Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[Calmdownnow]

Disney doesn’t need public money.

Let's see what they try to claim and then make a judgement.

Even if they did take federal money, are airlines providing customer data to the government?

Airlines certainly already are providing data. Telecom companies are probably also providing data. Google certainly is. Why would Disney do less?

I don’t know much about the defense production act but it seems unlikely that it would require Disney to share private customer information with the government.

I don't know much about it. That's why I asked.

 

[Calmdownnow]

I’m sure you would. But again Disney doesn’t have everyone’s information or contact information even for some they do have information for. Also I wouldn’t throw out percentages you can’t possible know

I'm just a good guy that assumes everyone else wants to be a good guy - - hence my belief that only 5% of the population who go to Disney are intellectual misfits or currently incarcerated. As for Disney having contact information, I would believe that they have a billing address for in excess of 90% of their guests, because very few over recent years have been turning up with fists full of benjamins.

 

[peter11435]

I'm just a good guy that assumes everyone else wants to be a good guy - - hence my belief that only 5% of the population who go to Disney are intellectual misfits or currently incarcerated. As for Disney having contact information, I would believe that they have a billing address for in excess of 90% of their guests, because very few over recent years have been turning up with fists full of benjamins.

Not all tickets are purchased directly through Disney and like I said not all tickets are linked to specific individuals. They don’t know exactly who was there. For many yes. But not for everyone. But again you’re throwing out percentages you can’t possibly know.

 

[DisneyCane]

My bet is that you are wrong about re-opening. I suspect that you are also wrong about the Florida trend heading down. It pains me to say this, but the evidence from around the world is that 3-5 months is the time-period most communities will have to slog through in order to master the social and economic conditions this virus has imposed. Unfortunately Disney World, and even later Florida as a whole, has been well behind the curve of mastering the problem. We are less than four weeks away from tens of thousands of people arriving on Main Street to view fireworks - yes bits of explosive stardust in the sky -- and who knows how many infections were seeded at that time.

Look at Florida's new case curve. It has definitely flattened over the last few days. The number of tests per day is increasing and the percentage of positive tests is decreasing. If Florida follows Italy's curve the new cases per day should start to decrease noticably in a week or so.

Miami-Dade has 34% of the State's cases. 58% are in Palm Beach County and south on the east coast. The situation is much different in southeast Florida vs. the rest of Florida.

 

[Calmdownnow]

Not all tickets are purchased directly through Disney and like I said not all tickets are linked to specific individuals. They don’t know exactly who was there. For many yes. But not for everyone. But again you’re throwing out percentages you can’t possibly know.

But Disney does. I'll repeat what I said, or was trying to say, earlier. Disney has a potentially very important data set that -- with small gaps -- is probably unique in it;s instant access and could be very important and enlightening for the whole country. Whether Disney makes this data available to policy-makers is a matter for the company, but also if they don't it should be a matter of record that is taken into account when or if they seek support from the government.

 

[DCBaker]

Taken today, just north west of Miami, in Hialeah.

 

[DisneyDoctor]

Taken today, just north west of Miami, in Hialeah.

Yikes. At least everyone has a mask on.

 

[peter11435]

But Disney does. I'll repeat what I said, or was trying to say, earlier. Disney has a potentially very important data set that -- with small gaps -- is probably unique in it;s instant access and could be very important and enlightening for the whole country. Whether Disney makes this data available to policy-makers is a matter for the company, but also if they don't it should be a matter of record that is taken into account when or if they seek support from the government.

But Disney doesn’t have the information you think it does. Not for as high a percentage of the guests who were there as you think they do. Disney does not know exactly who was in that park that night. They know some. But not nearly all.

Also I think it’s ridiculous that you think the company should be penalized for not violating the privacy of its customers. A company sharing private information with anyone include the government is a violation of privacy unless they previously disclosed that information could and would be shared.

I agree with you that the information could be useful. But it’s just not that easy. They don’t have the information you think they do and can’t just go sharing the information they do have.

 

["El Gran Magnifico"]

Disney has a potentially very important data set that -- with small gaps -- is probably unique in it;s instant access and could be very important and enlightening for the whole country.

But some of that data involves minors.

 

[GoofGoof]

But Disney does. I'll repeat what I said, or was trying to say, earlier. Disney has a potentially very important data set that -- with small gaps -- is probably unique in it;s instant access and could be very important and enlightening for the whole country. Whether Disney makes this data available to policy-makers is a matter for the company, but also if they don't it should be a matter of record that is taken into account when or if they seek support from the government.

Who is collecting the information? Are they getting lists of who was in crowds from NBA and NHL teams, concert venues, other amusement parks, aquariums, museums, tourist attractions, etc. Even if they collected all of that info how are they getting the medical records for who tested positive to cross check with? Is any of that legal to do? Health records are highly protected.

 

[Angel Ariel]

Nonsense. As a lawyer, I'm telling you Disney has every legal right to exclude entry on almost any basis (except for race, etc). They would have to refund the ticket of course. Knowing Disney, they would likely provide a future return ticket.

"For the safety of our guests, all entrants will be screened for fever.Those with temperatures over 100.1 will not be permitted entry. Those excluded for fever can undergo on-site testing for Coronavirus and referral to appropriate medical providers. "
(by the time parks re-open, testing should be widely available).

As a lawyer, how would you suppose that disney would handle medical conditions that result in lack of temperature regulation?

my daughter’s resting temperature is 99.0-99.5, sometimes 99.8. This is documented and agreed upon by her pediatrician (likely related to her genetic disorder). We are told not consider it a fever unless it is over 101.

