Disappointed in Disney World

toystorymaniacs

New Member
I am a 'rose color glasses' kinda girl, about almost everything in my life. I will admit I have seen plenty of changes over the last 25 years at the WDW, some good, some not so good.

With that being said, the one thing that has not changed for me is the feeling I get from being there. It really is a magical place for me. We were there the very first time they closed the parks back in 1999, we were there during 911, we have lived through huricanes and tropical stroms. I'll admit I did not enjoy standing in line for close to 4 hours in 1999 for my dinner at Whisper Canyon becasue it was the only resturant available during the up coming strom, but it never made me lose sight that I was still in WDW.

Overall, until I lose that 'feeling' I get the first time I walk under the railroad, through the tunnel to Main Street USA, I am not worried. I'll keep coming back.

Very well said. Nothing else makes my family feel the way we do when we are at Disney. We have made about 20 trips in the last 10 years on every trip there have been outstanding cast members and cast members that made me wonder why they chose to work at Disney. On every trip we have a had great meals and usually one that left something to be desired. I have had trips where I have seen more stuff that I wanted to buy than I needed to and other trips were nothing really stood out. However I have left every single trip feeling happy, satisfied, and ready to go back. If a day comes when I don't feel that way anymore then maybe well start going somewhere else. But fro now there is nowhere else I would rather be.
 

bgraham34

Well-Known Member
The one thing I have noticed in the last few trips is that the cast members aren't as friendly. I will be there next week and hopefully i will see what its like then.
 

Susan Savia

Well-Known Member
I just doesn't matter to me if I see a cm emptying a trash bin, or I get a few less french fries on my plate. Things are rough all over and when I go on my annual trip to the World, I am not thinking of all the negatives the park has to offer, but all the wonder and enjoyment, instead. :)
 

Uponastar

Well-Known Member
I am a 'rose color glasses' kinda girl, about almost everything in my life. I will admit I have seen plenty of changes over the last 25 years at the WDW, some good, some not so good.

With that being said, the one thing that has not changed for me is the feeling I get from being there. It really is a magical place for me. We were there the very first time they closed the parks back in 1999, we were there during 911, we have lived through huricanes and tropical stroms. I'll admit I did not enjoy standing in line for close to 4 hours in 1999 for my dinner at Whisper Canyon becasue it was the only resturant available during the up coming strom, but it never made me lose sight that I was still in WDW.

Overall, until I lose that 'feeling' I get the first time I walk under the railroad, through the tunnel to Main Street USA, I am not worried. I'll keep coming back.

Absolutely perfectly stated.
That walk under the railroad station never fails to give me that "feeling". And I, too, continue to wear those rose-colored glasses on every trip. Maybe there are times when I should expect more or better, but I haven't noticed it yet.
Maybe if I didn't go so often, if I planned a big trip only occasionally...or only once...I'd hope for everything to be perfect and would be disappointed if it wasn't. I can certainly understand that. Perhaps the infrequent visitor has reason to expect more.
I guess there are different sets of standards depending on how often one visits and what is expected on those visits. I can walk past an overflowing trash can without really noticing...stuff happens...but maybe that wouldn't be true if it occurred on my one big trip which I planned and saved for for a long time. I don't know. Maybe trash isn't a big part of what it's all about for me. Whatever, I'll continue to wear those rose-colored glasses and just go expecting to have a good time. That plan hasn't failed me yet.
 

Animaniac93-98

Well-Known Member
I just doesn't matter to me if I see a cm emptying a trash bin, or I get a few less french fries on my plate. Things are rough all over and when I go on my annual trip to the World, I am not thinking of all the negatives the park has to offer, but all the wonder and enjoyment, instead. :)

Because ignoring the problem makes it go away, right?

I'm sure everyone here feels warm and squishy inside "walking under the RR station" etc. (either that or we need to wear diapers), but if complaints about food, merch, and CMs are as frequent as they are now, maybe it wouldn't hurt to think about them for a second? Nobody looses if everyone's happy with the food, service and merchandise, but people do if they do not meet the standards that are broght up by people after thier trip (not to mention Disney looses if nobody is buying thier product).
 

lightboy

Member
Agree with much on this thread.

