Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[MaryJaneP]

Would it help vaccination rates if TDC released images of significant Disney characters getting and encouraging others to get vaccinated? Kinda like the Rosie the Riveter and similar posters from WWII.

 

[Tony the Tigger]

From what I have seen vaccine avoidance has been bipartisan just like the illness has no biases.

Read the article, and you’ll see in what ways your assertion is inaccurate.

 

[LaughingGravy]

The CDC has already revised their guidelines for fully vaccinated people to remove the quarantine requirements and restriction on indoor gatherings. Per the studies that are out there the risk of infection or spreading Covid is very low once vaccinated. That’s why they updated the guidelines and are preparing further updates on travel once fully vaccinated.

Yes, among fully vaccinated people. That's the key.

 

[GoofGoof]

No. I am not latching onto the worst case. I have repeatedly promoted caution, highlighted our lack of experience with pandemics and that steps on the list must be checked off, like the pre-flight checklist I mentioned a few days ago. What has happened is that my comments keep being interpreted as gloom and doom promoting a worst case scenario.

The actual worst case scenarios would not be “slow down” messaging but the ones in which we need 90%+ vaccination rates, a variant of concern erupts in one of the 7 billion people who have yet to be vaccinated that escapes immunity, immunity wears off... things like that.

I have consistently pushed back against the fears of the latter two. Only that we have to wait for the proof and not simply assume that something will be the case, on the timeline described by laypeople and get ahead of ourselves. The impact of going too fast is that it will end up slowing us down. Which will upset everyone. I do believe the herd immunity threshold is higher than people hope, because as I said before, I believe in math. We have confidence in the range of the transmissibility rate, and can make a calculation based on that, as someone else posted about. We can approximate. It makes no sense that with more transmissible variants than the original the threshold would go down. Except if it’s about messaging and not truth telling.

In Hollywood movie battles, there is often a guy shouting at the line to hold, to wait before charging. It’s always longer than others think it should be. That doesn’t equal defeatism and gloom and doom about the outcome. Impatience is an enemy, the same way denialism is. And with both, people claim they aren’t that at all. They believe they are just being optimistic.

On herd immunity go back to last Summer or even the fall. Many of the same experts were saying 40-60% immune as the range. It wasn’t until Oct/Nov and we found out that we had 2 vaccines with 95% efficacy that the number creeped up to 70-90%. I get that logic. If you say we can reach herd immunity with 60% immune and the vaccines were all 60% effective you would need 100% vaccinated. If you find out you have a 95% effective vaccine then you only need 2/3 vaccinated for 60% immune. If the public assumes only 2/3 need to be vaccinated you have more vaccine hesitancy. Bad outcome. You can Google the interviews where Dr Fauci said they same thing.

My only point is that the consensus estimated percent needed for herd immunity is not going down it‘s much higher than it was in the past. The estimates in the past were all based on math and science too so it wasn’t just wishful thinking. The truth is we have no idea what the number needs to be and won’t know until after we reach it. There’s no calculation that can be done today with any level of real certainty. As far as variants, the vaccines are highly effective vs the UK variant. See recent studies in the UK after the rollout of the vaccines. The unvaccinated will be infected faster than before the variants so if anything we may reach herd immunity faster if that particular variant becomes more dominant.

 

[danlb_2000]

Same webpage shows Active Cases dropping. I guess it depends on your POV, but I agree it would be nice for both graphs to be dropping.

Wife is in healthcare, it's been a steady drop at her hospital. Still ways to go.


We went last August and we will be back this August.

Not sure how reliable a number Active Cases is. Unless you were hospitalized, the state wouldn't know that you had recovered, unless they just assume after a certain number of days, you have recovered.

 

[correcaminos]

Would it help vaccination rates if TDC released images of significant Disney characters getting and encouraging others to get vaccinated? Kinda like the Rosie the Riveter and similar posters from WWII.

I don't mean to make light of vaccination promotion, but I just had a picture of Minnie as Rosie getting vaccinated

 

[LaughingGravy]

Not sure how reliable a number Active Cases is. Unless you were hospitalized, the state wouldn't know that you had recovered, unless they just assume after a certain number of days, you have recovered.

Neighbor family down the street. One kid was reportedly super sick with what may have been Covid-19 in February of 2020. He was never tested. The mom is convinced he had it. Let's simply say mom is no doctor. The kid is a college kid. Nobody in the house has been vaccinated to my knowledge. They are going under the assumption that he got it, transmitted it to the rest in the family, and that either the rest of the family had a mild or non symptomatic case, so they are all covered. More missing data.

