus drivers hitting children other vehicles. Monorail pilots being killed by a lack of care and staffing.

Courtesy. There is still plenty of this going around if you know where to look.

Show. This one is going the way of the buffalo - and not slowly.

Efficiency. The WDC is become a master of parting us with our $$$ quite efficiently.

</rant>

unfortunately this is the way of the world. As someone who has worked for Disney in a Human Resource role, I can tell you that hourly roles are often looked at as short term positions. Even some of the saliered positions are now looked at in this way. I left Disney after 3 years and now make twice what I made with them in the same field. It's sad that it has come to this way of thinking. I loved working for them however you have to go where the money is.

 

[Mr. Morrow]

Ok we are talking about a few dollars but if we were to start paying CM's 15 dollars at the start because that is what people think is fair there is no way you can tell be that ticket prices wouldn't go up.

 

[OFTeric]

Ok we are talking about a few dollars but if we were to start paying CM's 15 dollars at the start because that is what people think is fair there is no way you can tell be that ticket prices wouldn't go up.

Just for fun.... when Eisner retired, I figured out that you could give EVERY WDC employee, in EVERY line of business a 23,000.00 dollar a year raise for 15 years with Eisner's severance package.

 

[cactuscat]

college degree?

I have an office job right out of college even though I have been with the company over 1o years I still make under $14. Certain jobs are only worth so much.

When I was in High School, I worked for Kroger in Detroit making the princely sum of $1.00/hr
Was I supposed to say Kroger was unfair paying only $1.00/hr for a bag boy and stock clerk?
Michigan is a "closed shop" state, so after my 90 days probationary period was up, I would have had to pay the local food workers union $35.00 a week in dues and a $350.00 inititation fee.... for a job that payed $1.00/hr part time!
Who was unfair, Kroger or the Union?

 

[stlbobby]

This is a false assumption. If the union overused it's power and decided to extort the company than yes it could happen, but it isn't a forgone conclusion. It is more than possible that by having a more satisfied and professional workforce customer satisfaction and productivity would increase, increasing profits. An effective union can streamline human resources procedures such as filing grievances and pay structures saving the company time and money. Also by raising wages and benefits WDW would attract a better class of worker that could find better ways of doing things again saving the company money.
/QUOTE]


What productivity are you talking about?? Being able to sell desserts and more Mickey Bars??

Also, don't forget how much it costs to administer a Union organization.

Absolutely, every job can be done well and every job can be done poorly. A continuously disgruntled employee will not be as productive over the long term. There will always be unmotivated individuals, but for a large workforce as a whole many factors can be controlled to increase performance. Investing in the workforce will pay dividends to both the employee and the employer over time.

Even just selling snacks a person can make transactions accurately, quickly, and with excellent service or they can be a slow drag. The slow drag costs the company by keeping lines long--dissuading people from buying in the first place--and making people feel unhappy about spending their money--keeping them from returning. And in reality there are tons of entry level jobs at WDW that do way more than just sell things.

And by getting better employees across the board they change the corporate culture creating better better employees who will pay even bigger dividends as they move up the ladder.

As far as the cost of maintaining a union that cost is born by the employees and they will get what they pay for, just like anything else.

 

[floridabill]

Again this is a false assumption. If the company raised wages and maintained the same bottom-line number for salaries you are right.

But, and I think this is what the other poster meant, if the company raises wages and accepts the short-term loss of margin it will pay dividends in the long run by increasing guest satisfaction and spending.

The problem with these strategies is it initially looks bad on the balance sheet and company officers, whose compensation is tied to that balance sheet directly or through stock prices, are reluctant to take that long-term approach.

Well it's not really false, I say this because they would raise wages but and maintain the same bottom line number of salaries- then raise prices more and cut many things! It sad but it seems over the year the higher up's that have been hired are just money grubbing, they threw the disney difference out. they only care about number. Oh walt must be rolling in his grave =( seems disney has lost there way! hope they get back on the right path soon.