Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[CatesMom]

Why did it matter to the families whether Covid was listed as a cause of death? Were the families worried that they would be somehow tainted? Certainly the accidents were also identified as causes.

 

[Dan Deesnee]

Why did it matter to the families whether Covid was listed as a cause of death? Were the families worried that they would be somehow tainted? Certainly the accidents were also identified as causes.

Well I certainly wouldn't want my loved ones death being used to pad a statistic. One of the families I knew extremely well, the other I didn't so their motivations are their own.

 

[robhedin]

Yes, from the website:

This screening website will allow you to confirm a recent negative COVID-19 test result or vaccination status and demonstrate this information to third parties.

To facilitate this confirmation, the website collects your COVID-19 status, and website use for the sole purpose of your receiving a Excelsior Pass the essential information from you, which may include questions such as: First Name; Last name; Date of Birth; Zip Code; vaccination location or COVID-19 test location; vaccination type or COVID-19 test type; and vaccination date or COVID-19 test date.

Based on this information, the application queries the State-hosted database through an interface and returns to you and active or inactive pass.

NY State Excelsior Pass

epass.ny.gov

Required Disclosure: I am not speaking for my employer.

The NY State Excelsior program is build around IBM's Digital Health Pass, with which I am intimately aware. It is explicitly built to allow for a federated set of connected verifiers (eg: various states, labs, pharmacies, doctors, etc).

It's called Health Pass for a reason. It's not just about vaccinations, it also allows for validation of testing (the initial use case is, of course, COVID-19 but it could do anything, for example: proof of a negative STD test, proof of other vaccines, etc.).

One major point for the NY program: people don't have to use the digital pass; it's merely a means to an end. If a venue requires proof of vaccination, people can provide the necessary information in alternate means (the paper form showing they've been vaccinated for instance). It's probably easier to carry ones cell phone than their vaccination records, though.

 

[fgmnt]

Yeah, don't force people who are perfectly healthy to get the vaccine, just make it impossible for them to live a normal life. All for the "greater good" right? Anyone who supports vaccine passports should immediately start pushing for bans on unhealthy foods. After all we have to protect each others health and unhealthy food creates a huge drag on our health care system as well.

There will always be communicable diseases. Life will always have risk. These passports just continue the further stripping away of our freedoms in the name of "safety".

The USA requires healthy children many vaccines to enter most public schools in the country: MMR, polio, chicken pox, and DTaP are the ones most common. Polio is still endemic in a couple parts of the world. Most public universities require the meningococcal vaccine. Why? These are all potentially fatal, often damaging, and communicable viral originated diseases! Requiring people to enter certain facilities with a vaccine certification is an incredibly marginal (literally N+1) extension on top of what a vast, overwhelming, near unanimous number of American adults have experienced directly in public school or for much older Americans, indirectly through kids of their own. Decrying this specific idea as some sort of unprecedented and irreversible expansion of the security state of the USA is laughable. I guess you would have a leg to stand on if you were Amish or something, but you likely would not be on an online forum complaining about it.

It’s already up and running. The post I replied to said it would take so long to setup that the pandemic would be over. I was just pointing out that it doesn’t take that long to setup. If vaccine passports never become a reality in the US it will not be because of the time or challenges of setting them up. There are plenty of other reasons it’s unlikely to be a thing here.

Over a quarter of Americans have already been vaccinated against a disease that did not knowingly exist 16 months ago, and that is thanks to the overwhelming power of the American government and economy being directed in a way to benefit the American people and global community at a miraculous pace. For decades you could say "this country put man on the moon" as a way to define the power of American ingenuity and willpower. Now we have this. At this point, citizens of the US should rightly see any failure of a government-oriented project firmly as a political choice. This country absolutely can craft an effective covid vaccine passport program.

 

[GimpYancIent]

The USA requires healthy children many vaccines to enter most public schools in the country: MMR, polio, chicken pox, and DTaP are the ones most common. Polio is still endemic in a couple parts of the world. Most public universities require the meningococcal vaccine. Why? These are all potentially fatal, often damaging, and communicable viral originated diseases! Requiring people to enter certain facilities with a vaccine certification is an incredibly marginal (literally N+1) extension on top of what a vast, overwhelming, near unanimous number of American adults have experienced directly in public school or for much older Americans, indirectly through kids of their own. Decrying this specific idea as some sort of unprecedented and irreversible expansion of the security state of the USA is laughable. I guess you would have a leg to stand on if you were Amish or something, but you likely would not be on an online forum complaining about it.



Over a quarter of Americans have already been vaccinated against a disease that did not knowingly exist 16 months ago, and that is thanks to the overwhelming power of the American government and economy being directed in a way to benefit the American people and global community at a miraculous pace. For decades you could say "this country put man on the moon" as a way to define the power of American ingenuity and willpower. Now we have this. At this point, citizens of the US should rightly see any failure of a government-oriented project firmly as a political choice. This country absolutely can craft an effective covid vaccine passport program.

A COVID19 Vaccination Passport program sounds impressive but worthless. All that a person needs is a vaccination card, Hey!, something that already exists. I understand some people get a charge out of having an App on their personal electronic device yet the simple little vaccination card accomplishes the same thing. Tech is a wonderful thing until the smart device gets wet or there is a power outage. Just saying.

 

[fgmnt]

A COVID19 Vaccination Passport program sounds impressive but worthless. All that a person needs is a vaccination card, Hey!, something that already exists. I understand some people get a charge out of having an App on their personal electronic device yet the simple little vaccination card accomplishes the same thing. Tech is a wonderful thing until the smart device gets wet or there is a power outage. Just saying.

