Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[Disney Experience]

You guys can believe what you want, but there is no way you will convince me the majority of the anti-mask movement was based on that. I stand by my statement, that’s delusional. The anti-Fauci sentiment is purely and totally based on politics. Trump supporters felt he hurt Trump’s chances of being re-elected.

Actually I supported Trump. I love truth, and was disappointed when Fauci tried to deceive the general public, not because of trump in the least. Trump can stand or fall on his own words, and honestly I liked that Fauci would “sometimes disagree”. Politicians allowing disagreements is good in that varying points of opinion get known.

I think Fauci will not stay in lockstep with politicians of either party, and that is good to me. I am disappointed when someone lies to the public, because it diminishes the public trust in what truths they say in the future.

 

[DisneyCane]

You guys can believe what you want, but there is no way you will convince me the majority of the anti-mask movement was based on that. I stand by my statement, that’s delusional. The anti-Fauci sentiment is purely and totally based on politics. Trump supporters felt he hurt Trump’s chances of being re-elected.

I said "a good portion" not the majority. Although I have no proof, I would speculate that Trump latched onto what Fauci said as justification for his own mask ambivalence. It was certainly Trump's attitude that led to the majority of the anti-mask movement. However, Fauci's words gave people something to point to in order to justify it.

I didn't really think Fauci hurt Trump's chances of being re-elected. It would have hurt his chances if he listened to Fauci 100% or always did the complete opposite. If he listened to Fauci 100% it would have hurt the economy (Trump's strongest issue to that point although we'll never know if a recession would have begun anyway) even more and if he had gone opposite of Fauci on everything, the spread and deaths would have been worse. Either option hurt his chances with respect to Fauci.

Personally, the second this Trump supporter realized that COVID couldn't be contained to small geographic areas I knew the chance of Trump getting reelected was less than 25% and that was before all of the unrest over the summer.

 

[Jrb1979]

You guys can believe what you want, but there is no way you will convince me the majority of the anti-mask movement was based on that. I stand by my statement, that’s delusional. The anti-Fauci sentiment is purely and totally based on politics. Trump supporters felt he hurt Trump’s chances of being re-elected.

I agree. The same thing was said to Canadian's back in March in regards to masks not being needed. The difference there was no anti mask movement like there was in the US. The Covid response should have based in science from the start. Thankfully vaccines are here to hopefully make things better.

 

[Touchdown]

CDC at this time is not recommending a required Covid test for domestic travel.

They are however recommending getting one within 72 hours of your trip, getting one 3-4 days afterwards and quarantining for 7 days. Which I really think is overkill, especially for vaccinated individuals. A time is coming very soon where their continued hard line with vaccinated people is either going to lead to a full on revolt of all rules and/or public support for a vaccine failing.

In less then a month, 1 out of 3 seniors in this country are going to be fully vaccinated, and I guarantee you the most powerful voting block in the country will voice their displeasure. I really think public health officials should be stressing masking and social distancing but acknowledging it’s ok for vaccinated people to be more mobile.

 

[GoofGoof]

I said "a good portion" not the majority. Although I have no proof, I would speculate that Trump latched onto what Fauci said as justification for his own mask ambivalence. It was certainly Trump's attitude that led to the majority of the anti-mask movement. However, Fauci's words gave people something to point to in order to justify it.

I didn't really think Fauci hurt Trump's chances of being re-elected. It would have hurt his chances if he listened to Fauci 100% or always did the complete opposite. If he listened to Fauci 100% it would have hurt the economy (Trump's strongest issue to that point although we'll never know if a recession would have begun anyway) even more and if he had gone opposite of Fauci on everything, the spread and deaths would have been worse. Either option hurt his chances with respect to Fauci.

Personally, the second this Trump supporter realized that COVID couldn't be contained to small geographic areas I knew the chance of Trump getting reelected was less than 25% and that was before all of the unrest over the summer.

