Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[Heppenheimer]

I’m not who you quoted, but this came up in a search about their vaccine. Apparently their early data must look good, even without full submission. I wonder if recent quotes from Dr Fauci regarding three shots being necessary for full protection might be precursors to this, or if he’s referring to same-brand third shots? The second article posted is from a financial analyst’s point of view, but still a reasonable take

Either way, here’s to hoping.
https://seekingalpha.com/news/37355...-fully-vaccinated-two-weeks-after-second-dose

https://www.nasdaq.com/articles/nov...-the-solution-to-emerging-variants-2021-09-01

The enthusiasm from the second article might stem from the fact that Novovax also contains the viral membrane protein, which thus far, hasn't shown nearly as much variance as the spike protein. What I've read about most vaccine development, though, indicates that the spike protein generates the strongest antibody response, hence this is the reason why most of the research focused on the spike as a target. The response to the membrane protein might not be enough by itself provide sufficient immunity, but it could add extra protection along with the usual spike protein antibodies.

 

[mmascari]

As we talk about a third shot, I'm hearing that it's no longer being talked about as a "booster", but becoming a 3 shot series like tetanus.

Tetanus as described by the Mayo Clinic: "An adult who's never been immunized against tetanus should complete the initial tetanus series of three tetanus shots. The first two shots are given at least four weeks apart, and the third shot is given six to 12 months after the second shot."

Replace tetanus with COVID and that statement would work perfectly for the Pfizer vaccine.

Not sure what that means for J&J, but it wouldn't surprise me if that becomes a 2 shot series now, with the second shot after 6 months.

There's all kinds or interesting implications and questions on what that would me to to "Fully Vaccinated" or vaccine passports. I would like to think someone who has the first 2 is good enough to qualify for all of those until enough time has passed that they need third. Tracking it that ways could cause a "Fully Vaccinated" number to decrease if people skip the last shot. Here's your initial proof, it's good for 6-8 months, then you need a new one that's good for XX months/years.

 

[ABQ]

Aside from that, the Nasdaq and Dow Jones are full steam ahead and my 401K is happy!

I could use some further steam as with the rate of inflation though tings appear nice in my IRA, the actual value is less impressive.

 

[Heppenheimer]

I could use some further steam as with the rate of inflation though tings appear nice in my IRA, the actual value is less impressive.

I wouldn't mind some Fed rate increases if it slows down inflation. I could take a hit to my investments for a few months.

 

[sullyinMT]

As we talk about a third shot, I'm hearing that it's no longer being talked about as a "booster", but becoming a 3 shot series like tetanus.

Tetanus as described by the Mayo Clinic: "An adult who's never been immunized against tetanus should complete the initial tetanus series of three tetanus shots. The first two shots are given at least four weeks apart, and the third shot is given six to 12 months after the second shot."

Replace tetanus with COVID and that statement would work perfectly for the Pfizer vaccine.

Not sure what that means for J&J, but it wouldn't surprise me if that becomes a 2 shot series now, with the second shot after 6 months.

There's all kinds or interesting implications and questions on what that would me to to "Fully Vaccinated" or vaccine passports. I would like to think someone who has the first 2 is good enough to qualify for all of those until enough time has passed that they need third. Tracking it that ways could cause a "Fully Vaccinated" number to decrease if people skip the last shot. Here's your initial proof, it's good for 6-8 months, then you need a new one that's good for XX months/years.

It would be interesting as a few places in the EU, like Italy, are allowing continued US tourism without quarantine if fully vaccinated. What happens if you’re 3 months after dose 2 but not yet eligible for #3? Unless something drastically changes in data, that individual is still largely protected though incomplete in the series. Our vaxxed/unvaxxed hospitalization ratio shows at least community health system protection in that scenario. It will be interesting to watch, but for now I tend to agree that it would make sense to include them in the protected for travel’s sake bucket.

 

[DisneyCane]

The enthusiasm from the second article might stem from the fact that Novovax also contains the viral membrane protein, which thus far, hasn't shown nearly as much variance as the spike protein. What I've read about most vaccine development, though, indicates that the spike protein generates the strongest antibody response, hence this is the reason why most of the research focused on the spike as a target. The a response to the membrane protein might not be enough by itself provide sufficient immunity, but it could add extra protection along with the usual spike protein antibodies.

Future vaccine cocktails?

 

[DisneyCane]

As we talk about a third shot, I'm hearing that it's no longer being talked about as a "booster", but becoming a 3 shot series like tetanus.

Tetanus as described by the Mayo Clinic: "An adult who's never been immunized against tetanus should complete the initial tetanus series of three tetanus shots. The first two shots are given at least four weeks apart, and the third shot is given six to 12 months after the second shot."

