News DeSantis moves to bring state safety oversight of the Walt Disney World Monorail including suspending the service for inspections

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
Forgive my ignorance but I’m assuming that this type of accident would not be possible with a more modern safety system, that I’m assuming was installed after the incident ?
The automated system was installed as a result of the accident. The pilots supervise and initiate movement but it is all now computer controlled. A lot of the things related to movement that people say are due to poor upkeep are not, they’re the automated system driving the train.
 

disneylandtour

Active Member
Useless information to be sure but I was bored.

There has been one death on the monorail I know of and a quick google search put estimates at over a billion riders lifetime. Using that as a base line you are looking at less than a 0.0000001% chance of being killed on the monorail to date. That is orders of magnitude lower than your chance to die from a shark attack.

Just about the only thing less likely to kill you is a shark attack while on the actual monorail.
I believe that death was an operator in a pilot's booth. Guests are no longer allowed in pilot's areas to protect them, as the front and backs of the train are the most vulnerable part if there is a collision. (The death was related to a collision. From memory, in or near a station, though that last part could be wrong.). Anyway, if you're a guest, with this, you have a 0% chance of being killed to date.
 

JoeCamel

Well-Known Member
I believe that death was an operator in a pilot's booth. Guests are no longer allowed in pilot's areas to protect them, as the front and backs of the train are the most vulnerable part if there is a collision. (The death was related to a collision. From memory, in or near a station, though that last part could be wrong.). Anyway, if you're a guest, with this, you have a 0% chance of being killed to date.
But how about falling out an open door/window or have a part drop on you? Not a zero chance
 

note2001

Well-Known Member
But how about falling out an open door/window or have a part drop on you? Not a zero chance
This is what is concerning, and what has been eluded to over and over in this thread. There are no less than 6 areas of specialty for reviewing & inspecting standard train operation per the FRA.

Will the inspection teams be comprised of people who will look not only at the operations and tracks, but the trains themselves? A door randomly falling off over the EPCOT parking lot could have killed, thankfully it didn't. Someone should have noticed it was an issue long before it happened.
 

Ayla

Well-Known Member
Monorails are unique trains in that they have no bumper system to absorb impact. The issue was that combined with the sloped design of the nose cone causing one rail car to slide up and into the other. An inspection would not have prevented the result of the impact. What it may have done is to bring to light that there was a lack of staffing/training on the job preventing the accident to start with.
Inspections don't prevent human error, which was the cause of the fatal monorail accident.
 

Trauma

Well-Known Member
Why not just read the accident report?
I run my own business managing employees in 12 states.

I’m on the road 7 days a week working 14-16 hours.

The only reason I can participate in these forums is voice to text on my phone.

TLDR: I don’t have time so I asked.
 

Trauma

Well-Known Member
This is what is concerning, and what has been eluded to over and over in this thread. There are no less than 6 areas of specialty for reviewing & inspecting standard train operation per the FRA.

Will the inspection teams be comprised of people who will look not only at the operations and tracks, but the trains themselves? A door randomly falling off over the EPCOT parking lot could have killed, thankfully it didn't. Someone should have noticed it was an issue long before it happened.
The thing is the state should have stepped in with inspections after the door fell off it they thought it was necessary.

Now since it’s being done for the wrong reasons even if it is necessary it shouldn’t be happening.

🤷‍♂️
 

Rich Brownn

Well-Known Member
I don't know... Considering a door was wide open on one of these cars while it was in motion, this might not be a bad thing.
And a sizable piece fell off one as well.
In the old monorails back in the 70s "door unsafe" was rather common - either not closed enough (you had the slam the darn things) or they'd actually pop open. It was such a concern that the beams by the Contemporary have large support platforms to catch doors ripped off going into the Contemporary (I drove them, so I cannot begin to tell you the number of times I got a door unsafe and told to crawl into the C).
 

Rich Brownn

Well-Known Member
I believe that death was an operator in a pilot's booth. Guests are no longer allowed in pilot's areas to protect them, as the front and backs of the train are the most vulnerable part if there is a collision. (The death was related to a collision. From memory, in or near a station, though that last part could be wrong.). Anyway, if you're a guest, with this, you have a 0% chance of being killed to date.
It wasn't pilot error. During shutdown, monorails from EPCOT loop have to be shunted over to the MK loop. During this procedure the emergency stop system has to be overridden or the monorail will auto stop preventing the transfer. The EPCOT train needs to back through the TTC station. During this operation a supervisor is supposed to be onsite visually assuring the beam is switched. It was not and the supervisor was over at Denny's. As train #1 was backing through the station train #2 was approaching. While train #2 could see the approaching train, the operator in train #1 could not.

