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Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

GoofGoof

Premium Member
I completely agree. I am a teacher and we opened schools for students last week. Since preplanning.. 14 days.... the health department protocols have changed twice. TWICE!!! How after six months do we not have a consistent message from the medical community. I believe that education is so important and that we have to have a brick and mortar schools. We are going above and beyond doing everything we can to keep these kids safe but no one can tell us for sure what all of those things are. Protocols change constantly. It’s overwhelming andthe world can’t go on like this.
There is no excuse for the lack of firm plans. We needed (and still need) stronger leadership focused on results and science instead of peddling conspiracy theories and worrying about politics. It’s tragic to see unfold like this.
 

JoeCamel

Well-Known Member
Exactly! How many restaurants and other businesses, especially small locally-owned businesses, will have to permanently close their doors because of the financial hit? How many jobs are being lost? How many single parents are struggling with helping their children with online schooling while trying to maintain holding a job? How has this pandemic affected mental health in America- especially in terms of the number of suicides and substance abuse? How much has domestic violence increased the last six months? What about child abuse? Child neglect? All of these are factors that need to be considered as well.
The sad answer is a lot. When 20 million are out of work they are not out spending money in bars, stores and restaurants

We will need to change and adjust to move forward, for years I have seen pictures of Asian countries that have people on the streets wearing masks. This may become the norm here as well, no denying they help prevent the spread of viruses.

Lowering occupancy in indoor spaces, distancing, all may become the norm. If a business cannot implement these measures and be profitable they probably will not survive. Sad but we are not going back to all is well anytime soon. And if people won't distance and wear a mask it will be much longer.
 
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GoofGoof

Premium Member
The sad answer is a lot. When 20 million are out of work they are not out spending money in bars, stores and restaurants

We will need to change and adjust to move forward, for years I see pictures of Asian countries that have people on the streets wearing masks. This may become the norm here as well, no denying they help prevent the spread of viruses.

Lowering occupancy in indoor spaces, distancing, all may become the norm. If a business cannot implement these measures and be profitable it probably will not survive. Sad but we are not going back to all is well anytime soon. And if people won't distance and wear a mask it will be much longer.
Nobody asked for this and nobody wants it to last longer. We all need to do our part to help get as much of the economy up and running as possible. There Is a false narrative out there that there‘s a choice between the economy and public health. In reality the best thing for the economy is a reduction in cases so those things work hand in hand. As an example look at some bars that opened this summer. Instead of following social distancing and mask requirements they packed people in. That lead to a major surge in cases which lead to a lot of states closing bars again. So the short term money grab of packing the bar with people lead to a long term huge negative for all bar owners. If everyone does things the right way than more can be open and more people will be comfortable participating in the economy. That takes buy in from the public as well as business owners. Stop the Covid denial, the conspiracy theories, the resistance to masks and/or distancing and get with the program.
 

Ben_since_1971

Well-Known Member
If an obese patient tests positive for COVID, then suffers a fatal heart attack, should the cause of death be COVID? If he/she had the heart attack a week earlier before being diagnosed, it would be attributed to being obese. Likewise, if an 80-year old longtime diabetic suffers kidney failure and dies after being diagnosed with COVID, how should that be classified? Like I wrote in my original post, most people dying of COVID have close to three other conditions in addition to COVID-19.
I did not want to dive into this discussion because I have much more important things to do, but I need to add my .02 to this. My father is 78 years old. He has dementia, circulation issues, high blood pressure and is almost two years removed from his second heart attack that resulted in a sextuple bypass and valve replacement. Prior to June 5, he was very healthy (all things considered). His vitals were all normal (he lives in a nursing home), he had a normal appetite, and besides the dementia, you would never know anything was wrong.

June 6 he tested positive for Covid-19. I braced for the worst. Fortunately, and the only reason why I am posting this, he had a very mild case. He had fever for a couple of days, and his primary symptoms were fatigue and a nagging cough. July 6 he was released back to his residential unit, and today he is as he was on June 5. I am eternally grateful.

But if the worst had happened, if he had died, I no doubt believe cause of death would have been Covid with comorbidities of heart disease, hypertension, and I am sure they would have thrown a few more high score scrabble words in there. According to your logic, his death should not have been classified a Covid death because of the comorbidities. But it would have been Covid that brought on the episode that would have killed him. On June 5, there was no reason to believe my father was ready to join my stepmother in heaven, other than his number would have been up.