Disney has a philosophy currently of "short-term gains". It's a typical one set forth by many companies. It will catch up with them. Threads like this are popping up almost EVERY day. So it's great to see the guests actually starting to figure this out.

This philosophy IS the nickle and diming of the corporate world. Disney makes more money than any of you even realize. They are not hurting at all. What IS hurting are their profit margins...because of the economy.

Disney is unwilling to cope with the current times, so they nickle and dime, reduce quality, increase prices...so they don't lose profit. Instead of buckling down, maintaining their product, and waiting for things to get better. It's an economics lesson that many universities around the country haven't begun to start teaching about...

How to maintain profit margins in a failing economy:
-Reduce Staffing (check)
-Pay Staff Minimally (check) - Currently Paying Minimum Wage
-Reduce Expenditures (check)
-Increase Ticket Prices (check)
-Cut New attractions and Refurbishments (check)
-Create Generic Cheap Merchandise, Charge More For It (check)
-Purchase Cheaper Food Quality, But Keep Prices The Same (check)
-Create illusions of quality (that's the real magic) (check)

I don't believe any of the above are the ingredients for a successful product. Perfect for SHORT-TERM gains, until your customer realizes that they are being cheated. And it WILL happen. Only then, will things turn around.


"Disneyland is a work of love. We didn't go into Disneyland just with the idea of making money." - Walt Disney

...my...how times have changed. Yet they still don't realize they can do both. If you create a superior product...people WILL come.
 

fillerup

Well-Known Member
A timely article from the 8/28 Orlando Sentinel:



Cuts didn't trim fun, Orlando-area theme parks say



One year ago this month, the schedule for Universal Orlando's Islands of Adventure showed 16 days on which the theme park was open until 10 p.m.

The latest the park has been open this August, according to the monthly schedule, is 9 p.m. — and then for only one evening.

Universal is not alone. All of Orlando's big theme-park resorts — Walt Disney World and SeaWorld Orlando, included — have cut costs this year as they slog through the worst recession since World War II. By laying off workers, reducing hours, dropping shows and slashing countless other expenses, the parks have been able to soften the financial effects of falling attendance and lower guest spending.

But as the economy continues to struggle into the fall — a lean travel period even in good years — Disney, Universal and SeaWorld could find it difficult to continue the cutting without risking a backlash from guests.

"We are selling an experience. And if you reduce the experience and people don't want to come back, then you have hurt yourself more than you have helped. It's a balancing act," said John Gerner, managing director of Leisure Business Advisors, a Richmond, Va.,-based consulting business. "It's not easy to reverse negative opinions once they're in place."

Critics say the theme parks have already crossed that line. Kevin Yee, who has written several books about Disney theme parks, said Disney World's latest round of cost-cutting has exacerbated previous cutbacks.

"In years past, when times were good they were cutting, so they cut the fat out [then]. Now they're cutting meat and bone," Yee said, adding that he has seen similar developments at other Orlando parks.

Yee noted that Disney World has routinely closed Disney's Hollywood Studios at 7 p.m. this summer.

"For one of their four major parks to close at 7 p.m., that's not a cost-cutting device. That's an insult," he said.

Former park executives say the resorts know they must be careful when cutting. Brad Rex, a former Disney World vice president in charge of Epcot, noted that Disney management is filled with people who have guided the resort through downturns before.

"The decisions they make are done very thoughtfully, with the highest regard for preserving the guest and cast experience," Rex said.

Parks sidestep specifics

Perhaps wary of alerting guests to what has been cut, each of the parks would not discuss their cost-cutting approaches in any detail. Instead, they would comment only broadly.

"Our business decisions are always based on making sure we provide a great guest experience. Beyond that, we are working hard to manage our operations as efficiently and effectively as we can," Universal spokesman Tom Schroder said.