I agree that what Fauci said was used as a justification to be against masks. That’s different than saying it caused people to be anti-mask.

I also agree that Fauci didn’t necessarily hurt Trump’s chances. He was going to lose even if Covid never happened. I know we disagree on that and that’s fine too.

Actually I supported Trump. I love truth, and was disappointed when Fauci tried to deceive the general public, not because of trump in the least. Trump can stand or fall on his own words, and honestly I liked that Fauci would “sometimes disagree”. Politicians allowing disagreements is good in that varying points of opinion get known.

I think Fauci will not stay in lockstep with politicians of either party, and that is good to me. I am disappointed when someone lies to the public, because it diminishes the public trust in what truths they say in the future.

The lie has been blown out of proportion by the echo chamber. Back in March when PPE was in seriously short supply and hospitals were desperate to get equipment for their staff it was absolutely necessary to tell people not to make a run on masks and especially N95 masks desperately needed by hospitals. I have friends who work in hospitals including on a Covid unit that had to use bandanas and make shift masks because they couldn’t get the supplies they needed. One local hospital was paying 100X the normal price for cases of masks.

So while I am normally a supporter of “truth”, if Fauci came out and said everyone should wear a mask just in case (which was still not fully prpven at the time to be necessary due to our lack of understanding of asymptomatic spread) that would have crippled hospitals. It’s easy to say people should have been told the truth and would be smart enough to do the right thing but that’s simply not true. If Fauci and others in the government said everyone run out and buy masks it would have been a way worse outcome.

Of course this has all been said a million times already.

 

[Jrb1979]

CDC at this time is not recommending a required Covid test for domestic travel.

They are however recommending getting one within 72 hours of your trip, getting one 3-4 days afterwards and quarantining for 7 days. Which I really think is overkill, especially for vaccinated individuals. A time is coming very soon where their continued hard line with vaccinated people is either going to lead to a full on revolt of all rules and/or public support for a vaccine failing.

In less then a month, 1 out of 3 seniors in this country are going to be fully vaccinated, and I guarantee you the most powerful voting block in the country will voice their displeasure. I really think public health officials should be stressing masking and social distancing but acknowledging it’s ok for vaccinated people to be more mobile.

I disagree. I have no issue with keeping requirements in place til the vast majority are vaccinated.

 

[Touchdown]

I disagree. I have no issue with keeping requirements in place til the vast majority are vaccinated.

A vast majority will not be vaccinated for months, people want to live and that coupled with the drop in cases is going to lead to people not following rules. Better to focus on what is most important then be absolute about it.

Or poetically: The tighter you grip a handful of sand, the more slips through your fingers.

 

[Jrb1979]

A vast majority will not be vaccinated for months, people want to live and that coupled with the drop in cases is going to lead to people not following rules. Better to focus on what is most important then be absolute about it.

Or poetically: The tighter you grip a handful of sand, the more slips through your fingers.

It's the way it's here in Canada and there isn't that much complaining going on about keeping restrictions in place til the majority are vaccinated.

 

[Touchdown]

It's the way it's here in Canada and there isn't that much complaining going on about keeping restrictions in place til the majority are vaccinated.

Well that’s another difference between Canadians and Americans.

However, the way your country had to clamp down on travel south recently tells me your average Canadian isn’t as altruistic as you suggest.

 

[GoofGoof]

CDC at this time is not recommending a required Covid test for domestic travel.

They are however recommending getting one within 72 hours of your trip, getting one 3-4 days afterwards and quarantining for 7 days. Which I really think is overkill, especially for vaccinated individuals. A time is coming very soon where their continued hard line with vaccinated people is either going to lead to a full on revolt of all rules and/or public support for a vaccine failing.

In less then a month, 1 out of 3 seniors in this country are going to be fully vaccinated, and I guarantee you the most powerful voting block in the country will voice their displeasure. I really think public health officials should be stressing masking and social distancing but acknowledging it’s ok for vaccinated people to be more mobile.