I do not doubt that some deaths may have been overstated as Covid (i.e. the aforementioned auto accident victim who just found out they tested positive or post mortem was discovered positive). But to blanket say anyone with comorbidities and Covid is not a Covid death and should not be counted is shortsighted.

(Edited for grammar)
 

LukeS7

Well-Known Member
I did not want to dive into this discussion because I have much more important things to do, but I need to add my .02 to this. My father is 78 years old. He has dementia, circulation issues, high blood pressure and is almost two years removed from his second heart attack that resulted in a sextuple bypass and valve replacement. Prior to June 5, he was very healthy (all things considered). His vitals were all normal (he lives in a nursing home), he had a normal appetite, and besides the dementia, you would never know anything was wrong.

June 6 he tested positive for Covid-19. I braced for the worst. Fortunately, and the only reason why I am posting this, he had a very mild case. He had fever for a couple of days, and his primary symptoms were fatigue and a nagging cough. July 6 he was released back to his residential unit, and today he is as he was on June 5. I am eternally grateful.

But if the worst had happened, if he had died, I no doubt believe cause of death would have been Covid with comorbidities of heart disease, hypertension, and I am sure they would have thrown a few more high score scrabble words in there. According to your logic, his death should not have been classified a Covid death because of the comorbidities. But it would have been Covid that brought on the episode that would have killed him. On June 5, there was no reason to believe my father was ready to join my stepmother in heaven, other than his number would have been up.

I do not doubt that some deaths may have been overstated as Covid (i.e. the aforementioned auto accident victim who just found out they tested positive or post mortem was discovered positive). But to blanket say anyone with comorbidities and Covid is not a Covid death and should not be counted is shortsighted.

(Edited for grammar)
Glad your dad made it through okay!

I don’t get the comorbidity argument that some here are trying to make. As has been shown in other posts, we’ve had *much* higher than expected death rates for most weeks of this year. If people with comorbidities were going to die anyways, they would’ve been accounted for in the expected deaths and we wouldn’t be ~200,000 above our expected death amount already.
 

Castmbr

Active Member
I did not want to dive into this discussion because I have much more important things to do, but I need to add my .02 to this. My father is 78 years old. He has dementia, circulation issues, high blood pressure and is almost two years removed from his second heart attack that resulted in a sextuple bypass and valve replacement. Prior to June 5, he was very healthy (all things considered). His vitals were all normal (he lives in a nursing home), he had a normal appetite, and besides the dementia, you would never know anything was wrong.

June 6 he tested positive for Covid-19. I braced for the worst. Fortunately, and the only reason why I am posting this, he had a very mild case. He had fever for a couple of days, and his primary symptoms were fatigue and a nagging cough. July 6 he was released back to his residential unit, and today he is as he was on June 5. I am eternally grateful.

But if the worst had happened, if he had died, I no doubt believe cause of death would have been Covid with comorbidities of heart disease, hypertension, and I am sure they would have thrown a few more high score scrabble words in there. According to your logic, his death should not have been classified a Covid death because of the comorbidities. But it would have been Covid that brought on the episode that would have killed him. On June 5, there was no reason to believe my father was ready to join my stepmother in heaven, other than his number would have been up.

I do not doubt that some deaths may have been overstated as Covid (i.e. the aforementioned auto accident victim who just found out they tested positive or post mortem was discovered positive). But to blanket say anyone with comorbidities and Covid is not a Covid death and should not be counted is shortsighted.

(Edited for grammar)

Show me the data that supports that we have had a huge spike in overall deaths in the US over the monthly rolling averages from 2017,2018,2019 and I will agree with you. Considering the CDC conveniently stopped reporting from April -July 2020 it is VERY convenient. This is not as bad as the media is playing it to be. I agree that it has a certain age group that is susceptible but lock downs for everyone is foolish.

 
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LukeS7

Well-Known Member
Show me the data that supports that we have had a huge spike in overall deaths in the US over the monthly rolling averages from 2017,2018,2019 and I will agree with you. Considering the CDC conveniently stopped reporting from April -July 2020 it is VERY convenient. This is not as bad as the media is play it to be. I agree that it has a certain age group that is susceptible but lock downs for everyone is foolish.