On the flip side, my own resting temperature is 97.5. At 99, i almost certainly am actually sick and infectious. By the time I get a fever over 100, I’m usually in bed not moving much.

This alone shows how ineffectual temperature screening is.

ETA: Given apparent confusion in later posts, i am adding this explanation from a later post of mine:

if 100.4 is considered a fever with the “norm” generally regarded as 98.6, then a 1.8 degree temperature rise is what’s considered a fever.

For my daughter, that number would be (comjng from 99.5, which is her average resting temp) - 101.3. Far above the 100.4 limit. 100.4 for her is like someone with a resting temp of 98.6 having a 99.5 degree temperature - which, as you stated, is not considered a fever.

for myself, on the other hand - with a 97.5 temperature, my “fever” range - going with the 1.8 degree rise - would be 99.3 - far lower than the 100.4 threshold

 

[Calmdownnow]

Also I think it’s ridiculous that you think the company should be penalized for not violating the privacy of its customers. A company sharing private information with anyone include the government is a violation of privacy unless they previously disclosed that information could and would be shared.

I agree with you that the information could be useful. But it’s just not that easy. They don’t have the information you think they do and can’t just go sharing the information they do have.

I didn't say penalized. I said that they should not be able to claim substantial public financial support if they didn't support efforts aimed at the best public outcomes. That's not a penalty, it;s just a question of why giving a benefit to an entity that is not helping when they could.

We disagree on the extent of the information they hold. I think they hold substantial data that could be of use. You believe that a large number of people whose data they hold would be upset if that data was shared, I believe that a simple e-mail or text to those individuals would lead to them giving permission for the data to be used. because the overwhelming majority of people want to contribute to the defeat of this threat.

 

[Calmdownnow]

Who is collecting the information? Are they getting lists of who was in crowds from NBA and NHL teams, concert venues, other amusement parks, aquariums, museums, tourist attractions, etc

Disney is already collecting the information. The data sets already exist because your Magic Band, MDE bookings, fingerprints at park scanners are placing you at specific locations minute by minute within the Parks. It is a unique personalized location data set that is not replicated at sports or music events. That is the value of the data set.

 

[Calmdownnow]

But some of that data involves minors.

And? Are they not potential carrier or sufferers?

 

[peter11435]

I didn't say penalized. I said that they should not be able to claim substantial public financial support if they didn't support efforts aimed at the best public outcomes. That's not a penalty, it;s just a question of why giving a benefit to an entity that is not helping when they could.

We disagree on the extent of the information they hold. I think they hold substantial data that could be of use. You believe that a large number of people whose data they hold would be upset if that data was shared, I believe that a simple e-mail or text to those individuals would lead to them giving permission for the data to be used. because the overwhelming majority of people want to contribute to the defeat of this threat.

First of all you’re arguing semantics here. But if your argument is that public support should be withheld because they didn’t do something. Then by definition your argument is that they should be penalized for not doing that something.

Second, you’re just not listening. I know what you are saying. But you are wrong about the information you think they have. They simply don’t have names and contact information for every guest who was in the park. Some yes, but not nearly all. They don’t sell every ticket themselves and not every ticket they do sell is associated with a specific individual. So for all of those tickets they have no idea who actually used them.

I never said that a large number of people would have an issue with them sharing the information. I’m sure most would be ok with it, but that doesn’t mean they can simply just share it because they think most people would be fine with it. And you can’t simply send a simple email or text to someone if you don’t have that contact information. It’s just not as easy as you think it is.

 

[BrianLo]

As a lawyer, how would you suppose that disney would handle medical conditions that result in lack of temperature regulation?

my daughter’s resting temperature is 99.0-99.5, sometimes 99.8. This is documented and agreed upon by her pediatrician (likely related to her genetic disorder). We are told not consider it a fever unless it is over 101.

On the flip side, my own resting temperature is 97.5. At 99, i almost certainly am actually sick and infectious. By the time I get a fever over 100, I’m usually in bed not moving much.

This alone shows how ineffectual temperature screening is.

For what it is worth - those temperature ranges are not considered a fever for the general population. 38.0 celsius (100.4) is what would be considered a positive screen / Low grade fever threshold.

In the very rare likelihood someone had a periodic fever syndrome - I'm sure they would accept medical documentation to wave the false reading.

 

[peter11435]

Disney is already collecting the information. The data sets already exist because your Magic Band, MDE bookings, fingerprints at park scanners are placing you at specific locations minute by minute within the Parks. It is a unique personalized location data set that is not replicated at sports or music events. That is the value of the data set.

Not everyone has or utilizes magic bands or mdx. Disney does not collect information on every guest. Entrance touchpoint use biometrics not finger prints and do not identify specific individuals. Magic bands do not track location minute by minute.

 

[peter11435]

And? Are they not potential carrier or sufferers?

It would be a massive violation of privacy laws

 

[Angel Ariel]

Beyond that, I'm not aware of any time a contagious illness was considered a medical condition for purposes of a disability classification.

But contagious illness is not the only cause of elevated temperatures. My daughter’s, as i noted in a reply above, is a result of her genetic disorder, which absolutely is a disability.

 

[Calmdownnow]

But you are wrong about the information you think they have. They simply don’t have names and contact information for every guest who was in the park.

I would agree that there may be a limited number of people who have bought tickets via other outlets, but if the MDE fastpass booking system is the directed Disney route for getting access to E-ticket rides, then Disney will still have tracking data on these people, including contact details via the app.