• Welcome to the WDWMAGIC.COM Forums!
    Please take a look around, and feel free to sign up and join the community.You can use your Twitter or Facebook account to sign up, or register directly.

News Disney Riviera Resort announced

Sirwalterraleigh

Well-Known Member
Well I did, she thought I did so mistakenly.

Thing is though, I agree everyone can disagree about things. But calling people stupid for disagreeing makes no sense to me.
Stupid is a little harsh...but it’s in the ballpark. I have grown tired of the “lack of insight” displayed by WDW consumers on pretty much every front...because it drags everyone’s experience down with it. DVC has gone that way too. It’s probably just me.

My two things are:
  1. “Responsible consumerism”. I beg...it doesn’t happen.
  2. trust the shovels. As evidenced by that work being done on the Brazil pavilion...won’t be long till I’m buying Marty those caipirinhas now 😎
 

MickeyMinnieMom

Well-Known Member
Advertisement
I still don’t get this “less of a good deal” It should never be any kind of investment decision. This is a timeshare, the Disney way. Which means there is a resale market. Whether or not you make money by reselling depends on how much direct price rises since you buy.

We bought nearly 10years ago, direct. It was only ever sold to us as “pre-paying for Disney vacations”. The guide even told us everything else was icing on the cake.

But I do realise that many people do buy thinking they can make a profit when they sell. More fool them.
“I still don’t get this “less of a good deal””: MATH

I never said INVESTMENT. I said good financial deal. There’s a difference. I assume ZERO salvage value for DVC — so not an investment in the true sense.

It’s a break-even time question. That time is lengthening with DVC over time. Ie less of a good financial deal. That’s all.
 
Last edited:

Sirwalterraleigh

Well-Known Member
Gotta tell you — in my old age (!!), I care less and less about people not being happy about a legit, well-reasoned opinion I may hold. Getting older is freeing! LOL!

Wrt DVC, I kinda’ WANTED to be able to get there on DRR... I actually like the design and location (THOUGH I HATE THAT IT IS NOT WALKABLE TO A PARK). But alas, I like math and logic too much, and I couldn’t get mine to work out with our particulars. Oh, well...
My young apprentice...

365250
 

MickeyMinnieMom

Well-Known Member
ok, ok. lol I feel like the kid that just knock down the stacked can display at the supermarket and caused an chain reaction.

thanks for the clarification @MickeyMinnieMom , the first post sounded so harsh. . Your original post said "how many of them can do a cost analysis"? now I'm not in the timeshare business so I definitely believe you have seen some eye raising situations. but I do hate this "holier than thou" attitude that I find persuasive here. I always want to know how you guys know so much about other peoples financial situation. How you know folks are going into debt? or whether or not they can afford up charges?

Anyway I assure you my friends DO know how to do a cost/break even analysis and my late husband and I were able to wrap our little brains around it. lol

Either way I've got no horse in this race, I'm more the C'est la vie type gal. Your money, your choice.
Sounds like you might be taking this personally. It isn’t personal in any way.

Most people do not conduct a meaningful break even analysis. Whether they know how to and don’t, or don’t know how to. Most take the salesperson’s word for it. Truly.

I claimed no knowledge of other people’s financial situation. I keep referring to not being able to make the math work WITH MY PARTICULARS — everyone obviously has particulars as well so I can’t say what kind of a deal it is for everyone.

I can say the break even time is getting longer and longer, all assumptions held constant.

My point is that most don’t even conduct the analysis. If your friends do, they’re further ahead than most, and excellent for them!
 

eliza61nyc

Well-Known Member
All good.

Back to the regular schedule program. Riveria resort, Yay or nay.

I'm a pay where you want to stay gal so since I have no desire to ever stay here, not even thinking about adding on.
 

LuvtheGoof

Proud DVC Member
Premium Member
This resort looks lovely, but by my break-even analysis using our vacationing particulars, there's no way to justify this purchase. The only way I can get to a break-even is assuming the same rate of increase in dues (actually 5.5%/yr since we've owned), as in rack rates (actually 3.6%/yr since we've owned DVC) -- and even there I arrive at 40yrs.
Wondering where you get the extremely low 3.6% increase in rack rates? Some have gone up 10% in one year.
 

