Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[Ayla]

If a restaurant is short-staffed, your dinner takes longer.

If a hospital is short-staffed, you get diverted, potentially hours away from where you live. Or, you sit in the ER for 1-3 days waiting for a bed to open somewhere, anywhere. And your care might be suboptimal.

Or, worst case scenario, you die waiting for a bed/care.

 

[Heppenheimer]

The highest vaccinated states still have 20-30% of teens and adult unvaccinated.

Add to that still sizable population a more contagious variant, and you get this...

View attachment 600219

The current waves are a pandemic of the unvaccinated. And there is still a sizable number of them in every state. Imagine what that graph would look like if vaccination wasn't 70%, but 95%.

So... not surprising at all that the unvaccinated are catching and suffering from a super-charged COVID anywhere and everywhere.

The best way to describe the current course of COVID-19 is a pandemic of the unvaccinated, with some collateral damage amongst the vaccinated but vulnerable.

 

[Heppenheimer]

Or, worst case scenario, you die waiting for a bed/care.

Which has happened, unfortunately.

 

[Ayla]

Because he’s the “face” of the CDC and the CDC are the experts we look to for guidance.

I still think Biden should have asked someone else to step up as the CDC spokesperson, not because Fauci was bad but because so many people don’t trust him and feel he’s too political. A fresh face, without a year and a half of changing recommendations with new discoveries, may resonate better.

A man who has served under 7 different Administrations is not "too political". Some people don't like what he has to say because they're idiots who have zero idea how science actually works.

 

[Ayla]

Which has happened, unfortunately.

Yep.

 

[danlb_2000]

Anti-vaxers are now spreading ideas on how to remove the vaccine from your body if you are required to get vaccinated. We should just let them believe these things will work.

Vaccine holdouts are caving to mandates — then scrambling to 'undo' it

As mandates spread, anti-vaccine groups have been trafficking in pseudoscience treatments meant to remove or counteract the vaccines. Experts say it's like trying to "unring a bell."

www.nbcnews.com

 

[correcaminos]

Don't forget the length of the lab coat. How else would you know an intern, resident, fellow, attending apart if the lab coat didn't get longer each time.

Plus, they have those really big pockets. Need someplace for your Sanford Guide. If Apple is to be believed, for you iPad mini too. An especially important issue for women whose clothes never seem to have pockets. Not like you see men doctors wearing cargo pants either.

(Clearly in jest, but I bet @Heppenheimer has some stories of older colleagues where it wasn't.)

So funny story. My kid was in a production of Matilda Jr. He played the roll of Ms. Truncbull and part of the costume had a skirt. Well a skort but given the dance moves we would have put biker shorts on beneath. He decided at literally last minute to dress up for Halloween and since we had some pieces opted to just do Trunchbull for trick or treating. He grabs his cell phone and tries to put it in the front pocket....

He just learned how much women's clothing is in terms of pockets

 

[correcaminos]

Anti-vaxers are now spreading ideas on how to remove the vaccine from your body if you are required to get vaccinated. We should just let them believe these things will work.

Vaccine holdouts are caving to mandates — then scrambling to 'undo' it

As mandates spread, anti-vaccine groups have been trafficking in pseudoscience treatments meant to remove or counteract the vaccines. Experts say it's like trying to "unring a bell."

www.nbcnews.com

Just saw this posted elsewhere. Outside of the borax if this helps people vaccinate I really don't care what they believe

 

[Andrew C]

Anti-vaxers are now spreading ideas on how to remove the vaccine from your body if you are required to get vaccinated. We should just let them believe these things will work.

Vaccine holdouts are caving to mandates — then scrambling to 'undo' it

As mandates spread, anti-vaccine groups have been trafficking in pseudoscience treatments meant to remove or counteract the vaccines. Experts say it's like trying to "unring a bell."

www.nbcnews.com

Why is NBC News promoting a TikTok video? Hundreds of thousands of views wasn't enough for them?