Universal has been particularly aggressive this year. Records show the two-park resort slashed costs by 16 percent during the first six months of 2009, lopping off $59million worth of expenses. The deep cuts actually helped Universal boost its overall profit during the second quarter of the year despite lower attendance, though its profit was down for the full six-month period.

Site-specific figures are not available for Disney World. But Disney's worldwide theme-park division has reduced its expenses by 6 percent — $317 million in all — so far this calendar year, which has helped blunt overall profit declines brought on in part by the discounts Disney's parks have been using to lure travelers.

SeaWorld owner Anheuser-Busch InBev does not break out detailed financial results for either the park or its theme-park operating unit, Busch Entertainment Corp. But earlier this year, AB InBev executives credited cost cuts at its theme parks with helping keep profits overall stable despite slower sales.

"Like any successful business, SeaWorld manages costs in an effort to meet our performance targets," SeaWorld spokesman Nick Gollattscheck said. "We would like to emphasize, however, that while we manage costs as business conditions warrant, we never compromise our high standards of guest service, safety, overall quality and animal care."

Some cuts have drawn widespread attention. Disney, for instance, laid off more than 850 parks-and-resorts employees in Florida earlier this year and eliminated an additional 500 vacant positions. Universal, meanwhile, laid off 70 employees.

Though Busch Entertainment says it has not laid off any employees this year at its Florida parks, it made what may have been the most vehemently protested cut of all in January when it said it would stop offering free beer samples at the hospitality centers in its parks. Busch said it ended the practice to make the hospitality centers more appealing to a wider age range, not to save money.

Other cuts have been much subtler, such as fewer trains operating on roller-coaster tracks and less in-park entertainment. Yee said he has even noticed fewer open cashier lanes at some Disney restaurants this year.

'Like boiling a frog'

As difficult as they may be to spot, those kinds of small cuts add up, Yee said.

"Like boiling a frog in water slowly, the ratcheting up of prices, tightening of services, scrimping of portion sizes and reduction of menu choice has been so gradual that people can't really put their finger on what's wrong," Yee said. "But if you sit down and ask them if this vacation was just as magical as the one 10 years ago, you may well hear that it wasn't."

Disney, like Universal and SeaWorld, insists it does not compromise customer satisfaction in the name of savings. Spokeswoman Zoraya Suarez pointed out that current surveys show that 98 percent of Disney guests rate their vacations as good, very good or excellent.

"We regularly evaluate our offerings and make operational adjustments based on a variety of factors, including demand and guest feedback," Suarez said. "Our focus remains on providing a unique, high-quality experience."

Jason Garcia can be reached at 407-420-5414 or jrgarcia@orlandosentinel.com.
 

lightboy

Member
Interesting. I was mostly spot on with Jason's Sentinel article.

It'll add up. All of it will.

A lot of first time guests are having fun, because they've only ever been to Six Flags. They don't know what it used to be. This downward trend disturbs me greatly.
 

cblodg

Member
I personally have seen the decline in the merchandise. As many have said in this thread, I too have my 'stuff' from my earlier visits when each park had their novelty items and you could ONLY get it at WDW. I can remember buying T-shirts and mugs from each park or resort we stayed at because they were unique. Now, to some extent the resorts do have some resort specific merchandise. As for the parks, most of the merchandise is all the same.

In my last two trips, I am hard-pressed to come up with an item I purchased, not even a t-shirt.

The dining has become much more streamlined. We just did the DDP and actually didn't find it all that restrictive. Yes, some of the items at your Counter Service areas are the same, that's what you get with the plan. If we didn't have the dining plan then yes, we could have had various other options; however, of the counter service places we went, yes, all of the food was pretty much the same.
 

jakeman

Well-Known Member
How many people in this thread who are unhappy with the current state of the parks have complained while onsite?

How many people in this thread who are unhappy with the current state of the parks have written a letter to Guest Relations detailing issues?

How many people in this thread who are unhappy with the current state of the parks have taken their money elsewhere?