True, but at the same time they are no longer recommending quarantining if you are fully vaccinated and have contact with a covid positive person unless you have symptoms. So if you are exempt from quarantine with known contact I would assume you are also exempt from travel quarantining too when fully vaccinated. Maybe reading too much between the lines, but that’s my interpretation.

I think we are starting to see the beginning of relaxing of restrictions based on vaccinations. We aren’t close to enough vaccinated yet to see big moves but I think it’s going to be a reality in a matter of months. Right now only 4% of the population is fully vaccinated but in less than a month that will be over 10% since 11.4% right now have gotten at least 1 shot. It’s coming and sooner than later.

 

[Jrb1979]

True, but at the same time they are no longer recommending quarantining if you are fully vaccinated and have contact with a covid positive person unless you have symptoms. So if you are exempt from quarantine with known contact I would assume you are also exempt from travel quarantining too when fully vaccinated. Maybe reading too much between the lines, but that’s my interpretation.

I think we are starting to see the beginning of relaxing of restrictions based on vaccinations. We aren’t close to enough vaccinated yet to see big moves but I think it’s going to be a reality in a matter of months. Right now only 4% of the population is fully vaccinated but in less than a month that will be over 10% since 11.4% right now have gotten at least 1 shot. It’s coming and sooner than later.

The CDC recommendations are for flying are they not? Why not go on road trips instead?

 

[Flugell]

I have enjoyed the look back at what people posted over the past year and the acknowledgment of accuracy or inaccuracies in their opinions/predictions. However I must confess to a feeling of depression when reading posts that still seem to lean towards what people want to happen rather than what needs to happen.
Why would people who have been fortunate enough to be vaccinated, revolt against the very rules that kept them safe, until they were able to be vaccinated? There is, as far as I am aware, no definitive evidence that people who are vaccinated are not able to contribute to the spread of the virus. This is important information.
We have come so far and endured so much it would be tragic to jeopardise the arrival at the winning post by stopping a few days/weeks/ months short. Let science and statistics lead the way not our natural and almost overwhelmingly desire to return to some form of normality. How I long to see my son (December 2019) go on holiday (January 2020) or go out for a meal with friends (January 2020) but if necessary I will continue to wait.
Therefore it would seem that the decent thing to do would be to continue with all restrictions until the vast majority of people are vaccinated or we have irrefutable proof that those who have been vaccinated cannot cause harm to those still waiting. I have little or no sympathy for those who could be vaccinated but refuse to be. Those unable to for medical reasons have my total support.

 

[DisneyCane]

The CDC recommendations are for flying are they not? Why not go on road trips instead?

I believe the recommendations are for "travel." The test before travel would have been only for air travel.

Certain trips are not feasible by car. My recent trip to Colorado to ski is an example. To drive would have taken three days each way. I only had 6 days including my travel days for the trip. If I got up early enough on day 3 of driving, maybe I could have gotten a few runs in and then maybe a couple in the morning before leaving the next day.

 

[GoofGoof]

The CDC recommendations are for flying are they not? Why not go on road trips instead?

I believe the recommendations are for "travel." The test before travel would have been only for air travel.

Certain trips are not feasible by car. My recent trip to Colorado to ski is an example. To drive would have taken three days each way. I only had 6 days including my travel days for the trip. If I got up early enough on day 3 of driving, maybe I could have gotten a few runs in and then maybe a couple in the morning before leaving the next day.

Yes, I think it was part of a general recommendation not to travel. They didn’t come out and say “ignore all this stuff once you are vaccinated” but if you don’t need to quarantine after confirmed contact once vaccinated it makes sense that you wouldn’t need to jump through a lot of hoops for travel either.