Replace tetanus with COVID and that statement would work perfectly for the Pfizer vaccine.

Not sure what that means for J&J, but it wouldn't surprise me if that becomes a 2 shot series now, with the second shot after 6 months.

There's all kinds or interesting implications and questions on what that would me to to "Fully Vaccinated" or vaccine passports. I would like to think someone who has the first 2 is good enough to qualify for all of those until enough time has passed that they need third. Tracking it that ways could cause a "Fully Vaccinated" number to decrease if people skip the last shot. Here's your initial proof, it's good for 6-8 months, then you need a new one that's good for XX months/years.

It's going to take some time to gather the data to determine if a 3rd dose is the last in a series or if frequent boosters will still be needed. If it is just a 3rd dose to complete the series, I think the acceptance will be much higher than if it is a "booster" and boosters are needed more than once a year.

 

[Heppenheimer]

Future vaccine cocktails?

I'll take mine on the rocks with a cherry, please. Fire up some mid-century lounge music, and it'll be a party!

 

[Ayla]

Turns out Ivermectin won the Nobel Prize in 2015 for its outstanding results treating humans.

The Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine 2015

The Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine 2015 was divided, one half jointly to William C. Campbell and Satoshi Ōmura "for their discoveries concerning a novel therapy against infections caused by roundworm parasites" and the other half to Tu Youyou "for her discoveries concerning a novel...

www.nobelprize.org

Yes, humans with parasitic worms. It does nothing for covid.

 

[GoofGoof]

As we talk about a third shot, I'm hearing that it's no longer being talked about as a "booster", but becoming a 3 shot series like tetanus.

Tetanus as described by the Mayo Clinic: "An adult who's never been immunized against tetanus should complete the initial tetanus series of three tetanus shots. The first two shots are given at least four weeks apart, and the third shot is given six to 12 months after the second shot."

Replace tetanus with COVID and that statement would work perfectly for the Pfizer vaccine.

Not sure what that means for J&J, but it wouldn't surprise me if that becomes a 2 shot series now, with the second shot after 6 months.

There's all kinds or interesting implications and questions on what that would me to to "Fully Vaccinated" or vaccine passports. I would like to think someone who has the first 2 is good enough to qualify for all of those until enough time has passed that they need third. Tracking it that ways could cause a "Fully Vaccinated" number to decrease if people skip the last shot. Here's your initial proof, it's good for 6-8 months, then you need a new one that's good for XX months/years.

For things like employment vaccine requirements and passports I would assume they mirror the requirements of a 3rd shot 8 months after the 2nd shot. So for TWDC their non-union workers are required to have 2 shots by 10/1 therefore I would assume they will be required to have shot 3 by 6/1/22. For people who took JnJ I think we need to see what the recommendation is for an additional shot. If there is not a recommendation than I would assume you are considered in compliance after shot 1. If they also recommend a booster for JnJ after 8 months than I would assume you follow the same logic and require a second shot 8 months after the policy goes into effect.

 

[Ayla]

Yup. Wife’s company is a small player in the business traveller bucket, but just as trips were being approved the plug was pulled again. Trips aren’t outright banned, but the threshold for justification is quite high.

DH's company dropped the restriction on business travel for salesmen and three days later, as some of them were due to leave later that evening for their first in-person customer visits in 18 months, they were told to cancel.

Trips are still a no-go for their company.

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

In Africa and Asia, the drug was probably a game-changer.

Too bad it does nothing for COVID patients.

On top of that, people are walking into animal feed shops and trying to buy the livestock version off the shelf (there is a specific human-grade version). They're planning to use it without any medical guidance on things like a safe dosage.

Calgary feed shop forced to hide Ivermectin livestock dewormer being touted as COVID-19 cure | Globalnews.ca

Demand for the livestock dewormer Ivermectin as a cure for COVID-19 has forced one feed store south of Calgary to pull the product from shelves.

globalnews.ca

In some cases of head lice and rosacea, topical versions of Ivermectin are approved as well — but that’s the extent of it. It has no ability to protect humans from COVID-19 or any other sort of viral invader.

Humans who misuse or overdose on ivermectin can experience side effects like diarrhea, nausea, vomiting, low blood pressure, allergic reactions, problems with balance, seizures, coma and even death, according to the FDA.

 

[Andrew C]

God is great, beer is good, and people are crazy.

 

[Ayla]

On top of that, people are walking into animal feed shops and trying to buy the livestock version off the shelf (there is a specific human-grade version). They're planning to use it without any medical guidance on things like a safe dosage.

Calgary feed shop forced to hide Ivermectin livestock dewormer being touted as COVID-19 cure | Globalnews.ca

Demand for the livestock dewormer Ivermectin as a cure for COVID-19 has forced one feed store south of Calgary to pull the product from shelves.

globalnews.ca

In some cases of head lice and rosacea, topical versions of Ivermectin are approved as well — but that’s the extent of it. It has no ability to protect humans from COVID-19 or any other sort of viral invader.

