DisneyCane
Well-Known Member
I would too but Portugal is only 10 cases per 100k per week from the "substantial" range by the CDC definition and cases still appear to be increasing.
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Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion
- Thread starter Parker in NYC
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DisneyCane
Well-Known Member
That's why I believe that acceptance would be higher if the personal risk reduction aspect was sold more.
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DisneyCane
Well-Known Member
If Omicron is in fact the dominant variant and the people being hospitalized are all infected with Delta then that would seem to indicate that Omicron does not cause serious illness in many people.
Omicron is dominant in wastewater samples in Florida county
Even though there have been no cases of clinical infection, the new omicron variant is now the dominant strain of COVID-19 in the Florida county that is home to the nation's largest theme park resorts. That's based on wastewater samples. Officials said Wednesday that the omicron variant has...cbs12.com
Shout out to the people who do jobs like wastewater sample collection. It's like watching Dirty Jobs. Civilization can't exist if people aren't willing to do those things for a living and I appreciate them very much!
Heppenheimer
Well-Known Member
+1
The issue is coming up again because now that the Jansen vaccine has not held up as well against the delta variant as the two mRNA vaccines, and we have more data on the general population, they're reassessing if the known relative risk is still sufficiently outweighed by the benefit.
This clotting issue was known from the trials. It isn't a delayed side effect that comes out of nowhere months later, it occurs within days after receiving the vaccination.
The issue is coming up again because now that the Jansen vaccine has not held up as well against the delta variant as the two mRNA vaccines, and we have more data on the general population, they're reassessing if the known relative risk is still sufficiently outweighed by the benefit.
Incomudro
Well-Known Member
You don't understand the argument of those who do not want to get vaccinated.
You can't prove to them that we won't see sever problems caused by the Moderna and Phizer shots years down the line.
They'll tell you we don't know the long term implications, because the long term data isn't in.
willtravel
Well-Known Member
You can search all over the internet or listen to news for info and opinions. Research can differ greatly between experts, as you know. People will believe what they want to believe. You may feel your info is correct, but other experts may differ. This is never going to go away even if 98% of the population has received a vaccine.
Incomudro
Well-Known Member
I am giving you the argument of the unvaccinated, yet you are treating me as if I myself don't believe in the safety and effectiveness of my three Moderna shots.
I'm hurting the world by giving you the argument that people who don't want the shots are using?
That's ridiculous.
I"m vaccinated.
I'm hurting the world by giving you the argument that people who don't want the shots are using?
That's ridiculous.
You people are trying to convince me.
I"m vaccinated.
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lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
They’re arguments are made in bad faith. The data doesn’t matter as we have seen again and again. There will always be another excuse.
And yet you are still pushing for the respect of bad faith arguments. You do accept their arguments as valid and hypocritically denigrate others for their weight. Ridiculing people for their weight, dismissing their challenges and then blithely accepting and promoting people for choosing not to do a simple thing that provides near term benefits.
Heppenheimer
Well-Known Member
And you're doing nothing but continually airing antivaxxer talking points that have been refuted over and over again on this forum.
.Do we know the long term impact of eating a meal at the Crêperie restaurant in Epcot?
I mean, months or years later, the way they made that meal could cause some unknown issues to come up. It hasn't been open long enough to have long term data.
We just don't know. WE JUST DON"T KNOW.
The argument is ridiculous and is exactly the same. The people making it aren't really making it, it's just the excuse they're using. Repeating it as if it's valid is just as ridiculous then. All the worse, if you know it's ridiculous and still treat it as if it was real.
DisneyDebRob
Well-Known Member
That’s why I’m waiting 10 years before eating a crepe at that place. Can never be sure.
DisneyCane
Well-Known Member
Statements like these need a lot more clarification:
Also, we must be careful when speaking in percentages. I assume she is speaking mathematically so that it means that if the vaccines were 90% effective against infection by the original variant (at peak), it would mean 72% effective vs. delta and only 63% effective vs. Omicron.
Given the transmissibility of Omicron, that would basically mean the vaccines are not going to put much of a dent in community transmission of that variant.
That's why it is important to know how effective the vaccines are vs. serious illness with Omicron which may have a low frequency of causing serious illness to start with. If Omicron is no worse than a bad cold for 95% of those infected then its really a non issue anyway.
I'm assuming that both of those numbers a vs. baseline and not 30% less vs. the already reduced by 20%? Even so, "effective" must be defined when an "expert" makes a statement like this. Is she saying effective vs. infection or serious illness or death?
Also, we must be careful when speaking in percentages. I assume she is speaking mathematically so that it means that if the vaccines were 90% effective against infection by the original variant (at peak), it would mean 72% effective vs. delta and only 63% effective vs. Omicron.
Given the transmissibility of Omicron, that would basically mean the vaccines are not going to put much of a dent in community transmission of that variant.
That's why it is important to know how effective the vaccines are vs. serious illness with Omicron which may have a low frequency of causing serious illness to start with. If Omicron is no worse than a bad cold for 95% of those infected then its really a non issue anyway.
Gringrinngghost
Well-Known Member
While Florida is seeing case spikes, with cases doubling this past week, I don’t expect anything of substance but I might as well mention it.
There are no experts and no studies that say not getting vaccinated is better than getting vaccinated.
Nobody with any expertise recommends just getting COVID instead of vaccination.
Several, even on this thread, have taken the opinion that getting COVID is no big deal. None of them are experts in COVID, medicine, or health. They're all wrong too, statistically it's possible it's no big deal, but the impact if you're not in that group may be severe enough that even a small chance is to big a chance.
Chip Chipperson
Well-Known Member
It's especially ridiculous when the people making that argument refuse to listen when shown evidence that vaccines don't cause long-term side effects and that the mRNA is out of your system within days. When people choose to ignore evidence they are either not arguing in good faith or are so brainwashed by anti-vax rhetoric that they'd sooner believe that vaccines cause your favorite pair of socks to get a hole in them than believe that vaccines are safe.
I can understand the initial fear of the unknown. Back in the summer/fall of 2020, I wasn't planning to rush to the front of the line to get my shots when they became available. I figured I'd wait a few months and see how it played out. By the time they became available in late-2020, I had read enough about them and the trials to feel comfortable getting them as soon as I could. Unfortunately, some people never bother doing that while also plugging their ears and closing their eyes and yelling, "Lalalalala, I can't hear you!" when provided with any real information.
That explains so much, no wonder I needed all new socks this year.
The FDA approval process has done a remarkable job resisting becoming political. People may think the FDA is to slow, to many hoops to jump through, to bureaucratic, and it's possible it is all of those things. But, at the end of the day, the FDA safety record is quite reliable. It's managed remarkably to not sacrifice safety for political points for anyone.
JoeCamel
Well-Known Member
You wore socks last year? Not this guy
‘This is unprecedented’: Omicron causes 80% of coronavirus cases in Miami-Dade in 2 weeks
The coronavirus’ new omicron variant is rapidly replacing the delta variant, so public health officials at the federal and local levels are urging people to get the booster shot.
www.local10.com
If this is how bad it is in Miami-Dade County, Florida's most vaccinated county, and IMO, the one with most mask wearing (for Florida), I am horrified to imagine how other counties are doing. I'm also scared at the thought that every weekend, every route between Miami and Orlando is a traffic nightmare full of Miamians going to the parks and Orlandoans going to South Beach and Wynwood.
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