There is work that can be done on a national level to create an effective database of information about this, which is what the post was referring to. It's not like the federal government does not contain the capability to centrally contain data points unique to american citizens and residents! It's a political choice. It can be done! Whether or not it will be done, sure, wax however you will on that.

 

[UNCgolf]

This means by federal law they cannot be mandatory and any company that says they are mandatory to do business with or work for them can be sued for any and all damages resulting from the vaccines.

This is not even remotely close to being true. I have no idea where you heard this but whoever said it is either massively uninformed or blatantly lying.

 

[oceanbreeze77]

This doesn't even explore the privacy issues, that is a whole other story.

ONCE AGAIN PROOF OF VACCINATIONS IS NOT A BREACH OF PRIVACY.

Thousands of schools have required proof of vaccines for decades. Other countries have required certain vaccines to enter that country. THIS IS NOT A NEW CONCEPT.

 

[GimpYancIent]

There is work that can be done on a national level to create an effective database of information about this, which is what the post was referring to. It's not like the federal government does not contain the capability to centrally contain data points unique to american citizens and residents! It's a political choice. It can be done! Whether or not it will be done, sure, wax however you will on that.

Ah I forgot to say a person can laminate the card to better preserve it.

 

[GimpYancIent]

Not a good idea as boosters may be necessary.

True. I still have my old school shot / vaccination record and I actually ended up w two more shot / vaccination records from my time in the Army. I think I have been vaccinated against everything known to science, that is until now. I am happy with the card. All that documentation and $1.50 might get me a cup of coffee. Data bases with unimaginable amounts of information on people are all over the place, not just in governments, things are at a point where the right hand can not communicate w the left. The simple little card will do just fine for the intended purposes everybody keeps talking about.

 

[Dan Deesnee]

Cite the law.

Although i'm not aware of any law (I think vaccine producers/creators are actually exempt from being sued...that should tell you something), it's a tricky situation. I'm not doing the research for you, but if you read this you'll see that employers requiring the vaccine is, as stated above, a very tricky situation to navigate.

https://www.skillsoft.com/blog/to-r...orny-issue-of-the-covid-vaccine-for-employers

 

[Vegas Disney Fan]

Comparing California and Florida, as many of your ilk have done, is an oversimplification.

On a Disney message board it makes sense to compare the responses of the two US states with a Disney park though, the fact they are the 1st and 3rd most populous states just makes the comparisons that much more relevant.

People aren’t upset with California because they have mask mandates, social distancing mandates, etc... they are upset by the fact that California has completely ignored that the WDW counter measures have proven affective for 9 months and DL is still closed.

9 months later and despite DL (and most forms of entertainment) still being closed California’s numbers are almost identical to Florida’s, surely you can understand why people (especially Disney fans) would be comparing the stats and upset?

 

[MagicHappens1971]

Many counties in FL, especially the higher population ones, still have restaurant capacity restrictions and have since September. From speaking to some owners, break even is the best case for dine in at 50% capacity.

Some restaurants would have closed due to people not being comfortable eating out, however, fewer would have been put out of business or forced to lose enormous sums if not for government imposed restrictions.

As a native of Palm Beach County, one of the largest counties in Florida, we have no restrictions and have not since DeSantis lifted them in September. All bars/clubs/restaurants operate at 100% capacity.

 

[BrianLo]

In an ideal world, we would do one age group at a time, but I think in the interest of getting as many people vaccinated as possible (which is the end goal), that we should just open up vaccine appointments to everyone 18+ and have clinics open 24/7.

While this does theoretically seems problematic, remember it wasn't that long ago we were cancelling appointments when we ran out. The doses aren't being thrown out. If a 68 year old no-shows, there are more 68 (or 67) year olds waiting to take their spot. Opening up to everyone just ensures those patiently waiting their turn will significantly on average wait longer... thus creating a lottery system.

I would be worried if the backlog of supply was dramatically outpacing the ability to deliver, but that also isn't the issue. We just need more supply. It's frustrating to hear Americans happen upon a dose in a grocery store, but again that's not an actual responsible plan and not the reason they are ahead of us. It's all supply.

 

[BrianLo]

That's not how that works. Last I checked Seniors don't travel in their own exclusive herd.

 

[The Mom]

This is a NO Politics thread - there is another Covid thread in General Discussion if you must go down that road.

 

[Rumrunner]

This virus is fading because of the vaccines and the fact we are in the early stages of herd immunity. The mostly downward trends will hopefully accelerate as those factors become more prevalent.

 

[pixie225]

We don't leave home without our driver's license - no matter where we go - U.S. or outside U.S. Putting another hard plastic (vaccination) card next to it in our wallet would not be a big deal. Shouldn't be too hard for the government/state government to mail one out to each person who is vaccinated, as they do medicare/medicaid and drivers license or any other plastic cards people carry with them. (credit cards, library cards, aaa card, etc.).

 

[MisterPenguin]

Airborne and large doses of C (Emergen-C) have both been found NOT to boost immune systems or prevent sickness.

You mean that if I dump gallons of gas on top of my car engine, it won't go faster?

 

[Heppenheimer]

This virus is fading because of the vaccines and the fact we are in the early stages of herd immunity. The mostly downward trends will hopefully accelerate as those factors become more prevalent.

Except, it currently isn't fading:

New COVID-19 Cases Worldwide - Johns Hopkins Coronavirus Resource Center

Have countries flattened the curve? Daily confirmed new COVID-19 cases for the most affected countries over time.

coronavirus.jhu.edu

I hope this is just a temporary blip, but we've screwed this up enough times in the past and failed to learn the proper lessons every time... so let's just say my bet is that this is going to get worse again before it gets better.