Humans who misuse or overdose on ivermectin can experience side effects like diarrhea, nausea, vomiting, low blood pressure, allergic reactions, problems with balance, seizures, coma and even death, according to the FDA.

It can also put you straight into liver failure.

 

[Lilofan]

God is great, beer is good, and people are crazy.

All correct and the weather is warm and the drinks are cold - enjoy FL for all you visitors to the Sunshine State.

 

[Heppenheimer]

On top of that, people are walking into animal feed shops and trying to buy the livestock version off the shelf (there is a specific human-grade version). They're planning to use it without any medical guidance on things like a safe dosage.

Calgary feed shop forced to hide Ivermectin livestock dewormer being touted as COVID-19 cure | Globalnews.ca

Demand for the livestock dewormer Ivermectin as a cure for COVID-19 has forced one feed store south of Calgary to pull the product from shelves.

globalnews.ca

In some cases of head lice and rosacea, topical versions of Ivermectin are approved as well — but that’s the extent of it. It has no ability to protect humans from COVID-19 or any other sort of viral invader.

Humans who misuse or overdose on ivermectin can experience side effects like diarrhea, nausea, vomiting, low blood pressure, allergic reactions, problems with balance, seizures, coma and even death, according to the FDA.

Even human formulations make people feel a little toxic. It's not a medication you would want to take unless necessary.

 

[correcaminos]

If Novovax doesn’t get approved here in the US (although the company had been saying they were applying or use in 4th quarter), then what happens to my daughter and thousands of others who were part of their vaccine trial? Currently she is still being considered “unvaccinated” since Novovax isn’t approved/recognized in the US as a vaccine.

Any idea @Heppenheimer?

So that's the problem with being in a trial, you are not guaranteed status. If she has proof of vaccination at this stage (which I am guessing is the case based on what I just read from an article earlier this summer?) then it would be up to each requiring vaccination to decide if it is valid. Until it does have approval somewhere in the globe then yes, unvaccinated is the status for most things like travel. Keep in mind AZ/Oxford trial participants are there too, though they have been unblinded. Though globally should might be okay since they have their vaccine status at this point (they were unblinded only as vaccines became available to them and WHO approved edit to add link https://covid19.trackvaccines.org/agency/who/). If you look at cruises and such, they are often specific on which they accept. Ohio State is very specific and allows a lot of global vaccines. It is a negative to doing the trial. I knew if proof was required, I could be SOL. For example I didn't even get my vaccine card until about 6 months after the fact. Though I had a letter starting end of Jan.

 

[JohnByers]

Yeah, it’s a tough time for the travel industry. Aside from people pulling back on leisure travel many companies have put the breaks on a return of business travel. I know my company had finally removed the restriction on non-essential business travel back in June when most of the corporate offices reopened but we are back to no non-essential travel without VP level approval. It’s crushing to the airlines and hotel industry as well as the urban based restaurants. I can’t tell you how many meals a year just my group alone ate in downtown Houston and none of us has been to Houston since before the pandemic. I’m sure the same applies to many business travelers.

My wife is a TA and the amount of time she has spent planning and subsequently canceling vacations just in 2021 alone that she won't see a penny of payment is disheartening. I really feel for her and she loves her job but the steam is running out that is for sure.

 

[DisneyDebRob]

My wife is a TA and the amount of time she has spent planning and subsequently canceling vacations just in 2021 alone that she won't see a penny of payment is disheartening. I really feel for her and she loves her job but the steam is running out that is for sure.

Same here. It’s disheartening the planning , the time spent, all for cancellations. But that’s life in these times. Nothing anyone can do about it. Add that most flights are being moved to very strange time or cancelled just makes it crazier. This morning 2 clients canceled trips because of Florida’s situation, another group of 5 families traveling together had their flight from 8 am changed to 7 at night. It’s crazy.

 

[Polkadotdress]

I’m not who you quoted, but this came up in a search about their vaccine. Apparently their early data must look good, even without full submission. I wonder if recent quotes from Dr Fauci regarding three shots being necessary for full protection might be precursors to this, or if he’s referring to same-brand third shots? The second article posted is from a financial analyst’s point of view, but still a reasonable take

Either way, here’s to hoping.
https://seekingalpha.com/news/37355...-fully-vaccinated-two-weeks-after-second-dose

https://www.nasdaq.com/articles/nov...-the-solution-to-emerging-variants-2021-09-01

Sorry about that. The quote feature in the iPhone frequently pulls wrong info. And once it had posted I couldn’t fix it. That was Heppenheimer’s post.