This wasn't the first serious collision though. Back in the 70s trains were operator in violation of rules (but with permission of management) to have six trains on exterior beam. This required an override of the emergency stop system as the goal was to have your nose into the station before the tail of the other train exited, providing continual movement. One train had bad breaks and when applied, was too close to stop and crashed into the other train. This was a few months before I started and was emphasized to me on my training - everyone was on eggshells and overriding a hold area was an extreme no no. (The trains involved were red and blue. One was totally rebuilt). The driver wasn't killed, but seriously injured with life-changing injuries <the annunciator panel nearly cut him in half>. After that, five trains were max on exterior and overriding the emergency stop was only allowed during track transfer.
 

Lilofan

Well-Known Member
It wasn't pilot error. During shutdown, monorails from EPCOT loop have to be shunted over to the MK loop. During this procedure the emergency stop system has to be overridden or the monorail will auto stop preventing the transfer. The EPCOT train needs to back through the TTC station. During this operation a supervisor is supposed to be onsite visually assuring the beam is switched. It was not and the supervisor was over at Denny's. As train #1 was backing through the station train #2 was approaching. While train #2 could see the approaching train, the operator in train #1 could not.

This wasn't the first serious collision though. Back in the 70s trains were operator in violation of rules (but with permission of management) to have six trains on exterior beam. This required an override of the emergency stop system as the goal was to have your nose into the station before the tail of the other train exited, providing continual movement. One train had bad breaks and when applied, was too close to stop and crashed into the other train. This was a few months before I started and was emphasized to me on my training - everyone was on eggshells and overriding a hold area was an extreme no no. (The trains involved were red and blue. One was totally rebuilt). The driver wasn't killed, but seriously injured with life-changing injuries <the annunciator panel nearly cut him in half>. After that, five trains were max on exterior and overriding the emergency stop was only allowed during track transfer.
Yes the manager that was eating at Denny's off property and directing the monorails while on lunch break was the icing on the cake. Better that Disney settled with the family instead of a civil trial.
 

flynnibus

Premium Member
It wasn't pilot error. During shutdown, monorails from EPCOT loop have to be shunted over to the MK loop. During this procedure the emergency stop system has to be overridden or the monorail will auto stop preventing the transfer. The EPCOT train needs to back through the TTC station. During this operation a supervisor is supposed to be onsite visually assuring the beam is switched. It was not and the supervisor was over at Denny's. As train #1 was backing through the station train #2 was approaching. While train #2 could see the approaching train, the operator in train #1 could not.


I never heard anything why the staff on the platform didn’t initiate a shutdown when the train came in on the wrong beam. Were they not part of the radio chatter? Or was simply no one with a kill switch?
 

JoeCamel

Well-Known Member
I never heard anything why the staff on the platform didn’t initiate a shutdown when the train came in on the wrong beam. Were they not part of the radio chatter? Or was simply no one with a kill switch?
Given the time of the collision was there anyone on the platform? I forget from when I read the report
 

Nubs70

Well-Known Member
It wasn't pilot error. During shutdown, monorails from EPCOT loop have to be shunted over to the MK loop. During this procedure the emergency stop system has to be overridden or the monorail will auto stop preventing the transfer. The EPCOT train needs to back through the TTC station. During this operation a supervisor is supposed to be onsite visually assuring the beam is switched. It was not and the supervisor was over at Denny's. As train #1 was backing through the station train #2 was approaching. While train #2 could see the approaching train, the operator in train #1 could not.

This wasn't the first serious collision though. Back in the 70s trains were operator in violation of rules (but with permission of management) to have six trains on exterior beam. This required an override of the emergency stop system as the goal was to have your nose into the station before the tail of the other train exited, providing continual movement. One train had bad breaks and when applied, was too close to stop and crashed into the other train. This was a few months before I started and was emphasized to me on my training - everyone was on eggshells and overriding a hold area was an extreme no no. (The trains involved were red and blue. One was totally rebuilt). The driver wasn't killed, but seriously injured with life-changing injuries <the annunciator panel nearly cut him in half>. After that, five trains were max on exterior and overriding the emergency stop was only allowed during track transfer.
So WDW was operating the monorail in violation of safety protocols?
 

Ayla

Well-Known Member
But inspections do review procedures- which if different could have avoided the human mistakes and/or had other checks in place that could have caught the first error before the trains collided
When procedures aren't followed, it doesn't matter.
 

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