 

[Andrew C]

Some people don't like what he has to say because they're idiots who have zero idea how science actually works.

Some people don't like being misled and some people don't like officials answering hypotheticals with no basis to back up the claims, only to see these officials change their tune when actual information comes out. But yeah, as a public official, he has no responsibility over how people view him and whether they trust him. It is on everyone else who are apparently idiots.

 

[Flugell]

Happy Birthday dear Shiba 7 years old!

 

[Heppenheimer]

Anti-vaxers are now spreading ideas on how to remove the vaccine from your body if you are required to get vaccinated. We should just let them believe these things will work.

Vaccine holdouts are caving to mandates — then scrambling to 'undo' it

As mandates spread, anti-vaccine groups have been trafficking in pseudoscience treatments meant to remove or counteract the vaccines. Experts say it's like trying to "unring a bell."

www.nbcnews.com

Fortunately, the only way remove the effects of the vaccine would be to completely wipe out your bone marrow with high-dose chemotherapy. They can take all the borax and epsom salt baths they want. Those memory T and B cells aren't going anywhere.

This also shows a fundamental misunderstanding of how vaccines work.

 

[sullyinMT]

Bruce (Catahoula/Pit) and Ruby (Melanois/Border Collie). Bruce is a pandemic addition.

Even Nala, who hates being outside, had enjoyed our extended autumn.

 

[Andrew C]

Fortunately, the only way remove the effects of the vaccine would be to completely wipe out your bone marrow with high-dose chemotherapy. They can take all the borax and epsom salt baths they want. Those memory T and B cells aren't going anywhere.

This also shows a fundamental misunderstanding of how vaccines work.

Sounds painful.

 

[LittleBuford]

I'm not clowing/trolling. Apparently his instincts aren't very good based on how often he is wrong and changes his opinion based on the eventual data. If that's his job then he's not very good at it.

I haven't watched a single cable news show in at least 3 years except for the Coronavirus Task Force press conferences because I found them entertaining.

I don’t understand your focus on Fauci. It would make sense to me if he were giving advice that differed from that of most other experts and that had brought about an idiosyncratic or controversial government response (sort of as happened in Sweden with Anders Tegnell), but that isn’t the case. I’m struggling to see the practical implications of your personal dislike of him.

 

[DisneyCane]

A man who has served under 7 different Administrations is not "too political". Some people don't like what he has to say because they're idiots who have zero idea how science actually works.

Just for full disclosure, what is your degree in that makes you an authority on "how science works?"

A bureaucrat who has "served" under 7 different administrations does not make them apolitical. You think the EPA isn't filled with people with a certain political leaning?

Prior to COVID he just didn't have an outlet for his politics under the guise of "following the science."

 

[DisneyCane]

High of eligible. But, is that still 12+ or updated for 5+ now?

If it's 5+, then why is the "of population" so much lower?

The only value that matters concerning reducing spread is "of population fully vaccinated". Anything else is a feel good number to show progress but not really getting to the tipping point.

While I'll believe that 3 and 4 year olds aren't out socializing all the time. Their daycare are still hives of infectious spread. For a 9 year old, they're out enough to cause plenty of infectious spread.

When we have a state that's over 85% of population fully vaccinated, then I'll agree we have a state that's high on an absolute scale.

My county is 91.9% over 12, with 78% of population, getting very close to high, but in a state that's 77.8% over 12 and 66.5% of population. If we built a wall and had county boarder instead of a state, we'll probably be high in 7 weeks. Alas, we're part of a state, and 66.5% isn't likely going to get to 85% even in 7 weeks. Which is an unfortunate choice, it's clearly possible that it could.

They are currently only including 12+ in the stats. I'm sure that the 80%+ fully vaccinated states above will be at 85% within 6 weeks or so now that 5+ is eligible. There's still 10% or so with one shot that can add to that number in the ensuing time as well.