 

[Touchdown]

I have enjoyed the look back at what people posted over the past year and the acknowledgment of accuracy or inaccuracies in their opinions/predictions. However I must confess to a feeling of depression when reading posts that still seem to lean towards what people want to happen rather than what needs to happen.
Why would people who have been fortunate enough to be vaccinated, revolt against the very rules that kept them safe, until they were able to be vaccinated? There is, as far as I am aware, no definitive evidence that people who are vaccinated are not able to contribute to the spread of the virus. This is important information.
We have come so far and endured so much it would be tragic to jeopardise the arrival at the winning post by stopping a few days/weeks/ months short. Let science and statistics lead the way not our natural and almost overwhelmingly desire to return to some form of normality. How I long to see my son (December 2019) go on holiday (January 2020) or go out for a meal with friends (January 2020) but if necessary I will continue to wait.
Therefore it would seem that the decent thing to do would be to continue with all restrictions until the vast majority of people are vaccinated or we have irrefutable proof that those who have been vaccinated cannot cause harm to those still waiting. I have little or no sympathy for those who could be vaccinated but refuse to be. Those unable to for medical reasons have my total support.

We have never had to prove a vaccine stops transmission we have always assumed it did. Note I’m not in favor of stopping all restrictions, let’s still do the time proven one, of masks and social distancing, but airplanes seem to be realitively safe based on studies, being inside socially distant and masked seems to significantly lower your risk of transmission of disease making going into stores reasonable, likewise outdoor activities. That is because on top of the lower risks then expected vaccinated people are 95% likely not to get sick when exposed.

It’s called risk management, no situation in life is risk free, the question is when is it acceptable. When I’m 95% likely to not get the disease (and presumably around that, maybe less likely to transmit disease) and am willing to continue to do the most effective mitigations (mask and social distant) my risk is incredibly low. And the reward of living life far outweighs that risk.

 

[DisneyCane]

Darker is more doses administered per 100k. Looks like FL is doing pretty well from a shots in the arm perspective especially compared to other States with similar population. Map from the CDC:

 

[Kevin_W]

Darker is more doses administered per 100k. Looks like FL is doing pretty well from a shots in the arm perspective especially compared to other States with similar population. Map from the CDC:

View attachment 531971

I wonder for Florida got more allocations earlier because their >65 population was higher than other states relative to total population?

 

[Rimmit]

What if we listened to Dr. Fauci when he said (paraphrasing) you shouldn't travel unless you have to for work? Or now would be a good time for young, healthy people to get deals on vacations?

I understand that things changed as more data came in but let's not pretend like Dr. Fauci was spot on from day one and knew exactly what was going to happen or what to do to prevent it. The task force, with him on it from day one, was formed in January of last year.

No where did I say he was spot on from Day 1 or that he knew what to do to prevent it. I only stated that he and the rest of the task force were stating that a lot of people were gonna die, and that all you had to do was listen to the experts and look at what happened to other countries to know this wasn’t some hoax that was gonna disappear come November. No where did I ever state or even imply he was spot on from day one.

Again, it did not take an advanced degree to predict this outcome. People only had to listen to and trust science. Unfortunately, this is something that we as a society have gotten very bad at over the last several years.

 

[GoofGoof]

I wonder for Florida got more allocations earlier because their >65 population was higher than other states relative to total population?

It’s not supposed to work that way. Each state is supposed to get an allocation based solely on population. Most of the differences now are how many doses states are holding back for second shots or LT care (although they should be done most places by now) and also reporting delays. I think some states are more aggressive in giving out shots and taking the risk there aren’t enough for 2nd shots and others are being more conservative.

 

[GhostHost1000]

Odds of Disney World parks being maskless with nighttime shows returned in October is?

Trump downplayed Covid for his own personal gain (popularity)

Fauci downplayed masks for a few weeks to allow hospitals and healthcare providers to get properly stocked before another panic buy by the public wiped out supply.

That’s the difference.

Personally I’m not a Trump fan but I gotta say I think he just didn’t panic or want America to panic instead of everyone go crazy (think about what happened with just toilet paper alone) and then think we are all gonna die.