 

[DCBaker]

If you fit the eligibility guidelines, it seems there is plenty of vaccine with no wait at the Valencia College West Campus site -

 

[JAKECOTCenter]

I'm not worried about taking the vaccine but I am worried that we won't be able to vaccinate enough people because of hesitancy. we could end up vaccinating like 63 percent of the population and yet have 25 percent not take it because of hesitancy

 

[seascape]

I don’t know how Disney could ever actually enforce a masks only for the unvaccinated rule, but that doesn’t mean they won’t do that. What I think is highly likely is that many employers will make that their rule, including Disney for workers. Employees can come back to work at an office or at a bar or at a factory or at WDW and no longer need to wear a mask if they get vaccinated. If you aren’t vaccinated you still need to wear a mask. An employer can absolutely legally ask you for proof of vaccination. Many people falsely think that HIPPA laws make it illegal for an employer to ask that, but that’s not true. HIPPA only prevents doctors and pharmacies from sharing your medical records without your permission. I think it would be a powerful tool to get people who are hesitant to get the vaccine to get one. If you have to wear a mask for a while longer without it most people would just get the vaccine.

For Disney I would expect them to require CMs to get the vaccine and if they don’t want to then they will either be shifted to non-customer facing roles or asked to continue wearing a mask. For guests it’s possible at some point that they make their rule that you need to wear a mask unless you are vaccinated. They could require you to answer a yes/no question on vaccination when buying a park ticket or booking a hotel room and then just layout the rule. People would be on the honor system to comply. It would be a legal CYA. If someone started an outbreak Disney could point to the rule and be at least partially covered. I don’t see Disney ever actively trying to enforce a mask rule only on unvaccinated people.

Disney can't enforce a mask only for the unvaccinated rule. That is why my wife and I know we will wear masks to Dapper Day in late April. We missed a full year at WDW and since we will both be fully vaccinated will not wait any longer. However, we want everyone to do the right thing.

On another topic, I find it very humorous that anyone would say you are overly optimistic. I think you are actually pessimistic, since you keep saying June or later for normality to return. I am the optimistic person here even if I am yelling at my NJ and NY neighbors. see below.

Fellow resident in NJ here...

I think you're overselling the outdoor risks at the end of your post.

If you are outdoors, the virus doesn't spread as easily.

NJ numbers keep falling, let's hope for that.

NJ numbers are not falling. They have increased daily this past week. 41 cases per 100,000. If you think being number 1 for anything is good, then reconsider and think of NJ being dead last in fighting Covid19 because every other state and territory of the USA has less cases per 100,000. NJ is doing horribly and should be the laughingstock of the US based on our numbers. 20% more cases per 100,000 compared to the next highest state, NY.

 

[SamusAranX]

If you fit the eligibility guidelines, it seems there is plenty of vaccine with no wait at the Valencia College West Campus site -

Again, I wish they would allow walk-ups from all groups, to prevent waste of dosage(s). I would drive there immediately even though it’s 2 hours

 

[Incomudro]

And that is up to an individual. My question is why should I be forced to subject myself to an option that I have a moral disagreement with when there are other options available? This board is full people who pretend to be so progressive and tolerant until they aren't . I am not particularly referring to you . You asked a question and I answered it and now I am being lectured and vaccine shamed by one poster and another poster is making snide little passive aggressive comments clearly made at my expense.

I'm an atheist, yet fully understand why a person of faith might not want to get vaccinated by the J&J vaccine.

 

[Lilofan]

I'm not worried about taking the vaccine but I am worried that we won't be able to vaccinate enough people because of hesitancy. we could end up vaccinating like 63 percent of the population and yet have 25 percent not take it because of hesitancy

Just think the current private business policy of some is
No Mask No Service

Turn it Round and private business owners can institute
No Vaccine No Service

 

[GoofGoof]

Disney can't enforce a mask only for the unvaccinated rule. That is why my wife and I know we will wear masks to Dapper Day in late April. We missed a full year at WDW and since we will both be fully vaccinated will not wait any longer. However, we want everyone to do the right thing.

On another topic, I find it very humorous that anyone would say you are overly optimistic. I think you are actually pessimistic, since you keep saying June or later for normality to return. I am the optimistic person here even if I am yelling at my NJ and NY neighbors. see below.

Yes, among fully vaccinated people. That's the key.

Of course there will still be masks in late April and there probably will still be masks at WDW on 7/4. Eventually though we will reach the point where everyone who is going to get vaccinated has gone. It’s sometime after time that the masks and distancing and capacity limits should be gone. We can’t require 100% of people to wear masks and distance to protect the 20% or so people who don’t want a vaccine and a portion of them will be naturally immune anyway. That’s why the rules are likely to change to say if you are vaccinated you don’t need to do certain things and once the vast majority are in the vaccinated camp there’s no reason Disney won’t change the rules to reflect that.