Sirwalterraleigh

Well-Known Member
“I still don’t get this “less of a good deal””: MATH

I never said INVESTMENT. I said good financial deal. There’s a difference. I assume ZERO salvage value for DVC — so not an investment in the true sense.

It’s a break-end time question. That time is lengthening with DVC over time. Ie less of a good financial deal. That’s all.
I never get this either. The argument for new DVC sales is always based on the assumption that today’s price is correct...so it works backwards from there.

So if it was $50 in 1999....and $80 in 2003...and $100 in 2007 and $120 in 2011 and $150 in 2013 and $180 in 2018....all that makes sense.

Unless you compare it to the relative rise in room rates - not even taking into account what a room is actually booked for...

That’s where DVC analysis fails for me...rack rates are somewhere in the 200% increase over that range (there are exceptions)...while DVC is 400%.

A $300 base room at the grand Floridian in 1999 isn’t $1200 now.
 

MickeyMinnieMom

Well-Known Member
Wondering where you get the extremely low 3.6% increase in rack rates? Some have gone up 10% in one year.
I used the closest comparable for my situation: average annual rate of increase in the rack rates for BLT 2BR MK view 2013-2019 -- which is what I would book if not using my BLT DVC points there. I spot checked some other room categories and and it was in the same territory.

This is only 6 years, but it's better than using one year, absent authoritative info about future expected rate increases. These are all estimates -- there's no "right" figure to use -- I just try to get as close to our situation and get at least a few years' data.

Maybe better would be looking at a longer period across multiple resorts in the 2BR category, etc. -- not sure where I'd get all that data anyway, though. There's only so much time I think it makes sense to chase the perfect assumption here. The issue is less this particular % than it is the differential between rack increase and DVC dues increase. Over the comparable period, our DVC fees/due for BLT went up an average of 5.5% per year... that is... not great for this analysis.
 
Last edited:

LuvtheGoof

Proud DVC Member
Premium Member
I used the closest comparable for my situation: average annual rate of increase in the rack rates for BLT 2BR MK view 2013-2019 -- which is what I would book if not using my BLT DVC points there. I spot checked some other room categories and and it was in the same territory.

This is only 6 years, but it's better than using one year, absent authoritative info about future expected rate increases. These are all estimates -- there's no "right" figure to use -- I just try to get as close to our situation and get at least a few years' data.

Over the comparable period, our DVC fees/due for BLT went up an average of 5.5% per year... that is... not great for this analysis.
But where did you get the historical information from? I can find no reliable source anywhere for resort pricing information.
 

MickeyMinnieMom

Well-Known Member
But where did you get the historical information from? I can find no reliable source anywhere for resort pricing information.
I conducted a break-even analysis when we purchased BLT in 2013 -- I took note of the rack rates then. So I had my baseline. :)

I'm not trying to convince you or anyone else on this, btw. Just sharing what I found for our situation.
 

Sirwalterraleigh

Well-Known Member
But where did you get the historical information from? I can find no reliable source anywhere for resort pricing information.
I can give you the entire rack since about 1999 from memory within about 10%...If you really wanna know😉

The rate of rack Increase as opposed to DVC increase is usually assumed to be much closer by DVC buyers than it is...

It’s a “self soothing” tactic
 

xdan0920

Think for yourselfer
As for the pride in being members, why not? That has been the case for a long time, remember that slogan “Disney’s best kept secret”?
It’s just a weird thing to be proud of is all.
I agree. That is the only reason people should buy in. It’s why we bought in, and it happens to have paid off, should we want to sell - which we don’t yet. But if we don’t “make” anything when we sell, so be it.

I fail to see any other reason to buy in.

Those that come three or four times a year can probably do so that often simply because they bought in. Those buying for the first time today are unlikely to be able to accumulate points in the same way. Many of the big points owners I know bought when the recession was in full swing.
The old reason for buying in was to save money on your Disney trips. The new reason is to prepay for your Disney trips.

Uncaring? Did they upset you in some way? Are they being unkind to you by buying?

Oh, you mean they don’t care (different thing) .... about what exactly?
They don’t care about the obscene price point or making the numbers make sense. They just wanna “own” a piece of the magic.

Edit to add...

No I’m not upset at Riviera buyers. I don’t know any actually, except maybe you?
 
Top Bottom