I don’t understand your focus on Fauci. It would make sense to me if he were giving advice that differed from that of most other experts and that had given brought about an idiosyncratic or controversial government response (sort of as happened in Sweden with Anders Tegnell), but that isn’t the case. I’m struggling to see the practical implications of your personal dislike of him.

I've explained my dislike of his COVID leadership above a few times. I believe he errs on the side of authoritarian and worst case scenario too often and misleads people intentionally. I don't dislike him personally. I don't know him. He could be a nice guy for all I know.

 

[mmascari]

And no, I don't like masks and there is no scientific rationale for fully vaccinated people to be required to wear them anywhere when combined with the fact that everybody who wishes to protect themselves with vaccines and even boosters who is 5 or older can do so now. Yet you won't hear Fauci say the transportation mask mandate should be dropped anytime soon. He'll probably double down on how important masks are because his unstated goal is an unrealistic COVID Zero state.

• We've already agreed that the vaccine reduces but doesn't eliminate.
• We've already agreed that a vaccinated person that is also a breakthrough case is infectious for some period of time. (Less than an unvaccinated person)
• We've already agreed that a mask reduces spread, not eliminate, and that it's more effective as source control.
• We've already agreed that when there is more spread, there will be more breakthrough cases.

But, now, when we combine all of those somehow we get a different answer.

Since, I read that as: In an area with high spread there will be more breakthrough cases, leading to more vaccinated people being infectious (and probably not knowing it), and that to reduce this, they should wear a mask to reduce spread at the source.

It's unfortunate that "reducing community spread" to stop all of this is a group effort and there's group members who don't want to reduce spread. But, not doing the action doesn't make those people go away or cause the spread to be magically lower.

 

[Heppenheimer]

Bringing this back to Disney, wasn't Borax that powdered soap they formerly used in the restrooms?

 

[DisneyCane]

• We've already agreed that the vaccine reduces but doesn't eliminate.
• We've already agreed that a vaccinated person that is also a breakthrough case is infectious for some period of time. (Less than an unvaccinated person)
• We've already agreed that a mask reduces spread, not eliminate, and that it's more effective as source control.
• We've already agreed that when there is more spread, there will be more breakthrough cases.

But, now, when we combine all of those somehow we get a different answer.

Since, I read that as: In an area with high spread there will be more breakthrough cases, leading to more vaccinated people being infectious (and probably not knowing it), and that to reduce this, they should wear a mask to reduce spread at the source.

It's unfortunate that "reducing community spread" to stop all of this is a group effort and there's group members who don't want to reduce spread. But, not doing the action doesn't make those people go away or cause the spread to be magically lower.

Those breakthrough cases are still highly unlikely to lead to serious issues. Since the spread is not going to be eliminated and the protection against severe illness and death is so high for those who are vaccinated, I do not feel that it is incumbent upon the vaccinated to do everything possible to make the risk of spreading the virus as low as possible.

The reduction of spread by stacking mitigations is not additive. If due to the lower likelihood of being infected and the shorter time of being infectious, being vaccinated reduces my chance of being a spreader by 70% (I'm making up a number like Fauci) and if wearing a mask reduces my chance of spreading the virus by 30% (probably somewhere around reality but again, not fact based), being vaccinated and wearing a mask will reduce my chance of being a spreader by 79%.

If these estimates are within the realm of reality I don't feel that I should be subjected to discomfort for such a small (11%) improvement in reduced risk to somebody else especially when that other person could have chosen to be vaccinated as well making the chance of me transmitting to them quite low.

Edit to define quite low: If the risk of a vaccinated person spreading the virus is reduced by 70% and the vaccine is only 50% effective against transmission, the risk of one vaccinated person spreading it to another vaccinated person is reduced by 85% compared to an unvaccinated, no mitigation baseline.

By getting vaccinated, I "did my part." I shouldn't have to do anything else whether it is on an airplane or in line for RotR at DS.