 

[DisneyFan32]

Of course there will still be masks in late April and there probably will still be masks at WDW on 7/4. Eventually though we will reach the point where everyone who is going to get vaccinated has gone. It’s sometime after time that the masks and distancing and capacity limits should be gone. We can’t require 100% of people to wear masks and distance to protect the 20% or so people who don’t want a vaccine and a portion of them will be naturally immune anyway. That’s why the rules are likely to change to say if you are vaccinated you don’t need to do certain things and once the vast majority are in the vaccinated camp there’s no reason Disney won’t change the rules to reflect that.

Is NJ and NY may losing masks and social distancing soon when I getting second shot in April 1st to fully vaccinated. Is there's not going to be another spike or surge like UK, Brazil or South Africa variants? @GoofGoof

 

[Incomudro]

Here we are. Over a year later since the lockdown.
Every time there is a plateau, or some other good news, like higher vaccine availability is coming(not here yet, but coming next month or weeks away), and even opening up capacity ( which I don't agree with until the numbers are lower, but businesses are hurting and I get that, so open up slowly, but for heavens sake keep the mask and distancing mandates), a lot of people take that as a sign to:

• Not worry about it, ignore mask and or/distancing rules still in place ( increased capacity does not negate distancing and mask rules/common sense when we now know how this is spread).
• Further justify not even an intent to get an available vaccine because others will get the vaccine, planning on being part of the 20%-30% who never get vaccinated
• Have "moral objections" to the source of the vaccine. Yes, I put that in quotes intended for the hypocrites who selectively pull that out while ignoring many other moral or religious issues that don't suit them either in the past or at the moment.
• Wear a mask loosely, not properly fitting to do the job and only a single layer.
• Not sanitizing or washing hands when in contact with things where you should be. Many did it in the beginning, but people get complacent.

It's been over a year.
For those who fit any or more of the above points, for those still objecting on the mask front, including those who rip off the mask the second they walk outside of a requiring store ( or not even all the way out of the store, or exposing their nose whenever possible, not even waiting until they get back in their car), this will continue and you are part of the problem. The rest of us are not.

Here in NJ, one of the hardest hit states at the beginning, we had beautiful weather this past weekend, and people everywhere were gathering at local little league games, on the streets, in parking lots, parks, walking, etc. with no distancing or masks.

In less than two weeks, our covid numbers and deaths will go up yet again. I'm hoping for a nice July 4th, but it's not going to happen unless we get everybody to cooperate.

Removing one's mask the second one exits a store or before entering their car (as I do) does absolutely nothing spread covid19 unless people who do so exit stores and enter parking lots that are densely packed with people.
I don't know where such places are - perhaps there are parking lots where people can't avoid being some 6 feet or more from other people?
I've never seen such a place, even in urban locations.

 

[HarperRose]

You read way too much into my post and honestly I'm baffled why you cared to reply if you dislike me so much. I'm not an expert on anything. Used articles to explain and used a global figure to back up. What does Martin Luther have to do with it other than maybe a subtle dig at Catholics though? And yes, there is a need to point out pro-life and the real meaning. As a true pro life person I get disgusted with how it is misused.

I'm not tolerant of those fighting science and claiming to use religion as an excuse. I'm usually understanding and tolerant of a lot, but the selfish world we live in has pushed me. So yes, this is not a valid excuse at all. It's reaching. Dislike it all you like but that's the reality. The same people who didn't want it before actually latched on to a Catholic archbishop going against the church and ran with it. Catholic or not.

Oh and vaccine shame? No. Just stop with the playing victim. I'm not easily manipulated, thanks.

For goodness sake just stop already. No one is forcing or shaming. Explaining is not shaming. Not claiming to be progressive either... geez.

We've all seen over the last 12 months facts, truth and science don't matter to too many people. Don't waste your time on them.

 

[hopemax]

On another topic, I find it very humorous that anyone would say you are overly optimistic. I think you are actually pessimistic, since you keep saying June or later for normality to return.

For the record, I made a statement about the effect of misplaced optimism of Americans, overall. And a separate statement on a specific piece of the state of the pandemic involving GoofGoof. People can be in more than one place about the state of things. Precautions are one thing, meeting benchmarks are another.

 

[DisneyFan32]

For the record, I made a statement about the effect of misplaced optimism of Americans, overall. And a separate statement on a specific piece of the state of the pandemic involving GoofGoof. People can be in more than one place about the state of things. Precautions are one thing, meeting benchmarks are another.

Is unlikely we will get another surge soon or not? As many people will getting vaccinating by July. Is going to be back to normal by summer or fall/winter.

 

[correcaminos]

Is unlikely we will get another surge soon or not? As many people will getting vaccinating by July. Is going to be back to normal by summer or fall/winter.

Unlikely a real sugre will happen