How many people in this thread who are uphappy with the current state of the parks are content to complain online and do nothing as a consumer to improve the situation?
 

CinderellaFan

Member
Original Poster
I would love to write someone a detailed letter of my experiences at the parks this year,however, I don't have the address. Could someone pass it on please. As far as taking my money elsewhere I found that I spent more time out of the parks the usual due to the elimination of the length of stay pass. I also went outside of the parks to dine quite frequently because I couldn't eat another hot dog or plate of chicken fingers. I tried to get reservations at a sit down dinner such as Sci-Fi or 50's prime time but was told that people who have the dining plan booked out tables months ago.
 

Animaniac93-98

Well-Known Member
How many people in this thread who are unhappy with the current state of the parks have complained while onsite?

How many people in this thread who are unhappy with the current state of the parks have written a letter to Guest Relations detailing issues?

How many people in this thread who are unhappy with the current state of the parks have taken their money elsewhere?

How many people in this thread who are unhappy with the current state of the parks are content to complain online and do nothing as a consumer to improve the situation?

As usual jakeman, the online community is never good enough for you, but you're more than happy to make us feel awful.

Actions speak louder than any words that are replied with machine like droning written in reply emails/letters and CMs who do not wish to hear us (one member on this site specifically said she would have no interest in listening to us! How's that for service?). If I don't want to eat somewhere, I won't spend my money there. If I don't see something I like, I won't buy it.

Online, I am free to speak my mind with like minded individuals and have no fear of coming off as "polite". I'm free to be blunt with criticism and praise whenever I feel like it and since Disney apparently reads these board a "I don't buy crap" comment is more likely to get attention than "I wish there were more.../I wouldn't mind... etc."

You, I and others may mock the "Comic Book Guy" like approach to putting an opinion out there, but that's how it is these days. We live in an age when Lauren Bacall can about Twilight on Twitter, not one where we eagerly await mail or a phone call to hear from relatives.

To suggest we do nothing as a consumer to show are dislike for Disney is insulting and ignorant. If we didn't, the Disney Store would be a smash hit in it's current form (which it isn't), Disney wouldn't feel the need to discount merch sold at the park and people wouldn't eat offsite to save some money.

I can very much still go to Disney and do the things I enjoy, but not for example pay to go to MNSSHP (due to fireworks edits and ever increasing ticket prices), not go see SGE and not bother to go to DTD. It's their loss if I don't and online I can tell them why for as long as I feel required to and not have my opinion compromised to politeness sake or ignored (as much) because some secretary has files to sort.
 

SirGoofy

Member
How many people in this thread who are unhappy with the current state of the parks have complained while onsite?

How many people in this thread who are unhappy with the current state of the parks have written a letter to Guest Relations detailing issues?

How many people in this thread who are unhappy with the current state of the parks have taken their money elsewhere?

How many people in this thread who are uphappy with the current state of the parks are content to complain online and do nothing as a consumer to improve the situation?

I've complained to WDI and called Phil Holmes.

Does that count?:lol:
 

DisneyMusician2

Well-Known Member
I know I'm jumping in late, but here goes...

There have been improvements in several areas over the past year from info I've gotten from others and family who have the means to travel during this recession.

As for the dining, MANY things are more disappointing, but I do feel that some experiences are more authentic than they used to be with a wider variety of food being represented.

Disney has been in the process of building new hotel room and refurbishing old ones for the past several years.

I don't mean to sound like an apologist, as I see things being sliced and understand the reasoning behind it to an extent. But Disney has spent quite a bit of money trying to improve the RESORT half of the Disney experience recently, and I don't think that should be overlooked.
 