 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
Show me the data that supports that we have had a huge spike in overall deaths in the US over the monthly rolling averages from 2017,2018,2019 and I will agree with you. Considering the CDC conveniently stopped reporting from April -July 2020 it is VERY convenient. This is not as bad as the media is play it to be. I agree that it has a certain age group that is susceptible but lock downs for everyone is foolish.

You're doing it again. You keep denying the accuracy of all the data which would require the entire medical establishments of all the countries, states, and counties of the entire world to be in this conspiracy to put out false data.

And when we get to the point where we say, "Well, look at the corpses. They're real. They've been counted." You then question even that.

If anything, the number of COVID cases has been *undercounted." Not overcounted. Besides the link @Touchdown posted, here's what the NYT has been tracking...

View attachment 493771

So, what's your source that the number of dead human beings from COVID is significantly off?
 

Ben_since_1971

Well-Known Member
Show me the data that supports that we have had a huge spike in overall deaths in the US over the monthly rolling averages from 2017,2018,2019 and I will agree with you. Considering the CDC conveniently stopped reporting from April -July 2020 it is VERY convenient. This is not as bad as the media is play it to be. I agree that it has a certain age group that is susceptible but lock downs for everyone is foolish.

Talk about non sequitir replies........... :rolleyes:
 

Castmbr

Active Member
New CDC report shows 94% of COVID-19 deaths in U.S. had contributing conditions


I hate it when I am right..... Mom censored/deleted the rest of my posts on this thread because there apparently are no adults and no freedom of ideas.

BTW - I have been banned from this thread because I dare disagree with the mob.
 
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Ben_since_1971

Well-Known Member
New CDC report shows 94% of COVID-19 deaths in U.S. had contributing conditions


I hate it when I am right.....
I don’t think we are disputing that many covid related deaths (such as what could have happened to my father) had comorbidities. What we are disputing is the claim that the remaining 6% is the true covid death number and therefore the whole pandemic is overblown. That is just plain wrong.
 

MisterPenguin

Rumormonger
Premium Member
Exactly! How many restaurants and other businesses, especially small locally-owned businesses, will have to permanently close their doors because of the financial hit?

And how many aren't rebounding even though their state has started to open things up? People stay home in a pandemic. The idea that there wouldn't be an economic hit if we just kept things open is blatantly refuted by businesses having rough times because their employees are sick or because their customers aren't out shopping.

WDW is open and can't reach their capacity, as reduced as it is, on weekdays. People hunker down.
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
US hotel occupancy recently broke 50% for the first time since this started. This is encouraging news. But still a long way to go. Way below pre Covid still.
That is pretty good. Considering major hotel spots like Hawaii, Vegas and Orlando are still hurting and business travel is still way down that‘s a promising number. This doesn’t apply to WDW but hotel discounts right now are crazy good.
 

Andrew C

You know what's funny?
That is pretty good. Considering major hotel spots like Hawaii, Vegas and Orlando are still hurting and business travel is still way down that‘s a promising number. This doesn’t apply to WDW but hotel discounts right now are crazy good.
I think the major destinations are still below 50% on average. But the country overall...bit better. Right now all dependent on domestic travel.
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
I think the major destinations are still below 50% on average. But the country overall...bit better. Right now all dependent on domestic travel.
I know people are sick of sitting at home and at least where I live it was very popular to go anywhere with low case numbers this summer. NJ shore, renting finger lake cabins in upstate NY, even camping. I also know a bunch of people who traveled recently to drop kids off at college. People are starting to get a little more comfortable traveling. I think if we can continue to trend down there could be a bump in holiday demand.
 

Chi84

Premium Member
Until the mask restriction is lifted...... there will be issues with ANY tourism driven business. That is all I am am saying and I think that one thing is probably the worst restrictions that is reducing confidence in most people. I think that one restriction should be removed ASAP.
I agree. Masks are the one restriction that is a deal-breaker for us visiting Disney. As soon as they’re gone, we’ll be back.
 

Jrb1979

Well-Known Member
I know people are sick of sitting at home and at least where I live it was very popular to go anywhere with low case numbers this summer. NJ shore, renting finger lake cabins in upstate NY, even camping. I also know a bunch of people who traveled recently to drop kids off at college. People are starting to get a little more comfortable traveling. I think if we can continue to trend down there could be a bump in holiday demand.
I'm highly doubtful that any bump in demand is coming. People maybe more comfortable traveling but many haven't felt the job loss yet. Its already started in many places. What amazes me is how many ignore that.
 

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