momofnine

Member
We noticed this last December when we were there. I posted on a thread about this same subject. It was worse this July/Aug. We stayed at the POP, our daughter had her softball nationals at Wide World of Sports. The parks were not busy for this time of year, our wait at 11:00a.m. in fantasyland was 5 to 10 minutes for each ride, we were shocked. The bushes that use to look perfect were over grown, the elephant that is to the right of MK entrance (on the walk to the Poly) parts of it had the metal showing. Dirt and cobwebs, pealing paint, things you never use to see at Disney, were everywhere. I love Disney, we go at least once a year, but I refuse to wear rose colored glasses. Yes, I still love the feeling that I get when I walk into the MK and see the castle, but the upkeep of the parks, attractions, restaurants,and resorts needs to be addressed so that people like us (ALL of us on this board) will want to pay the top dollar to keep coming back. Because when you pay that dollar to Disney, you are expecting the high quality and high standards that Disney had been known for.
 

jakeman

Well-Known Member
As usual jakeman, the online community is never good enough for you, but you're more than happy to make us feel awful.
How did I make you feel awful just now? By asking a few questions?

Actions speak louder than any words that are replied with machine like droning written in reply emails/letters and CMs who do not wish to hear us (one member on this site specifically said she would have no interest in listening to us! How's that for service?). If I don't want to eat somewhere, I won't spend my money there. If I don't see something I like, I won't buy it.
That's my point. A responsible consumer takes their money elsewhere when they are unhappy with a product.

Online, I am free to speak my mind with like minded individuals and have no fear of coming off as "polite". I'm free to be blunt with criticism and praise whenever I feel like it and since Disney apparently reads these board a "I don't buy crap" comment is more likely to get attention than "I wish there were more.../I wouldn't mind... etc."
So anonimity replaces manners? Mature.

You, I and others may mock the "Comic Book Guy" like approach to putting an opinion out there, but that's how it is these days. We live in an age when Lauren Bacall can about Twilight on Twitter, not one where we eagerly await mail or a phone call to hear from relatives.
Yes, all of this online complaining really seems to be affecting timetables and decisions at TDO...

To suggest we do nothing as a consumer to show [our] dislike for Disney is insulting and ignorant. If we didn't, the Disney Store would be a smash hit in it's current form (which it isn't), Disney wouldn't feel the need to discount merch sold at the park and people wouldn't eat offsite to save some money.
Yet you keep going to a place with an abudance of flaws.

can very much still go to Disney and do the things I enjoy, but not for example pay to go to MNSSHP (due to fireworks edits and ever increasing ticket prices), not go see SGE and not bother to go to DTD. It's their loss if I don't and online I can tell them why for as long as I feel required to and not have my opinion compromised to politeness sake or ignored (as much) because some secretary has files to sort.
So they should just "know" that you are unhappy? They should search you out? Especially when there are 3 more people waiting to take your place? Think about the logic of that for a second.

There is a difference between right to complain and the effectiveness of a complaint.

The most effective way to complain is to take your money elsewhere and let the offending company know what made you choose a competitor. It's not my hang up that many of the loudest and most negative complainers around here can't seem to do that.

I've complained to WDI and called Phil Holmes.

Does that count?:lol:
Only if you were in the bushes by his house! :lol:
 

trendicoff

New Member
Agree with much on this thread.

Disney has a philosophy currently of "short-term gains". It's a typical one set forth by many companies. It will catch up with them. Threads like this are popping up almost EVERY day. So it's great to see the guests actually starting to figure this out.

This philosophy IS the nickle and diming of the corporate world. Disney makes more money than any of you even realize. They are not hurting at all. What IS hurting are their profit margins...because of the economy.

Disney is unwilling to cope with the current times, so they nickle and dime, reduce quality, increase prices...so they don't lose profit. Instead of buckling down, maintaining their product, and waiting for things to get better. It's an economics lesson that many universities around the country haven't begun to start teaching about...

How to maintain profit margins in a failing economy:
-Reduce Staffing (check)
-Pay Staff Minimally (check) - Currently Paying Minimum Wage
-Reduce Expenditures (check)
-Increase Ticket Prices (check)
-Cut New attractions and Refurbishments (check)
-Create Generic Cheap Merchandise, Charge More For It (check)
-Purchase Cheaper Food Quality, But Keep Prices The Same (check)
-Create illusions of quality (that's the real magic) (check)

I don't believe any of the above are the ingredients for a successful product. Perfect for SHORT-TERM gains, until your customer realizes that they are being cheated. And it WILL happen. Only then, will things turn around.


"Disneyland is a work of love. We didn't go into Disneyland just with the idea of making money." - Walt Disney

...my...how times have changed. Yet they still don't realize they can do both. If you create a superior product...people WILL come.

Lightboy, most of your facts are correct, but I have to think you're spinning them in the wrong way. It's true that much of the strategy you mentioned is for short term gains, however, many of the points you made not only can also apply to a long term strategy, but have been standard to Disney since the mid 80's or before. For example:

*Raising ticket prices - Disney's ticket price increases have never exceeded anything more then a few percentage points over the CPI rise (US national average). It can often seem like more since they don't necessarily do it on a yearly basis (admittedly in recent years it has been more regular), but again this has always been SOP.

*Nickel and Diming the customer (guest) - In writing many reports over the years on Disney, they have always made mention to (the acronym has often changed) to average income per head, referring to on a broad level, the capital generated by each average guest. They often break it down further to specific areas so they can know how much the average guest who rides TOT (random example) generates. I know we don't like the fact that Disney squeezes as much as possible out of us as guests, but my point is this is again SOP for most of WDW's history, not a cost saving measure.

*Making more money than we think - I don't know about you, but I read all their financial reports and income statements. It's true Disney makes alot of money, but you need to realize 2 things: (1) their yearly revenue (forget net income) is much lower than lots of big companies like Comcast. (2) only a small fraction of their income even comes from the theme park and resorts division.

In any case, I don't think that I view Disney through rose colored glasses even though I think they are an incredible organization. I do feel that there has been a noticeable decline in the quality of the experience provided by Disney, however from my experience as a CM, I feel the decline comes from lax hiring standards and lax enforcement of guest service policies. I completely understand people (especially CMs) have bad days, but there are too many CMs I have encountered or worked with who NEVER have a good day. My opinion, if you don't want to make the Disney magic, get out of Disney!! Wal-mart is just down the street and pays better. Wow, I think this is the longest post I've ever posted.

Just my 2 cents.
 

DisneyMusician2

Well-Known Member
Lightboy, most of your facts are correct, but I have to think you're spinning them in the wrong way. It's true that much of the strategy you mentioned is for short term gains, however, many of the points you made not only can also apply to a long term strategy, but have been standard to Disney since the mid 80's or before. For example:

*Raising ticket prices - Disney's ticket price increases have never exceeded anything more then a few percentage points over the CPI rise (US national average). It can often seem like more since they don't necessarily do it on a yearly basis (admittedly in recent years it has been more regular), but again this has always been SOP.

*Nickel and Diming the customer (guest) - In writing many reports over the years on Disney, they have always made mention to (the acronym has often changed) to average income per head, referring to on a broad level, the capital generated by each average guest. They often break it down further to specific areas so they can know how much the average guest who rides TOT (random example) generates. I know we don't like the fact that Disney squeezes as much as possible out of us as guests, but my point is this is again SOP for most of WDW's history, not a cost saving measure.

*Making more money than we think - I don't know about you, but I read all their financial reports and income statements. It's true Disney makes alot of money, but you need to realize 2 things: (1) their yearly revenue (forget net income) is much lower than lots of big companies like Comcast. (2) only a small fraction of their income even comes from the theme park and resorts division.

In any case, I don't think that I view Disney through rose colored glasses even though I think they are an incredible organization. I do feel that there has been a noticeable decline in the quality of the experience provided by Disney, however from my experience as a CM, I feel the decline comes from lax hiring standards and lax enforcement of guest service policies. I completely understand people (especially CMs) have bad days, but there are too many CMs I have encountered or worked with who NEVER have a good day. My opinion, if you don't want to make the Disney magic, get out of Disney!! Wal-mart is just down the street and pays better. Wow, I think this is the longest post I've ever posted.

Just my 2 cents.

Perhaps long, but well said.:)

Thanks for some perspective.
 

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